Anyone else not really feel addictiveness from normally addictive drugs?

[bunge]

Opiates have always been my downfall, ever since that first dose of dhc around the age of 15. Most stimulants I can take or leave, partially due to the comedowns. Nicotine and caffeine are major addictions of mine...I personally find tobacco more addicting than crack cocaine, as absurd as that sounds.

Thats not absurd at all; nicotine is (scientifically speaking) the most addictive drug known to mankind.
The addictive potential of any drug is increased with certain routes of administration (psychadelics are perhaps an exception). Smoking and injecting are the most addictive ROA's as they allow the majority of the drug to hit the brain quickly and produce a more intense effect.
Drugs that are taken orally generally take a bit longer to cause addiction but personal preferance and body chemistry will factor in as well.

 

[dopemegently]

True. Of all the drugs I've tried, nicotine is the one I've never been able to avoid in the long term.Why is it some pills take so little time to hit, though? I took a certain pill today, and it took a mere 10 minutes to kick in, for some reason?

 

[bunge]

I would guess thats mainly due to two factors, the fillers used in the pill dissolve at different rates (like diazepam thats bound in lactose which dissolves quickly) and the amount of food thats in your stomach at the time of ingestion (and what types of food, very fatty foods can slow the rate you absorb it).

 

[Toz]

I don't really find the hard drugs that addictive these days but that is only because I have been addicted to several of them for almost a decade. I've endured the pain and the suffering, I've been down the road of addiction and I know exactly where it ends. I just don't see myself going down that road again. I've had enough.

While I am sure I have not suffered my last opiate withdrawal, I can say that I am pretty sure I am done destroying myself by using these drugs. If I feel I am going over the edge these days, I simply stop. No matter how bad I feel, I do not allow myself to indulge in copious amounts of drugs, I know it will solve nothing in the end and only make the suffering a million times worse when I do decide that enough is enough. Because I always do sooner or later. Better to do it sooner and avoid as much of the suffering as possible I say.

I have and can easily turn down drugs like MDMA/Coke/Heroin/Meth when my friends are doing them. Hell, most of the time these days when I hang around them and they do drugs I stay sober. It doesn't bother me much. Except when they do heroin, those cravings really never go away, but I can endure it.

 

[Flynnal]

I find that Phenibut isn't addictive at all. I take it once a fortnight to once a month, and find that I don't feel the need to re-dose once it's a few days past taking it. I only use 750mg to 1.5g at the very most, not sure if this makes any difference. But it sure makes a difference to anxiety levels and worrying and obsessive thinking.

 

[Pill Hoarder]

well for ME-quitting smoking and i was a 3-4 pack a day man, was a walk in the park compared to pain pills. Quitting booze was nothing compared to them either and i was a daily drinker. I got really drunk one night, was shaking at work the next day and had 2 drinks there to straighten out-the next day one drink and it was over.

Ops took years of suffering to quit and without suboxone, and if i had easy access as i did, Idda never gotten off them-never!!!

All i want to get across is-dont believe what you read-I believed you could kick pain pills in 72 hours with 'flu like symptoms' MY FUCKING ASS!!!

 

[taskamil]

As i observed drug scene during last 16 years, also be in part of it, I think addiction is very general term. I categorize drug users and abusers in three general groups:

1. Reality escapers: This people uses drug mind altering effects to escape from reality. The reality is here means old mistakes that person done, hardness of life, bad vision of themselves, etc...This group will be highly addicted to alcohol, benzos, opiates and stimulants.
2. Just for fun users: This people uses drug with community. They use them as socializer or entertainer. This group will use alcohol, cannabis, inhalants and stimulants. They generally use with alot of people together and make parties. This group is also unlikely to be addicted.
3. Mind Explorers: This people uses drug to alter their mind and to see theirselves from outer. Like near death experiences, different ways of communication, energies, etc...This group will be less addicted. Their best drugs are psychodelics (lsd, mushrooms) ,dissosiatives (ketamine, dxm) and also delirants (anticholinergics).

I recommend every drug user to read 70's great psychodelic explorers like Timothy Leary, John Lilly, etc...Learn eight circuit model of consciousness stuff and read alot. If done properly one can really induce higher level of consciousness without any drugs. Be aware that every drug that is considered as psychoactive is a derivative of natural thing and also is a somekind part of your own body. Just more powerful version but they are already inside your body readily, waiting you to explore them. If you belong to first group you must realize that drugs or any other addictiveness (i mean obsessive compulsive behavior-sex,money,power, etc...) can not alter or fix the real problem. So as my point of view, addictiveness is not just a choice of abuser, it is problem that abuser can't solve and somekind of a exit path, and also leads to destruction of body at the end.

