Benzos benzos or alcohol

[bighooter]

What does more damage to the brain/body?

I mean when recreationally using these drugs, not abusing them by that I mean addiction.

I ask this because I prefer to take something on a weekend just to feel comfortable sociallising ( I have social Anxiety disorder) and I want to know what is ideally the best to take.

When it comes to drinking alcohol I will usually consume 6 pints of cider in a session.

When it comes to benzos I will usually take 20-30mg (max) in a session.

Cheers people!

 

[madog11]

I think they can both be helpful, which do you think helps more or has more positive effects than negative? Never do them both together!

 

[tricomb]

I'd say alcohol destroys your body while benzos destroy your mind.

Benzodiazepines are not a recreational drug, think tool not toy. The best treatment for social anxiety is exposure.

 

[Tryptamino]

I'd say alcohol destroys your body while benzos destroy your mind.

Benzodiazepines are not a recreational drug, think tool not toy. The best treatment for social anxiety is exposure.

thank you, i thought i was the only one who did find any rec value in them. they do the trick for sleep and anxiety though.

 

[i against i]

i don't find any recreational value in benzo's either. i'd say alcohol is less damaging. this graph from a paper by david nutt (former head of UK advisory council on misuse of drugs, he left because the govt. wouldn't listen to his rational, evidence based suggestions) puts them about the same.

 

[Snake_Eyes]

I hate alcohol but I find benzos very recreational more so than even opiates. Weed and a lowish dose (1mg xanax or equivalent for example) benzo is heaven to me.

 

[bighooter]

cheers for the posts guys I think i've been taking benzos on a regular basis for over a year now, so am pretty sure this is maybe why my anxiety seems to of got worse.

As for alcohol because of the taste and ROA I have never had a problem with it, so i'll probably just stick to drinking on the weekend at least this way I wont be doing as much damage to my mind.

 

[Trigeminal]

I'd say alcohol destroys your body while benzos destroy your mind.

Benzodiazepines are not a recreational drug, think tool not toy. The best treatment for social anxiety is exposure.

I agree, although I'd say benzo withdrawal destroys your body as well, but definitely the larger component is damage to your mind.

OP, I would pick alcohol every time over benzos.

Tricomb said it pretty well--benzos are not a toy. I learned this the hard way.

Unless you're drinking heavily and frequently, alcohol won't be too much of a problem.

 

[kokaino]

i don't find any recreational value in benzo's either. i'd say alcohol is less damaging. this graph from a paper by david nutt (former head of UK advisory council on misuse of drugs, he left because the govt. wouldn't listen to his rational, evidence based suggestions) puts them about the same.

This graph is not very accurate. As far as physical harm and psychological dependence, I would rank crystal meth above cocaine and heroin. Especially when it comes to physical harm. I'd also rank cocaine over heroin in physical harm. There is so much wrong with this graph. It should not at all be taken as a "serious source". It is completely inaccurate. They have benzos's as causing more physical harm than ecstasy. That is a joke! How's ketamine more physically harmful than amphetamines? There is just so much wrong with this graph man! They have benzos as being more addictive than amphetamines? 8(

David Nutt has NEVER ever touched a drug in his life. The only graphs I'll believe in are ones made by former addicts - people who know what they are talking about when it comes to drug use/abuse.

 

[i against i]

This graph is not very accurate. As far as physical harm and psychological dependence, I would rank crystal meth above cocaine and heroin. Especially when it comes to physical harm. I'd also rank cocaine over heroin in physical harm. There is so much wrong with this graph. It should not at all be taken as a "serious source". It is completely inaccurate. They have benzos's as causing more physical harm than ecstasy. That is a joke! How's ketamine more physically harmful than amphetamines? There is just so much wrong with this graph man! They have benzos as being more addictive than amphetamines? 8(

David Nutt has NEVER ever touched a drug in his life. The only graphs I'll believe in are ones made by former addicts - people who know what they are talking about when it comes to drug use/abuse.

you have obviously studied this graph very well. it doesn't have methamp on it. also this is taken out of the context of the paper in which they define "physical harm" and dependence" and how they work out the relative harms, so i don't really think you're in a position to comment, from a subjective perspective, and without knowing how they even worked it out. in another paper he did along a similar line, taking into account socio-economic, societal and personal damage, methamp did come out on top in one category (personal harm i think). alcohol came out most damaging overall. pm me if you want me to find this paper for you, i don't have it to hand. benzo withdrawal can kill you. there were 1810 deaths from benzo's 1990-96 (uk, source) during which period a large amount of x was also consumed, pretty sure deaths were only in double figures. ketamine and amphetamine overlap in physical harm, how is this worth comment?

i'm not going to argue too much with you, as david nutt is qualified, and it doesn't really matter whether he is wrong or right on this graph, he wants all drugs legalized, he knows what he's talking about, and he's prepared to stand up for what he believes in. and how do you know what drugs he's done or not? given he lifetime study of them, i highly doubt he's never indulged.

 

[Tryptamino]

^i against i your username is a fucking win

 

[Illuminatus]

What does more damage to the brain/body?

I mean when recreationally using these drugs, not abusing them by that I mean addiction.

I ask this because I prefer to take something on a weekend just to feel comfortable sociallising ( I have social Anxiety disorder) and I want to know what is ideally the best to take.

