Benzos Fast-onset, short/intermediate-acting benzos?

[suessmayr]

I am prescribed oxazepam for PRN use. The reason for this is that my shrink doesn't want to give me alprazolam - he says its onset is too fast and its duration of action too short, so that it becomes a hazard for people who have abused benzos before (like me, although a long time ago).

The thing that pisses me off with oxazepam is that I have to wait nearly 3 hours to get the effects I need. I'm not joking. There is something small after about 1.5 hrs (or sometimes 1 hr if I have eaten absolutely nothing) but generally it takes between 2.5 and 3 hrs before I have what I need.

I am not interested in long-acting benzos like diazepam or clonazepam because I don't like waking up groggy etc. So my question is whether there are any other anxiolytic benzos people can think of with (1) a fast onset and (2) a short-intermediate duration of action. The only one I can think of is maybe lorazepam?

 

[Alex000]

I think diazepam, chlordiazepoxidem, or lorazepam could all be of help. Diazepam isn't super long acting, but its metabolites do have a long half-life, really long, but anyway its onset is fairly quick, all of this is true with chlordiazepoxide as well. Lorazepam is pretty quick acting, too. It is a good benzo for whatever you need, panic, anxiety, insomnia. It is very versatile in my opinion. But, the effects aren't super short, they can linger. Either diazepam or lorazepam have even faster onset if taken sublingually, and don't taste like alprazolam . Seriously, diazepam is not a bad choice if you only need it now and again, and the metabolites don't really have a chance to build up. You can't really feel it for that long, but lorazepam is a little better for panic, however, I'd say lorazepam may last a little longer than diazepam in its subjective effects. They are both good. Now I can mention another one, triazolam, that I'm sure you've heard of. It is marketed as a hypnotic and is noted for its very amnesic properties, however its onset is extremely quick orally or sublingually, and it doesn't last very long. I doubt your doctor would script this for insomnia let alone panic, and I'm not sure being on triazolam in public is the best idea, even if the dose is relatively low. I don't know, I say go with lorazepam or diazepam.

 

[heavyriffer]

I'd say Lorazepam(Ativan), its almost like Alprazolam but not that bad. It will kick in fast and help, hes right though the doctor, Xanax(Alprazolam) does kick in very quick but lasts so short that it almost like you didnt take anything for stress and anxiety in the first place. even Valium maybe.

 

[NeighborhoodThreat]

Agreed, lorazepam is a nice middle ground between the short acting benzos like alprazolam and the longer acting ones.

It's pretty damn addictive though, and it doesn't have any active metabolites, so between-dose-cravings can be an issue.

 

[suessmayr]

It's pretty damn addictive though, and it doesn't have any active metabolites, so between-dose-cravings can be an issue.

Wait, what does this mean?

I have only taken lorazepam once before. At that time I was basically addicted to diazepam and my shrink switched me to lorazepam for a week or so. I was only interested in getting high back then and I remember thinking "lorazepam is shit. I can barely feel it compared to diazepam". Although now I genuinely only need it for anxiety. Oxazepam has a HL of 4-15 hrs and I think lorazepam is 10-20?

My shrink also mentioned bromazepam. Anyone tried this? Valium would not be ideal as I sometimes use every second day. If I did that with valium I would essentially be maintaining a steady dose in my system because of the long HL.

 

[Psychonauticunt]

Wait, what does this mean?

I have only taken lorazepam once before. At that time I was basically addicted to diazepam and my shrink switched me to lorazepam for a week or so. I was only interested in getting high back then and I remember thinking "lorazepam is shit. I can barely feel it compared to diazepam". Although now I genuinely only need it for anxiety. Oxazepam has a HL of 4-15 hrs and I think lorazepam is 10-20?

My shrink also mentioned bromazepam. Anyone tried this? Valium would not be ideal as I sometimes use every second day. If I did that with valium I would essentially be maintaining a steady dose in my system because of the long HL.