Just my opinions...

 

[regfairfield]

What Is phenibut

 

[Toz]

well for ME-quitting smoking and i was a 3-4 pack a day man, was a walk in the park compared to pain pills. Quitting booze was nothing compared to them either and i was a daily drinker. I got really drunk one night, was shaking at work the next day and had 2 drinks there to straighten out-the next day one drink and it was over.

Ops took years of suffering to quit and without suboxone, and if i had easy access as i did, Idda never gotten off them-never!!!

All i want to get across is-dont believe what you read-I believed you could kick pain pills in 72 hours with 'flu like symptoms' MY FUCKING ASS!!!

Lol yea I couldn't agree more, 72 hours and flu like symptoms my ass. More like 720 hours of intolerable sickness and then 720 more hours of depression and mild sickness. Those who shrug off opiate withdrawal in 72 hours were not even addicted to begín with, they just used a bit too much and had a minor hangover in my oppinion.

 

[opiatekrzy]

when I first started heroin 10yrs ago at age 18, I couldn't control myself, I was out of control. now im 27, and when I get high from it, its lke not a big deal to me at all, I even question and wonder why people are still strung out on heroin that I know 10yrs later still doing it crazy about it, I feel very fortunate to overcome the obsession of the euphoria from opiates, granted I was on suboxone for 3-4yrs, (and on methadone currently), but when I was on suboxone I remember I stopped taking it for 2 days and shot up heroin, I didn't end up selling all my subs and going back deep into addiction, like everyone else I know who started heroin with me 10yrs ago & still doing it, everytime they go on suboxone, they sell all of them for dope....me I didn't do that, I got high from the heroin, and went back to the subs and really didn't look back...im an addict I should understand addiction, sometimes I just don't understand how people still r heroin addicts when they have a bottle of methadone in there house and sell those for dope, or sell there subs for dope, 10yrs later still doing heroin. regardless im still dysfunction, I been an addict 15yrs, and substituted and became a crackhead for 4yrs after I stopped heroin and got on suboxone. now I don't do crack anymore, and opiates just don't phase me like thet used to....I think when you get older you get more self discipline and act more on intellect rather than emotion./compulsion.

 

[dopemegently]

It's very good to move past the need for opiate euphoria; suboxone helped me move past it. I've been on it far too long though- a whopping 8 years.
I only really take it to keep withdrawal at bay. I'm still as much an addict as I've ever been; caffeine, nicotine, suboxone, large amounts of phenibut, etizolam, some hallucinogens-it all adds up to a king kong sized monkey on my back, for sure.

 

[tyrael]

As i observed drug scene during last 16 years, also be in part of it, I think addiction is very general term. I categorize drug users and abusers in three general groups
..... If you belong to first group you must realize that drugs or any other addictiveness (i mean obsessive compulsive behavior-sex,money,power, etc...) can not alter or fix the real problem. So as my point of view, addictiveness is not just a choice of abuser, it is problem that abuser can't solve and somekind of a exit path, and also leads to destruction of body at the end.......Just my opinions...

Good post! I haven't fully read every post however I do kind of agree, although imo (and this is just my opinion of course) is that all three of those could (ultimately) be traced back to actually "user-type 1". The novelty seeker (your "type 2") tries x-drug for the first time for a specific escapism reason - even if the reason is "just" to escape boredom - and the mind-explorer is again, escaping from reality (for different reasons but ultimately its an escape). I believe ultimately all drug use comes back to escapism (just my opinion of course ).

... stop while you're ahead, esp if you think you can beat nature, cuz u cant in the end :D

+1, I'm sure, esp. those who've been on BL for a while, have seen the old "I've tried/do x-drug and I don't/won't get addicted"* and unfortunately do end up.

Opiates have always been my downfall.....Nicotine and caffeine are major addictions of mine...I personally find tobacco more addicting than crack cocaine, as absurd as that sounds.

I'm the same (re the opiate use ) yet every other drug I could take it or leave it! Nicotine can be unbelievably (unknowingly) addictive with a strong correlation between depression and nicotine!


* Not saying you're specifically saying this.

