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What is wrong with the MDMA available today?

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Thank you for clarification on my question Glubra. Wish there was a way to get a Raman of some of the newer product as they seem incredibly hard to find post 2010.

Also Glubra I think you may be onto something.. It's amazing how hard they clamped down on quality safrole and MDP2P but it seems this MDP2P glycidate is just coasting past borders and the only reasoning people have for that is "it's a powder instead of liquid..". Sure solids are easier to smuggle than liquids but still it almost seems like people can get it too easy. Also why is it so cheap and plentiful?

Many say it's manufactured from different precursors that aren't safrole. I'm curious what those are.. How come all the sudden we're flooded with this stuff yet no one really knows all that much about it?..

Then we've got people getting fried off one dose for years after and we've gotta start to wonder..

Glubra like you said, what better way to tarnish the name of MDMA?

Also montel, we aren't claiming ALL labs synthesize the same. But there are general trends that can be seen when the research is examined. I'd argue the only time MOST of the MDMA was synthesized the same was the early to mid 90's, all other eras of MDMA have been marked with general trends but overall there were still multiple routes used throughout the world.

-GC
 
So here's what makes me feel these lab tests aren't always telling the full story: https://www.ecstasydata.org/view.php?id=6083

The pill weighs 334mg containing 155mg of MDMA, but nothing else is listed. That means there is 179mg, more than half the pill, containing unknown active or inactive substance(s). I get the feeling that with these lab tests if they aren't looking for the chemicals, or they aren't the usual suspects, they won't be found.
 
Hilopsilo said:
So here's what makes me feel these lab tests aren't always telling the full story: https://www.ecstasydata.org/view.php?id=6083

The pill weighs 334mg containing 155mg of MDMA, but nothing else is listed. That means there is 179mg, more than half the pill, containing unknown active or inactive substance(s). I get the feeling that with these lab tests if they aren't looking for the chemicals, or they aren't the usual suspects, they won't be found.
Click to expand...

But again...that is kind of the point.

If there is an adulterant that is currently NOT being tested for, that is being mixed with MDMA in pills and causing a reduced MDMA experience & worse comedown, then that is a safety hazard.

155 mg of MDMA should produce a fairly strong MDMA experience. If there is something else in that pill that is preventing that, then that needs to be determined.

Unknown adulterants have been towards the top of the list of suspects for awhile now.
 
and Montel...no one has ever said that every lab does the same thing. But there are trends in the availability and popularity of certain precursors and methods. There are plenty of news articles available online that detail these shifts in precursor availability/legality and subsequent changes in production.
 
Hilopsilo said:
So here's what makes me feel these lab tests aren't always telling the full story: https://www.ecstasydata.org/view.php?id=6083

The pill weighs 334mg containing 155mg of MDMA, but nothing else is listed. That means there is 179mg, more than half the pill, containing unknown active or inactive substance(s). I get the feeling that with these lab tests if they aren't looking for the chemicals, or they aren't the usual suspects, they won't be found.
Click to expand...

Tablet mix and binders and colours usually non active. Same as youd get in a multivitamin, its not pure vitamins.
 
Lets say for example I had an original Q dance pill, could any tests be done on it to explain why it knocked the boll*x out of other pills?
I could send it a warnerbro for example to compare it to. Just curious.

I still stand by my opinion that different buzz of 90s pills because there was more MDA around. Remember snowballs?
 
I sent a lot of old pills into ecstasydata as well. Yes, some were MDA, and the effect was distinctive. Most were MDMA. I don't think that is the explanation.

Wish we could get something set up to test with more detail. Then users who have good/bad quality samples could see what showed up in a lab report as the difference.
 
JG0007 said:
Lets say for example I had an original Q dance pill, could any tests be done on it to explain why it knocked the boll*x out of other pills?
I could send it a warnerbro for example to compare it to. Just curious.

I still stand by my opinion that different buzz of 90s pills because there was more MDA around. Remember snowballs?
Click to expand...

