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Tapering Benzo withdrawal: Losing my mind

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toothpastedog said:
Is there any way you could get your methadone on the blackmarket so you could smoke weed cj? Far from ideal, but I was just curious. I think the clinic is a good place for you right now, aside from their policy on cannabis use.
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^ this. Also, what's your plan for the benzo withdrawal?
 
Black market sourcing of drugs is really a bad idea. Undoubtedly you'll end up using more and more, just because you can, because it's there.

I don't mean to "preach", but I still think getting off methadone and benzos is a must.
 
Don't get methadone from dealers, the street level, or the "Black market".

There are a lot of look alike pills and powders even methadone look alikes that are being laced with fentanyl and other powerful opiates. People who use these drugs can't tell the difference and wind up dead.

Check into a detox/rehab clinic run by medical professionals and have them help you get off both the opiates and benzos. If you can't find one in your state go out of state to a near by state to do this. Or go to a hospital and tell the how you want to get off of benzos, have a large tolerance to them and worry about having seizures and dying.

Yes it is that serious as people have died from trying to get off of benzos without medical help or supervision.

Smoking weed or using other drugs even if you drink alcohol are not going to help you as this is just going to wind up being a substitute addiction for you, and you will not get sober from the opiates or benzos this way.
 
I have no connections for gababention or methadone currently. I have taken 6mg Xanax today (still sober). I am done with benzos for at least a week after this. Hopefully I wont have withdrawal since its only been 72 hours of hard use. I am going to wait a week of sobriety or synthetic cannabis freeze my pee then start smoking again. Getting off methadone isn't in the cards unless I am getting back on heroin.
 
Please don't stop taking benzos at 6mg - you really need a taper. Please go to the hospital and let them know what's going on. That is an extremely high dose to jump from...this is not going to go very well. I think your benzo use has been too sporadic for this to work out.

Which synthetic cannaboid are you going to try?
 
Captain.Heroin said:
Research chemical cannabinoids are a bad idea.
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Agreed. I've tried them in the past, only one mimicked weed (and not very well, way to potent) and the others triggered seizures and were very speedy, like stimulants. Some of the ones I tried induced psychosis relatively quickly. I tried them when I was going through benzo PAWS. I had so many seizures, and my seizure meds did nothing to prevent them when I smoked.

One time I freaked out and was certain someone was in my house (I lived alone). I was renovating the master bathroom at the time and had a bunch of backer board, tiles, and a five gallon bucket of mortar along with other stuff. I barricaded myself into the bathroom by placing the backer board across the door, then moved the vanity in front of the door, and poledthe mortar and tiles on the vanity. I was too paranoid and irrational to call the cops (don't really trust cops) so I called my 70!year old Dad in a panic. He has a heart condition, and my addiction and subsequent getting sober was already stressing him out. He lived a few blocks away from me and came over. While I was waiting for him I smoked ansecond bowl (I always smoked it in the bathroom because I was too paranoid to do it outside, but didn't allow smoking in the rest of the house. While smoking my bp shot through the roof and I had a partial seizure meaning I didn't totally lose consciousness. My Dad arrived and I couldn't talk to him as I was seizing and aspirating on vomit. He almost had another cardiac event trying to get to me because I had so much stuff in front of the door. He ended up breaking through the door. Needless to say, nobody had broken into my house and my stupidity almost killed my Dad and myself.

All this happened right when the JWH series became illegal so I was smoking some mystery cannaboid that I bought at the gas station. I tried a few other kinds and finally quit because it was nothing like weed.

I think these synth cannaboids come out so quickly that it's almost anyone's guess as to how people will respond. Also, many of them are quite dangerous for consumption. The ones I preferred had a napatholine ring, which is horrifically carcinogenic, plus inwas combusting it. I would not be surprised to come down with cancer from the year I toyed with those. I've never done meth but I have heard several different people say that they feel more like meth than weed.

At any rate, I wanted to share some of my experience with synths while in benzo withdrawal/PAWS. I really don't think this is a good idea - you are dealing with so much as it is, you don't need another layer of complexity. They are also difficult to recover from because they make you stupid quick, and tend to disassociate you from your feelings, but not in a positive way, more like you have a good chance of winding up in prison way :/

Your situation is so dire and the desperatation is apparent, is there any way to get into a facility? As much as it sucks, can you find a safe place and just curl up and go on standby for a few weeks, meaning just do methadone and try to ignore the other unpleasantness? I know it's easier said than done, but it's not impossible. I did that during the worst of my benzo withdrawal. I was so close to killing myself, I had a plan, wrote out a will, and everything. I was going to do it the next day and something clicked in my brain and I told myself, hell, I don't think it can get worse than this, instead of killing myself I will just lay in bed and wait to die. I stayed in that bed for at least two weeks, I only got out of bed for the bathroom, needed water, or when I fell out having a seizure. I didn't shower or anything for that time. At one point I puked on the floor and covered it with a towel and it stayed there for about a month until I could take care of it. It was hell, but I survived. I was on benzos for ten years, and also had recently ended a seventeen year alcohol binge. You shouldn't be anywhere as bad as that, can you ride it out (again, easier said than done I know)?

