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Opioids What anti convulsants would people recommend with tramadol?

scarlet_rain

scarlet_rain

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Joined
Nov 19, 2012
Messages
6
Location
London
Ive heard of benzos being used alot but I'm just wondering what other ones can be used. I have personally never had a seizure on it, but ive heard of people suddenly having them even on a lower dose than they normally take. I was specifically wondering about whether gabapentin would work cos I can get that easliy.
Any suggestions?
 
I'm confused are you trying to potentiate tramadol? Because at this point it seems like you are asking what you should take with tramadol to ensure a seizure.
 
In general tramadol shouldn't be taken recreationally, but it is the doc for a lot of people. Just dose low because tramadol will lower your seizure threshold. And don't mix with other drugs that will lower your seizure threshold. Like GABA drugs and benzos.
 
thanks, ive never taken over 400mg so im not really worried i would just hate to have a seizure so thought id ask.
 
As far as i know, Gabapentin/Lyrica won't help preventing seizures caused by tramadol. They are anti-convulsants, but only work for some types of seizures (and not the generalized ones tramadol is known to cause) and even then usually aren't used as a single treatment - they're more of an add-on if another med isn't enough to control the seizures. At least that's my understanding of how they work, but if i'm wrong please correct me.

Other anti-convulsant drugs like valproic acid etc need time to build up in your system to work, so that's no alternative either. So this leaves benzos, which also isn't the best idea (i think i don't need to tell you why). After i had a seizure from tramadol (about 250mg, so if your seizure threshold is relatively low anyway, it doesn't need high doses) i took benzos with it for a while, but really, that's just stupid and i stopped because tramadol just isn't worth it. Don't take tramadol if you're worried about seizures or if you have a higher risk for seizures in any way.

Unrelated: Pregabalin caused one of my seizures. But i think you have to look at that as a paradoxical reaction. Also, it was a massive dose of Lyrica, so maybe it's fair to say stupidity caused the seizure.
 
When I was in recovery I heard a couple horror stories about people having grand mal seizures at threshold/lower doses of tramadol.
 
Yeah, and it isn't even necessary for one to have a low seizure threshold for that. For me that may be the case (2 seizures from meds, so yeah, as i said - maybe), but i heard of several people who certainly don't have a low seizure threshold (judging by the stuff they are able to put in their bodys, while not sleeping etc) who some day out of the blue had a grand mal from a normal dose of tramadol. Don't know why that is.
 
prabably just their body finally giving in (kinda like the way u can develop allergies) and as far as I know i dont have a low threshold.
 
Somberlain said:
As far as i know, Gabapentin/Lyrica won't help preventing seizures caused by tramadol. They are anti-convulsants, but only work for some types of seizures (and not the generalized ones tramadol is known to cause) and even then usually aren't used as a single treatment - they're more of an add-on if another med isn't enough to control the seizures. At least that's my understanding of how they work, but if i'm wrong please correct me.

Other anti-convulsant drugs like valproic acid etc need time to build up in your system to work, so that's no alternative either. So this leaves benzos, which also isn't the best idea (i think i don't need to tell you why). After i had a seizure from tramadol (about 250mg, so if your seizure threshold is relatively low anyway, it doesn't need high doses) i took benzos with it for a while, but really, that's just stupid and i stopped because tramadol just isn't worth it. Don't take tramadol if you're worried about seizures or if you have a higher risk for seizures in any way.

Unrelated: Pregabalin caused one of my seizures. But i think you have to look at that as a paradoxical reaction. Also, it was a massive dose of Lyrica, so maybe it's fair to say stupidity caused the seizure.
Click to expand...


this is true pregabalin is specifically prescribed for certain seizures, but it still raises the seizure threshold. taking lyrica/gabapentin with tramadol is still better than taking tramadol alone.

i recommend clonazepam, valium, and/or pregabalin/gabapentin. 400mg tramadol has the opioid action of 10-20mg IV morphine, which is very limited opioid action, and tramadol is an NRI which should cause stimulation. benzos + tramadol is definitely better than tramadol alone! that being said, if you take 10-20mgs of klonopin with tramadol than of course this would not be safe! im not saying down a whole script of kpin/valium, im saying take like 0.5-1mg kpin or 10-20mgs valium and you should be fine
 
Also one might consider fasting/ketosis. It is proven method against seizures and sometimes in even severe forms of epilepsy it works better than drugs.

In ketosis brains favor GABA over glutamate and they work more efficiently and smoothly. Ketosis is neuroprotective state. Personally, I've used ketosis during my benzo etc. withdrawals and feel it helps.

One time I took tramadol 400mg (not once - in about 10 hours) with 600mg lyrica DURING acute phase of benzo withdrawal. I knew I was playing dangerous roulette but my fait was so strong on ketosis and other neuroprotective/seizure preventive things I used that I took the risk. Because at that time I really needed to relax, I had'nt been able to sleep more than 2-4 hours at night for allmost week and was still going to work everyday etc. Well, I didn't seize. It was nice and relaxing experience during benzo withdrawal. One time I panicked though.