If you really have those, wait until more conclusive tests are organized.
 
I have 2 original Q dance in my collection yes. If only we knew how special they were at the time.
 
JG0007 said:
Lets say for example I had an original Q dance pill, could any tests be done on it to explain why it knocked the boll*x out of other pills?
I could send it a warnerbro for example to compare it to. Just curious.

I still stand by my opinion that different buzz of 90s pills because there was more MDA around. Remember snowballs?
Click to expand...

ummmm snowballs they were ace. never knew it was mda though, but though to myself the fookers are strong
 
The term pure MDMA & Molly is thrown around loosely nowadays.....Soo many imprints, soo many people who havent had a genuine MDMA trip. Add that its a Party drug, so loyalty / purity isnt consistent...I did my homework I thought, besides a test, I wasnt used to getting a dud.....Im in my 30's now so im out of the loop....I wish things were like when I didnt have to do a bunch or research..My 3 great experiences are ingrained in my head....
 
@Glubra- It seems piperonal was the original precursor for indigos lackluster product he was getting as well.. I wonder if it's this starting point that creates sub par product?

@Hilo- Indeed those lab tests don't get everything. They only list active substances that they know to search for. The likelihood a new impurity not well known to occur in MDMA previously, passing by the analysts heads is high.

@JG- The little analysis of ecstasy back then combined with anecdotal reports tells us otherwise. I've done plenty of MDA, lots combined with MDMA and it's not the culprit for the reason MDMA was different back then. From what I've seen MDA can be awesome at a music event but generally is better for an at-home roll where you can gush to your hearts desire to the ones around you. 75% of the time when I take MDA out at a music event I tend to want to leave and don't feel like I'm rolling until I walk out for fresh air and get hit like a ton of bricks. (The other 25% is 6-8hrs solid dancing, aka best night of your life.). It's simply to unreliable in its effects to be the culprit.

90's MDMA (rather impure leuckart synthesized product) was reliable in that it made everyone get out on the dance floor and move. MDA can be stimulating for some and mongy for others. My last two experiences with MDMA/MDA combos, (both on 100mg mdma, 25mg MDA plus a mdma booster) one was highly stimulating one was rather chill but both on the same MDA. MDMA (whether the 90's stuff or just the high quality crystals available in certain areas these days) has always been more reliable in how it effects people.

Also while the snowballs had MDA they were quite obviously different from the rest of the pills of that era.

I will say after reading through Reddit a bit I can see some people still get good product. Reddit seems to be more of an American forum too.. Look up embarrassing things people have said and done on MDMA there to see what I mean lol.

I'd say the biggest tragedy of this era of MDMA is the way it's used as opposed to the crappy sub par product floating around. Reddit being a prime example. People worrying too much about showing pictures of how "big" (usually not all that big mind you) their pupils are or other posts while rolling. When I'm rolling I'm doing it to be 100% present in the moment, typically dancing or bonding with others, I've got no time to prove how potent my product is via a picture of my pupils nor do I care even when sober.

I remember a time when a light show was something a rolling person got lost in, now it's a moment t catch a selfie to show everyone how cool you are.. I guess this happened in the 90's too, commercialism ruins the scene until it dies off almost completely only to be reborn again by the few who remained for the true spirit of it all.

-GC
 
Sorry to double post but found this thread on Reddit that I find interesting. I believe the "LTC phenomenon" we see here on BL is directly related to the possible impurities that cause the lackluster effects people described.

https://www.reddit.com/r/MDMA/comments/8893um/impure_mdma_story/

In this post, while they did not test they were obtaining through a dealer who had been legit in the past (I know not saying much.). It's the effects of the pills and subsequent reaction that makes me think impur MDMA. They felt good but things felt a little off until they redosed and shit became lethargic and in a sense toxic feeling.

Two of the people involved still are feeling DP/DR.

