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Concentrates The HHC thread (Hexahydrocannabinol)

Snafu in the Void said:
@Curious Chemist you've had the luxury of using highly pure THC-O / THC-P / HHC? Interesting! The only products I've tried were extremely diluted but still effective for someone without an extreme cannabinoid tolerance.
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They can all be obtained from pure (-)-CBD, which is commercially available in bulk and high purity. The Δ8-THC-OPp is the O-propionate, the propionic acid ester… , NOT the Δ9-THCP (“THC-P”) with a longer alkyl sidechain than the standard Δ9-THC (C7 versus C5, respectively). I don’t think Δ8-THC-OPp is available anywhere.
 
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Snafu in the Void said:
HHC has three chiral centers, meaning it has three different forms of it.
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I fully agree on the three chiral centers in HHCs. However, I would like to respectfully correct some inconsistencies in your intro, hope you don’t mind.

In principle the number of stereoisomers is 2^n (“two to the power of n”, with n = number of chiral centers). For three chiral centers that is 2 x 2 x 2 = 8 stereoisomers.

Of the 8 different stereoisomers only two are relevant for HHC. The 9α and 9β-isomer of HHC differ from each other in the stereochemistry at the 9-position. The inactive 9α-HHC has an axial-methyl group (for which there is no place in the CB receptor, thus resulting in low binding affinity) and the active 9β-HHC has an equatorial methyl group (that fits nicely in the CB receptor, thus resulting in strong binding).

These two stereoisomers, 9α-HCC and 9β-HCC, are NOT enantiomers (mirror images) because they have exactly the same stereochemistry at the remaining two stereocenters labeled as 6 and 10a. The 6 and 10a stereocenters of HHC are locked in the same stereochemistry as those found in CBD, Δ9-THC, or Δ8-THC. The fact that two of the three stereocenters are locked is exactly the reason why only 2 of the theoretically possible 8 stereoisomers are observed.

The two isomers, 9α-HCC and 9β-HCC are formed in an approximately 1:1 ratio upon hydrogenation of Δ9-THC or Δ8-THC, but there are also some fully synthetic protocols that furnish exclusively the active 9β-HCC.

I have not yet found any experimental affinity constants for HHCs but like most cannabinoids both 9α-HCC and 9β-HCC can be expected to bind with compound specific affinities to both the CB1 and CB2 receptors.

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This stuff is really nice, I smoked 3x5mg, full dose is around 20mg they say. The stoned feeling you normally get with weed, especially with no tolerance is not there. And I had 0 tolerance. that same feeling that makes you paranoid.
 
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somnilicious said:
I know this is late but I tested positive for THC after preliminary tests and labs for over 3 weeks after taking 1 pull off an HHC cart.
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This is interesting, a bit uncommon, but not unheard of. Seems results come out a few different ways. I’d say 50-60% pass their test, so I gave it some good thought and here’s what I think.

#1. Negative on dip stick and passing the lab, with zero positives at any time
#2. Positive on dip stick for only 24 hours but then passing 48 later, while passing the lab.
#3. Positive on the dip stick and positive at the lab several days to 30 days after last use.
#4. Inordinate amounts of time (I.e 90 days) for the above.

So, I believe #1 is thanks to brands like Moonwalkr and Bearly Legal, who do not include any other THC cannabinoids in their HHC. I have noticed both brands are mentioned for passing both stick and lab, with Bearly Legal getting the most shoutouts due to its popularity.

I think #2. is because CBN is frequently found in small amounts, per some COAs. Basically, no THC cannabinoids present, but a small amount of CBN would produce a positive dip stick test for maybe 1 or 2 days…..however, a lab confirmation WILL rule out a THC positive in this case.

The point I’m making is ensure they have a COA from an acredited 3rd party lab, and most importantly, make sure the COA shows ZERO (ND) for Delta 8/9/10. Even trace amounts can fuck you over and I’ll explain why (since Pure HHC is likely to pass a drug test).