I'm allmost certain I would have seized if I hadn't been in ketosis and have ate something shit because sometimes during my rapid withdrawals even tiny amount of simple carbohydrates (like 50g of Tuc salt snackers) had made me feeling I would seize in a minute. Like tight and tingling feeling all over the body, especially in neck, chest and arms, and anxiety/panic etc. Sometimes when I have that feeling during withdrawal I just take MCT or coconut oil and it soothes things allmost immediately. Thing is, MCT oils turns into ketonebodies very quickly and brains get them very fast. So thats a one way to ease tension and prevent seizures.

If interested my experimental withdrawal regarding ketosis/fasting, I have a thread in ADD Achieves from it. Because I won't be posting here again studies and links about fasting/ketosis neuroprotective and seizure preventive effects.
 
Tramadol causes tonic-clonic seizures, and gabapentin is generally for management/prevention of focal seizures, but I'm sure it would still exhibit a preventative effect.

There's really no need to worry about a seizure though at a dose of 400mg, unless you have a history of seizures or an uncommonly low seizure threshold. But something like lamotrigine or valproate would be better options if you want a big league anticonvulsant. Or you could just take a benzodiazepine like clonazepam.
 
Honestly, you should not be taking so much tramadol that you have to worry about seizures, I really would not recommend people take more than 400mg or otherwise consume hundreds if not thousands of milligrams of tramadol when spread out over the day, that's really, really, really bad for you. The SNRI aspect of tramadol ruins it to the point where if you have a tolerance high enough to be worrying about seizures, you really need to switch to another opioid now.

In the spirits of harm reduction, it would be highly advisable that you switched to a safer opioid such as the codeine-based compounds, where you have less to worry about and don't have to resort to extreme measures like combining CNS depressants. I know that it can be done, mixing benzodiazepines with tramadol to allow higher dosing, but the problem with that is your obviously taking a large dose of an opioid narcotic CNS depressant and multiplying the CNS depressant effects exponentially when you add in a benzodiazepine like 0.25mg clonazepam or 5mg diazepam.

It would be much more dangerous to be uninformed and recklessly take benzodiazepines with your opioid dose if your not very tolerant to benzodiazepines and opioids. The doses have to be methodically calculated and lowered accordingly when mixing CNS depressants, and in order to do the math, one must determine the level of tolerance to both benzodiazepines and opioids. Combining them results in exponential CNS depression and most users have reported that taking a benzodiazepine with an opioid actually diminishes / blunts the euphoric and other positive effects of the opioid, which is yet another reason not to proceed with your original plan.

Tramadol is way too dangerous to mess around with, and because it's weak potency wise, it is widely prescribed and thought of as a less-abusable pain killer, there are lots of misinformed users out there with access to it and a percentage of those will require hospitalization.
 
If you must dose over 400mg of tramadol, I would recommend an anticonvulsant benzo with minimal sedation and respiratory depression, such as clonazepam. Long duration is also key. A dose of 0,5-1mg should be plenty.
 
okay. used gabapentin and so far okay, helps me get to sleep anyway cos the tramadol makes me feel kinda wired.
 
You said you've never taken more than 400mg of tramadol? I've almost seized out on 300mgs (although without much tolerance, so I guess it's not a great comparison), so if you can take 400mg, you're fine, just as a general rule, NEVER take more than 400mg. If you're still worried about the seizure danger, to be honest, benzos and gabapentin are a bit of an overkill, smoking a particularly sedating indica, even if just a little (which is probably better, weed overpowers weaker opiates if you smoke too much), it'll sort you out. The time that I almost seized, I had dosed 300mg, and then forgotten about it, and had a hash sesh with some friends, and then after maybe 3 hours, we stopped smoking to go get food, but then the weed wore off, and I started to shake violently and get extreme nausea and itching, and I could not move my hands. My friends rushed me back to the house, carried me up to the room, packed me a huge bong rip, and since I couldn't move very well, they pressed it up to my mouth and lit it, and literally the second I inhaled, I felt my muscles loosen up, and I felt 100% normal again, and I went into a nod immediately.

However, benzos will make tramadol a lot more enjoyable, and IME, combining tram with pretty much any downer (even 75-100mg DPH will do the trick, although clonazepam or temazepam are ideal) will make for a long and VERY nice nod, albeit a slightly dirty feeling one, although tramadol isn't particularly known for it's "clean" feelings, anyway, the SNRI effects ruin the opioid effects. With any opioid tolerance, tramadol is recreationally useless on it's own, the only times I use it are for minor opioid WD or in combination with either benzos or other opioids (oxy + tram + temazepam is one of my favorite combos), although when used during heavy opioid WD it will not only not help the WD, but it will make it 10X worse and the seizure danger will skyrocket, so when I say minor opioid WD, I mean like after a week-long heroin/oxy binge, where I will get mild sickness on the day after, but not full WD, I will take either tramadol or codeine throughout the next few days, tapering as to make whatever WD symptoms I doget as manageable as possible.

Well, yeah, that's pretty much all you could possibly need to know lol, lucky you, I found your thread right after taking some adderall, so instead of getting a simple answer to your question, you get the comprehensive guide to tramadol! I know everybody just loves when I take amps and make these posts... Right? :p
 
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