That Wacky Modafinil

[coriolis]

In the past I was taking modafinil 200mg q.i.d. sometimes even 1200mg or 1400mg daily and 100-200mg of quetiapine hora somni for the ensuing insomnia. I took such large doses for about 3 months and I felt well-it helped to compensate my cognitive deficit due to mainly idiopathic encephalopathy. But after this period I got constant sore throat and flu-like feeling-perhaps a some blood dyscrasia appeared.

 

[MurphyClox]

Holy...! 1200 - 1400 mg daily is by FAR more than recommended! As was said earlier, modafinil (almost) lacks any real stimulating property. It keeps you awake, but doesn't provide the pushing like amphetamine and alike. Why did you take such high doses? Did it change the "high" to some degree?

 

[nabollocks]

Holy...! 1200 - 1400 mg daily is by FAR more than recommended! As was said earlier, modafinil (almost) lacks any real stimulating property. It keeps you awake, but doesn't provide the pushing like amphetamine and alike. Why did you take such high doses? Did it change the "high" to some degree?

I have been there once... just in the name of science.

Needless to say, I did not sleep that night. 8)

The experience was sort of self regulating. Like my brain was telling me that it did not require any more of the substance. Definately not a nice feeling, and all i wanted was to be normal again.

 

[Riemann Zeta]

Above 400mg or so, modafinil is all side effects (mainly headache, dizziness and stomach discomfort) and no additional beneficial CNS stimulation. So, as mentioned, it is pretty 'self-regulating.'

 

[hexxx]

Modafinil addictive and unnecessary? Bah.

no evidence about that.

I wish my doctors thought that way, a psych and a neurologist have both told me that (pretty much), I'm dying for some stimulation. All I have at hand are depressants and I really want Modafinil to help me get up in the morning and concentrate. It is S5 here, same category as benzos and relatively strong painkillers (CIII in US).

Even while I was asking at pharmacy for possible help with concentration because of high Lyrica use, they immediately said to speak to my doctor about Provigil and gave me the box instructions without batting an eyelid. I was hoping for some nootropics or something but they are actually scheduled here (nootropil is S3 - which means you normally need a script or they may hand them to you without a script if you give them a story, diclofenac is the same although they normally just hand that out).

I have one doctor left to try and get it from but he's a oncologist and I won't see him for a few months. I don't know if he'll buy the PCCI story, he was strict on meds even when I had cancer... My psych told me to ask him so maybe there's hope. The psych wouldn't even RX nootropil because he said it's useless and told me that there is evidence of dimentia from Ginko Biloba usage - maybe he just thinks I'm really fucked up?

EDIT: I think the psychs getting high off his own supply. They tried to use ginkgo to treat dementia, it doesn't cause it.

 

[Kudos]

Modafinil seems severely underrated. In my experience using it, it has proven to be the overall superior stimulant. In terms of wakefulness, it's the only thing short of opiates that makes reasonable sleep deprivation close to bearable. Getting little to no sleep results in complete anguish for me; my body temperature plummets, my brain completely shuts off, my skin gets oily and all my muscles hurt. In a word, it's torture. Amphetamines just cause further damage, though it keeps me from toppling over; caffeine decimates the glycemic index (I'd be better off just eating fruit). Most noteworthy, the energy modafinil gives stands in stark contrast to that of Ritalin, speed and the like. It is far more easy-going, friendly, playful and visceral than the cerebral, analytical, often arrogant, cocky etc. equivalent of these others. As a result, I have found it inferior to Ritalin for strictly intellectual activities requiring """ADD""" suppression, but far more practical for regular use. I'd consider it a far superior replacement for daily caffeine.

However, Modafinil also seems to be a far superior anti-depressant (for what we'll call my 'depression), than any anti-depressant, anti-psychotic, benzodiazepine, etc. etc. It has been more productive in that regard than anything short of hallucinogens, and, assuming I am not some lone freak brain, it is practically a scandal that it has not been researched more thoroughly for this type of treatment.

It would be very nice to have more information about its mechanisms, especially for the purpose of finding similarly great chemicals :D.

