Opioids Best Opiod For Pain

[tackyjan]

Codeine 15mg -vs- Dihydrocodeine 30mg

From a recreational point of view which is more desirable, Codeine 15mg or Dihydrocodeine 30mg?

Thanks!



P.S. Can any braniac out there tell me the difference between codeine and dihydrocodeine?

 

[shreddedlettuce]

http://www.bluelight.ru/vb/threads/564885-Opioid-Conversion-Chart

 

[bayhead415]

I can not really explain the difference, but there is codine, hydrocodone, and dihydrocodone just as there is morphine, hydromorphone, and dihydromorphone. The prefix di means two. I honestly could not explain the difference between codeine and hydrocodone, but I believe dihydrocodone is two hydrocodone molecules bonded to each other, but I could be very wrong. Do some research it should not be to hard to figure out. I would guess DHC is more potent than codeine and would require a lower dose, but I do not know for sure. A quick look on wikipedia or a google search will probably answer your question. This requires very little knowledge to research and does not require a brainiac to understand.

 

[tricomb]

^I don't think that's how it works.

Codeine, dihydrocodeine, hydrocodone respectively.

 

[sekio]

I honestly could not explain the difference between codeine and hydrocodone, but I believe dihydrocodone is two hydrocodone molecules bonded to each other, but I could be very wrong.

Wrongo

Codeine is a naturally occuring opium alkaloid, an ether of morphine, it is 3-methylmorphine.

It can go through a process called hydrogenation, that adds 2 hydrogen atoms, to make dihydrocodeine. This can be further oxidised to dihydrocodeinone (aka hydrocodone). see attached schema

Oxycodone/oxymorphone is produced through a related process, it is also a hydrogenated and oxidised codeine derivative.

---


On the topic of your thread, dihydrocodeine is variable betwen individuals, but 30mg of DHC will probably do more for killing pain than 15mg codeine ever will. Neither of those is a particularly large dose.

 

[bayhead415]

Thanks for correcting me. I was just doing a lazy response as it is not too hard to look it up and figure it out. I just did not care to take the time I believe the OP should be taking to figure out the answer...

edit: I especially appreciate the second post that lists the main difference between morphine and codeine being the upper left bond that I am to uneducated to name properly. Also thanks for helping me realize dihydrocodeine and dihydrocodone are different things where the first is another name for vicodin/hydrocodone... I would have never guessed.

Edit 2: Very good wrap up tricomb definitely good things to notice besides different molecular structure.

 

[tricomb]

I'm not even really sure what the OP was asking, "what's the difference" is a very vague question. I'd try to answer it as follows:
-They are different opioids, with different affinities for the delta, kappa, and mu receptors.
-Different potency
-Different bioavailability
-Different half-life / duration

Basically, they're two slightly different molecules that behave alike, but have different therapeutic values/properties.

 

[EEhouseEE]

Does anyone know which would be in Tylenol 3 pills ( canada)....Codeine or dihydrocodeine ?

 

[sekio]

Tylenol 3 is codeine.

 

[bayhead415]

Tylonal 3 is also not pure codine, but also contains other compounds toxic in high doses. If you take more than 1 or 2 at a time or are using multiple over a long period I would recommend doing a CWE to extract the codine from the tylonal 3 formulation leaving most of the acetaminophen or other additive behind.

-Crush pill

-Mix in lukewarm water (the less the better, but too much will not let too much through. A shot glass is a good way to eyebal it.) and stir for a minute or two (not hot, but not cold. Room temp can do, but mix very well)

-Put the tylonal 3 saturated water in the fridge to cool down until you see a layer of powder at the bottom. This should be the stuff you do not want and not the codine. It may happen in a few minutes, but the longer you leave it in the more acetaminophen will fall to the bottom.

-Filter through a coffee filter into a fresh cup and you should be left with all the codeine and maybe a little acetaminophen or w/e else could be there. There should be some of the pill in the coffee filter and can be further washed with a tiny bit of cold water (maybe a ml at most) to try to further extract any possible remaining codeine, but this is unnecessary and may end up with more of what you are trying to separate to end in your filtered solution.

-Either drink plain or with some fruit juice to make the taste.

Be careful not to easily go overboard as codeine is a powerful narcotic with addictive properties that you do not want to develop a dependency to. Codeine is also the least addictive natural opiate compound as well as the least powerful & sedating and is definitely the safest to use for recreation IMO. Still even though this is true do not underestimate the strength and potential for addiction this compound has.

 

[tackyjan]

I injured my back in a car accident a few months ago and I have a doctor who is pretty liberal and he is going to give me some pain meds. Which opiod is the best for pain. I was thinking of asking for one of the following: Codeine, Darvocet, DF118, or Dihydrocodeine. Which one would help the pain the best?

