Mother of OD victim wants BitCoins banned

[AlannaLouisa]

Idiot comment. Daniel's mother

 

[Black Rabbit of Inle]

Why? The stuff was cut. The police took away most of it. his browsing history lasted 20 mins after he got home. They murdered my son in the prime of his life. He wasnt even a regular experimenter. It could have been anyone of anyone here. These online sites are all lies even user ratings.

That's why there should be regulation to the system and not just reactionary blanket bans.

 

[missmeyet?]

I am confused..what are the 2 comments from AlannaLouisa from? I mean, what is she responding to? Where did it come from and what is it regarding? Is that supposed to be the mom of the boy who ODd? Why what?

 

[poledriver]

Yeah it seems so. Who knows if that's legit, but seems like it, I mean who else would really do that.

I hope she comes back on and comments more.

If you read this, sorry about your son. I used to spend a fair bit of time around Collaroy when I was younger. RIP.

I dont think these sites are all bullshit and lies tho, some of the user rating systems work. Cocaine in this country (Aus) is generally weak and cut as far as I know, sometimes people who use drugs can have a beter chance of getting better quality stuff from places over seas, especially cocaine and MDMA (ecstasy), but not always. In some ways using these sites is safer as well as you dont have to go meet drug dealers and 'friends of friends' and stuff who might end up ripping you off or worse, but on the other side of the coin, you also may be importing drugs into the country if you buy it from someone over seas.

I'm guessing this comment by her -

Idiot comment. Daniel's mother

Was intended as a reply to someones comment, but she didn't quote which comment. Maybe the one not too far above saying they should send her to jail for raising a son who bought drugs online. I'm not sure tho.

I guess she came across this thread in a google search about her son and articles about him.

Alanna -

They murdered my son in the prime of his life.

Nobody murdered your son. HE chose to buy cocaine and use it. Nobody forced him to, nobody is to blame, not the site (or those kinds of sites) he got it off, not the growers and producers of the cocaine, not bitcoins, not his mates, not Australia post for delivering to your house, not the makers of the products that are used as a cut. Nobody. I know it must be VERY hard to accept and I am sorry for your loss, blaming anyone wont help or do anything though. You can't stop people using drugs, if they wont to use them they will.

As Black Rabbit said if there was some kind of regulation, people who are going to use drugs could get a pure, properly labeled and weighed product with no cuts and much less chance of harm to the user. The product could also come in some form of packaging that had health warnings and phone numbers for help like detox and rehab and quit kind of places. And general health warning and educational messages.

Some kind of system that is currently being used now by Colorado for cannabis, where you can buy it legally in shops and have so much on your person without fear of police action. And where you can buy is in its pure, well labeled and weighted form.

In some ways I dont wont meth (ice) and heroin and cocaine available legally, but I have come to the decision over many years now that it would be safer for the users of such drugs (I dont use drugs anymore, except beer and coffee) to have the drugs in a pure form with proper packaging and weights (doses). The way it is now (all illegal) hasn't worked at all, and we've seen many, many people die from that, and many people also get rich from it, and there is no shortage of any of the drugs still, even though the police try. So there is no regulation in the purity of the drugs (that users or experimenters) will continue to buy anyway) so often the drugs are cut or adulterated with harmful products unfortunately. Making these types of drugs legal would also keep the profits within the country for our government to use instead of god knows who, alot of the money probably goes back over seas currently. If the government was making loads of money off legal drugs hopefully some of it could be invested back in eduction and awareness campaigns and rehabs and detox clinics to get people off and away from drugs if they wont to.

 

[neversickanymore]

Why? The stuff was cut. The police took away most of it. his browsing history lasted 20 mins after he got home. They murdered my son in the prime of his life. He wasnt even a regular experimenter. It could have been anyone of anyone here. These online sites are all lies even user ratings.

If you are Daniel's mother Im sorry for your loss and I hope you find some measure of peace in time.

 

[AlannaLouisa]

If you think that legalising all 79 pages X 12 ie over 1000 drugs on these sites is going to make everyone, including non users who want the freedom not to live with drug and alcohol related crimes and violence, better off - think again sunshine. There is no way anyone would or could make all that these sites sell legal AND NOR SHOULD THEY. So go back to the drawing board Poledriver. Idiot comment again. This generation of people buying from these sites because they think it is safer than buying from a man in the street doesn't realise any unemployed person who comes across any toxic poison that looks white from anywhere in the globe can set up on these online drug sites and sell any toxin to anyone, anywhere in the globe....and it just astonishes me that people like poledriver still want to see this as personal choice. Back in the 70s if people wanted drugs they had to go to a lot of difficulty in sourcing and that is better than now - because sourcing acted as a deterrent. Also the product range was much more limited. Now young people think they are in a candy shop only the candy isn't always sweet (and there are no guarantees). Its nice you say it was my son's choice to take an adulterated drug when it clearly wasn't at all. Legalisation isn't possible when these filthy sites are developing one new synthetic high a week and I am surprised you don't back up and support me in trying to shut these sites down (and if shutting down the cash bitcoin dealers is one way to do then lets do it).

