A little help guiding me in the right direction..

[infantannihilator]

Ahhh now, MDMA is one of the BEST psychedelics there is. I won't have that debate again but come on, MDMA psychotherapy. Calling MDMA 'not a psychedelic' was really an advertising move for the 70s and mind 80s generation...an idea of Shulgin's carried on by the therapists that used it, for marketing and PR back in the day. Of course it is a mind expanding substance.

Lol, not looking to have a debate. I just base it on my personal experience.. its amazing but there is too much of a "cracked out" aspect to it for me. Maybe I never truly had the pure stuff but I know that its definitely not something I am after nor that I can really attain and be relatively certain of its quality.

 

[Morninggloryseed]

ol, define trouble if not making a career out of this sort of thing? Aside from the HPPD type issues (I am assuming by career you mean, not giving a fuck what sides you may end up with)

I'll leave the perception of what I mean by career to you to define...I've been writing here a long time. HPPD.....yeah that is a pet peave of mine since I've run into 1 or 2 people out of 100 who actually have symptoms that can be diagnoses as HPPD. Let's just say you are talking to a writer, consultant, and person who has so integrated the psychedelic experience into every day life that I work hard to be in a psychedelic mindstate 24/7. I don't need to take them anymore, I am able to (for example) meditate myself into a 5-MeO-DMT void when the dentist is drilling into me. I've completely integrated being psychedelic into life in a way that...well I have no problem working, being amongst people of any brand, color, creed, disposition, and the like.

Oh and I agree, chemicals are chemicals, natural or lab. Having said that, and having used and worked with around 40 or so chemicals of the psychedelic brand.....I am still driven back to psilocin, DMT, 5-MeO-DMT, and missing my yopo beans...can't wait to place an order on pay day! Post iboga, most of the synthetics require WORK WORK WORK to get to the ++++ where as the ++++ seems to happen nearly every time with a magic plant.

Some off-board words of mine...

Natural, synthetic, fatural, schmymthetic. Remember, DMT was first made in a lab, later found in magic plants, later found in all living brains. Even Hoffman said (when asked if LSD was 'natural') 'Not Yet." I've had mescaline, DMT, 5-MeO-DMT, bufotenine, and all four are materials I will always have around me, all three are materials I will always know and love. Yet I find 2C-T_7, 2C-B, 2C-C, 2C-E, iprocin, psilacetin, and even a couple of the synthetic cannabinoids every bit as worth as the 'naturals.'

Maybe. I've grown mushrooms and extracted my own DMT (lovingly, patiently) but my shaving kit is blessed and I've become one with the razors and creams inside so I connect just as well with those.

Shaving kit refers to the synthetics.

And the MDMA comment was directed to magic duck. Carry on!

 

[infantannihilator]

Ahh I thought you were referring to the bit where I mentioned MDMA in my first post.

Appreciate the insights nonetheless

thanks guys

 

[Magickduck]

Lol, define trouble if not making a career out of this sort of thing? Aside from the HPPD type issues (I am assuming by career you mean, not giving a fuck what sides you may end up with)

I feel where you are coming from, I really do, but to me, chemicals are chemicals, whether theyre natural or synthetic.. lsd is the most widely used and known and refereed to of all the psychedelics and its synthetic. I like the fact that I have a greater control over my dosage (within batches). If I know that 19mg was a little too much, the next time round I'll take 16 and see whatsup kind of deal. With plants and natural stuff its really a crapshoot as to the exact quantities youre getting. I dont know how to get DMT, I know I can get cactus though, and as far as shrooms go, yeah theyre easy as hell to grow and I'll probably grow some when I want to go for them again! lol. Smokeables are out of the question at the present as I live in a basement apartment and can't smoke indoors. At night I'll head out to smoke some pot around the corner in the park if I feel the need, but Id rather not get into a psychedelic mess like that.. While I am looking into synthetics, I very much do like to play things safe as far as my trip goes. My one experience I shared above taught me a lot about my surroundings and what I personally prefer, though I do realize that thats in regards to mushrooms and doesnt speak for every other substance.

2c-b is banned pretty much universally though no?