We are starting to see more cases of LTC where multiple people are coming down with these nasty symptoms, whereas before it was an isolated incident here and there.

I supppse it could of been another substance which caused this but I've seen enough reports with tested product causing these symptoms to believe this was likely impure MDMA.

Now more than ever we need to figure this out as it could mean the health of many people.

The only easy test I have is this... And it definitely is not conclusive but the marquis reagent does contain more purple when even the slightest amount of safrole is present and it seems safrole product doesn't likely cause these problems. No safrole and the MDMA will go jet black with zero purple seen. That's the best we have for now..

Indigo did you marquis test that new stuff?

-GC
 
I stopped reading at page 6 and figured I'd just chime in randomly like the dummie I am.

jredcity said:
whoops, i hit the return button instead of shift. so real quick, the Ethiopian's faces got like long like a banana and my friend, J looked at the ground and pucked up three completely whole, undigested meatballs one after the other&from then on it was BLISS. so many details. but not enough time to go into. anyway I've seen nothing even close since then. yup
,
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First off, thanks for the laugh, I really did lol about the meatballs.

Second. I did x in the 90's and I remember wonderful times on things like double/triple stacked Mitsubishis or Supermans or green clovers.
I recall getting a couple hundred pink pills with the statue of liberty on them, they were a bit trippy but good and very cheap for some reason.
I remember the good times OP is talking about. It was like a miracle drug. It brought together the closest group of friends I've ever had when
we were teens and we all still communicate at least to an extent with each other.
As I tried x years later, I was really disappointed. But then again, this has happened with coke, meth, acid etc.
EVerything seems to have gone down the shitter quality wise.
I have thought to myself that it is age and chemical changes etc but I recall the last time I tried x about a decade ago.
Me and my buddy got nothing off of it but my other friend, she was rollin hard. She was one of the group I did x with in the 90's
and she was not burnt out or have chemical changes, age etc.
So it's hard for me to tell what's really going on given this last experience because of her, but in my own experience it is all crap now.
 
G_Chem said:
Sorry to double post but found this thread on Reddit that I find interesting. I believe the "LTC phenomenon" we see here on BL is directly related to the possible impurities that cause the lackluster effects people described.

https://www.reddit.com/r/MDMA/comments/8893um/impure_mdma_story/

In this post, while they did not test they were obtaining through a dealer who had been legit in the past (I know not saying much.). It's the effects of the pills and subsequent reaction that makes me think impur MDMA. They felt good but things felt a little off until they redosed and shit became lethargic and in a sense toxic feeling.

Two of the people involved still are feeling DP/DR.

We are starting to see more cases of LTC where multiple people are coming down with these nasty symptoms, whereas before it was an isolated incident here and there.

I supppse it could of been another substance which caused this but I've seen enough reports with tested product causing these symptoms to believe this was likely impure MDMA.

Now more than ever we need to figure this out as it could mean the health of many people.

The only easy test I have is this... And it definitely is not conclusive but the marquis reagent does contain more purple when even the slightest amount of safrole is present and it seems safrole product doesn't likely cause these problems. No safrole and the MDMA will go jet black with zero purple seen. That's the best we have for now..

Indigo did you marquis test that new stuff?

-GC
Click to expand...

I think the LTC is just from abuse/impure product. The vast majority of posts on here from people feeling shit from "MDMA" just by reading their post you can tell they don't know much about it, from their story you can tell they didn't exercise harm reduction, or they pounded through a large amount of it in 1 night or many consecutively. MDMA is a much bigger part of pop culture at this point, more people doing it, more people to come to the internet with their problems. And I'm sure you're aware, but one is much more likely to post about difficulties with MDMA than good times. I've had countless great times with MDMA, but the handful of posts I've ever made on internet forums has been about difficulties surrounding it.