I am having a similar issue. I asked the doctor to change my clonazepam (0,5-1mg/day) to something else, because I'm also on temazepam for the night, so with clonazepam's long half-life I'm on benzos 24/7. The clonazepam was great for my panic and anxiety, though, and was not sedating or anything, so I remained fully functional.
The doc prescribed me oxazepam (10mg-30mg per day, which is smaller than my earlier clonazepam dose in terms of equivalence charts, and subjectively I consider the equivalent dose compared to other benzos of oxazepam to be 30mg, not 20mg). The short duration is good, so I can only be on it for a few hours a day when I really need it, but at the doses required to manage my anxiety and attacks, it is noticeably more sedative than the clonazepam.

Bromazepam I haven't tried, but it sounds like it would be suitable from anecdotal evidence and from reading up on it. Lorazepam has a duration of action of about 6-8 hours for me personally, and it has a fast onset of action. It is also decidedly un-recreational for me, but very potently anxiolytic, and not very sedative, so that may be one option. You won't be tempted to eat them for fun, and it'll curb your anxiety. Valium also has a similar duration of action, but accumulation of active metabolites would, as you say, potentially lead to residual grogginess from repeated doses. It is also more balanced in its effects, so in my opinion to achieve the same level of anxiolytic relief, you would have to take slightly more diazepam than lorazepam, and this dose would be more sedative. In my experience. Alprazolam would sound like it would work, but if your doc's unwilling to prescribe it, I would ask for either lorazepam or bromazepam.

 

[Dexed]

Temazepam fits this profile perfectly. A dose taken on an empty stomach will be felt within 10 minutes, and the terminal half-life is 8-22 hours. Though renowned for its hypnotic properties, temazepam is actually a fantastic anxiolytic and anticonvulsant as well. Don't expect to get this prescribed for anxiety if your shrink won't even script alpraz though. Restoril (brand name in the U.S.) lends itself to tolerance and addiction much easier than the more common anxiolytic benzodiazepines IME. Good luck. Lorazepam is a much more reasonable suggestion ^

 

[suessmayr]

Psychonauticunt - How are you finding the oxazepam generally? Does it take ages to take effect for you? And do you find it to be less or more 'abuseable' than lorazepam? And what about sedation? One thing I do like about oxazepam is that it seems to make me less 'foggy' than other benzos - like I can still more or less think.

Dexed - Yeah, this shrink is very by the book, so I doubt he'd give me a hypnotic for anxiety. I was scripted temazepam from another shrink once for anxiety and yeah, it was fucking great. Such a fast onset.

 

[Titus]

I was thinking lorazepam as well. It's my favorite benzo due to it's fast onset which I like when I am feeling anxious and have some available.

 

[Psychonauticunt]

Psychonauticunt - How are you finding the oxazepam generally? Does it take ages to take effect for you? And do you find it to be less or more 'abuseable' than lorazepam? And what about sedation? One thing I do like about oxazepam is that it seems to make me less 'foggy' than other benzos - like I can still more or less think.

It was a poor choice for me, I talked to the doctor to have it changed although she hasn't gotten back to me yet since she wants to consult a specialist (she's a GP).
It takes about 2-3 hours for effects to be felt (and the effects, unless doses are high or anxiety is particularly high, are quite subtle). This is bad, because I would prefer to have relief for only a small portion of the day, and this is usually the morning (when I have my lectures), so I need to wake up an hour or two earlier just to take my medication so I can go attend my lectures without losing it.
I find it to be maybe equally abusable with lorazepam - really no good on its own, you won't feel a thing until you've taken too much and do stupid shit, and alright for boosting relaxation in small amounts with small amounts of opiates/alcohol and cannabis. So basically, it has more or less the same (lack of) recreational value and abuse potential. Many people would claim lorazepam is more abusable, but it is decidedly un-recreational for me so I hardly have any temptation to take them for anything other than what they're prescribed for (except curing comedowns, hangovers etc).

It is much weaker than the clonazepam, and a mild benzo in general, but its effects profile is also more balanced than that of clonazepam in my opinion, and that includes greater sedation. So to achieve the same degree of anxiolysis and panic attack deterrence as with clonazepam, the corresponding dose of oxazepam is more sedating. This is clearly bad. It made me more "foggy" at the levels needed to reduce anxiety than clonazepam did.

