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  • LAVA Moderator: Shinji Ikari

WORK SUCKS: Talk About Your Job

Surely as someone who is in favor of rigor and the precision of mathematics when it comes to arguments, you can see the flaw in your logic here?

Your data-set for BFAs and MFAs is limited to those you see working in that hospital's Starbucks. Don't you think your chosen field has precluded you from knowing the true amount of other career opportunities those poor saps with the fine arts degrees have?

Granted the drummer in my band is a BFA in English and has 3 jobs washing dishes.....lol poor guy...
 
I have never met anyone with a fine arts degree who had a) a non-entry level job b) a job that actually involved the arts.

**Excepting Professors themselves, but that's kind of an out-layer and based on the FACT that there is usually 1 prof and 2 T.A.'s for a class of 300 people, that's 1% who actually do have a job not in the service industry.

Most of the professional artists I've met had a) no degree or b) a degree in STEM or something close like comp sci and used the skills they got in their STEM degree to do art with. Be that using higher mathematics to create stunning imagery or using engineering skills to make performance art pieces involving machines, or physics to do cool ass shit with optics/lasers/holograms/X-rays/florescent stuff, Chem to do similarly neat stuff with material science (quantum dots, non-newtonian fluids, etc.) biomed to do life related art (plasticized organs, imagery of organisms, etc) comp sci to do dope graphics/music/etc. And they all make pretty good bank too, while actually doing art, not serving coffee to boring Hepatologists wearing Yamukas and talking in a nasal voice, complaining about "How dwy the aaaire is and it's huwrting my nasal cavitehs."
 
I actually agree with you very much. Reading a novel and discussing its meaning is a task you can easily achieve with the internet for free. Do that a few times and you've got yourself a college literature course. Sure you might be missing out on the insights of a particularly cunning professor, but a bright person with google and patience can approximate much of whatever that prof's wisdom entails. A dumb person's efforts in any intellectual pursuit doesn't matter anyway. They're just making themselves feel good. I agree, in principle, with the idea that you go to college to enrich yourself regardless of the economic opportunities out there, but now a days it's too hard out there to be fucking around with the "poly-sci" fields, and you can have a spiritual journey that doesn't require making installments a decade after the fact.

That's why I've only ever done science in college when I wasn't doing music electives, but dropped out in the end.

I'm hoping to get a fresh start once I get this job the local private uni here. Free tuition, and benefits, and never more than 40 hour work weeks...not to mention ties with the Eastman Conservatory where I can finally meet the sexy cellist/repressed nympho of my dreams.
 
I wish that more people went to college/uni for what they are actually interested in instead of what they are pushed to go to school for. I feel like the majority of my years in college/uni were a waste because of that. Oh well.

I still love my job ... not really related to my post-secondary education. I never thought that I would be okay with a 9-5 type job (I hate mornings) but I actually wake up at 7 AM every day, no complaints, deal with rush hour, because I really like my job. Who would have guessed. I remember every summer job or part time job I've had, and school, I would DREAD going to work or class. Not anymore :D

Also nice to be on a salary with benefits finally lol :p :)
 
CoffeeDrinker said:
Some random thoughts, before I continue to ignore you for the rest of my life.

Pride is a sign of taking oneself way too seriously. Pride in one's accomplishments is rational, but pride in yourself, to the point where you get elevated blood pressure and red in the face just for thinking about doing some menial job that you think you are too good for, is just plain immaturity. Especially when you have no accomplishments of note.

People that say they love their job usually have pretty sweet jobs too. As a person with a wholly adolescent sense of the world, I'm sure you never thought that there could be jobs that people enjoyed outside of the cliched childhood fantasies of "rockstar, astronaut, kung fu master, princess" but, alas, there's so much stuff out there you literally have no idea what you're talking about.
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You can enjoy cleaning shitty toilets at a Mexican restaurant for $7.25 with no benefits. Who needs pride? or maybe even a little dignity for that matter...

If you want to be a drug addict living in your parent's basement who never raises a proper family then fuck it! Swallow that horrible sense of egotism that would want your kids to have healthcare.

