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  • AADD Moderators: swilow | Vagabond696

The 'Harm Reduction' party

^ same with dexamphetamine, which I'm sure is a monopolistic little cash cow for Sigma!

however its going to be a long long time before the stakeholders & board will allow a corporate structure to even entertain the idea of mass producing the likes of MDMA. With corporate governance, social & environmental sustainability, etc building the corp framework, such ideas wont get far
 
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To others, what I meant was once HR gets some where and we say we are going to (using MDMA as an example) make MDMA legal and distribute it at a cost and give them the contract to produce and sell it if they can help fund a campaign.
 
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The idea of obtaining backing from pharmaceutical companies is not completely realistic but is the kind of creative thinking I believe could uncover a pragmatic plan. I think the obvious flaw is that you want substances decriminalised for recreational purposes. If MDMA were approved for pharmaceutical companies it would be as something therepeutic. You would have to go perscription shopping for it, evincing symptoms of 'post-traumatic stress disorder' that you learnt to mimic off wikipedia. Undignified and not exactly what you're aiming for.

The tobacco and alcohol industry probably has more of an interest in the legalisation of recreational drugs, so long as its a highly regulated and limited to licensed retailers. Alternatively Crown Casino seem to be able to get any exemption they want out of the Victorian state government, they would be designated an MDMA permitted zone if they thought it was in their interests.

This all leaves a bad taste in the mouth.
 
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Yeah, I never said they had to be pharm companies, just any companies that want to make money.

Any one know of a company like that?
 
Sorry to burst the bubble...

The problem is, pharmacologically, MDMA is neurotoxic 4 ways as it causes;

1) Irreversible inhibition of Tryptophan Hydroxylase (preventing serotonin from being replenished)
2) Depletion of serotonin in some areas of the brain
3) Axon damage to 5HT neurons
4) Reversing of thermoregulation in the hypothalamus

So, while debate still goes on as to the overall toxicity of MDMA, from a pharmacological POV, if it were invented today, MDMA would never make it passed the initial stage 1 trials.

Sure there's pharms out there which cause one, or even maybe two of the effects above (excluding 4 perhaps) but never all 4.

So, as the pharm approval system goes, many rules would need to be bent/broken in order for MDMA to be approved in any way as a prescription only medication. Which also means, that even if government and the general public said legalise it, opposition would be massive from the medical and pharmaceutical industries. To ignore that would make a mockery of the health system.
 
^ What about the use of supplements and neuro-protectory medication to prevent some of those risks? 5-HTP and possibly an SSRI in the hours after the experience. I'm talking about use in a therapy session here.

To the user who commented about people doctor shopping for it; unless you really dig rolling with your therapist there's not gonna be too much of a point. :D

I think the way I see a HR Party is like the Australian Democrats in their hey-day - 'Keeping the Bastards Honest'. By that I mean, the party would be there to monitor how drug policy is developing and to make sure that promising ideas and research are followed through on, as well as promoting harm reduction measures.

For example:

* Try and prevent penalties for drug use escalating.
* Examine the current scheduling of commonly used drugs and whether this could be re-evaluated.
* Promote research into harm reduction measures and what can be feasibly implemented, e.g. more shooting galleries, greater education, funding for HR groups
* Perhaps most importantly, providing a balanced eye or 'counter-point' if you will every time some drug controversy comes up. Every time there is a death the politicians leap on it as a chance to demonize drugs; it would be refreshing to hear a party that argues we should see what exactly went wrong and how it can be prevented through methods other then a 'zero tolerance' approach.
 
Mr Blonde said:
* Perhaps most importantly, providing a balanced eye or 'counter-point' if you will every time some drug controversy comes up. Every time there is a death the politicians leap on it as a chance to demonize drugs; it would be refreshing to hear a party that argues we should see what exactly went wrong and how it can be prevented through methods other then a 'zero tolerance' approach.
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Maybe a re commitment to the central ideas ofd harm reduction is needed here,
And a commitment by the government to listen to a Public Service is Impartial and providing the best advice based on Evidence.

the politiicans are not going to give up their most valuable tool for steering the public (FEAR) eaisly. People are too happy to use the convience factor and stand behind their pollies rather than question them.

Mac- we all know how much great work you all did foir the HR movement in Aus but i think that the more idealistic people we have the better. If we dream of a better world and are optimistic and idealistic that things can happen then they are more likely to continue with the effort of change.
 
phase_dancer said:
The problem is, pharmacologically, MDMA is neurotoxic 4 ways as it causes;

1) Irreversible inhibition of Tryptophan Hydroxylase (preventing serotonin from being replenished)
2) Depletion of serotonin in some areas of the brain
3) Axon damage to 5HT neurons
4) Reversing of thermoregulation in the hypothalamus

So, while debate still goes on as to the overall toxicity of MDMA, from a pharmacological POV, if it were invented today, MDMA would never make it passed the initial stage 1 trials.

Sure there's pharms out there which cause one, or even maybe two of the effects above (excluding 4 perhaps) but never all 4.

So, as the pharm approval system goes, many rules would need to be bent/broken in order for MDMA to be approved in any way as a prescription only medication. Which also means, that even if government and the general public said legalise it, opposition would be massive from the medical and pharmaceutical industries. To ignore that would make a mockery of the health system.
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I was just using MDMA as an example. You could replace it with any drug.
 
