The EADD Mental Health Discussion Thread - Theoretical chat

[ColtDan]

I have nothing but the deepest respect for those who commit suicide. Cowards way out it certainly isn't.

I have a lot more to say but my brain just spilled out on the floor. Please don't dis people who are brave enough to take their own lives.

EDIT Thank fuck, just seen OTW's view. Now I know I'm on the right side of the debate.

Spot on, nailed it

ive heard too many times, suicide is a selfish act. in my opinion its self-less. some people didnt ask to be born, if they arnt happy with their life theyre well within there right to end it. just like somebody is well within there right to take drugs, wether its deemed socially acceptable legality whatever. suicide takes some serious fucking balls. there is no right or wrong, its perspective. the heartache it causes afterwards is a shitter though. tbh going out being more remembered than fading away lonely into a piss pants old peoples home, sod that

 

[Marmalade]

tbh going out being more remembered than fading away lonely into a piss pants old peoples home, sod that

^^ this too. I'm not having kids, and I'm the youngest of my siblings (so in theory, I'll be the last of my direct clan and at the mercy of the state, cause I'm also poor ... , so honestly, this is probably how I'm gonna end up ... and the choice should be mine to either accept it, or make a conscious choice to check out early if that's what I'd prefer.

I said to someone by PM recently that I will keep this thread a "safe space" for those going through mental health problems.

It is here for people in distress to offload, and for others to offer support.

I'll remove posts that don't fit that profile.

can you be a bit more specific about the kind of posts that dont fit the right profile? Not cos I wanna be a cunt and push the limits, but so I can keep things productive if I'm not being so ... I like this thread and it's purpose and want it to do its job.


Hope that makes sense

 

[knock]

can you be a bit more specific about the kind of posts that dont fit the right profile? Not cos I wanna be a cunt and push the limits, but so I can keep things productive if I'm not being so ... I like this thread and it's purpose and want it to do its job.


Hope that makes sense

Yeah I wrote that post, then I thought, wait a minute, sounds a bit authoritarian. Not exactly my style.

So maybe we can have a discussion about it instead

I think this that other thread should be a "safe space" where people can post about whatever they're going through, how they're feeling, and so on. And others can give support, advice, help, encouragement.*

On the subject of suicide specifically, I feel that there have been a few generalisations made here that don't stand up to scrutiny. I don't think it's productive for anyone to assume that they know what suicidal thoughts, or depression generally, are like for anyone else. I think it's possible to come to an understanding, but it takes a bit of dialogue.

However is this the right thread to discuss that? edit: yes it is now It seems "academic", "theoretical". And I don't think the Mental Health Support thread should be an "academic" thread.


(* I think these things need to be defined a bit more clearly though. I don't think "Pull yourself together" or "get a grip" posts are helpful. I don't think abuse is helpful. I don't think snide remarks are helpful.)

 

[mydrugbuddy]

i totally agree knock. This isnt the thread for intellectualising suicide. That should be another thread.

I was impressed with your authoritative post, and then you doubted yourself.

if someone comes here as a last resort and sees pro suicide posts thats not good HR which is what the site is meant to be.

 

[Marmalade]

Yeah I wrote that post, then I thought, wait a minute, sounds a bit authoritarian. Not exactly my style.

So maybe we can have a discussion about it instead

I think this thread should be a "safe space" where people can post about whatever they're going through, how they're feeling, and so on. And others can give support, advice, help, encouragement.

On the subject of suicide specifically, I feel that there have been a few generalisations made here that don't stand up to scrutiny. I don't think it's productive for anyone to assume that they know what suicidal thoughts, or depression generally, are like for anyone else.

However is this the right thread to discuss that? It seems "academic", "theoretical". And I don't think the Mental Health Support thread should be an "academic" thread.

I like this thread. I try to be supportive in it. I'm not in a position to think or contemplate about what you've just said right now. Just tell me if I'm doing it right or wrong either way (and no explanations be needed). I'll take your word for it either way and can/will act/react accordingly.

[edit]

This isnt the thread for intellectualising suicide.

^ This tho, I fully 'get'. And can stick to just supportive comments on the subject, if that's kinda what you're implying knock

(and thanks MDB for the simplification )

 

[Allein]

^^^^

A agree but don't need to be so eloquent or diplomatic.

Posts are being made that could be enough to seriously affect those struggling with very real problems.