It's a good thing African-American slaves never had too much pride or else thier masters wouldn't have been so successful exploiting the shit out of them. I suppose Martin Luther King Jr. was egotistical prick too. He had an overblown sense of self when he thought that African-Americans should be able to eek out more than a menial existence. Cesar Chavez was a total docuhe too...how dare he demand humane treatment and decent pay for people that picked vegetables under the california sun. People pay good money to get a good tan you know...
 
If you want to be a drug addict living in your parent's basement who never raises a proper family then fuck it! Swallow that horrible sense of egotism that would want your kids to have healthcare.
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What's wrong with something in the middle? What's wrong with being an academic in STEM, still doing drugs, still partying, not having kids, etc.

Shit, that way you can get a nice condo downtown in a tower with a lake view instead of a house in a sub-division and drive a Maserati instead of a minivan and go on dates with your bangin' hot (absent of stretch marks, no saggy boobs, vagoo not dilated out) S/O to pick up other girls and guys and have a wicked fun hotel party, instead of going to P.T.A. meetings with your rarely sexual, not hot, bitchy baby momma?
 
rangrz said:
What's wrong with something in the middle? What's wrong with being an academic in STEM, still doing drugs, still partying, not having kids, etc.

Shit, that way you can get a nice condo downtown in a tower with a lake view instead of a house in a sub-division and drive a Maserati instead of a minivan and go on dates with your bangin' hot (absent of stretch marks, no saggy boobs, vagoo not dilated out) S/O to pick up other girls and guys and have a wicked fun hotel party, instead of going to P.T.A. meetings with your rarely sexual, not hot, bitchy baby momma?
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Do students in Canada make enough money to drive Maseratis? I suppose you get some sort of GI benefit. I'm talking about the minimum wage workforce. There are lots of "ordinary" people working minimum wage and trying to support families. Bluelight is apparently full of playboys who think fast food is just a summer job people need to quit bitching about. People are trying to make a living doing that shit and they deserve better. Do you not realize the slum conditions that most minimum wage earners in America live in? It ain't no fucking condo, and anything other than a leaking shithole costs a fortune to rent.
 
Do students in Canada make enough money to drive Maseratis?
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Generally not. But recently graduated physicians in their residency do. Engineers with a good gig do. I was not strictly saying "students" I was saying to avoid cleaning toilets, go to school for something in the STEM field. After school, you have actual, useful knowledge that is in demand and brings in good money. You get job that pays you enough to buy a Maserati and have a condo downtown.

Vs not going to school or going into the arts/humanities, where you work at Starbucks forever more.
 
MyFinalRest said:
I'm talking about the minimum wage workforce. There are lots of "ordinary" people working minimum wage and trying to support families. Bluelight is apparently full of playboys who think fast food is just a summer job people need to quit bitching about. People are trying to make a living doing that shit and they deserve better. Do you not realize the slum conditions that most minimum wage earners in America live in? It ain't no fucking condo, and anything other than a leaking shithole costs a fortune to rent.
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I can agree with most of this post ^

MFR, I think your heart's in the right place. The problem is that you tend to be a dick when people disagree you or worse yet, offer you advice.
 
rangrz said:
What's wrong with something in the middle? What's wrong with being an academic in STEM, still doing drugs, still partying, not having kids, etc.

Shit, that way you can get a nice condo downtown in a tower with a lake view instead of a house in a sub-division and drive a Maserati instead of a minivan and go on dates with your bangin' hot (absent of stretch marks, no saggy boobs, vagoo not dilated out) S/O to pick up other girls and guys and have a wicked fun hotel party, instead of going to P.T.A. meetings with your rarely sexual, not hot, bitchy baby momma?
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LOL I love this! This is almost exactly what my boyfriend and I want / have planned. Obviously we both aren't doing STEM work, but we both have good jobs, don't plan on having kids, and want to keep having fun for a long time!

And I would loooooove to have a condo downtown with the lakeview ... would be amazing ... expensive but amazing! (Eh, without kids, easier to afford it!!)