I don't mean this judgmentally, but I find that people who don't know much about a drug or are inexperienced are less likely to have access to good product or use it responsibly in either case. Seriously, from the post: "We suspect that there were large traces of Ketamine in the trump pills." (and I think "large traces" is an oxymoron)

Even as I've grown up doing it, I've noticed some culture surrounding it has shifted a bit from taking your pill at the beginning of the night to racking that shit back til the morning. I noticed this practice become popularized around 2010-2011 when good MDMA became incredibly scarce (and it became an element of hip-hop culture) , and people likely had to do way more of it to get anywhere close to a desired effect (why isn't this working?? lets do more!). Even with perfectly good MDMA, I've seen people go through grams of it in a night like its nothing. Like thats their concept of how its done, oh you want to do MDMA? Ok lets split a gram and snort it all night.
 
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^^Thats all very true and part of the reason it's so hard to accurately assess what's really the cause of this. I think impure product is likely the problem too and people less connected are probably more likely to run into impure product with negative symptoms (talking product with MDMA in it but other crap as well..)

I'd argue though that only about half the people who report LTC are ones who abuse it. Many are college kids who were curious and tried one or two pills, one or two times. I've got a few theories as to why that's the case.. But whatever the cause I can say fairly certainly we've never had this quantity of people coming in with complaints. There's a change, but what that change is it hard to pinpoint.

To list off what I think some of the causes may be:

-Impurity/ies leftover from synthesis
-Change in culture surrounding consumption
-Higher dosage pills
-More non-drug taking people with little experience trying Mdma
-More people talking about their lives via internet

There's probably more but those come to mind, the culprit is likely an amalgam of these factors.

The thing that often scares me about the LTC reports is that often the experience the person had was usually all not that intense. More often than not they have a rather normal experience and a rather normal day after until the symptoms appear days later. This to me indicates impurity as the dosages never seem to high. Of course there are the abusers who get these symptoms after much use but their LTC seems different and often more transient in nature compared to the one off person who came down with it after one dose.

-GC
 
Ive not much used mdma (something like 20 times and I dont plan to repeat as I have 2cc, trypta, lyser and related stuff that I prefer) but I can agree with the op. My first pills was cool but not as much as ppl make them sound like. I had the wiggles, the euphoria, some empathy, touch sensation,then a comedown. Somewhere near the 10-15th pills, a friend of mine was making propaganda to myself about trying some fucked up pills he found. They was violet or something, pressed as a hearth or a rose flower I dont remember. I wasnt that motivated as mdma is not my things, but I finally bought 3 or propaganda wouldnt stop. And omg. Its not that the high necessarelly did fuck up myself more, but the sensation was simply out of this world : empathy and touch was far more pronounced and I got far more appreciation of social stuff, euphoria sounded like it had far more into it than simple serotoninergic stuff like previous mdma I had or to a lesser extend a good cathinone, let alone 4fa. The wiggles and physicals was similar, but didnt feel like bad side effect. After that I got another connection with other pills, and another one who got it from dnm but these last was the same as the first one : a good serotoninergic, perhaps a bit better than 6apb but shorter, but nothing to shout the drug name all over. Then I decided to stop mdma mainly because of comedown, risk of LTR, suspected neurotoxicity and I find LSD and related drugs better.
Sry for english mistake Im french
 
Indigo did you marquis test that new stuff?
Click to expand...

My friend did, and the lab did as well. You can see the purple in the lab link. https://www.ecstasydata.org/view.php?id=6072

no_id, I think your story really adds a new element. Your first experiences were unimpressive and matched what many of us are finding with the product currently available on the street. Later on, you had a product that matched the experiences we recall from a higher quality product. Since you had an unimpressive experience first, that establishes that it is not simply tolerance. If it was tolerance, then your first experience would be the best and it would go downhill from there.

Short update, not sure when I will get a chance to try the dw product. Had a friend I hoped to participate with, and he is out. So, it will most likely just be me doing it alone, and I have a ton of stuff going on right now. I guess a longer wait will yield better data anyway.
 
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