 

[taskamil]

Yes Tyreal, all drug users are escapers i agree. We use drugs to escape from something. But the worst is, escaping from this real world life problems, after drug effects are gone and you feel lonelyness, you and your ruined veins and come back to this world, this is the worst. I feel sometimes we have chains to this material world, that we all have to come back... like gravity always wins . After then we have no place to hide to feel peace and silence...
Also psychodelic explorers are in danger of being total loss control of reality, and going mad. Reality is also very subjective, it's a perception that may be %60 of the population perceive.

"The world of imagination is the world of eternity. It is the divine bosom into which we shall all go after the death of the vegetated body. This world of imagination is infinite and eternal, whereas the world of generation is finite and temporal. There exist in that eternal world the eternal realities of everything which we see reflected in this vegetable glass of nature." William Blake

 

[tyrael]

Yes Tyreal, all drug users are escapers i agree. We use drugs to escape from something. But the worst is...

Nice words!

Human perception (as a research/working) field is fascinating! As human, our senses are only able to perceive (read: receive and pass on to our brains) a percentage of the total information available (think the electromagnetic spectrum and our ability to perceive just a very small fraction - 400nm - 700nm from 0 to 1000+nm!), atop that our brains are only able to process a percentage of that (the rest just get "thrown away". Think optical/auditory/etc. illusions [although a large part of visual illusions are actually due to pre-processing by the retina!]), along with social (and such) conditioning/group dynamics, inferences, attention (or there lack of), memory (or more so the flaws adherent), information (physiological and theoretical) processing, etc., etc.

Basically, we're really not "getting" (receiving/processing/etc) all the information (which is available out there)!!.

It's interesting how psychedelics (or any psychoactive drug I guess) force us to change this "boxed" view all of those influences (above) force us into!

....Also psychodelic explorers are in danger of being total loss control of reality, and going mad. Reality is also very subjective, it's a perception that may be %60 of the population perceive....

True. In fact it's believed schizophrenia (which literally means "break from reality") / psychotic disorders might be a fault in one part of our "filtering" system allowing the brain the sense/receive data input it's not "set up" for, causing the brain to try to process this odd input and produce the effects this dz does. Psychosis is an interesting state of mind and as a disorder come an extremely long way (in terms of tx as well as basic understanding) since the 60's!

 

[omnipresenthuman]

I wanted to give my two cents - just because you don't think a drug is addictive at the moment doesn't mean that it's not very, very bad for your health. Meth and coke, regardless of how addicted you are to them or how addictive you think that they are, are physically harmful, point blank. This goes out to the OP - stop while you're ahead. Most drug addictions take several years to develop. At minimum, it takes a few months, usually, but those months creep up on you fast as hell. I don't even need to elaborate on this with a logical argument, of which many I could give yo...if you're still healthy, don't indulge, or even do, unhealthy stuff, you're just ingesting and putting bullshit into your body, no matter the seemingly positive effects that you get from the high. Stick to weed and psychedelics, if that's your thing, because you could definitely handle those if you can handle meth, but uppers are just bad news dude. Strong downers too but that's a different story...

 

[tyrael]

I wanted to give my two cents - just because you don't think a drug is addictive at the moment doesn't mean that it's not very, very bad for your health....

Very true. I don't think anyone would argue that cessation is most definitely the best course of action! Thing is, we're (mostly all) on BL for this specific reason, we do take drugs.

....At minimum, it takes a few months, usually, but those months creep up on you fast as hell....Stick to weed and psychedelics, if that's your thing, because you could definitely handle those if you can handle meth, but uppers are just bad news dude. Strong downers too but that's a different story...

An addiction cannot really be put into a time span - too many variables really. Also imo I wouldn't make a distinction between "uppers" or "downers" and their possible damage to oneself, pharmacology doesn't work this simply unfortunately. Each pharmacological profile for each drug should be taken on a per drug case. A "downer" could cause just as much, if not more, damage than a stimulant - all depends on many things but specifically each drug's MOA! Physicians (and such) are taught that all drugs are poisons, what matters is the dose! All drugs will have negative side effects, and positive side effects. When your physician scripts you something (or when you buy a drug), he's basically making a decision that the positive side effects from x-drug out weight any possible negative side effects* - anything from APAP to (medical) heroin (diacetylmorphine).

Your caution is still a good one regardless!