For #3, it’s almost certainly the trace THCs. The thing is some companies use a full spectrum blend……and some just don’t care enough to remove the Delta-8 residue (aka being cheap for profiteering). I think most fall into the former though, basically believing HHC with trace THCs give more bang for buck. The problem is that if you enough trace THC in your system, it could easily fail you! Add to that that there is a *theory* saying that If you are within a stones throw of 50ng/ml, the HHC could have an additive effect, and put you over 50ng/ml. Here’s the rub. A MS-lab confirmation should rule out a positive for THC……..IFFFFF your Delta-9 COOH metabolite is below the 15ng cutoff threshold. Most, but not all, businesses and courts perform confirmation tests, but some looking to save a few pennies might not. If it fails confirmation, it’s most likely because the THC itself was too high, HHC has more molecular difference to Delta-9 than say Delta-8, and HHC turns into a hydroxy metabolite, rather than a COOH one, lol.

For #4, I hate to say it, but bad product! I’ve seen reports of people having quite like 120 days and cannot get a clean test. I think there’s something going on, like a *fucked up* improperly made version of HHC or something. I think this might of been what happened to you. Just my views.

Overall, I would say HHC is notably *easier* to pass a drug test with than D-8 or D-10, but due to variables, I would say easier doesn’t imply nearly always. Just that it’s a safer risk if you have to drug test.
 
Nucynta_80 said:
Overall, I would say HHC is notably *easier* to pass a drug test with than D-8 or D-10, but due to variables, I would say easier doesn’t imply nearly always. Just that it’s a safer risk if you have to drug test.
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I heard from someone that he took a urine test directly after smoking some HHC and he was positive for d9-THC.
 
izo said:
I heard from someone that he took a urine test directly after smoking some HHC and he was positive for d9-THC.
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Ive checked out several of the HHC carts. Several of the COAs indicate they contact Delta-8 or Delta-9 in small doses as well. In fact, a few carts had considerable doses of Delta-8 enough to give a buzz, even if no HHC had been included. Delta Extracts had a considerable amount of Delta-8 in their COAs for HHC vapes, but only advertised the product as an HHC vape. I did research for a friend to see what vapes she could safely use for drug test purposes. After checking the COAs on several brands out, only 3 total were ND for any THC.

The thing is, if you want HHC that’s below detectability for Delta-8/9/10, you are going to have to spend more.

The gummies I use are pure HHC, but they aren’t cheap. Negative on cheap at home test, but based on considerable reporting I’ve read, the primary way HHC products fail people for drug tests, especially if MS-lab confirmation is involved, is because it contains either Delta-8 or Delta-8 and 9. Also, a few companies skirt the rules by simply adding water to the molecule, rather than true hydrogenation through one of the 3 primary methods (aka it’s **actually** Delta-8).

Solid COA for an high quality HHC only containing product should not have ANY detectable THC, and either zero or only a minuscule amount of CBN. Part of the issue might lay in form.

It seems like gummies have less impurities and per COAs, a reputable company will only have the cannaboids advertised. When it comes to vapes, it appears the purity factor decreases.

For this reason, I won’t touch any brands currently for HHC, except for Moonwalkr and Bearly Legal…..and only gummies at that lol.
 
To be clear, I’m not trying to throw shade on HHC vape companies. I get it, it’s expensive to make it THC free (or below detection). Some companies also **want** Delta-8 included. Others are just ridding on the fact that it’s mostly HHC, sure it has THC residue, but people with drug tests coming up shouldn’t take them. I get all that.

Here’s the rub. Only a few companies make pure HHC. I would surmise based on my research, that roughly 70% of HHC vapes have some level of THC in them. Furthermore, drug test folks are more of niche clientele. A lesser known company like Moonwalkr or Bearly Legal has more incentive to draw in these niche users with purer products.

To be fair to the bulk of HHC producers, they will even say on their site that you may fail a drug test….and that some THC could be left in the processing.

HHC isn’t the issue. It’s THC. HHC was essentially a workaround, but ultimately, it still suffers from the THC problem. Again, it’s just **less likely** to cause a drug test failure, but it does and can happen to be sure. Plenty of people also pass, and Bearly Legal seems to have garnered some reputation for this reason.

In a sense, HHC is a bit of a loss overall, because police officers, firefighters, EMTs, nurses, etc., these folks should be able to have access to legal cannabis off-duty, especially for medical reasons. However, this often isn’t allowed at the state level. HHC was a promising answer, yet it remains risky due to THC residue in the products. 😔
 
Over here pure hhc is really cheap but I find it a little too weird and for my liking it’s not sedating enough. This can get really disturbing due to it’s long action. I don’t think that thc urine tests can differentiate the two. The test checks for a closed oxane ring and so differentiates between thc and cbd but that’s it. A proper lab test will distinguish these both though.