 

[death_kitten]

My expirence with Modafinil

First off, I have narcolepsy, which was diagnosed about 2.5-3 years ago and due to factors beyond my control, I had to change doctors and was unable to be on my full set of meds for some months. Now, however; I am back on my full script regimen (with limited exceptions to be explained later) of Dextroamphetamine: 30mg twice daily (max legal dosage), Modafinil: 200mg twice daily, Fluoxetine: 20mg twice daily, and Temazepam: 10mg-20mg as needed... On top of all that I drink any energy drinks I can get my hands on and smoke 1-2 cigs every three days or so (working on trying to quit, but not working so well), and given all of that, I can still fall asleep during the day usually. Now, the pharmacy that I have to go through to get my meds has a bunch of extra regulations on how they handle Schedule II medications, which means that in the past in the past year, I have not been on my Dex for a total of a month because of the incompetence of their staff and sheer absurdity of their Schedule II medication refill system. So I called my neurologist and asked him what to do and he said to use the Modafinil as needed and he would refill it early, one of the days I got up to about 2g through out the course of the day. Given it was a day that I had to go out and do stuff like drive and interact with people and such, cause the last thing I wanted was to fall asleep while driving or something. The only additional effects that I felt on this high of a dosage was a slight increase in paranoia, muscle tension (especially in my neck), and the normal effects were increased slightly, though I still got a full night of sleep that night.

Now, as for the standard effects that I have noticed while on this medication are that it does promote a state of being awake, it seems to help with my problem solving abilities and a slight increase in the speed at which I can react to situations (or perhaps my brain just subconsciously assesses the situation and the increase in problem solving affects that, I don't know. All I know is that I can have my arms full of groceries, drop a bottle, and catch it before it hits the ground and without dropping any other items.) One other effect that this substance has (it seems to affect depressants in this way as well as stims, though I don't have enough experience on that side to fully verify this theory) is that it seems to synergize with and amplify meds/chems that act on the CNS in general; it definitely does this with CNS stims from my expirence. Which partially explains the ill effects many people have when mixing with caffeine, it would probably feel a lot like you were experiencing some degree of a caffeine OD, and those are just nasty. One last note, the way that I have described how Modafinil feels when it is active is that it has a very "clean and almost clinically sanitary feeling" to it, where for me Adderall (I was on that before I had to change docs) felt kind of "fuzzy and tacky" and Dex just feels "edgy" comparatively. Hopefully that helps a bit, and if anyone has questions, feel free to ask and I will do my best to help answer them.

 

[nordr]

First off, I have narcolepsy, which was diagnosed about 2.5-3 years ago and due to factors beyond my control, I had to change doctors and was unable to be on my full set of meds for some months. Now, however; I am back on my full script regimen (with limited exceptions to be explained later) of Dextroamphetamine: 30mg twice daily (max legal dosage), Modafinil: 200mg twice daily, Fluoxetine: 20mg twice daily, and Temazepam: 10mg-20mg as needed... On top of all that I drink any energy drinks I can get my hands on and smoke 1-2 cigs every three days or so (working on trying to quit, but not working so well), and given all of that, I can still fall asleep during the day usually. Now, the pharmacy that I have to go through to get my meds has a bunch of extra regulations on how they handle Schedule II medications, which means that in the past in the past year, I have not been on my Dex for a total of a month because of the incompetence of their staff and sheer absurdity of their Schedule II medication refill system. So I called my neurologist and asked him what to do and he said to use the Modafinil as needed and he would refill it early, one of the days I got up to about 2g through out the course of the day. Given it was a day that I had to go out and do stuff like drive and interact with people and such, cause the last thing I wanted was to fall asleep while driving or something. The only additional effects that I felt on this high of a dosage was a slight increase in paranoia, muscle tension (especially in my neck), and the normal effects were increased slightly, though I still got a full night of sleep that night.