 

[AlannaLouisa]

"That's why there should be regulation and not just reactionary blanket bans"

Try reading the petition at change.org and read it properly this time

 

[Felonious Monk]

I'm sorry for your loss but you have no idea what you are talking about. It's not even worth trying to respond to you. Process your grief and take up a hobby, cause arguing online is not your forte.

Unfortunate incidents happen when drugs are sold on the black market. Legalization is the answer. If the basics were legally available nobody would be taking the random RCs except those psychonauts who were truly informed and had some desire to experience something novel.

 

[poledriver]

If you think that legalising all 79 pages X 12 ie over 1000 drugs on these sites is going to make everyone, including non users who want the freedom not to live with drug and alcohol related crimes and violence, better off - think again sunshine. There is no way anyone would or could make all that these sites sell legal AND NOR SHOULD THEY. So go back to the drawing board Poledriver. Idiot comment again. This generation of people buying from these sites because they think it is safer than buying from a man in the street doesn't realise any unemployed person who comes across any toxic poison that looks white from anywhere in the globe can set up on these online drug sites and sell any toxin to anyone, anywhere in the globe....and it just astonishes me that people like poledriver still want to see this as personal choice. Back in the 70s if people wanted drugs they had to go to a lot of difficulty in sourcing and that is better than now - because sourcing acted as a deterrent. Also the product range was much more limited. Now young people think they are in a candy shop only the candy isn't always sweet (and there are no guarantees). Its nice you say it was my son's choice to take an adulterated drug when it clearly wasn't at all. Legalisation isn't possible when these filthy sites are developing one new synthetic high a week and I am surprised you don't back up and support me in trying to shut these sites down (and if shutting down the cash bitcoin dealers is one way to do then lets do it).

Trying to stop sites and technologies like bitcoins wont make even the tiniest of dents in the whole thing, but I doubt you will listen, you have your own ideas and that's fine. As one site gets taken down another 2 will open, if bit coins get stopped they will create or find another way to accept payments.

You seem to not realise that it cannot be stopped. And it wont ever be stopped. Locking people up or even threatening them with the risk of the death penalty still doesnt stop people using or dealing or making drugs.

To me it's all a bit like file sharing and sites like the pirate bay where people can download movies and shows and music, the powers that be have tried so many times to shut down the sites and technologies (like napster) and spent god knows how much time and money trying to stop digital piracy and has it made any small dent in people illegally sharing copyrighted material at all? Nope, nothing has changed.

Drug trends have changed since the 70's sure (although im pretty sure there was alot of LSD and pot and heroin and maybe coke around then even tho there was no internet or mobile phones) but anyway drug trends will constantly change always, and as Monk said people wouldnt need such sites to get their drugs of choice if they could buy them in safe environments like shops or chemists where they had been made by highly trained chemists in a pharmaceutical environment with pure/clean ingredients and facilities.

People will always use drugs and will always be able to get them and it's not going to get any harder for them to obtain them with more technologies as time progresses.

Look how much ice is in Sydney and how many people (apparently) use that drug, you think that's going very well for the police the way they are doing it currently? Seems to be no shortage for the people who wont it, same with cannabis. The laws are working so well hey.

Why are alcohol and tobacco ok to buy and use as much of as you like but I'm not allowed to buy some clean LSD (labelled with how strong it is) or MDMA (again labelled) or cocaine (labelled with purity level) or some cannabis that is labelled with it's thc/cbd content so I know what strength weed I am getting? And in set doses. Why is all the money going to criminal gangs and bikies and people like that, why not keep the profits from people using the drugs within the government in the form of tax, like with alcohol and tobacco (or cannabis as Colorado USA has done now).

Since people are going to obviously use drugs anyway no matter what the laws why dont we have drug testing facilities where people can get their batches of whatever drugs tested for adulterants? Oh I know why, because drugs are illegal and it's all working so well the way it is, we'll just keep banning stuff and close our eyes to it all and hope it just goes away. That's been working wonders so far hey

Have fun on your mission, it wont change a thing and you are going about it all the wrong way imo.

