Gibberings CXVIII: We used to score using phone boxes

[Marmalade]

I don't think anyone has ever mentioned Americans giving up the right to bear arms. Just the right to bear high powered assault rifles. It's not a decent principle to defend imo, most countries in the "developed" world don't have a right to wave machine guns about & I don't believe that they should. Cunts like that cunt should not be allowed to own assault rifles.

Personal freedom is a decent principle to defend imo. 'developed' world doesn't really factor for me.

 

[parttime crackhead]

Personal freedom is a decent principle, yes. Fair enough. When that personal freedom involves weapons designed for mass murder though...

I look at it in fairly simple terms based on my own life. No-one around me owns massive caches of machine guns. I feel perfectly safe in my own home with a baseball bat. I don't think I would feel perfectly safe with that baseball bat if I knew that all around me, in all the other houses, were loads of assault rifles. So in my opinion I am safer with tight gun control. Do you disagree with that? Libertarianism/personal freedom aside, just from a simple personal safety perspective.

 

[Marmalade]

Exactly. People who are rabid gun hungry nutters are exactly the sort of people who shouldn't be allowed guns. The dude said in that interview that he has something like 50 guns. 50 fucking guns. Aye, coz you need 50 guns to defend yourself. Stupid cunt.

I disagree with this too. He's the type of person to know about guns and how to handle them and knows what they're for and what they aren't. I'd wager this type of person is least likely to go postal and nuts and shoot up a school or whatever. He may fantasise about what his plans are 'when the anarchy comes' but that's highly unlikely to be factor in his lifetime. He's a patriot, and likely loathes the shootings which have generated the current debate

 

[parttime crackhead]

Did you see how much he flipped out just with creepy Piers asking him questions? Imagine what that cunt does if his neighbour accidentally kicked a football through his window then told him to fuck off when he started screaming abuse at them. "I'm a get my gaaaaawd daaamn rifle!!! Get off my propertaaaay!"

Anyway, I've explained my reasons for feeling how I do about gun control in my previous post. They're fairly simple.

Explain why you think it's a good thing that Alex Jones can own 50 guns. Why is that better than him not being able to own 50 guns? Why is that a benefit to society?

 

[SpecialK_]

Similar stuff came to my mind when watching, he is exactly the kind of person I wouldn't want to have access to a gun.

 

[tekkeN]

I think he flips out most when talking about losing his guns.. Free speech is cool anyway, a lot of governments wouldn't let him say the things he says. That principle is more important than whether you're allowed an assault rifle or not

 

[parttime crackhead]

He's all about "FUCK THE FIRST AMENDMENT IF YOU WANT TO SAY BAD THINGS ABOUT THE MUTHAFUCKIN SECOND AMENDMENT!!!! YOU'LL NEVER TAKE MY GUNS GOD DAMN YOU YOU FUCKING FOREIGNER GIMMEMAGUNS GUNSGUNSGUNS!" As soon as the thought of someone taking his precious comes into his head he totally loses it lol. They should revoke his firearms license (I hope to fuck that's actually a thing) just on the basis of that interview.

"It's OK Alex, US citizens can own assault rifles. It's just you who can't"


Edit - Btw, do they not have any sort of regulation as to the amount of guns you can own? I'm fairly sure they're all registered to the owners so there must be a record & you'd think there would be someone going "Right, you've already got 49 guns, I think that's plenty". Is it just a straight up "You're not allowed a gun" or baws oot "Have aaaaaaaall the guns!"?

Edit again - Just remembered a bit in that interview where it seems like he's almost about to say "A bomb killed people in x (I can't remember what/where he was talking about) so should we ban bombs???" lol.

 

[Marmalade]

Did you see how much he flipped out just with creepy Piers asking him questions? Imagine what that cunt does if his neighbour accidentally kicked a football through his window then told him to fuck off when he started screaming abuse at them. "I'm a get my gaaaaawd daaamn rifle!!! Get off my propertaaaay!"

