Urgentish - Is this Diazepam & heroin safe I have done

[neilios]

Please help! Urgentish - Is this Diazepam & heroin safe I have done

Hi guys,

Bit of a silly question and one that might not be answerable.

I am not a regular user of h at all.

Recently got some brown #4 that is the strongest I have ever tried, approx 10-15 mgs snorted has you nodding / drifting and itching nicely (with zero tolerance)

Anyhow the real focus was this - I took about 15 - 20 mgs diazepam about 15 hours ago.

In the last 3 hours have snorted about 30mgs of this light brown #4 as said it really is strong, I had in 3 10mg lines spaced out.

Any after bit of nodding am certainly gonna drift off, I am assuming 15 - 20mgz diazepam that long ago would be ok. However I know now that is does have a very long half life hence am worried.

Assume (for arguments sake, I know it is most likely not gonna be of course) the h as pure, are these amounts dangerous for someone with little to no tolerance?

Could not find any figures / charts to gauge what is 'safe'. I understand a lot people would say its never safe etc.

Just cos of that half life I was interested to know thoughts / experiences. I know these are low figures but remember this is with pretty low tolerance etc. have done this by mistake as underestimated half life of Valium - not advocating this at all!

Many thanks

 

[kokaino]

I would say no that 30 mg of intranasal heroin is not very dangerous. You have to remember that heroin is a morphine prodrug and when you take 30 mg of "heroin" via the oral or intranasal routes means that you are simply taking 30 mg of morphine. Morphine has a very poor BA through both those routes of administration and you only end up with roughly 10-35% of the dose which you took. Plus the 15-20 mg of diazepam will not kill or harm you.

 

[debaser]

Hello. No, it's not safe to mix heroin and diazepam, especially if you have no tolerance, whatever the dose. But you have already done them, haven't you?

 

[kokaino]

^It's generally not safe to mix ANY CNS depressants, but at the doses the OP stated it should be completely okay. The starting oral or intranasal dose for heroin/morphine is 30 mg!

 

[neilios]

I am certainly not advocating the combination of them, essentially taken by mistake in a sense as i completely underestimated the half life of diazepam, hence panicking and asking here.

Additionally are you sure that the intranasal dose is equivalent to oral? That doesn't sound right tbh, this is #4 and highly water soluble.

Finally (note I would never do this again and only happened because I was stupid in not checking half life of Valium) hr is about giving information that will reduce harm. We all know that comments such as 'don't do this it will kill you' will not prevent people doing it.

I would not personally ever risk again (am glad was not a graver mistake, made the stupid assumption that most of diazepam would be gone after those 16 hours) but surely having some basic guides / danger level charts would make more sense from an hr point of view? (obviously with the caveat that 'this could well lead to real harm / death and should not be done') thereby sticking with the original message.

My flustered smart phone google search showed that the 2 can be administered in a medical setting (sure not the norm) but this means there should be some data somewhere.

Just my 2 cents

 

[Swimmingdancer]

The starting oral or intranasal dose for heroin/morphine is 30 mg!

Where did you hear/read that? I have seen people overdose off less than 30mg of heroin.

I would say that it is never safe to mix benzos and opioids when you have no tolerance to either. I believe the OP is asking so they know whether or not they can go to sleep worry-free? (or conversely if they should be getting someone to watch them, going to the ER, etc)

It is really difficult to judge what a dangerous dose for diazepam and heroin would be when there are so many variables involved. But I think that because the diazepam was taken 15 hrs ago and you are presumably not currently exhibiting signs of respiratory depression etc that you should be ok .

How long ago did you do your last line of heroin? EDIT: Just realized it's been a while since you posted. Hope everything went ok!

 

[neilios]

Hey swimming, thanks for the check lol

All ok, not sure if op was written correctly but was pretty worried tbh - thought diazepam had a much shorter half life or would not have done the h. Stupid of me to not check before, would not take together intentionally. Could feel myself losing consciousness when writing and was doing all I could to stay awake. Pretty much was trying to work out if was in the danger zone. Luckily all ok, taught me a lesson though.

Yes he h stupidly strong, 10-15mg gets you nodding with little tolerance. Not to be messed with.

Still think there should be some info on here re safety levels, not something I would do again and I understand an incredibly bad idea but just telling people not to do it is not really hr IMO.

Anyhow don't do this anyone reading, just thinking it could go badly is enough reason, be safe

X

 

[Swimmingdancer]

Yeah, the problem is that, as I said, there are so many different variables that it would be impossible to come up with a guide on "safe" doses for combining opioids and benzos. It's not like one could say A dose is fine but B dose is dangerous. You have to take into account the specific opioids and benzos involved (there would be so many different combinations), the person's tolerance to each drug (that can make a huge difference), how much time passed in between taking the 2 drugs, the person's unique brain/body/metabolism, whether they have a tolerance to any related drugs such as alcohol, the ROAs for the drugs, the potency - in the case of street heroin there is always an unknown purity level, whether they have any health conditions, and so on and so on. What is going to do little to one person could easily kill another person.

Mixing opioids and benzos is the number 1 cause of overdoses and in this case it really is a situation where the only harm reduction is to tell people not to mix them, especially if they don't have a tolerance to either drug.

The only other advice we can really give is to take, say, 1/2 or 1/3 of your normal dose of each drug if you are going to insist on taking an opioid and benzo close to each other. We can do our best to advise people in your situation who have already done it and want to know if they should be worried, but we need to know all the relevant details and even then we can't be certain.

 

[Tripman]

I'd just like to remind everyone about a certain rule in the BDD guidelines:

5) NO "URGENT REPLY" REQUESTS
Please do not include "Urgent/Quick Response/Etc." in your thread title. Your thread will be responded to when people have the chance. If there is an actual emergency you shouldn't be posting about it on the internet. If someone's life is in danger, contact Emergency Medical Services.

 

[Tommyboy]

You have to remember that heroin is a morphine prodrug and when you take 30 mg of "heroin" via the oral or intranasal routes means that you are simply taking 30 mg of morphine. Morphine has a very poor BA through both those routes of administration and you only end up with roughly 10-35% of the dose which you took.

I though that's only true with oral administration and that you experience some effects from the 6 MAM when taking it using ROAs other than oral.

 

[Swimmingdancer]

^Yeah, and even orally taking 30mg heroin is not the same as taking 30mg of morphine.

The maximum plasma concentration of morphine was twofold higher after oral diacetylmorphine (heroin) than after morphine administration. Oral absorption of morphine from diacetylmorphine was also found to be dose dependent. [source]

 

[Tripman]

SD and TB are correct. 30mg of heroin is not the same as 30mg of morphine intranasally, and even orally it will be different - just because it's a prodrug doesn't mean it will be exactly the same...

I would say no that 30 mg of intranasal heroin is not very dangerous. You have to remember that heroin is a morphine prodrug and when you take 30 mg of "heroin" via the oral or intranasal routes means that you are simply taking 30 mg of morphine. Morphine has a very poor BA through both those routes of administration and you only end up with roughly 10-35% of the dose which you took. Plus the 15-20 mg of diazepam will not kill or harm you.

Kokaino please refrain from making statements like this without a source - This is a HR forum, misinformation can be deadly.