 

[wayab]

im pretty sure that all people that use the dark net used to get their drugs by other means before.
what if he got the toxic stuff from your neighbourhood dealers(yes you have more than one no matter what type of people live there) with cash... ban cash then ?

why did usa relegalise alcohol after the prohibition? one of the reasons was that people did not stop drinking they just started drinking toxic stuff like methanol, etc.

its horrible what happened but if a blame is to be put on anyone at all it should be on the lack of proper regulation

 

[RTrain]

So hold on, first off no one has any statistics that will support whether street or hidden online marketplace drugs are safer than the other. There are inherent risks in both. You can argue it all day, but in the end we can't take one isolated incident of a tainted product being sold and claim that is the justification that one or the other is safer, regardless of which way it was procured.

She should push to ban the internet. And drugs. And Mobile phones. And everything.

Every parent who loses a kid to an OD wants to steal everyone else's vague bit of freedom they hold onto. If it was a dealer who sold them it they would say lock all drug dealers up for life, but that is a played out plea and this one is right on point with the current "digital world", so it was worth writing an article about.

It reminds me of a really good friend of mine that died 2 years ago from driving his camaro reckless as fuck. I sent so many letter to my congressman urging for a ban on cars but i never got a single response. It is sad how ineffective our government is towards the emotionally intelligent plight of the common nanny state supporter!

Nope, if you had been as wise as this woman, you would have aimed to ban gasoline, seeing as it is to cars what bitcoins are to the illegal online marketplace. Bitcoins are the fuel for these online marketplaces, see the parallel here.

 

[poledriver]

"That's why there should be regulation and not just reactionary blanket bans"

Try reading the petition at change.org and read it properly this time

Tony Abbott: Commence an inquiry into bitcoin - it's protecting drug dealers

They’re calling it "a virtual Wild West for narco-traffickers and other criminals."

My beautiful kind-hearted boy, Daniel, was just 21. Now, he’s died before he should have. Daniel died because he was lured into a world where criminals and drug dealers use an unregulated currency called “bitcoin” to get away with it. He had fallen into a dark web of dangerous people, completely unregulated -- and determined to squeeze money out of our kids for dodgy drugs.

Now we read that these drugs, combined with alcohol, are also influencing the wave of violence on our streets

Other countries are waking up to the threat posed by an unregulated currency and taking action. We need to urgently do the same in Australia before more lives are lost.

Bitcoin is operating as a black bank and facilitating the hiding of participants in drug and other black market transactions. Bitcoin is also offering a marketing service for global drug traffickers who are targeting Australian youth.

My son was just 21. And now he’s been taken from me. He died from drugs and I know that I can’t bring him back, but if the same laws had been applied to bitcoin as applies to regular currency, it would be easier for the police to find the people who did this. The other parents I’ve talked to think it’s not happening to them, but I know it is.

After my son died, I had to go through his facebook and emails to see the unbelievable trail of push marketing from people trying to use bitcoin to sell every possible drug you could imagine. And when I told the police about it, they told me they don’t have the resources to fight it.

Australians are rightfully concerned about this new threat. That’s why I’m asking the government to regulate bitcoin and prevent its use as a malicious market. We need the government to have a proper inquiry into bitcoin and stop pretending it doesn’t exist.

The inquiry should consider how banks can get away with allowing these people to trade in bitcoin and how we’re letting them get away with killing our children.

To:
Tony Abbott, Prime Minister of Australia
Senator Arthur Sinodinos, Assistant Treasurer
The Hon Peter Dutton MP, Minister of Health
The Hon Malcolm Turnbull MP, Minister Communications and Digital Economy
The Hon Kevin Andrews MP, Minister for Social Services
The Hon Bill Shorten MP, Leader of the Opposition
The Hon Kevin John Humphries MP, Minister for Mental Health
The Hon Michael Joseph Gallacher MP, Minister of Police
The Hon Anthony Roberts MP, Minister of Fair Trading
The Hon Barry Robert OFarrell, Premier of NSW
Stop all our banks accommodating BITCOIN transactions. Bitcoin is operating as a black bank and facilitating the hiding of participants in drug and other black market transactions. Bitcoin is also offering a marketing service for global drug traffickers who are targeting Australian youth.
Sincerely,
[Your name]

Here's the link to it -

https://www.change.org/en-AU/petiti...iry-into-bitcoin-it-s-protecting-drug-dealers

 

[poledriver]

Every parent who loses a kid to an OD wants to steal everyone else's vague bit of freedom they hold onto. If it was a dealer who sold them it they would say lock all drug dealers up for life, but that is a played out plea and this one is right on point with the current "digital world", so it was worth writing an article about.

Maybe alot do, but not all. Take Tony Trimingham for instance, his son, Damien died of a heroin overdose in Sydney in 1997.