TDS is a fine resource and the mod team their should be recognised for their tireless work, however due to time differences and come cultural differences it's not always easy to fully interact there as a European .

Threads like this one are our 'cut-down' TDS and should be treated with the same respect and thoughtfulness when posting.

I've made my formal comments on the individual that I see as being a good proportion of the issue and I trust my view will be properly assessed .

 

[knock]

I just don't want to rush in here and start unapproving posts. I might separate some posts into another thread.

I'm not being diplomatic, Allein. I am simply attempting, as always, to be rational and inclusive.

Any cunt calls me diplomatic or, fuck sake, "sycophantic" (it's happened twice now and I do not like it). I will give you an infraction point. You can then take that up with seniors.

:D

 

[Marmalade]

Yeah I wrote that post, then I thought, wait a minute, sounds a bit authoritarian. Not exactly my style.

So maybe we can have a discussion about it instead

I think this thread should be a "safe space" where people can post about whatever they're going through, how they're feeling, and so on. And others can give support, advice, help, encouragement.*

On the subject of suicide specifically, I feel that there have been a few generalisations made here that don't stand up to scrutiny. I don't think it's productive for anyone to assume that they know what suicidal thoughts, or depression generally, are like for anyone else. I think it's possible to come to an understanding, but it takes a bit of dialogue.

However is this the right thread to discuss that? It seems "academic", "theoretical". And I don't think the Mental Health Support thread should be an "academic" thread.


(* I think these things need to be defined a bit more clearly though. I don't think "Pull yourself together" or "get a grip" posts are helpful. I don't think abuse is helpful. I don't think snide remarks are helpful.)

In agreement with everything you've written, and particularly the bolded part.

Please let me know in public or private if you think I've acted inappropriately and I'll adapt my approach without question.

 

[knock]

I just want to note that it's FUCKING HARD to moderate a discussion which is in full flow. I can't act or speak without posts being made before I get to hit whatever button it is I need to hit.

 

[knock]

In agreement with everything you've written, and particularly the bolded part.

Please let me know in public or private if you think I've acted inappropriately and I'll adapt my approach without question.

No I don't think you've acted inappropriately, any more than anyone else has including me.

I think the issue is we have two related but incompatible things going on in this thread. Actually there are more than two things, but there are only two things which I think are of value.

The first thing is: people expressing their anguish, and people offering support.

The second thing is: people discussing the nature of mental health and related issues.

So I think I should create a new thread: "EADD Mental Health Discussion Thread".

What do you (plural, EADD) think?

 

[justinsayno]

May I just say something ?

A close family member had a good go at suicide some years ago.
I can tell you it fucking hurts.
At first i was angry...why didnt she just call me ?
The anger past and the tears came...why couldnt she just call me ?

The people you leave behind will never get over it.


IMO the discussion on assisted suicide shouldn't be here. It could actually be a good thread if people can manage to debate it with a cool head, but it shouldnt be what people are reading if they are feeling close to the edge.

 

[One Thousand Words]

I sometimes think we're living in a Golden Age (it's all perspective). My generation just missed National Service for example. We have a decent abortion law. Drugs a plenty. I'm convinced the assisted suicide law will be passed in my lifetime. I really hope so. It's a stupid moralistic idea to say we can't take our own lives. It's born out of religious anachronism, the idea that only God (mythical being) can decide our fate.

That's where this 'coward' rubbish comes from. People like OTW parrot 'coward' like they think it's their own original thought. It's not. Your brain is just slavishly following its conditioning, Christianity seeping in and poisoning minds. Oh yes it does.

Christianity is inhuman. We leave people on beds for months dying in agony all because of that made up God shit.

Pass an assisted suicide act now.

I make no apologies for loving life. I have no problems if you don't want to call those people who take their lives cowards, I take offense in calling them brave though. There is nothing brave about suicide, at least I have never met a person who didn't try to take their lives painlessly. I feel for those who want to die, and euthanasia is justified for those suffering physical pain or conditions where a vegetative state is no way to live.

Depression and "a shit life" is no reason to end your life. While members here continue to take their own life I will continue to be a voice of difference. I feel it is irresponsible to promote or encourage views that suicide is ever a noble action. You are often the only social contact many people here have and like it or not you all need to show some fortitude and guidance to your fellow man. When you prove to me to be capable of saving your lost souls then I will walk away.