I hate how many people think that you need kids, a family, etc. to be successful. Many people do not have kids ... or should not have kids. (Sorry, this is going a bit further than education and careers, but I feel like having kids would totally ruin my career!) I respect that other people have kids and are great with kids, and we do need kids to keep the generations going, but that is NOT my thing. I'd rather be focused on my career and my life than kids. :p
 
shimazu said:
I know someone from a while back who started their own business

it's definitely working outisde though like if you want to get as much done as possible. South Americans make me look like molasses tbh
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Lucky! I don't know anyone with a business, so I'll have to keep looking. So far, I've only been able to find openings for either experienced landscapers, or full-time. I might have to start my own business...
 
rangrz said:
Generally not. But recently graduated physicians in their residency do. Engineers with a good gig do. I was not strictly saying "students" I was saying to avoid cleaning toilets, go to school for something in the STEM field. After school, you have actual, useful knowledge that is in demand and brings in good money. You get job that pays you enough to buy a Maserati and have a condo downtown.

Vs not going to school or going into the arts/humanities, where you work at Starbucks forever more.
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Those STEM jobs will become more scarce as more students gravitate towards that field - and they are!
 
MyFinalRest said:
Those STEM jobs will become more scarce as more students gravitate towards that field - and they are!
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not for a long time. take statistics, for example: the explosion of available data is creating an analytics arms race in all kinds of industries, with companies fighting to find better and more effective ways to leverage the unprecedented amount of information they now have at their fingertips. this means not only will they need more statisticians to analyze the data, but also an entire framework around those analytics - data integrity, model validation, more sophisticated audit teams, a whole world of IT and programming support, etc etc etc. This will also increase demand for computing and software resources, as well as more specialized consulting teams to help companies through this transition. Likewise, all of these processes are subject to regulation, so the regulators also need to hire more technical staff to evaluate the data, models, software, etc. I can only speak for my own industry (mathematical finance), but I find it hard to imagine that a similar situation isn't unfolding in all kinds of other fields as well.
 
A degree is just paper, being competent is entirely different. there are people with STEM degrees who are unemployable fools because they are incompetent, and there are people with art degrees who are highly employable and command a large salary because they are competent.
 
I love my career. 14 years now. 2 positions. 2 different states. I loved that I never planned it.
I knew that if I went into science I would figure out something I liked to learn and apply along the way.

I am 40. Married. Childless by choice. Raising a proper family has never been a goal of mine. No Maserati. I drive a Mercedes.
 
Jean-Paul said:
i hate my job. it's a meaningless, robotic, peon job for people with no education. that being said i started doing the fafsa thing here (the first time i fucked up and tried to start too soon before it came through) and i do plan on doing that still.....but in a place i can actually stand. so while my moving right now might seem flaky from the outside i see it as an investment in my mental health. i can transfer my shitty job there, look for a better one or get on disability (i am surely actually deserving of this, mentally, i surely assure you) and work part time. THEN do the fafsa thing out there. i don't know what i specifically want to do but i know pursuing something you have an interest in opens up doors to tolerable jobs just by having the degree and networking. plus with the grants i'll qualify for it's not like i'll be getting myself into debt or something. we'll see.
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Hey at least you have a job and working towards something better. I miss working at the shelter and that was my favorite job ever. My boss helped lots of people get on SSI or SSDI. I'm still waiting for my hearing. (I have a number of health problems) I was approved for fafsa last fall but he told me it would not help my case to go back to university or even a technical college. I think the logic behind that is if you're getting job training/advancing your career that makes you employable. So if you want to pursue getting disability, you should apply soon because it does take a while for that process.
 
kaywholed said:
A degree is just paper, being competent is entirely different. there are people with STEM degrees who are unemployable fools because they are incompetent, and there are people with art degrees who are highly employable and command a large salary because they are competent.
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This is true. Professors just put the students through college and grade on large enough curves that C's are the lowest grades awarded. Same with the notion of "experience." Lots of experienced managers are looking for work because everybody hates their guts for fucking everything up and acting like a butthole.
 
Experience is overrated. It doesn't translate into actual ability and certainly not enthusiasm. I was much better before I ever worked...now I'm just disillusioned and committed to doing the least possible to get by.

We've all had that old teacher who worked in the system for 50 years, but that never made her any damn good did it?

Same thng for the world of romance...experienced folks are just more likely to be jaded and have STD's...
 
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