I mentioned lorazepam to the doc, but she said that according to her knowledge it is generally considered one of the more sedative benzos, and is frequently prescribed here as a hypnotic (funny - in Finland it is never prescribed as a hypnotic, and exclusively as an anxiolytic, or for hospital procedures as an anticonvulsant/anxiolytic to interrupt stimulant/psychedelic overdose/psychosis). So I don't know if she'll be willing to prescribe that. In about an hour or so she should be calling back, and I'll find out what happens - she may decide to put me back on the clonazepam, since it's better than the oxazepam, but other anxiolytics prescribed here she may offer (depending on what the psychiatrist says) include bromazepam, lorazepam and alprazolam.

Despite alprazolam's massive abuse potential and the fact that I love it recreationally, I think it would actually probably be the ideal choice for me in this situation, and I would not be tempted to abuse it because I have A) REAL issues and I can't afford to run out of pills/raise my tolerance and B) I have withdrawn from benzos before and I am NOT doing it again.

EDIT:

Realized the post is kinda long and rambling, so in a nutshell, oxazepam for me:

+ Suitable because of short duration of action
+ Low abuse potential
- Not very potent, more sedative/intoxicating than clonazepam at doses providing equivalent anxiolytic relief, which impedes functionality
- Duration of onset is too long

 

[Ayrios]

Lorazepam is certainly the most debilitating benzo I've used at doses equipotent to functional doses of other benzos, both short and long-acting. It lasted at least 5-6 hours the last few times I've used it, and once it wore off, left me falling sleep. I always felt like shit the next day after waking up. Triazolam AKA Halcion would be nice, but good luck getting a script for it.

 

[KingBlueTwista]

Etizolam is an analogue of benzodiazepines and it seems to have the effect profile you desire.
Onset for me is roughly 30 minutes on an empty stomach and last for about 6-7 hours. If taken at night there is no groggy feeling in the morning, AND it is said to be 6x more potent than diazepam in the anxiolysis department. I can't vouch for that last one but I do know it completely squashes any anxiety I may have about anything, ever. It's like a cosy little fire blanket for the mind

 

[axe battler]

^^this. etizolam is fast acting and extremely non-sedating (for me anyway).

bromazepam sounds like a good option for you, but im surprised no-one's suggested clobazam. it's not sedating at all and it's anxiolytic as fuck. it doesn't have a very short half life, but nowhere near diazepam's.

good luck man

 

[Pegasus]

The reason for this is that my shrink doesn't want to give me alprazolam - he says its onset is too fast and its duration of action too short, so that it becomes a hazard for people who have abused benzos before (like me, although a long time ago).

Your doctor really understands benzos! God am I glad to see a doctor give accurate information about prescribed benzos.

 

[heavyriffer]

where im at the doctors are alright but they are not experienced enough with benzodiazepines, like my doctor wanted me to come off one way too fast.

 

[Psychonauticunt]

Your doctor really understands benzos! God am I glad to see a doctor give accurate information about prescribed benzos.

Indeed. When I mentioned alprazolam to my GP, she said that to her knowledge, it is an anti-depressant which I will have to take daily for about 2 weeks before the effects would begin to be felt, and it was more of a maintenance drug, not suitable for acute treatment or prevention of panic attacks, especially not on an irregular basis.
I told her, with all due respect, to consult a specialist and get back to me later, as it was a telephone appointment (above, I was complaining about the efficacy, or lack thereof, of oxazepam for my condition - this was concerning that). She called back a few hours later and scripted me 0,25mg alprazolam up to 3x per day as needed. If memory serves me correctly, they should be pretty ideally suited to my situation right now, and I hopefully won't have to use them long enough to get hooked. I also don't need to take them every day.

 

[King Hop Head]

I am prescribed oxazepam for PRN use. The reason for this is that my shrink doesn't want to give me alprazolam - he says its onset is too fast and its duration of action too short, so that it becomes a hazard for people who have abused benzos before (like me, although a long time ago).