Mr Trimingham said he would wholeheartedly support regulation in heroin use in Australia and is adamant that doing so would eradicate many of the social problems associated with addiction.

http://www.news.com.au/national/the...ir-son-to-heroin/story-e6frfkp9-1226682357495

Damien tried heroin for the first time 18 months before he died, and, along with his girlfriend, became addicted quickly. After a period of heavy use, he was able to quit, more or less, with treatment. In the 12-month period before he died, he used heroin only once or twice. On the last day of his life, he was in a bar with his new girlfriend, they had an argument, she left, and he embarked on a journey by train and foot that took him to a drug ghetto in King’s Cross.

Damien died about 500 meters from where a safe injection site now stands. It wasn’t there then. His father says we will never know if he would have gone there to inject if it had been there, but Damien did travel a long way that day to get to that neighbourhood where he could buy drugs and clean needles, and there’s good reason to believe he might have gone another 500 meters to inject somewhere safe.

That facility that now exists there has supervised millions of injections, including 3,000 overdoses, all of which were successfully intervened in by nurses. Not one life has been lost.

http://www.knitnut.net/2008/07/damien-triminghams-story/

 

[Black Rabbit of Inle]

"That's why there should be regulation and not just reactionary blanket bans"

Try reading the petition at change.org and read it properly this time

I read it, what's your point. This tirade against BitCoins is still a reactionary attempt at a blanket ban.

Say BitCoins were made illegal? Then what? There would be absolutely zero change in the amount of people buying drugs online.

Regardless of the access he had online, your son would have eventually found someone in your neighbourhood to buy drugs from. Granted, he may have never gotten his hands on cocaine, but he would have had access to the dangerous 'legal' RC's.

To break it down more,
a) you're targeting the wrong thing,
b) even if you were targeting the drugs themselves, history shows that it would have very little impact on their availability and
c) you should look at pushing for regulation instead as it will save more lives in the long run (including lives ruined by the judicial system)

 

[bit_pattern]

How does AnnaLouisa propose that BitCoins be "regulated" anyway? The currency already exists in a parallel economy that exists outside of the regulatory system. Wherever a person can run an internet connection and encrypt their shit there is going to be Bit Coins. You may as well order the tide not to come in.

 

[bit_pattern]

Why? The stuff was cut.

Yup. And if recreational drugs were regulated by an authority like the TGA your boy wouldn't have had to ingest cocaine cut with a veterinary worming drug and would most likely still be alive today.

 

[poledriver]

^ Yeah, but when people purchase bitcoins doesnt there need to be some part where you have to either goto a physical bank to deposit money or transfer money to a bank or site so they can send you the digital bit coin currency?

I know a person who used SR a few times and they had to personally goto a bank to have the money transferred somewhere and email the deposit slip to someplace so they could get the bit coins? Is that correct? Or is there a way of buying bit coins that you don't have to deal with banks at all?

I guess they could ban all banks in Aus from allowing deposits to any bit coin places and the government could try and ban all sites that trade in the sale of bit coins, but then surely people could just transfer money over to other countries to get their bit coins?

Im not sure how it all works, so im not sure if it could be stopped or not. I'd like to hear more from people who are experienced with BC's on this.

 

[bit_pattern]

^ Yeah, but when people purchase bitcoins doesnt there need to be some part where you have to either goto a physical bank to deposit money or transfer money to a bank or site so they can send you the digital bit coin currency?

I know a person who used SR a few times and they had to personally goto a bank to have the money transferred somewhere and email the deposit slip to someplace so they could get the bit coins? Is that correct? Or is there a way of buying bit coins that you don't have to deal with banks at all?

I guess they could ban all banks in Aus from allowing deposits to any bit coin places and the government could try and ban all sites that trade in the sale of bit coins, but then surely people could just transfer money over to other countries to get their bit coins?

Im not sure how it all works, so im not sure if it could be stopped or not. I'd like to hear more from people who are experienced with BC's on this.

I've never used it, certainly no expert, but pretty sure you can buy BC via Tor - the same way you buy the drugs - and I'm pretty sure you can do black market currency exchanges via Tor

 

[missmeyet?]

^ This is correct. I have bought bitcoins several times and have never had to leave my house to do it and it has never had any connection to my bank account (or any other bank account). There were no ties to any legit brick and mortar bank at all.

I do not feel comfortable discussing it here on the forum but if you will message me I will be more than happy to explain.

 

[bit_pattern]

^^ Thanks for the info

Anyone else remember that Golden Age before BitCoin when nobody ever died of drug overdoses and drug dealers were arrested every time they made a cash transaction? Those were the days 8)