* This tenant is known - and could recite - by anyone who works with drugs in fact! Originating all the way in the 15th century where Paracelsus was quoted as saying, "Alle Dinge sind Gift und nichts ist ohne Gift; allein die Dosis macht, dass ein Ding kein Gift ist." which translates as, "All things are poison and nothing is without poison; only the dose makes a thing not a poison.". His work (and this quote) originated from toxicology, but this applies to pharmacology still.

 

[omnipresenthuman]

Thing is, I used to do harder stuff all the time for fun, I'm just a pothead now lol, that still qualifies me as a drug user where I'm from. But yes, you are right, I am not being technically correct when I just throw out 'uppers' and 'downers' like I know what I'm talking about. I just have experience with 'uppers' myself, I wasn't trying to be facetious. Mainly just trying to err on the side of caution because I've had my own issues with upper addiction, and I didn't think it was a big deal for a year and a half, and then it just hit me hard.

 

[tyrael]

.... Mainly just trying to err on the side of caution because I've had my own issues with upper addiction, and I didn't think it was a big deal for a year and a half, and then it just hit me hard.

Which is a good thing! (apologies if my post didn't come across as agreement! ). A good cautionary tail than, definitely!

 

[taskamil]

* This tenant is known - and could recite - by anyone who works with drugs in fact! Originating all the way in the 15th century where Paracelsus was quoted as saying, "Alle Dinge sind Gift und nichts ist ohne Gift; allein die Dosis macht, dass ein Ding kein Gift ist." which translates as, "All things are poison and nothing is without poison; only the dose makes a thing not a poison.". His work (and this quote) originated from toxicology, but this applies to pharmacology still.

One of the best words describes pharmacology is above. As we are humans infact we all need water. Water is generally considered safe but you can kill yourself if you drink too much water. It will cause hyponatremia. Every drug is poison and every poison is drug, only dosage matters.

when I first started heroin 10yrs ago at age 18, I couldn't control myself, I was out of control. now im 27, and when I get high from it, its lke not a big deal to me at all...

I agree, my obsession of seeking opiate eupharia decreased as i pass my thirties. Also the feel of eupharia and rush has decreased even after 3 months of cessation, same drug same dosage does not give old good eupharia. This probably because of growing old and receptors are also being old, if not dead . If an addict manage to pass twenties, he/she generally survive. There is also a risk at the beginning of forties because of body metabolism quickly changes and addict can't adapt herself/himself.

 

[tyrael]

One of the best words describes pharmacology is above. As we are humans infact we all need water. Water is generally considered safe but you can kill yourself if you drink too much water. It will cause hyponatremia. Every drug is poison and every poison is drug, only dosage matters....

"All drugs are poisons" is one of the first thing learnt in pharma-/toxicology class! All because of this, I truly believe one should 1. Have a regular physician - who knows you and your conditions/treatments inside and out - and 2. Be fully truthful to said physician, even if you think what you're taking is irrelevant! Just because something is OTC, or even easily purchasable from your local supermarket (eg, Saint Johns Wort and AD's), unless you're in the medical field yourself, one really doesn't/wouldn't know the drug-drug interactions with what you may think as an innocuous, supermarket "supplement" and a prescription drug - there are often interactions, with some being possible quite dangerous or even lethal (eg, Saint Johns Wort + AD's causing Serotonin Syndrome).

(I'm gonna be a little facetious.... ) When one consumes a lethal dose of water, the condition HypoNatremia and the subsequent pathologies are technically due to extremely low electrolyte (salts) plasma concentrations causing disturbances in the body's homeostasis and consequently a whole set of issues!

Technically the word describes extreme low concentrations (hypo) of Sodium (Sodium's two letter abbreviation being Na) in blood plasma (-emia)*. Although hyponatremia can be caused by many other conditions, when referring to water toxicity the word "hyponatremia" is (afaik) initially used as a general "catch all for reduced electrolyte concentrations - Na, K, Ca, Mg, Cl, etc. - due to excess water intake" (being the first sign/symptom in these cases).


* A tip for learning medical/patho-/physio-/etc. terminology ..... 99% of these words have their etiology derived from Greek/Latin and can often be deconstructioned into each constituent parts (prefix, in-fix and suffixes). There are a lot to learn - medicine as a profession is one of the oldest of course - however once you've learnt enough, it's possible to encounter a never before seen word, break it down, and understand somewhat it's pathology/MOA without initial study (although this does follow; learning ED/TD/LD50%'s, contra-/indications, dosages [adults and peds], blah, blah).