When it comes to drinking alcohol I will usually consume 6 pints of cider in a session.

When it comes to benzos I will usually take 20-30mg (max) in a session.

Cheers people!

I just feel the need to point out that 20-30 mg of one benzo can be completely different effect and many times stronger or weaker than another benzo at the same dose

There are many benzo drugs and they are all different. For example 30 mg of valium (diazepam) would probably equal my normal prescribed daily dose of 3 mg klonopin (clonazepam) while 30 mg clonazepam would make me fall asleep and all I would want to do is sleep and if I had some beers with 30 mg clonazepam I would be facing possibly deadly overdose

 

[-Guido-]

Benzodiazepines are not a recreational drug, think tool not toy.

This. I have always felt that way. The only times I ever used benzos was during comedown after rolling, to get through a couple of hours until I could get my heroin fix, to get rid of a panic attack, and to get to sleep after amping myself up to much on thermogenics, metabolic enhancers, and steroids.

 

[Swain]

benzos are much easier to develop dependency with. Alcohol you have to phsysially be downing drinks all day but it;s easy to stay high all day espeically with a long halflife like diazepam.. and benzo withdrawal is how I imagine hell would be if it's even nearly that bad.

 

[tricomb]

I just feel the need to point out that 20-30 mg of one benzo can be completely different effect and many times stronger or weaker than another benzo at the same dose

There are many benzo drugs and they are all different. For example 30 mg of valium (diazepam) would probably equal my normal prescribed daily dose of 3 mg klonopin (clonazepam) while 30 mg clonazepam would make me fall asleep and all I would want to do is sleep and if I had some beers with 30 mg clonazepam I would be facing possibly deadly overdose

ya 30mg triazolam, i dont even want to imagine that.

 

[hyperreal]

I think they both can messed many things up, but benzos are little easier to take too much. You know, its just a little pills. And when you fucked up one pill more seems to not do nothing bad, and one more too, and bang. You waking up and thinging 'wat I been doing this time'? Well...actually with booze I was having similar actions.

 

[kokaino]

you have obviously studied this graph very well. it doesn't have methamp on it. also this is taken out of the context of the paper in which they define "physical harm" and dependence" and how they work out the relative harms, so i don't really think you're in a position to comment, from a subjective perspective, and without knowing how they even worked it out. in another paper he did along a similar line, taking into account socio-economic, societal and personal damage, methamp did come out on top in one category (personal harm i think). alcohol came out most damaging overall. pm me if you want me to find this paper for you, i don't have it to hand. benzo withdrawal can kill you. there were 1810 deaths from benzo's 1990-96 (uk, source) during which period a large amount of x was also consumed, pretty sure deaths were only in double figures. ketamine and amphetamine overlap in physical harm, how is this worth comment?

i'm not going to argue too much with you, as david nutt is qualified, and it doesn't really matter whether he is wrong or right on this graph, he wants all drugs legalized, he knows what he's talking about, and he's prepared to stand up for what he believes in. and how do you know what drugs he's done or not? given he lifetime study of them, i highly doubt he's never indulged.

Most of the 1810 benzo deaths were attributed to one benzo: temazepam. There was a rash of deaths attributed to temazepam back in the early 90's in Britain. It was so bad that in the early 90's temazepam related deaths were higher than cocaine related deaths. I just don't see the graph as accurate at a glance. He wants drugs legalized, that's great - but it doesn't make his graph accurate. Do his peers in the scientific community vouch for this graph, or is he a lone wolf on this? But sure, I would love it if you PM'd me the paper on it. Thanks.

 

[kokaino]

Benzos cause just as much harm as alcohol does, or at least they can.

Abrupt withdrawal after long term use from therapeutic doses of temazepam may result in a very severe benzodiazepine withdrawal syndrome. There are reports in the medical literature of at least six psychotic states developing after abrupt withdrawal from temazepam including delirium after abrupt withdrawal of only 30 mg of temazepam and in another case, auditory hallucinations and visual cognitive disorder developed after abrupt withdrawal from 10 mg of temazepam, 5 mg of nitrazepam and 0.5 mg of triazolam. Gradual and careful reduction of the dosage, preferably with a milder long-acting benzodiazepine such as clonazepam or diazepam, or even a milder short to intermediate acting benzodiazepine such as oxazepam or alprazolam, was recommended to prevent severe withdrawal syndromes from developing. Other strong hypnotic benzodiazepines, whether short, intermediate or long-acting are not recommended. Antipsychotics increase the severity of benzodiazepine withdrawal effects with an increase in the intensity and severity of convulsions. Depersonalisation has also been reported as a benzodiazepine withdrawal effect from temazepam.
Abrupt withdrawal from very high doses is even more likely to cause severe withdrawal effects. Withdrawal from very high doses of temazepam will cause severe hypoperfusion of the whole brain with diffuse slow activity on EEG. After withdrawal, abnormalities in hypofrontal brain wave patterns may persist beyond the withdrawal syndrome suggesting that organic brain damage may occur from chronic high dose abuse of temazepam. Temazepam withdrawal has been well known to cause a sudden and often violent death.

Source - Wikidoc, written by an actual doctor and his contact info is right on the page and if you click his name you'll see all his credentials.