 

[fatstep]

If youre in the US darvocet is out of the question because it was removed from the market a couple years ago, also df118 is the same as dihydrocodeine, but i'd pick that one as it's stronger than codeine

 

[King J]

If you're in the USA, your only choices are: Tramadol, Codeine, Tapentadol, Morphine, Hydrocodone, Oxycodone, Hydromorphone, Oxymorphone, and Fentanyl; strength is in order from weakest to strongest (that doesn't mean that the weakest won't work as you have to build up a tolerance to medication and all medications act differently.

The above listed medications are known as narcotic opioid/opiate-based pain killers and are highly addictive with withdrawal symptoms if you choose to suddenly stop taking them.

Your question was very vague. Is your pain muscle, neuro, or bone-related? If more than one is associated with your pain, then you'll need a combination of medications to help alleviate your pain.

Common neuro pain relievers: Neurontin, Lyrica

Common muscle relaxers (for muscle pain/spasms): Flexeril, Zanaflex, Baclofen, Soma

It's always best to try over the counter medications instead of getting prescriptions, especially mentally addictive and physically dependent medications as listed above.

In some countries, such as Canada, Mexico, and across the UK, there are over the counter pain relief medications. Some provide combinations of weak opiate/narcotic medications while others contain combinations of muscle relaxers. It must be so nice to live in such free open market countries so that you can find what's best for you.

Common over the counter medications: Tylenol, Ibuprofen, Alleve, and Aspirin.

Again, you were vague and don't say anything about your pain or what's causing it. Maybe you strained a muscle and thus that could be healed within 3 days with proper care without any medication.

Good luck to you.

 

[tackyjan]

If you're in the USA, your only choices are: Tramadol, Codeine, Tapentadol, Morphine, Hydrocodone, Oxycodone, Hydromorphone, Oxymorphone, and Fentanyl; strength is in order from weakest to strongest (that doesn't mean that the weakest won't work as you have to build up a tolerance to medication and all medications act differently.

The above listed medications are known as narcotic opioid/opiate-based pain killers and are highly addictive with withdrawal symptoms if you choose to suddenly stop taking them.

Your question was very vague. Is your pain muscle, neuro, or bone-related? If more than one is associated with your pain, then you'll need a combination of medications to help alleviate your pain.

Common neuro pain relievers: Neurontin, Lyrica

Common muscle relaxers (for muscle pain/spasms): Flexeril, Zanaflex, Baclofen, Soma

It's always best to try over the counter medications instead of getting prescriptions, especially mentally addictive and physically dependent medications as listed above.

In some countries, such as Canada, Mexico, and across the UK, there are over the counter pain relief medications. Some provide combinations of weak opiate/narcotic medications while others contain combinations of muscle relaxers. It must be so nice to live in such free open market countries so that you can find what's best for you.

Common over the counter medications: Tylenol, Ibuprofen, Alleve, and Aspirin.

Again, you were vague and don't say anything about your pain or what's causing it. Maybe you strained a muscle and thus that could be healed within 3 days with proper care without any medication.

Good luck to you.

Wow thanks for the thorough response!!! It's late and I am tired so that's probably why my question was vague. I will elaborate more in the morning after my coffee.

I do have a quick question... DF118 was not in your list of meds. What exactly is DF118? Why such a strange name?

I have seen pharmacies selling both DF118 and dihydrocodeine. If they are the same why would they carry both?

Thanks!

 

[tricomb]

He never said Tylenol 3 was pure codeine, it would be redundant for him to say "Tylenol 3 is Tylenol with codeine"

Also I recommend using COLD water for your COLD water extraction

 

[T. Calderone]

When I was in pain management, oxycodone worked well for me but it got expensive. Hydrocodone provides good pain relief as well and cheaper.
Codeine was harsh on my stomach for some reason. Also alternating with ibuprofen helps.

 

[tackyjan]

When I was in pain management, oxycodone worked well for me but it got expensive. Hydrocodone provides good pain relief as well and cheaper.
Codeine was harsh on my stomach for some reason. Also alternating with ibuprofen helps.

I just thought of something.... I had bariatric surgery (gastric sleeve) and I was told I can never take NSAIDs (ibuprofen, etc.). I w9onder if the 118 or dihydrocodeine will hurt my stomach.