 

[Allein]

I just want to note that it's FUCKING HARD to moderate a discussion which is in full flow. I can't act or speak without posts being made before I get to hit whatever button it is I need to hit.

New thread with a clear set of rules

There are plenty of other threads and forums to make such comments but as someone that comes to BL at least inn part to discuss mental health I find myself not wanting to post here and am slowly migrating over to TDS, where this stuff just doesn't happen.

I'm really disappointed that one of the main instigators of problems in this thread and in EADD more widely seems to suffer no consequences, it's unjust and incocsistant.

WE have have only just lost another of the EADD family, would things have been different if the atmosphere was more supportive, I don't kmow and none of us ever will.

 

[mydrugbuddy]

Intellectualizing suicide? Que?

You think it's good HR to shout coward at someone to further demean them? If someone comes here suicidal and reads mine and OTW's posts, which post do you think is going to make them feel better? One calling them a coward or one offering them the deepest respect? And if they feel either a) a little worse or b) a little better, which of these two emotions, a or b, is more likely to put them in a different frame of mind?

its not about whose right whether its you or OTW, its about whether this kind of discussion should be in this thread. I think thats what knock and allein are saying.

 

[knock]

New thread with a clear set of rules

Exactly what I suggested in post #968

There are plenty of other threads and forums to make such comments but as someone that comes to BL at least inn part to discuss mental health I find myself not wanting to post here and am slowly migrating over to TDS, where this stuff just doesn't happen.

I'm really disappointed that one of the main instigators of problems in this thread and in EADD more widely seems to suffer no consequences, it's unjust and incocsistant.

WE have have only just lost another of the EADD family, would things have been different if the atmosphere was more supportive, I don't kmow and none of us ever will.

I'd respond to this now but I'm going to make that new thread instead....

 

[Marmalade]

I make no apologies for loving life. I have no problems if you don't want to call those people who take their lives cowards, I take offense in calling them brave though. There is nothing brave about suicide, at least I have never met a person who didn't try to take their lives painlessly. I feel for those who want to die, and euthanasia is justified for those suffering physical pain or conditions where a vegetative state is no way to live.

Depression and "a shit life" is no reason to end your life. While members here continue to take their own life I will continue to be a voice of difference. I feel it is irresponsible to promote or encourage views that suicide is ever a noble action. You are often the only social contact many people here have and like it or not you all need to show some fortitude and guidance to your fellow man. When you prove to me to be capable of saving your lost souls then I will walk away.

but this isn't 'supportive' in the terms of the nature of this thread. This thread is about providing support to those that need it, not a soapbox for an 'opinion' on depression. PLEASE recognise the VERY significant difference between offering support to people and expressing your opinion. This is actually pretty closely linked to what I was referrencing about personal intent being 'effective' and helpful

 

[Allein]

its not about whose right whether its you or OTW, its about whether this kind of discussion should be in this thread. I think thats what knock and allein are saying.

Double fixed for clarity and 10 golden start for your talent to be succinct

 

[knock]

The EADD Mental Health Discussion Thread

Here is where you can talk about:

What is depression?

Is suicide cowardly or brave?

And other such stuff. If you're looking for support while you go through rough times, go here.

 

[Marmalade]

What do you (plural, EADD) think?

I'll go along with what's best for the sake of the thread ... separation of philosophy and present dilema seems to be the crux, so I can see the natural division there being officially split

May I just say something ?

A close family member had a good go at suicide some years ago.
I can tell you it fucking hurts.
At first i was angry...why didnt she just call me ?
The anger past and the tears came...why couldnt she just call me ?

The people you leave behind will never get over it.


IMO the discussion on assisted suicide shouldn't be here. It could actually be a good thread if people can manage to debate it with a cool head, but it shouldnt be what people are reading if they are feeling close to the edge.

I don't see a discussion on assisted suicide? Just vague references.

 

[One Thousand Words]

A mental illness thread is not the place for promoting or even giving suicide justification. It is irresponsible and I think suicide should never be encouraged by strangers on the Internet. You aren't the ones left behind to deal with the fallout. It is easy to be a keyboard warrior when you then don't have to look after their family for the months and years after. I have said it before, if the families knew half the shit that some of you are privy to they would take action themselves. We have a unique window into a lot of members heads and we must act accordingly.

Being brave means sometimes looking like a cunt for the right reasons.