Anyway, I've explained my reasons for feeling how I do about gun control in my previous post. They're fairly simple.

Explain why you think it's a good thing that Alex Jones can own 50 guns. Why is that better than him not being able to own 50 guns? Why is that a benefit to society?

it's NOTHING to do with being a benefit to society. He doesn't exist to be a benefit to society. He believes in having the right to defend himself against his government. It's not a morally bankrupt principle to believe in.

I don't like or trust the way my government behaves with the legitimate arms it bears ... [edit] (possibly the kind of argument he was alluding to with your bomb question? - just saw that you'd edited that in .. )

There are lots of valid principles in this guys outlook imo. And again, I don't think this kind of guy is someone you have to be overly concerned about when it comes to going tonto.

I have more concerns about the amount of personal hand guns owned by the average joe in the states and the relaxed laws about owning and carrying one, than I do about this guy. He's a passionate loon, but I don't think he's a dangerous one.

I think he flips out most when talking about losing his guns.. Free speech is cool anyway, a lot of governments wouldn't let him say the things he says. That principle is more important than whether you're allowed an assault rifle or not

^^ this.

I saw how he was. I don't think he is likely to shoot his neighbour in a moment of anger for a ridiculous reason. I think you're wrong about that. I think you're making assumptions based on your perception of what motivates his anger.

His anger is motivated by the frustration about what he believes to be potential and valid threats to withdraw what he sees as his rights to defend himself against his government (as Tekken notes). I don't think the extreme way he reacted can be extrapolated as a theory on how he will react to everyday problematc social situations

 

[parttime crackhead]

I was only really using Alex Jones as a prop to illustrate a point about gun control in that post that you've quoted. The point isn't really 'would Alex Jones shoot his neighbour or not'. My point is that there should be strict gun control.

You seem to have missed my post where I explained, aside from the Alex Jones factor, why I think strict gun control is a good thing. I personally feel safer with strict gun control, yer man is vehemently against strict gun control, therefore I think he is totally wrong. I would feel less safe if my country controlled guns the way that people like Alex Jones want them to be controlled (ie, not really at all).

 

[Marmalade]

I was only really using Alex Jones as a prop to illustrate a point about gun control in that post that you've quoted. The point isn't really 'would Alex Jones should his neighbour or not'. My point is that there should be stricter gun control.

You seem to have missed my post where I explained, aside from the Alex Jones factor, why I think strict gun control is a good thing. I personally feel safer with strict gun control, yer man is vehemently against strict gun control, therefore I think he is totally wrong. I think that I would feel less safe if my country controlled guns the way that people like Alex Jones want them to be controlled (ie, not really at all).

ahhh ... safety. and feeling safe. ... it's a chestnut and a half. feeling safe doesn't equate to being safer. It's the exact misnomer that all our political structures are based around tho.



....


however. all that being said, I DO agree with having strict gun controls. I just have a lot of empathy and time for his line of reasoning (the wild conspiracy theories on NWO etc should be taken with a pinch of salt, but imo they too also have a lot of very valid underpinning concerns and points that shouldn't just be dismissed as 'crazy talk')

I think it's easy to do what's just been done, and dismiss this guy out of hand as a crazy nutjob loon who's the exact type of person we need 'protecting' from. that imo completely misinterprets the situation and the issues involved in the topic


[edit]
eh, bedtime for me ... I can't be doing with sleeping in until 3pm again .. cause nowt gets done

'nite folks

 

[acieed_ed]

right you two bedtime.now.

 

[parttime crackhead]

Aye, to be fair I think Piers Morgan was a mile out with the "Who knocked down the towers?" line. You could tell exactly what he was going for there. He was going for "This guy's a crackpot, don't listen to him". That's why I said in my original post about this that I wished they'd got someone better to interview him. Someone that could actually debate against his points (which I don't think would be too difficult) rather than just show him to be a loony (which he is, but I suppose loonies can have valid arguments too so that shouldn't be the sole way to argue against him).

ahhh ... safety. and feeling safe. ... it's a chestnut and a half. feeling safe doesn't equate to being safer. It's the exact misnomer that all our political structures are based around tho.