I have to look up more of the canadian law.. but I don't think its legal :/

ok, well even if you are going to look at it like that, there are far more instances of health issues and long term side effects from the 2c's and nbome's compared to the natural ones such as mescaline and psilocybin.

And LSD, I consider it to be one of the most powerful but can also be one of the most damaging.

 

[Magickduck]

Ahhh now, MDMA is one of the BEST psychedelics there is. I won't have that debate again but come on, MDMA psychotherapy. Calling MDMA 'not a psychedelic' was really an advertising move for the 70s and mind 80s generation...an idea of Shulgin's carried on by the therapists that used it, for marketing and PR back in the day. Of course it is a mind expanding substance.

I still don't consider it a psychedelic... maybe by literal definition of the WORD, but not the categorazation of drugs - I put it in its own category with empathogens. The realizations are of a completely different nature, the feeling is different, there is no abstract analytical thought process, the thoughts are more shallow... while its amazing, to me, its not a psychedelic. just as ketamine is a dissassociative.

Lol, not looking to have a debate. I just base it on my personal experience.. its amazing but there is too much of a "cracked out" aspect to it for me. Maybe I never truly had the pure stuff but I know that its definitely not something I am after nor that I can really attain and be relatively certain of its quality.

must have not had real MDMA. you can get a tester kit to determine if you've got real stuff.

 

[Morninggloryseed]

Yeah from that perspective, ibogaine and 5-MeO-DMT aren't really psychedelic either. Ibogaine 'looks' like LSD on the surface but the place it takes you too is not universal oneness. And 5-MeO-DMT (while it does give oneness) is hardly a 'mind expanding' drug anyway you look at it. Still, falling back on the chemistry...MDMA is a PEA related to mescaline and should go into the psychedelic category. Ketamine, is not mind expanding...entheogenic indeed but you aren't going to discover DNA in a K-hole.

 

[GolemGolem]

The Nbomes always treated me as a more visual good 2c-x. My selfish problems were from doing them every week or two for a while. Don't do that, the cross tolerance really is rather brutal. I'd go easier on those than anything else you picked up for the sake of the other things you've picked up if nothing else.
2c-e I think is the most intense mentally of what you have picked up, and can send you to places amazing and terrifying. I've seen music on a number of substances, but not like 2c-e.
Though I hear Morning Glory and I'm considering taking a longer break, growing some mushrooms and then extracting the alkaloids and then using those with MXE and/or DXM. Might not discover DNA but I'm not a scientist, I just like their work.

 

[Morninggloryseed]

Ok someone really quick answer me this....I am very fried right now from a long day of work and it prevents me from using the fucking search engine...

How long do the NBOMEs last? Are they 24hr trips like DOx and the FLY series (no thanks), or shorter (hmmmmm)? I love the PEAs, why haven't I done more research into the NBOMEs?

 

[infantannihilator]

I still don't consider it a psychedelic... maybe by literal definition of the WORD, but not the categorazation of drugs - I put it in its own category with empathogens. The realizations are of a completely different nature, the feeling is different, there is no abstract analytical thought process, the thoughts are more shallow... while its amazing, to me, its not a psychedelic. just as ketamine is a dissassociative.
must have not had real MDMA. you can get a tester kit to determine if you've got real stuff.

I agree with you, though I have found in the past it to potentiate visual effects along with weed. I can actually remember OEVs with a mushroom and "e" combination. It wasnt just mdma obviously,no pressed pill ever is and I am not naive to think so. could very well have been mda or speed or god knows what that led to the oevs though. the beauty of combinations.. unknown ones at that!

The problem with tester kits is just this, even if you test the product you got, majority of the time thats the only product you can get.. I realize there are some ways out there other than relying on a dude you know, but I don't buy into the whole e-currency if you catch my drift. This is really the whole crux of why RC's entice me. Aside from substances I can grow, I truly have no access to the true goto synthetics like mdma and lsd.

I've not yet bought 2c-e,d or i, but have been considering it. The place I bought the nBome off of just put it on sale since theyre ending distribution of it and they gave me a voucher sicne I ordered a day before and literally paid double... so I may grab some 4-aco-dmt just for the hell of it, to have.

