NZ - Cannabis now a stroke risk

poledriver

poledriver

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NZ - Cannabis now a stroke risk

CANNABIS use may more than double the risk of stroke in young adults, say Auckland researchers, who are convinced it is the illegal drug, and not the tobacco the victims are also smoking, that is to blame.

The study of 160 stroke and mini-stroke victims, aged between 18 and 55, was presented to a stroke conference in Hawaii this week.

It showed they were 2.3 times more likely than other patients to have cannabis detected in urine tests.

"This is the first case-controlled study to show a possible link to the increased risk of stroke from cannabis," said study leader, Auckland University Professor Alan Barber.

Previous research showed strokes developed hours after cannabis use, he said.

But the association is confounded because all but one of the stroke patients who were cannabis users also used tobacco regularly.

"We believe it is the cannabis use and not tobacco," Prof Barber said.


"People need to think twice about using cannabis, because it can affect brain development and result in emphysema, heart attack and now stroke."

He hopes to conduct another study to determine whether there's an association between cannabis and stroke independent of tobacco use.

"This may prove difficult given the risks of bias and ethical strictures of studying the use of an illegal substance.

"However, the high prevalence of cannabis use in this cohort of younger stroke patients makes this research imperative."

It was also challenging to study the use of illegal substances because people were likely to lie about using them.

http://www.theaustralian.com.au/new...ow-a-stroke-risk/story-fn3dxix6-1226570467745
 
The study of 160 stroke and mini-stroke victims, aged between 18 and 55, was presented to a stroke conference in Hawaii this week.

It showed they were 2.3 times more likely than other patients to have cannabis detected in urine tests.
Click to expand...

But the association is confounded because all but one of the stroke patients who were cannabis users also used tobacco regularly.

"We believe it is the cannabis use and not tobacco," Prof Barber said.
Click to expand...

Yeh right.. 160 people tested who had strokes or mini-strokes and because they were 2 times more likely to have cannabis in their system they blame cannabis? All but one of the stroke patients who were cannabis users also used tobacco regularly, so why do they believe it was the cannabis then? What about things like diet, genetics, exercise and probably other factors.
 
And of course quite a few newspapers and news sites are posting this story, and I'm sure more and more will, why is it when some 'study' comes out regarding any negative things to do with recreational drugs many sites jump on it to wack it up on their pages, but when positive articles or 'studies' come to light not nearly as many will post them up? Seems that way to me anyway.
 
how is cannabis going to be worse than tobacco in causing emphysemia?
these kind of agendas really piss me off

"We believe it is the cannabis use and not tobacco," Prof Barber said.
ok give us some in detail facts then prof.

clearly biased.
 
poledriver said:
And of course quite a few newspapers and news sites are posting this story, and I'm sure more and more will, why is it when some 'study' comes out regarding any negative things to do with recreational drugs many sites jump on it to wack it up on their pages, but when positive articles or 'studies' come to light not nearly as many will post them up?
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fear and bad news sells basically. without going too conspiracy theory, an ancient plant that has mind expanding properties has always got to be portrayed to be bad, evil, dangerous, even though you may now and again see a positive story in the msm
 
They don't understand the correlation.

The correlation seems to be that cannabis users are more likely to smoke cigarettes than non-users, and that tobacco use can cause strokes.

EDIT: After stepping away to the computer I realized the above comment was probably fueled by the stoner "pot is harmless" knee-jerk reaction, prompted by an obvious flaw in their method. Pot definitely is not harmless, nor is it very well understood yet.
 
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Since cannabis can raise heart rate and blood pressure, it makes sense that it could be connected to strokes.
But the study doesn't really seem to show that.
It seems like a propaganda tool, instead. Very unfortunate when political agenda dictates scientific findings.

For example, there is a big difference between
It showed they were 2.3 times more likely than other patients to have cannabis detected in urine tests.
Click to expand...
and
Researchers believe cannabis users are 2.3 times more likely to have a stroke than other patients
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But the article states the second, based on the first.
Incredibly ignorant and deceptive.

Also, the lead author seems very unconvinced of a link between cannabis use and stroke incidence, based on the study, and despite the quote that the article uses.

He hopes to conduct another study to determine whether there's an association between cannabis and stroke independent of tobacco use.

"This may prove difficult given the risks of bias and ethical strictures of studying the use of an illegal substance.

"However, the high prevalence of cannabis use in this cohort of younger stroke patients makes this research imperative."
Click to expand...

Maybe he should determine whether there is an associate between cannabis and stroke BEFORE articles like this are published, and before he says
"We believe it is the cannabis use and not tobacco," Prof Barber said
Click to expand...
 
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Does smoking marijuana cause stroke?

There have been scattered reports in the literature claiming an association between the use of cannabis and ischemia and/or hemorrhagic stroke. Although no convincing mechanism has been postulated, some suggest that use of marijuana or hashish and the occurrence of stroke may stem from the ability of cannabis to cause orthostatic hypotension, or possibly vasoconstriction.