 

[bayhead415]

I never said he did, but some might think that coming across this topic. Also the idea of mixing it warm is to make sure it all dissolve as fast as possible and than the cooling in the fridge is supposed to cool down the solution to crash out the acetaminophen (kinda like freezing a DMT saturated naptha solution to crash out the crystals). I would think mixing it in cold water could allow for some codeine to be left behind as well as take longer to trap the codeine in the water, but it is probably a negligible difference to the method I posted. That is just the way I originally learned to do it and do not find it takes too much effort or time as well as leaves a negligible amount of acetaminophen in the end that I only notice due to the light taste of it. Plus I only leave my water in the fridge for a very short amount of time and the longer it is left in the fridge the more acetaminophen will crash out.

I don't think one method is more efficient than another and just up to personal preference, but I have not done a purly cold water extract so I could not say for sure

 

[bayhead415]

In my experience I find using a morphine solution at night as well as a codeine formulation in the daytime only if needed. Morphine formulations I find to produce a more sedating effect with analgesia, while codeine formulations produce euphoria with analgesia. This is a very simplified view on something that is very complex and may not be 100% correct as it is based off my uneducated opinion and speculations.

I myself use oxymorphone(opana) at night and hydrocodone in the day if needed. There is also dilaudid and morphine instead of oxymorphone, but I find them to not have as strictly as a sedating and sleep inducing effect as opana which could actually be the wrong choice as opana can easily get to the point where you can not keep your eyes open and continue working on what you where doing. Codeine and oxycodone are other common codeine formulations available and in my experience they do not cause as much of a sedating effect, but still retaining the analgesia effect. I would reccomend working with some combonation of these medications first by testing them and seeing what works best for you. Since people digest things differently not everyone gets the same effect and where all codeine formulations do not sedate me it can get another person to become so sedated they can not keep their head up.

There are also many synthetic opiates, but I recommend working with natural opiates first as the synthetic ones usually develop major long lasting dependencies due to their ability to bind to the receptors longer and work at a lower dose. Although that is why they have some benefits to use if one can not find relief from natural opiates without dosing multiple times a day or with a low dose.

This will definitely take some trial and error to figure out the best medication and you are fortunate to have a liberal doctor that will work with you to find the right medication. Best wishes to you for a fast recovery!

Edit: dihydrocodeine is the compound name while DF-118 is a brand name. Both are the same thing, but just manufactured from different people.

Edit 2: Darvocet seems to be quite risky and even be banned in US and EU. Someone correct me if I am wrong. Kingj also explained very well that there are other things that you should try first before trying to get heavily addictive narcotic medication.

 

[kokaino]

Morphine. All research studies have concluded that there is not a single painkiller out there that has proven itself to be superior to morphine. It was discovered in 1804 and more than 200 years later it is still the best we have. There is no doubt about it. Maybe its closest family members like heroin (morphine diacetate), nicomorphine, dibenzoylmorphine, dipropanoylmorphine, desomorphine, hydromorphinol, and dihydromorphine are comparable.

In my experience I find using a morphine solution at night as well as a codeine formulation in the daytime only if needed. Morphine formulations I find to produce a more sedating effect with analgesia, while codeine formulations produce euphoria with analgesia. This is a very simplified view on something that is very complex and may not be 100% correct as it is based off my uneducated opinion and speculations.

I myself use oxymorphone(opana) at night and hydrocodone in the day if needed. There is also dilaudid and morphine instead of oxymorphone, but I find them to not have as strictly as a sedating and sleep inducing effect as opana which could actually be the wrong choice as opana can easily get to the point where you can not keep your eyes open and continue working on what you where doing. Codeine and oxycodone are other common codeine formulations available and in my experience they do not cause as much of a sedating effect, but still retaining the analgesia effect. I would reccomend working with some combonation of these medications first by testing them and seeing what works best for you. Since people digest things differently not everyone gets the same effect and where all codeine formulations do not sedate me it can get another person to become so sedated they can not keep their head up.

There are also many synthetic opiates, but I recommend working with natural opiates first as the synthetic ones usually develop major long lasting dependencies due to their ability to bind to the receptors longer and work at a lower dose. Although that is why they have some benefits to use if one can not find relief from natural opiates without dosing multiple times a day or with a low dose.

This will definitely take some trial and error to figure out the best medication and you are fortunate to have a liberal doctor that will work with you to find the right medication. Best wishes to you for a fast recovery!

Edit: dihydrocodeine is the compound name while DF-118 is a brand name. Both are the same thing, but just manufactured from different people.

Edit 2: Darvocet seems to be quite risky and even be banned in US and EU. Someone correct me if I am wrong. Kingj also explained very well that there are other things that you should try first before trying to get heavily addictive narcotic medication.

Are you saying that oxymorphone is more sedating than morphine? I don't know what you've been doing but all studies comparing the two claim that morphine has a significantly higher incidence of side effects including sedation, respiratory depression, itching, constipation, and the higher incidence of side effects also comes with euphoria.