Change everything where I said "I feel safer" to "In my opinion I am safer" then.

 

[mattnotrik]

Anyone seen this? Or maybe Ive been living in the dark ages

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/technology-20944726

A laser weapons system that can shoot down two drones at a distance of over a mile has been demonstrated by Rheinmetall Defence.

The German defence firm used the high-energy laser equipment to shoot fast-moving drones at a distance.

The system, which uses two laser weapons, was also used to cut through a steel girder a kilometre away.

The company plans to make the laser weapons system mobile and to integrate automatic cannon.

The high-energy laser system was used to cut through a 15mm-thick steel girder, and to shoot out of the air a steel ball designed to mimic a mortar round

Being able to penetrate 1.5cm of steel from about 1km is impressive, as well as targeting a fast drone and keeping locked on. Its all getting a bit star warsy

 

[Marmalade]

Change everything where I said "I feel safer" to "In my opinion I am safer" then.

too late, you've commited yourself now. no making any last minute changes ;p

right you two bedtime.now.

LOL

you don't get to call that one unless someone's been typing HEAVILY IN CAPS and using lots of exclamation marks !!!11!1 ..

anyhoo ... bedtime (my choice, not because you said ) ... toodles ..

 

[parttime crackhead]

too late, you've commited yourself now. no making any last minute changes ;p

Ha, good one. When was the last time you didn't edit the shit out of a post

 

[acieed_ed]

hey marmz having a quick snack then directly to bed myself.
work tommorow u have a lot of explaining to do lol
nn

 

[ColtDan]

This guy is absolutely off his fucking rocker.

Agreed

 

[masaz]

Morning darlings!

Got 3000 words to do before 4pm. Got 1000 so far in about half an hour, is the creative writing class I accidentally transferred to because I'm an idiot. Been putting it off for weeks but getting right into it now. Should be even better when my housemate gets up to buy me my writin' whiskey :D

Need to get a fuckin new debit card sorted.

 

[StoneHappyMonday]

Personal freedom is a decent principle to defend imo.

Dependent entirely upon context. Personal freedom to do what? To ignore laws that are beneficial to society just because someone decides they have a different political view on something? When libertarianism crosses into right-wing extremism, with guns, then the personal freedom argument becomes redundant. Collective freedom vs individual freedom (with a gun)? Because socialised health care/abortion/immigration may not be your thing?

Personal freedom, against big government, has always been a cause celebre of the right-wing. Health&Safety? Stop interfering government. I'll kill my workers how I damn want to. Its the survival of the fittest innit?

He believes in having the right to defend himself against his government. It's not a morally bankrupt principle to believe in.

Having the right to defend yourself against the government goes way beyond the 'principle' of the right to bear arms. The right to defend yourself involves debate and all sorts of (in our country) extra-parliamentary activity plus strong democratic collective-based laws that enshrine such rights of behaviour. It's called, as Tekken notes, free speech. America's gun control comes from an era 200 years ago when times were slightly different. The right to bear arms in the US today is completely morally bankrupt and the preserve of the slightly psycopathic right-wing. It has nothing to do with the common good against a dangerous authoritarian government anymore.

 

[effie]

Morning snolls Good luck! All about the writin' whiskey, channel your inner HST :D

Determined to be more productive today. Let the battle with the bedroom-mould commence. Also decided now is the time to get back in touch with a load of people I've lost contact with over the past few months and attempt to catch up with my PMs. This could take a while..

I need a new debit card too, mine has an alarmingly enlarging crack in it. Probably from crushing shit up, I don't usually use it for that but desperate times..

edit: morning SHM