Now, as for the standard effects that I have noticed while on this medication are that it does promote a state of being awake, it seems to help with my problem solving abilities and a slight increase in the speed at which I can react to situations (or perhaps my brain just subconsciously assesses the situation and the increase in problem solving affects that, I don't know. All I know is that I can have my arms full of groceries, drop a bottle, and catch it before it hits the ground and without dropping any other items.) One other effect that this substance has (it seems to affect depressants in this way as well as stims, though I don't have enough experience on that side to fully verify this theory) is that it seems to synergize with and amplify meds/chems that act on the CNS in general; it definitely does this with CNS stims from my expirence. Which partially explains the ill effects many people have when mixing with caffeine, it would probably feel a lot like you were experiencing some degree of a caffeine OD, and those are just nasty. One last note, the way that I have described how Modafinil feels when it is active is that it has a very "clean and almost clinically sanitary feeling" to it, where for me Adderall (I was on that before I had to change docs) felt kind of "fuzzy and tacky" and Dex just feels "edgy" comparatively. Hopefully that helps a bit, and if anyone has questions, feel free to ask and I will do my best to help answer them.

Quoted for absolute truth. I'm an on-call analyst at a financial firm (you can imagine what that's like these days... and no I didn't get us into this mess, I work in the side of the business that cleans up after these kinds of messes), and suffer from basilar-type migraines. As such, I'm on a battery of meds to combat that, as well as Alprazolam to help me sleep at night. Naturally, I wake up groggy as fuck. I was prescribed Provigil (name-brand, no generic shit here) a week ago and I can already notice a difference. I don't feel like superman, I don't have the urge to type 90WPM, but I *do* socialize much better, I *do* detect a subtle increase in my cognitive function, and I find that it completely offsets the stupifying effects of Topamax. I have also managed to work 6 hours straight on a mind-numbing report, whereas my usual ADD-self would be checking Bluelight or Google Reader every ten minutes.

Provigil is a drug designed to solve a problem, not to help you escape. It has been an absolute godsend for me.

 

[LuxEtVeritas]

^indeed it can be for those who respond well and find the right therapeutic dose

 

[irobeth]

I've been taking 200mg/day for about two weeks now, and here's my take on it:

Modafinil lets you ignore exhaustion, both physical and mental, and nothing more.

Recently I was out on travel and took 200mg/8 hours, I was awake for 80 hours with no negative side effects until i discontinued the dose so I could get some sleep, at which point the classic signs of sleep deprivation kicked in. There was, after about day two, a haze of sluggishness which I would attribute to the body being worn out, but it didn't stop or hinder daily function - it was very easy to compensate for that lag by thought.

The first day I started taking them, I was capable of great physical exertion (high difficulty DDR for 6 - 7 hours nonstop) only to realize the next day that I had hurt myself doing it; I haven't tried anything like that since because I'm still getting used to actively listening for signals that I'm approaching a threshold for safety.

It'd seem the function of Modafinil is to let you shut off the alerts your body gives that you're reaching your limit. That's not necessarily a good thing, but it does allow you to debt yourself in the future for performance in the present. It's true that the drug itself doesn't push you, but if you've got the will it lets you push yourself.

I can't say that it's addicting because more often than not, discontinuing it is a welcome break from always being active. It isn't fun or unfun to use; It's just 'there' when you need it, minus the two or three hours it takes to pick you up. Taking it with caffeine makes up for its delay, however.

As for problems sleeping, I find that 25mg diphenhydramine seems to abort its wakefulness effects.

 

[Riemann Zeta]

^^ That's a good way of describing the effects of modafinil in situations where running with little sleep is the only option. It does have a way of ameliorating the nasty-feeling side effects of sleep deprivation, both mental and physical. In the context of lack of sleep, modafinil does not provide you with an 'amped' feeling, but (to some extent) does compensate for the sleep loss, making you feel relatively normal.

 

[pofacedhoe]

How would you classify modafinil?

It binds to DAT, increases MA levels, has odd H3 effects.



hypocretin? Never even heard of it until now. Oh, it's orexin.

from wiki:



It seems to not be recreational, but all of mechanisms seem to scream recreational. So why not?

I've taken it two days now (at 175, tommorow I'll go to 200 where I was supposed to start, but better safe than sorry- I was up until 3am last night), and I don't know that I could distinguish it from a low dose of amphetamine. Definitely not like a DARI, which even at low doses I experienced euphoria, but with amphetamine I never did. I don't have any euphoria, but it is still useful.

It's probably the most mentally boosting drug I've ever used.