It’s not that easy to get proper d8-thc, a bit sad, I’ve heard good things about it.
 
Also interesting to note is that this Stuff tastes exactly as amt when vaped, maybe a little less strong but it’s got exactly the same taste.
 
smoked in a cigarette i noticed nothing but in a bubble, exactely same taste as amt. i got hhc as a brown rubbery and sticky substance.
 
Hello, I’m curious about your thoughts on HHC-O. How is it made? I’ve looked around online but the answer remains unclear (maybe I’m just bad at looking around). Forgive my rudimentary understanding of chemistry - after looking for how HHC-O is made and finding no answers, I looked into how THC-O is made thinking the process might be related and discovered that acetic anhydride is possibly involved in the process. I say possibly because I find it unlikely that a List II precursor is used for the synthesis of cannabis intended for the gray market. Regardless if it was used I have several safety concerns as it appears acetic anhydride is harmful for the lungs. This long bullshit is all to ask - is HHC-O (smoked) more dangerous than regular pot
 
i dont think it works smoked because it is a prodrug that has to be taken orally to get rid of the acetate group.
 
winegambit said:
HHC-O. How is it made?
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HHC and its O-acetate HHC-OAc (HHC-O) are "semisynthetic". They are derived from a natural product by chemical conversions.

The required chemical transformations include:

#1. cyclization of CBD to Δ8-THC (using Brønsted or Lewis acids) [this step is skipped in case THC is used as starting material].
#2. hydrogenation of Δ8-THC or Δ9-THC to HHC, or Δ8-THC-OAc or Δ9-THC-OAc to HHC-OAc (using H2 gas and palladium or platinum catalysts)
#3. O-acetylation of Δ8-THC, Δ9-THC, or HHC to Δ8-THC-OAc, Δ9-THC-OAc, or HHC-OAc respectively (using acetanhydride)

Starting material and reaction sequence might differ depending on the various countries.

1a. natural CBD --> Δ8-THC --> HHC --> HHC-OAc [#1, #2, #3]
1b. natural CBD --> Δ8-THC --> Δ8-THC-OAc --> HHC-OAc [#1, #3, #2]
2a. natural Δ9-THC --> HHC --> HHC-OAc [#2, #3]
2b. natural Δ9-THC --> Δ9-THC-OAc --> HHC-OAc [#3, #2]

The O-acetylation is performed using acetanhydride (or acetyl chloride), any other procedure would be inefficient and expensive.
Both acetanhydride and acetyl chloride are known precursors for the synthesis of heroin, so additional paperwork is required when purchasing them.
End-users will be requested to declare that they do not use them to synthesize illegal drugs.
At the same time they are very cheap standard reagents commonly required for the synthesis of O-Ac, N-Ac, or S-Ac derivatives...
Almost every organic synthesis lab uses these reagents.

They are quite reactive but not particularly dangerous or toxic. They are readily hydrolyzed by water, so THC-OAc and HHC-OAc do not contain any of these chemicals (if properly cleaned). Residual amounts would give rise to a sharp vinegar-type smell.

The health concern with vaping the O-acetates of THC and HHC is the potential formation of highly reactive (and potentially toxic) ketene gas (H2C=C=O) upon pyrolysis at high temperatures.
 
HHC is still the Kang for me. been dabbing it regularly for a yr, and its the smoothest and most fun euphoric altnoid i can dab safely. I like the acetates but yeah fuck dabbing em, HHC is just about perfection. and it still helps with sleep after a month of all day every day smoking, so thats a plus
 
i couldnt fall asleep on it, no sedation but long duration of action. might be my brain chemistry which is a bit out of whack but i needed bdo for sleeping on it. it is strange somehow, you are somewhat stoned but you thoughts are extra silly.
 
Has the market started making a pure (R)-HHC yet?

Everything I see is highly diluted with (S)-HHC, an inactive cannabinoid.
 
found this thread while looking yp high dose HHC. i just took 400+ mg (unmeasured disty gob + 120mg in hard candies) w peanut butter + a cookie for fat binding so i think im the first person to megadose this shit. ill let yall know how it goes but im already stupid high rn and its not even fully in yet
 
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