Yeah from that perspective, ibogaine and 5-MeO-DMT aren't really psychedelic either. Ibogaine 'looks' like LSD on the surface but the place it takes you too is not universal oneness. And 5-MeO-DMT (while it does give oneness) is hardly a 'mind expanding' drug anyway you look at it. Still, falling back on the chemistry...MDMA is a PEA related to mescaline and should go into the psychedelic category. Ketamine, is not mind expanding...entheogenic indeed but you aren't going to discover DNA in a K-hole.

When you speak of some of these substances and relate them to MDMA it really intrigues me.. I never really had considered those sort of euphoric tactile good feels to be a psychadelic thing, I guess because of my shroom dominant background.

At this point I somewhat feel that I can read forever, but I truly don't know until I jump in the deep end so to speak lol.

 

[infantannihilator]

Ok someone really quick answer me this....I am very fried right now from a long day of work and it prevents me from using the fucking search engine...

How long do the NBOMEs last? Are they 24hr trips like DOx and the FLY series (no thanks), or shorter (hmmmmm)? I love the PEAs, why haven't I done more research into the NBOMEs?

You know I am a noob here, but from what I have read 25i is really ROA dependant, nasally a come up is supposedly achieved in under an hour and will peak for a few and then come down very abruptly, but not hard like a crash, like 4-6 hours. sublingual it takes longer to kick in and pushes out the experience to the 8 hour mark. Again this is just from what I have read, I have no experience yet (as you know)

Ive done some other research on the others but not as much, but iirc like the 2c-x's they have varying lengths in trip time

 

[Morninggloryseed]

I see the thread below that speaks of these NBOMEs and the one based off 2C-D seems shortest...but how short is short? Any of these things 6-8hr experience (or less)? I did make an attempt to look.

 

[infantannihilator]

2c-d is supposed to be the shortest of the 2c-x's too from what Ive read.. I know 25i is supposed to be in the 6-8 hour range, even taken buccally.

Personally, and this is just based on what I've read, the buccal administration is really hit or miss as far as the time it takes to come on and how much actually gets absorbed, and it seems most of the issues people have had were because they ended up taking another tab an hour in thinking they felt nothing and then 30 mins later were floored with negative side effects as it all kicked in. Insufflation is regarded as dangerous on erowid and other places, but I believe that to be simply because of people trying to eye out 1mg or less and fucking up.. it comes on a lot faster, but your dose is reliable and repeatable. Just have to make sure you prep it right using the volumetric method is all. I honestly read through the majority of the 4 huge B&D threads on 25i before hitting the order button

 

[GolemGolem]

6-8 hours, 3-4 of those intense, little hard to get to sleep for a few hours more is how med/low sub-lingual dose treats most.

I've only done nasal with a volumetric liquid solution as to not fuck up my dose. It tends to hit me like a ton of bricks if you dose more than 500mics and the first hour or two feels unhealthy as hell, crazy pulse, breathing labored. I'm inclined to go with Erowid on this one. Sub-lingual is a little more finicky, tastes nasty, and takes longer but if I ever do nbome's again it's how I'll do them.

 

[psykedenlitenment]

Morning glory, IME, 25i will be finishing visuals at 6-8 hours, but leaves you squirrely for up to another 4, totaling 10-12. 25c seems to be completely wrapped up at 8-9, but it's infinitely easier to sleep. Though i haven't tread into heavy territory with either. 25i max 1.2 mgs, 25c at about .75 mgs.

Edit: i do have more experience with 25i, about 12 experiments, 25c about 5 asperigus's

 

[Solipsis]

Sorry about the energy invested in this thread but it does indeed clash with the rules: no 'what should I take?' threads, which this basically is even if you use an euphemism.

Still it seems like you got a few answers.

Check the Beginner's FAQ (signature below in my link) where the question is covered a little bit - in short the advice is just to read a lot about it instead of asking other people. Along the way you will probably get some ideas about what you are looking for in a psychedelic and sooner or later you will read descriptions that match your interest. It can be a lot of homework to do, but you can have fun exploring these things IMO.