Also, I've seen some 'modafinil analogues' of phenyltropanes made that were insanely potent; have similar things been tried for regular PEAs or is the ethylamine to short to stick the sulfur into?

speed to me feels so boring like i'm in an office photocopying my soul till it erodes for sure but ritalin is euphoric creative rave up (MAKES ME FEEL SEXY AND STYLISH). the wonders of individual brain a neuron genetic styles

daris all the way but as for dopamine it may just miss the reward pathway and loiter somewhere pointless like shattners basson

this drug sounds usefull if you get tweaky of dex, it may not get you high but you can hold down a job-an actual decent result and positive long term gain(during moneygheddon)



moneygheddon- charlie brooker coined this term to make the financial climate sound bad but exciting rather than just plain old shit. remeber the chinese have crisis and oppportunity the same word.

 

[Riemann Zeta]

Crisatunity.

 

[Solipsis]

I see people are trying not so modest amounts through oral administration - probably tablets?
Might be worth mentioning that I have gotten excellent results from insufflating absolutely tiny amounts (in the order of 20 mg) pure product of course - the effect is absolutely instant and it only builds up more in the course of a couple hours. I don't understand because it shouldn't be water soluble?? Hmm.
I wouldn't call it a typical stimulant by any means, it facilitates the mere possibility of mental concentration and wakefulness as opposed to most stimulants that directly result in stimulation.
Little amounts of dextroamphetamine are used for AD(H)D and while I have only 1 experience with it I feel simultaneously more sedated and energized i.e. I have a clear head and a clear body, both can handle more activity though the direct effect is being LESS active!
Now, from modafinil I don't get less active but hopefully you see my point.

 

[irobeth]

I see people are trying not so modest amounts through oral administration - probably tablets?
...
Little amounts of dextroamphetamine are used for AD(H)D and while I have only 1 experience with it I feel simultaneously more sedated and energized i.e. I have a clear head and a clear body, both can handle more activity though the direct effect is being LESS active!
Now, from modafinil I don't get less active but hopefully you see my point.

I've got 200mg tabs, yeah.

As far as clear head and body go, after about a month of prescription use, I'm noticing that I feel 'dirty' or 'hazy' in both mental process and physical clarity. Can't put my finger on it.

 

[coriolis]

As to the modafinil's capability of enhancing the efficacy of mental work I would say that modafinil makes me alert yet my mind is easily distracted, as to the amount of significant work I am able to do, methylphenidate is much more efficient, methylphenidate makes me focused and although it has the drawbacks of a "comedown', unlike modafinil, it can be attenuated by dosing it prudently in small amounts.

 

[coriolis]

Also be careful of combining modafinil with quetiapine especially in combination with oxandrolone. I don't know if it was only some exceptional drug idiosyncrasy but after this combination I suffered a severe hypertension, tachycardia and pyrexia, only sufficient dose of clonazepam and metoprolol saved me from an urgent visit to a hospital.

 

[Ximot]

also be careful when combining modafinil with psychedelic phenethylamines (2ce/2cd come to mind). sensory hyperstimulation was felt so acutely that I wasn't too sure if that was my mind or my body that was going to explode there. Due to the nature of modafinil, i wasn't even freaked out per se ... almost interested at how I was being pulled apart at the seams... didn't check bp or anything but it did get me to ingest an emergency helping of ghb . . .

 

[egor]

^I had a really bad experience with modafinil and 4-aco-mipt recently too...

 

[Solipsis]

Thanks for the heads up, probably when I'm in a condition to use psychedelics I should not have any need for modafinil but I will definitely pay attention to abstaining from the combination to be sure.

Oh wow, I'm really impressed with this stuff! I can eat on it, sleep wasn't a problem although I didn't take any further in the afternoon - there are no peripheral effects remotely strong enough to annoy me and in the course of peak plasma builing up over the first few hours there is a very very definite mood lift hinting to euphoria but about 10 times more natural than any other stimulating substance I've come across.

I've gotten about 1,5 g from a friend who often falls asleep right after taking it!
Hm weird.

A perfect piece of pharmacological wonder if you ask me!

(and it has a nice aroma too LOL)