4-AcO-DMT vs. ayahuasca?

[TheAppleCore]

^ Personally, I'm pretty sensitive, but I would consider 20+ mg as a high dose. 20 mg of 4-AcO-DMT fumarate was incredibly intense for me, and gave me possibly the most amazing and detailed visuals I have ever seen in my life.

 

[Ismene]

That's totally opposite from my experience. Mushrooms hit me much faster than any other psychedelic

Could be because you're drinking mushroom tea whereas you're taking 4aco capsuled?

Try taking them both the same way and see what happens.

 

[Ismene]

^ismene and what about caapi or syrian rue with 4-aco-dmt?

Never actually tried 4aco with moclobemide but my guess is it would be much closer to oral DMT than just taking a high dose of 4aco.

Oral DMT has something unique about it - there's a presence to it and it's a lot more psychedelic than mushrooms and 4aco by themselves.

 

[Zandra]

Could be because you're drinking mushroom tea whereas you're taking 4aco capsuled?

Try taking them both the same way and see what happens.

Well, I usually just chew them up and swallow them, and I didn't take 4-AcO-DMT in a capsule. Would the chewing cause enough of the alkaloids absorb sublingually? Because I could possibly see that, but not really otherwise. From what I'd heard it seems like most people think it lasts a little longer than mushrooms, but of course there will be individual variance.

 

[Ismene]

Would the chewing cause enough of the alkaloids absorb sublingually?

Yep.

From what I'd heard it seems like most people think it lasts a little longer

Might vary with dose - a small dose of 4aco might not last as long as a bigger dose of mushrooms. Obviously if you take the mushrooms capsuled then your body has to extract the goodies from all the grams of plant material so it lasts a lot longer than 4aco.

 

[TheAppleCore]

Well, now I've had a little bit of experience, and can contribute to my own thread.

In short, yes there are similarities, but there are also remarkable differences.

With the dosages of caapi and psychotria I am currently using, ayahuasca seems almost indistinguishable from vaporized DMT, to me; although perhaps that is subject to change, if I were to drink heavier on the caapi. So, to me, the differences between 4-AcO-DMT and ayahuasca are analogous to the differences between 4-AcO-DMT and DMT itself.

The most striking difference to me is that 4-AcO-DMT is much more emotionally intense than DMT / ayahuasca. Which, for myself, I think is a bad thing, because I am a very emotional person as it stands, often to excess. So I think the fact that ayahuasca allows me to be a little more detached from my emotions, helps a lot to stabilize the trip and steer it in an intelligent and constructive direction. Hence, I much prefer ayahuasca. Although, I can easily see how 4-AcO-DMT's wild emotional charge could help me learn to deal with my own sober emotions, so maybe my opinion will change in the future?

 

[Jesusgreen]

your not the 1st person on Bl that i have heard feels that 4 aco is similar to smoked DMT but IMO i dont get it

obviously im only one person and have never gone over ~20mg with the 4 aco so maybe the similarities is in the higher doses but i just figured id throw out my opinion that smoked DMT and 4 aco arent incredibly similar

I would definitely say yes you haven't gone high enough. 20mg oral 4-AcO-DMT for me is something like smoking 5-10mg of DMT, just a lot longer lasting and as such quite a pleasant worthwhile ride.

My experiences with 35mg+ are much more like DMT, especially my one overdose experience which produced what felt like an 8 hour smoked DMT breakthrough. Crazy stuff.

That said it has its own unique characteristics though. For me 4-AcO-DMT feels a lot more confusing, cloudy, and dreamy; DMT is almost too sharp and clear at times, hyperreal in both its imagery and mindset.

 

[spacejunk]

i definitely get the character of DMT in a 4-AcO-DMT trip.
it's hard to put into words, but there is something beautifully alien about it. like a sub-breakthrough smoked dmt experience where you sit there looking around the room going "wow!" but drawn out. i haven't had sufficient experience with oral dmt/pharmahuasca to properly compare the trips, but closer to oral dmt than mushrooms in my eyes.

one particularly interesting experience i had with 4-AcO-DMT was in listening back to some electronic music i had recorded.

while tripping i was blown away that in this track (just some cheap lo-fi analogue synth sequencer experimentation) i had captured the music you hear on a DMT trip. i was adamant about this - i had recorded something (a few days earlier) that somehow perfectly captured the sounds of DMT tripping.
i was quite impressed with myself, especially as i couldn't really remember anything distinctive about the sort of auditory hallucinations DMT has caused.
but somehow i had recorded something that perfectly captured and replicated those sounds.

i listened to the same track the following day on a sober head, and heard none of these DMT qualities. quite fascinating.
i find 4-AcO-DMT to have a sort of warbling, flanging effect on music. it makes some things sound very odd, but really blew my mind the way it imposed some sort of "DMT aesthetic" on what i was listening to.
i am looking forward to having the time and energy to experiment further. the couple of times i've tried this stuff, i've been by myself and had nobody to bounce these thoughts off. similar to mushrooms, but with the characteristics of DMT more clearly stamped upon it.
i don't know if this post makes any sense, as these states can be hard to put into words.

 

[muie]

I always thought 4 aco dmt was identical to shrooms (just slightly different but not so much in effects rather the onset etc) plus it turns into psylocibin in the body anyways...

i've never had ayahuasca but i wish i did, i did however smoke both dmt and 5 meo dmt on seperate ocassions the 5 meo dmt was fucked and nothing special in terms of visuals plus i was scared to break through but i did break through on dmt and it was intensley psychedelic in both mental and visual sense (major visuals and visual distorion), i was had some full body spasm i was talking in sounds like indians and ocasioanly say an english word but most prayer talking stuff making voices as if possed by the dmt demons, also it looked like i was a person going to die, plus i felt like opening my eyes would make things worse and felt like i would never be normal again...in 10-15 min i go to the guy watching me...sup guys need some water u guys ok? lol

4 aco dmt ive had lots of it about 3-5 doses a night (a lot) and i never got like dmt! Though i would immagine a strong ayahusca trip to be like a strong 4 aco dmt trip i remeber looking at the ceiling with the lights off and i was suspended in some wierd part of the galaxy i could see stars and glowing stars pulsating plus a multitute of colours like aurora borealis.

Also on 4 aco dmt even a moderate to strong dose you can still function relatively normal in terms of conversations and i say relatively only because were comparing it to smoked dmt on which you cannot even speak ur native language (just sounds...freaky sounds)
That is also something to consider.

my 2 cents
peace

 

[muie]

Theres a strong posibility though that oral dmt (ayahusca) or snorted dmt may very well feel like 4 aco dmt