This whole idea is doomed from the word go if legalisation is even whispered. forget about legal mdma or anything else for that matter. I can just imagine the headline ,
"HARM MINIMISATION PARTY WANTS TO MAKE ALL DRUGS LEGAL" If all you really want is(insert drug name) legalised then start a MAKE DRUGS LEGAL PARTY
 
mushi mushi 88 said:
I've often thought about trying to make whole cities aware of this site and mainly our HR purposes...

Now I am a student who studies Marketing and have always thought that it would be a good project/assignment to try and make a majority of a city realize about this site and about the HR of drugs and what dangers they hold.

Now when I am off holidays and back in study mode I will probably come back to this thread and start a little project, HR is something that I strongly believe in and feel that not many people are aware of HR.

Now I thought maybe running around the city and sticking up poster in the drug prone areas of the city would not hurt and maybe even on radio/TV/newspaper building to get their attention and maybe some PR/Publicity effects...

I've also thought about maybe getting some lads to put up "BLUELIGHT" when they go out painting or something, or even putting up fake adds in newspapers about seeking drug takers for assessments and put this website to refer too, then when they get here they will explore and learn the site.

A lot of these things would gain a lot of media attention which is something that could be both a bad thing and a good thing which in the end is once again publicity...

Hmmm this little project is starting to sound very interesting... I feel I will have to ask my teacher if I can do it as an assignment, this will be fun and may make a difference. This will be happening in Brisbane city so if there are any other Marketing students in other cities I think you may want to look into this as well, we could do it as a team project and get high marks lol.
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Fuck, Im a lad and a writer. When i get aroudn to it after me bday n have some money after i finish work i could do a big BLUELIGHT HARM REDUCTION Piece with a couple of capsules and a pot leaf or something on a rooftop
 
"moderateuser" me using barrack obama as an example was intended to put a smile on everyone's face i wasn't refering to his campaign but the voters themselves, even the not so intelligent know you need money at that level in the usa...
Regarding my comments rich vs poor i'm a little bit offended that you consider this to be a marxist idea of the past not sure how to take this ? As you can see i'm trying to make an effort, getting involved, using empowerment to encourage effort, not trying to criticise. However I will not take it to heart as i'm sure you mean well and have alot to offer.

*awaiting moderateuser's ideas not criticisms

-----------

Something i believe we should discuss is "0" tolerance....and how it doesn't work.....
also,
Drugs - Taking away the legal factor...links to black market ....cost of fighting crime relating to all drugs and drug laws ...

Creations of red zones white zones (self explanatory if you want me to elaborate i will, just ask)

More to come
 
The lads from New Zealand have done a very good job in arguing the role of 'social tonics' as an alternative to meth...
Have a look at the Drugs Policy Alliance website- a fine example of what idealism, money, and single issue, non-party organisations can achieve in the USA- traditionally a much tougher forum for drugs policy than Oz...
http://www.drugpolicy.org/homepage.cfm
 
Brilliant site, DrP thanks for the tip. The DPA seems to be exactly what we need here!

Anyone seen those ads from the Game Council (of NSW): "Want to Hunt? - Join me and help protect our native flora and fauna..." If they can say that with a straight face, then surely what we're about doesn't seem so preposterous after all. (Edit: "Want Drug Reform? - Join me in protecting our kids...")
 
I've been following these guys since way back when they were the Lindesmith Institute. The 2001 State of Ecstasy conference was excellent. I don't know that the audio is available online anymore, but I have most of it on disc (all except the Rave representatives which I thought was terrible - but that too is probably still around somewhere). I could upload if it didn't ruffle any feathers. I'm sure you'd all like to hear Sasha and Ann Shulgin speak...
 
^ I'd like to hear that if it's not too much trouble. :)

What was wrong with the rave reps?
 
^ I'd like to hear that if it's not too much trouble.

What was wrong with the rave reps?
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Well, after feeling inspired from listening to all sorts of speakers; from DEA to medical researchers, individuals' case studies etc, the rave speaker is barely audible, and has loud, terrible sounding music going in the background (I think they must have held up an old tape player 1 metre from the mic or something). To top it all off their argument sounds too PLURish and I didn't feel it fitted in with the rest of the conference. Sorry to phrase it like that, and I hope I haven't offended anyone in the process, but if you listen to it all, you'll definitely see what I mean. Incidentally, there's a few hours worth in total....

I have to compress the audio on the discs before uploading. Give me a kick up the bum if I don't get to it in a reasonable time frame.
 
drplatypus said:
The lads from New Zealand have done a very good job in arguing the role of 'social tonics' as an alternative to meth...
Click to expand...

True, although they lost that particular fight in the end (should say 'we lost' seeing as I made a submission to the Select Committee ;)).

The good thing about NZ drug policyn is that the stated goal is harm minimisation. Sure, drugs are still illegal. But it's actually part of the policy that, if there's a conflict between law enforcement and harm reduction approaches, the govt should use the harm reduction approach. It's not much, but it's a good start, and IMO it has worked (we had 3 MDMA deaths at the start of this decade, and none since AFAIK).

One way of starting might be to lobby your governments to take this approach.

Another way might be a dedicated letter writing campaign to local papers etc. Get the idea out there that drugs aren't particularly dangerous, and that harm minimisation saves lives. (I know from watching people enter politics that a lot of them start by letter writing and attending public meetings; get known in the media as someone who advocates a particular view, then form a lobby group - Australians for Sensible Drug Policy or something) and the media will come to you for opinions. If this goes well, try turning it into a party.
 
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