In the grand scheme of things it's so temporary but so worth itnconsidered the alternative of active addiction. Which would you prefer, extreme illness for a week or so or blowing guys for dope money in definately? This cycle could go on for years, but it is within your power to stop it now. I'm not trying to be harsh or depressing, I know how bad it is. I wish I could give you a big hug in person and let you know everything will be okay. I am so very concerned for you, I wish I could take your pain away. Please don't add anything new to the mix, and please don't go back to full blown active addiction. You got sober once, focus on that time and the steps you took to get there.
 
While synth cannabinoids are not a great idea, I think they probably wouldn't be any worse than getting back on benzos full time.

I think cj would be better off taking low doses of some synth cannabinoid than having to deal with the benzo rollercoaster. He just needs to be very, very careful with which one he gets.

He needs to make sure he does the research to try and find the least dangerous one. It's really a shame the first gen synth cannabinoids are no longer easily accessible. Those were relatively benign compared to some of what has come out since.

As Moreaux said, this is only a temporary measure. A stopgap, to help cj get over the hump of shiftiness that is the acute and post acute withdrawal of benzos. So it wouldn't be more than for a few months, six months tops I would imagine. He should slowly taper off whatever RC cannabinoid he ends up going with so as to minimize any withdrawal syndrome.

This will prevent him from getting kick off methadone and having to go back on heroin (horrible idea) AND getting dependent on benzos again (almost as horrible of an idea, given the circumstances).

Keep you head up cj, you're almost there! I'm really glad to see you're figuring this shit out. I know it is not easy - actually it sounds super fucking hard! I'll give you a call later today to check in. Love you brother! <3
 
Thanks for the encouragement everyone. It means so much to me. I have a good but of benzos on hand right now if I start to get withdrawals but my current plan is to stop them today and just see where I am at dependence wise. If I am dependent again I am going to try to taper myself without getting the medical authorities involved as my parents made it abundantly clear they will stop paying for my methadone if I was to relapse on benzos.

Then again there is a part of me that just wants to check into the phych ward go thru the preliminary methadone withdrawals then get back on heroin. I also met some people yesterday who can get meth and ghb. A part of me just want to go on the mother of all drug runs and hope I don't survive. My head is just all over the place right now honestly. But the suicidal ideation is getting stronger.
 
Try and stay strong cj, that kind of burn out plan never works out well in the end. Likely you won't end up even going out in a (false) flame of "glory." It is more likely you'll end up committing some serious crime(s), getting a serious record, ruining your family's lives, and spending some time in prison. That or get institutionalized in a shitty southern mental health facility. IMO it just isn't worth it for any short term pleasure.

This is all about being patient. As you said, you have a good bit of benzos on hand. Try and just stay safe and use a little as possible for the time being. You can always get detoxed off them again if need be.

GHB or meth would be a horrible idea for you - GHB withdrawal will make benzo withdrawals look like a walk in the park, assuming you are safe enough with the dosing not to OD on it and kill yourself; meth will surely end up getting you kick out of the methadone program and you back on heroin (again, horrible idea).

Do you have a therapist you can talk to about all this stuff cj? I don't think any of us on BL are really qualified at the end of the day to give you the support you need with some of what you're struggling with.

I love you brother, I'll talk to you later today.

p.s. I started a thread in OD about finding you the safest possible RC cannabinoid. Lets see what suggestions they come up with, don't you think?
 
Wow tpd thank you for starting that thread for me! Its very kind of you. I do have a therapist I see tomorrow, I just find it difficult to lay out how bleak things truly are as she is just a really upbeat person. Or for some reason I have a hard time being honest with her.
 
You know it is my pleasure :)

I hope you're able to find the courage to bite the bullet and open up with her about what is going on, perhaps prefacing what you tell her by making it clear you are concerned about confidentiality and her potential reaction.

It will probably turn out to be the best decision you could make, opening up to her so that you have at least one person IRL you can be totally transparent and 100% honest with.

Therapists are paid to provide this kind of service, after all. It is there job to be such a person.
 
cj said:
Thanks for the encouragement everyone. It means so much to me. I have a good but of benzos on hand right now if I start to get withdrawals but my current plan is to stop them today and just see where I am at dependence wise. If I am dependent again I am going to try to taper myself without getting the medical authorities involved as my parents made it abundantly clear they will stop paying for my methadone if I was to relapse on benzos.

Then again there is a part of me that just wants to check into the phych ward go thru the preliminary methadone withdrawals then get back on heroin. I also met some people yesterday who can get meth and ghb. A part of me just want to go on the mother of all drug runs and hope I don't survive. My head is just all over the place right now honestly. But the suicidal ideation is getting stronger.
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Get help NOW. You wrote how you are suicidal, want to go on a drug run/huge binge and you have access to meth and GHB this is not a good thing at all...combining it with the withdrawl from the benzos and opiates is not going to help, and you are playing with your life and are risking getting addicted to GHB and meth or dying from using them if you decide to use them.

