Opioids Mallinckrodt 4 mg Hydromorphone (Dilaudid) - Not as powerful, anyone else?

[Wesley_pipes_27]

Skip to last paragraph to get right to the actual question, the preceding is just my PM background for context.

I am a chronic pain patient (multiple thoracic disc herniation's {T7-T8, T8-T9}, compression fractures in multiple thoracic vertebrae {T7, T8, T9}, plus several other ailments including soft patella bursa {knee} damage , rotator cuff {shoulder} damage, etc...) as a result of a severe automobile accident in April, 2003 that also left me with 7 broken/fractured ribs and a fractured sternum. The latter injuries (ribs/sternum) healed in due time, however the more severe injuries have left me in almost constant pain and discomfort to say the least. I was not a candidate for surgery on my spine due to several factors including age (24 yrs old at the time), my being an epileptic (grand mal seizures), and the complexity of the surgery. Both surgeons I consulted with informed me that to fix (haha) or fuse my vertebrae would require an anterior (chest) incision, sawing open of the sternum, removal of a rib, and deflation of 1 of my lungs just to reach the correct area of the vertebrae to be fused. The success rate of this type of surgery was not very good either (long term).

Sorry so long winded (kinda buzzed lol), but the point was to establish that the only option for me, other than benign physical therapy, has been a narcotic prescription pain management regimen. I started off with hydrocodone and the like (about as good as Tylenol, IMO) and 8 years later I am on a combination of Oxycodone (30 mg ir's) and Hydromorphone (8 mg ir's) plus various muscle relaxers, NSAIDS, Valium, etc. I have been on this particular combination for about the last 2+ years with above average results.

Okay, now to my actual question (once again, sorry for being so long winded) The Dilaudid's that I have always gotten from my local pharmacy have been the Mallinckrodt brand 8 mg ir's that are shaped like a triangle. They work great for me, especially when I do the occasional IV ROA (fantastic rush) however this month the pharmacy was out of them and my Dr. just changed my script to 2x's the amount of the 4 mg ir's. Now I have had great experience using only half of one of my 8 mg ir's and was DUMBFOUNDED to find that the 4 mg pills (same manufacturer, Mallinckrodt) provided absolutely NO RUSH WHATSOEVER !!! I will say that they do still work fairly well to quell the pain, thank God. Has anyone else experienced this problem with the 4 mg Malli. Hydromorphone ir's? I searched the internet (Google Fu) for quite sometime and only found one other instance of someone complaining of this and it was just a simple statement w/ no replies. Again, anyone who has had this problem or might be able to shed some light on this would be greatly appreciated. If you made it this far, THANKS, MY HATS OFF TO YOU.

WP

 

[aveoturbo]

Your just well adjusted to the 8s. Have you tried to do the actual double dose of the 4s?

 

[Wesley_pipes_27]

Have you tried to do the actual double dose of the 4s?

Yes, in fact my first shot was 2 1/2 of them.

Your just well adjusted to the 8s.

Could it really be just that simple? Furthermore, why would this be? I understand that there are/can be different inactive ingredients, any link? Seems flimsy now that I think about it..... inactive and all. Just curious, thanks for the quick reply. Think I'm gonna get a little sleep and try again when I wake up.

Thanks again man.

WP

 

[Wesley_pipes_27]

Don't get me wrong by the way, I definitely feel them, I've been up all night typing my ass off all across the interwebz and I haven't even thought about my back in hours, ie. it's not bothering me one bit. Just real curious about the lack of rush which I've become quite fond of.

 

[MemphisX3]

they all feel the same to me and i have IV'd pretty much every brand of dilaudid.

 

[King J]

To be honest with you, when it comes to pills, just because you break it in half doesn't mean you're actually getting half of the dose. You never know where the filler is. I mean there's a LOT of garbage in there.

When you break a pill in half, you could have been shooting up 6mg of Hydromorphone at times when you did this without realizing it because you just can't tell. Also, because pills have fillers, your 8mg IR's don't even really have 8mg of Hydromorphone in it. No pill does. It's an estimate. It's probably like 7.2 to 7.6mg of Hydromorphone tops. I think you can find more info about this at webmd.com as I have read and it makes sense. Also, being that statement into consideration, you never know the potency. All manufacturers, especially generic manufacturers, hold different potency's for different mg's. What worked for you for 8mg could be a bad 4mg brand. The pharmaceutical world is crazy and I think that it's honestly just wrong.

You also built a tolerance to the higher mg pills and what I said before, you don't know how many mg is what you break in half, could be the cause.