If such an association is real, it must be exceedingly rare. The purpose of this paper, from the University of Strasbourg in France, was to “analyze the different aspects of neurovascular complications in cannabis users as described in the literature”. This stated purpose is so vague as to be useless, and, in fact, the entire paper is a mess.

The authors searched PubMed for articles association stroke OR ischemic stroke with cannabis OR marijuana. The say they identified 59 cases. But how were these chosen? What was the case definition? Did the case descriptions rule out other known causes of stroke, such as cocaine or amphetamine use? The authors don’t bother to discuss this. I do agree with their recommendation that young patients with unexplained stroke by asked in detail about their drug consumption.
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http://www.thepoisonreview.com/2013/01/26/does-smoking-marijuana-cause-stroke/
 
There is actually a lot of decent evidence in support of this hypothesis. A lot of it is connected to the effect of cannabis on cerebral perfusion and due to it's propensity to cause cerebral vasoconstriction and vasospasm.

Lots of studies from the last 25-30 years.

an ancient plant that has mind expanding properties has always got to be portrayed to be bad, evil, dangerous,
Click to expand...

What does being "ancient" or a photosynthetic eukaryote with organelles known as chloroplasts got to do with it? Does that make hemlock safe too?

Mind expanding properties, is both a very subjective/questionable claim (how is it more "mind expanding" than morphine or cocaine, also plant products!) and again irrelevant (nothing about the property "mind expanding" is disjunctive from the property "increases risk of CVA")

Ultimately, these scientists, like virtually all other scientists, looked at a set of data, noticed something funny in that data, did some statistical analysis, looked at some other research on the general subject, and reported their findings. If you don't like, well tough. I don't like falling down the stairs, it hurts and stuff like that, but that does not really negate the validity of Classical mechanics and General relativity which both posit such events are likely to occur due to gravity. That's the damn truth of the matter.
 
As far as I can tell your evidence centers around a few case studies which don't prove cannabis as more dangerous than strenuous activity or coffee - rather, than most things which raise blood pressure and/or constrict blood vessels.
 
Quick Google search told me tobacco "Doubles the risk of stroke". How true that statement is I'm not sure, didn't bother finding any studies myself.

All but one of these cannabis smokers smoked tobacco. I'd say more research needs to be done before newspapers run around shouting "CANNABIS CAUSES STROKES".
 
Weed has always caused my heart to beat fast........I dont like the weed effects much so I quit toking 10 years ago but the study the scientists did doesnt hold water imo because everyone person but a couple smoked cigs as well so the study is in fact no good because you can easily say people smoking weed & cigs have a higher risk of getting a stroke then a person just smoking weed w/o using cigs.
 
The "confounding" variable of the cannabis users also being tobacco users is not that much of a confounding variable at all. It's REALLY fucking simple to control for that one. Just compare the cannabis + tobacco smokers stroke risk to that of tobacco only smokers.

Holy shit! That's a brilliant idea! Why, it's almost as if I just cuntpasted that idea from the trials on hormonal contraception and it's increased risk of CVA in young women who are smokers. Or are y'all here on BL going to start arguing "Herpderp, if the women where smokers anyways, like then how can you possibly say it was the pill?!" Because one notices that Women who smoke *and* are on the pill have a higher stroke incidence than women who only smoke, or alternatively, you will find more women who take BC and smoke in a survey of young female stroke patients then you will in a survey of arbitrary internal medicine patients, even after adjusting for the number of smokers.

Which is what they did in this study, but replace the pill with cannabis.

Plus, there is good, very controlled studies showing the general propensity of cannabis to alter blood flow to the brain. Controlled as in testing/ensuring the experiment and control subjects differ only by their cannabis intake, which is done right there during the experiment. There is also decent evidence linking cannabis to more rapid onset of angina, and a significant increase in the risk of M.I. after smoking, suggesting very strongly that cannabis does something wonky that causes blood vessels to spasm or constrict.
 
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Don't know if this is related, but... I've noticed in myself and in other users with low blood pressure, smoking weed lowers blood pressure even more. If you already have weak cerebral blood flow, then cutting more pressure could lead to stroke.

It's not just high blood pressure that causes stroke but also blood pressure that is too low.
 
rangrz said:
The "confounding" variable of the cannabis users also being tobacco users is not that much of a confounding variable at all. It's REALLY fucking simple to control for that one. Just compare the cannabis + tobacco smokers stroke risk to that of tobacco only smokers.
Click to expand...

I'm no expert on these things and I agree it's likely that cannabis is a stroke risk because of all the effects it has on circulation, but if tobacco doubles the risk of stroke and in this studies they say the cannabis smokers (who also smoked tobacco) were 2.3 times more likely to have suffered a stroke how do we work out the stroke risk caused by cannabis alone?

Still it would be best if they did a study without tobacco being involved, what if the combination of cannabis and tobacco has some kind of interaction which causes stroke risk to increase even more than just combining the risks of the two.
 
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