Check into a psych ward, hospital, rehab, etc. and get off both the benzos and opiates.

Tell your therapist that you are seeing everything you posted here about how you are suicidal, and want to use other drugs or go on a huge binge and take lots of drugs so you don't survive.

Seriously it's not worth it to do this, and once you get sober you will look back and wonder WTF you were thinking.
 
I don't think just because you're suicidal that means you need to be institutionalized.

A lot of us go through suicidal feelings. It's just part of life. Thoughts are nothing to be ashamed or afraid of.

cj knows in-patient is an option, and is choosing to not utilize it.
 
IMO cj getting off the methadone right now would be a terrible idea because he has made it clear he would just get on heroin again.
 
CJ, trust me on this, you can get through this; and there is a beauty in life which you can rekindle and cherish.

After experiencing depression for the first time in my life a few years ago, my life has been incredibly dull and tough. This culminated in me becoming addicted to benzos this year. I started in January, and by the spring/summer I was taking 200+mg of alprazolam. Unfortunately I can't remember the exact number because multiple seizures on four separate occasions have pretty much obliterated my memory of this year; but I've just checked my benzo log on my phone and I hit at least 210mg... I seem to remember hitting 300, but I couldn't say with certainty.

My point is, I managed to taper down to 10mg, before confessing to my parents and seeking medical help. I was then prescribed 4mg diazepam 3 times a day, which was reduced by 2mg a week. Unfortunately I relapsed and had a seizure on the last day of my taper. I've now been back on 4mg diazepam in the morning and 2mg at night.

If I can come off a ridiculous amount like that, then I promise you can do it. My benzo tolerance is stable now and I know they still work. I know this because when I started taking 4mg in the morning again, I initially felt a very, very mild effect. The problem with tolerance for me is that benzos don't make me sleepy, so I can easily take silly amounts, and if I redose within a day, my tolerance doubles. This causes tolerance to build fast. Throw in the fact that even when you're not on them they seem to make you act different and somewhat more recklessly, and its literally a recipe for disaster. I can remember taking doses like 100mg alprazolam and feeling sober. That's very fucked up.

HOWEVER, my mood is currently stable and hopefully this low dose diazepam taper should prevent damage. I've also experienced minimal withdrawal symptoms - mainly anxiety, and obviously seizures. But the seizures were generally a case of forgetting to dose. I'd say it took about 3 months to get from 200+mg down to 10mg. I had to do this by myself because no doctor is going to prescribe the equivalent amount of diazepam.

The way that I did it was to dose every 3-4 days. Withdrawals would really start to kick in on day 3, culminating in seizures on day 4, without fail. Because my withdrawals seemed to have a sort of rigid routine, then I could plan my taper quite effectively and reduce my dose when my tolerance had dropped substantially enough by day four.

The 4mg of diazepam in the morning/2mg at night that I've been on for the past three weeks is a godsend for stabilising my mood, and withdrawals should be minimal if I taper slow enough, which my doctor intends to do. BTW, I've taken 2mg of that alprazolam powder and it's as potent as the any of the tablets I've had over the years. 1mg has my friends nodding off to sleep.

Can you not get your doctor/a different doctor to prescribe you 2mg Diaz/clonaz tablets, and do a very slow taper? Perhaps get your parents to look after the tablets and administer the doses? You just can't have it lying around and accessible in this kind of phase, as we've both come to realise.

I completely understand about your various grievances too by the way. And also the posts about being on autopilot and it being almost like Anton mindfulness.

BTW, I apologise if this post doesn't flow so well - I'm on my phone and it's not been easy!

But I promise you can do this. Eventually physiological/economic factors are going to put an end to benzos anyway. I'm just glad it happened for me in the early days. I guess that tolerance was somewhat of a blessing.

Peace, and take care. X
 
Oh, and apologies for the double post (phone complications etc), but I think its important not to assume that you've caused some kind of damage and so its too late to taper. I feel better than I did before I started, or during my use. A lot better. I'm certain that you will to.

You really, really need to taper slowly. Like I say, a good doctor and/or the help of your parents would be ideal.
 
I appreciate all the kindness and support I have gotten from this site for the last 11 years. Good times and bad you guys are amazing. Ive decided that I need a change. I am going to be living on the street for awhile. I want to see if I can do it. Well honestly I want to die and this is a good way to do it I hope. My first goal is too get out of Alabama. Bus ticket to Philly or Cali is the plan. I want to live before I die. I want to suffer. I want to know real pain. Not this middle class bullshit version. I am sick of being the family fuckup. I love you guys more then you will ever know. Herby, toothpastedog, captain h, so many more to name. You know who you are. Ill try to check in when I can. If anyone can spare a couch that would be cool I swear im not a thief, But yeah I love you all PLUR
 
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