 

[MemphisX3]

To be honest with you, when it comes to pills, just because you break it in half doesn't mean you're actually getting half of the dose. You never know where the filler is. I mean there's a LOT of garbage in there.

When you break a pill in half, you could have been shooting up 6mg of Hydromorphone at times when you did this without realizing it because you just can't tell. Also, because pills have fillers, your 8mg IR's don't even really have 8mg of Hydromorphone in it. No pill does. It's an estimate. It's probably like 7.2 to 7.6mg of Hydromorphone tops. I think you can find more info about this at webmd.com as I have read and it makes sense. Also, being that statement into consideration, you never know the potency. All manufacturers, especially generic manufacturers, hold different potency's for different mg's. What worked for you for 8mg could be a bad 4mg brand. The pharmaceutical world is crazy and I think that it's honestly just wrong.

You also built a tolerance to the higher mg pills and what I said before, you don't know how many mg is what you break in half, could be the cause.

ummmmm acctually im pretty sure pharm companies distribute the active chemical accordingly. dont quote me because im no expert but a lot of doctors will prescribe pills and tell the patient to break them in half.


by saying what you say that means that xanax bars have indentions for no purpose what so ever.


lolwut dude i just read your post more carefully. you never know the potency? SURE I DO ITS PRINTED ON THE FUCKING PILL...its a multibillion dollar pharm company dude not some back woods wanna be chemist. now if you said this in relation to E pills i would be inclined to agree with you but that simply isnt the case. no pharm company is going to jip you on the potency of their pills.

wtf did you gather your info or is it just your idea?

 

[stanmarsh]

To be honest with you, when it comes to pills, just because you break it in half doesn't mean you're actually getting half of the dose. You never know where the filler is. I mean there's a LOT of garbage in there.

When you break a pill in half, you could have been shooting up 6mg of Hydromorphone at times when you did this without realizing it because you just can't tell. Also, because pills have fillers, your 8mg IR's don't even really have 8mg of Hydromorphone in it. No pill does. It's an estimate. It's probably like 7.2 to 7.6mg of Hydromorphone tops. I think you can find more info about this at webmd.com as I have read and it makes sense. Also, being that statement into consideration, you never know the potency. All manufacturers, especially generic manufacturers, hold different potency's for different mg's. What worked for you for 8mg could be a bad 4mg brand. The pharmaceutical world is crazy and I think that it's honestly just wrong.

I highly doubt there would be much variation in active content from one half of a pill to another. If that were the case, there must be a high amount of variation from pill to pill, which I'm sure must be controlled to a certain extent (i.e. label +-5% actives). There are a million other variables which could contribute to how much you feel a rush or onset or high, not the least of which is your head space at the time. My guess is you will find them to be pretty similar in the long run. The only other thing that comes to mind is possibly more filler/inactives would be present in 2 4mg's than 1 8mg, but that really shouldn't hinder any ROA besides maybe insufflation. Best of luck.

 

[Doug2113]

Actually, filler has nothing to do with the amount of active drug in a dosing unit...if you throw a 7.5/750 hydrocodone onto a scale (at least the ones I had) they weigh a gram total on the dot (this is with a 500x.01g scale though so it could vary). I thought it was odd because 7.5mg+750mg=.7575...not 1.0...just a little food for thought...

edit: not to hijack a thread, but could different inactives from brand to brand affect how your body responds to the active drug? I mean every little thing you put in your body affects it, so why would inactive ingredients?

Also...love you handle stan...funny fucking show lol...

 

[sekio]

The FDA mandates that pills have to caontain the amount of drugs marked, there is no possible way aside from serious fuckups on the pharmacy's side that your 2x4mg dilaudids don't actually have 8mg of active in them.

Your tolerance has probably just caught up with you.

 

[Wesley_pipes_27]

^^^ Thanks guys, food for thought. I will say that when I woke up today, after a much needed night of good sleep, I IV'd 2 of them (4 mg ir's) with a much better result. Perhaps my lack of sleep and current mental state at the time (fatigue) was what caused the poor results the first time around.

Either way, I still prefer my 8 mg ir's to 2 4's any day. I guess it all comes down to what works best, for whatever reason. Thanks again for your input guys.

WP

 

[sekio]

Perhaps my lack of sleep and current mental state at the time (fatigue) was what caused the poor results the first time around.

That's very likely. You're much more likely to catch a good nod if you're not feeling like crap.

Anyway, this looks like it's been answered so I will close it now. Happy opiate-using.