The thing that pisses me off with oxazepam is that I have to wait nearly 3 hours to get the effects I need. I'm not joking. There is something small after about 1.5 hrs (or sometimes 1 hr if I have eaten absolutely nothing) but generally it takes between 2.5 and 3 hrs before I have what I need.

I am not interested in long-acting benzos like diazepam or clonazepam because I don't like waking up groggy etc. So my question is whether there are any other anxiolytic benzos people can think of with (1) a fast onset and (2) a short-intermediate duration of action. The only one I can think of is maybe lorazepam?

Etizolam- fast onset, medium term duration, currently unschedulled and cheap

 

[suessmayr]

I think my doctor would be highly suspicious if I went in talking about etizolam - bear in mind that I'm in Australia and that our prescriptions differ a lot. For instance, clonazepam is barely used here - diazepam seems to be preferred. But yeah, I think because, once upon a time, I abused benzos, my doctors' ears are now essentially closed to anything I have to say. I should have kept quiet. I told him all about the doctor-shopping I used to do, and about how manipulative I was, so I think he's like constantly on guard. It's a shit situation - because now I genuinely, dearly need benzos just to do routine things - see friends, catch buses, attend classes, and so forth - and so it makes sense that I should be on the ideal benzo.

Another problem is that etizolam seems to have a half-life similar to alprazolam - in which case my shrink wouldn't prescribe it anyway.

Psychonauticunt - I find the exact same thing with oxazepam! I once needed it for a 9am meeting - I had to get up at SIX AM just to have enough time to take it! It's highly impractical. And there is a big contradiction in my case - I have oxazepam for PRN (not daily) use, but because it takes so long to take effect, I have to wake up every day and take oxazepam just in case a situation arises in which I need it. I can't risk finding myself in the moment and needing help, because the onset is too slow. So the prescription is self-defeating, because to be effective it needs to be daily and not PRN. Let us know how the xanax goes.

 

[Psychonauticunt]

Yeah. The doctor told me the oxazepam would kick in quite quickly, within 15-30 minutes. I knew she was wrong but I didn't remember by how far she was off so I didn't say anything about it (and young males sometimes have to tread a fine line in just how much of their pharmacological knowledge they reveal to the doctor; knowing too much is easily seen as a sign of drug-seeking behavior, at least by some doctors), and just told her after a few days - so that I could also tell her I have anecdotal experience from the past few days to go with the "told-you-so" - that it was, among other things, way too slow in its onset.

Right now the Xanax is working better than either the clonazepam or oxazepam all in all, but it's a little different - clonazepam was quite "chilled" as a maintenance drug, but that had the flipside of being semi-drugged all day. Now I have to consciously think about having pills on me, having the right amount if I happen to stay out for a particularly long period of time, etc. At the prescribed dose (0.25mg 0-3x daily) I'm not noticing any unpleasant side effects, it hasn't seemed to affect my memory and it's no more sedating or intoxicating than the either two - and more powerfully anxiolytic, so in that sense, it's ideal. Also, with its short duration I only need to be on it a few hours a day. I also try to take days off as often as I can to keep tolerance from rising.

There's a definite threshold to when the majority of the effects subside though, and for me it comes very rapidly, somewhat disturbingly so sometimes. It's nothing nearly like a crash or anything, but very suddenly the veil that's been protecting me is stripped away. It's quite tempting to re-dose even though I've just come home and have all night to feel anxious if need be. I've resisted the temptation so far, though, so good call in my book from the doc. It's early days yet, though, but I've felt the most functional now since these problems started, and I haven't really abused what I used to consider far and away the most recreational benzo.

 

[method own girl]

I also suggest lorazepam, I have taken most of them and I really like lorazepam. It takes effect within 20 min. And really helps with acute panic attacks. As far as recreationally, it's quite good when mixed with other things like alcohol and opiates. I take methadone so if I am looking for a recreational high type thing it's easy to achieve. However if you do mix it with other drugs be aware. I have had entire days that I can't remember and it is pretty obvious that up I'm high to others when in public. So keep that in mind and stay home if you plan to combine lorazepam with other drugs. I learned this the hard way, being pulled over and car towed for driving 35 in a 65 on the freeway.