☛ Official ☚ The Big & Dandy Ibogaine/Iboga Thread

[psychedelic food]

I have some iboga root bark. Im thinking about taking it to help with mild benzo withdrawals. Do you think this is a good idea?

 

[Xorkoth]

Could be... just make sure you do a lot of research about dosage and proper way to take it, and make sure you're in a safe place and have a lot of time to decompress from the trip... maybe give yourself 2 or 3 days of no responsibilities because it lasts a long time. And please make sure to have some sort of sitter or person who's nearby who can help you if necessary. You may be completely out of it and out of touch with the physical world around you, so if no one is around it could be quite dangerous to you.

 

[B9]

I wouldn't be stopping the benzo taper tho - that way is surely not wise.

 

[lsg]

I have read about some people kicking h and the iboga made it worse. If anyone is tring to detox with it becarefull. From what I understand of the chemistry of opiate addiction and ibogaine I see little reason to think this will help withdrawls although it may have a pyschological affect to help one want to quite.

 

[CokeMonger]

I tried sending this PM to someone who wrote a post that sounded like he'd tried it.... Wouldn't go thru (I think because I'm a newbie). Can anyone else answer it? What's the consensus on Ibogaine?

---------------

It sounds from your post that you might have tried Ibogaine? (You made reference to preferring a 15-20 minute beatdown over a 48-72 hour Ibogaine experience).

Have you tried it? I'm looking into it now if I can put the $ together (tried 12 steps, suboxone, etc). It doesn't sound like you're for it.... I'm looking for hear from as many people as possible who actually "Been there - done that."

Any information highly appreciated!!

THANKS!!!!

 

[PxDxA]

This sound like an amazing psychedelic and an amazing trip/journey. I would like to try it someday. Perhaps when I'm old and am crossing things off on my list of thing to do before I kick the bucket

 

[CokeMonger]

Yeah, well, I still wish there was a consensus on Ibogaine. There seems to be so much saying its either a scam or a Godsend... It looks like it would max out a credit card to give it a shot - if it does what is claimed by its adherents, it would obviously be worth it ten times over. If, on the other hand, it's a waste of time & dangerous with no real upside, then (obviously) I'd pass on the experience.

Hmmm. It appears that my check of old copies of Consumer Reports doesn't have an answer. There's got to be some credible, neutral source that would settle the question..... no?

 

[Propyl Power]

^As with any entheogen, you get out what you put into it. It is not a magic bullet for addiction, but with the right preparation and intent it can clearly provide transformative experiences of the highest order. Likewise ayahuasca. I think that the relationship with the plant is more relevant than any supposed neurochemical quick fix in these situations.

 

[daysonatrain]

Yeah, well, I still wish there was a consensus on Ibogaine. There seems to be so much saying its either a scam or a Godsend... It looks like it would max out a credit card to give it a shot - if it does what is claimed by its adherents, it would obviously be worth it ten times over. If, on the other hand, it's a waste of time & dangerous with no real upside, then (obviously) I'd pass on the experience.

Hmmm. It appears that my check of old copies of Consumer Reports doesn't have an answer. There's got to be some credible, neutral source that would settle the question..... no?

the cost can be avoided by driving up to canada or mexico and purchasing some wehre it is not illegal. (if your in the states i suppose)

 

[ungelesene_bettlek]

even if purchased legally, it is very expensive, as far as I know.

 

[daysonatrain]

^pretty sure i saw a website a while back in canada where it was pretty cheap, and also believe ive heard it said on forums. i think its just the private atmosphere that costs so much. but i never really cared cause im in the states wehre its illegal

 

[Delsyd]

a friend of mine has had heart issues in the past; he has had open heart surgery and had everything corrected.

He feels he is ready to quit dope, is a very experienced user of psychedelics and feels this may give him that extra little push that he needs,

Would it be safe for him to take ibogaine?

 

[mwl65926]

It works!!!!

i have tried ibogaine. it works. it is amazing. i don't understand why more people don't know about this. it virtually cured my addiction issues, and i lost 20 pounds within a single month.
on the other hand, i can tell you that it will not completely eliminate benzo withdrawal. valium was the only drug that i had to continue taking after finishing my ibogaine treatment, but not for long. my tolerance was reduced to just a fraction of what it had been before treatment. it took just 2 weeks before i was able to come off of valium entirely. i no longer had any desire to use drugs. i just felt happy.

Just make sure you are ready for a very long and intense experience. As long as you are in a safe and comfortable place, you should be fine. JUST MAKE SURE YOU ARE IN A SAFE AND COMFORTABLE PLACE!!!

 

[Sherwin_Maxawow]

Glad I found this little (yet growing) forum. I admit that I have not been able to really read over everyone's posts & replies yet. I have a "headache" at the moment after having just spent an OVERKILL length of time trying to just reorganize my classic rock music collection.... including all the right album artwork & "folder" images showing up vista style! - O.C.D.!

But I've been wanting to say "HI" since I discovered this forum earlier today, and I also may have some good stuff worth sharing!
I happen to know Howard Lotsof, or at least I have talked to him on the phone several times since he met my father who is a now retired Clinical Social Worker (M.S.W).
Although my famous friend's health is suddenly not looking very good, which I just learned last weekend on the phone, and he wasnt in a very positive mood & we didnt even talk too long. Honestly, we should all keep him in our prayers....or at least in our positive thoughts! Its actually pretty serious, and we may not have the one who discovered Ibogaine's anti-addictive properties around very much longer. I dont know if anyone else has heard this news or not? I heard it straight from Howard himself just a few days ago, and according to him it is serious.

About ibogaine, I am trying to do it myself. I know a lot about it....since I have been wanting to do it for a long time, and I am now FINALLY getting close to its reality!
I cannot continue taking "Subutex" (Buprenorphine) for the rest of my life and I do not want it anymore at all! I really do want freedom, and personal enlightenment would of course be a wonderful thing as well.

The way I SEE it.....breaking free from "drug addiction" (of any kind) and "personal enlightenment" are both two sides of the same coin! How can they not be totally, intimately 'inter-connected' ........since any addiction is a more than a physical disease of the body, but a disease of entire self, physical, mind & or spirit----- Whatever you choose to call it, its an illness that reaches into one's "deeper inner self" of which the disease is it's probably much more destructive to than we consciously realize. Probably more so than we have any idea!
Its this 'ignorance' in us, of not realizing or recognizing the the full destructive reality that chemical addiction causes deep within us, on mutiple levels...and therefor destroying the fabric of our lives. Often ruining the most important things within our lives---- Relationships with family & loved ones, all being effected and often ruined....becauses the relationship with our own inner- inner self is all screwed up, & out of tune.....making it impossible for us to connect to anyone else in any meaningful way, since we are not connecting with our own inner light or higher self....or (dare i say it?) GOD. Oh no.....whatever deep rooted sense of self & light we had always connected to in various conscious & subconscious ways as a child.....is gone. Those connections are now interupted by a chemical that fools the soul into letting go of the connection of true self & true meaning or inner light.....and distracting us from it long enough for us to lose the ability to easily get it back.........if ever!


All hope seems almost to be completely lost in this MOVIE..........expect for one thing---- IBOGAINE! (like RAMBO!)---The band of 'addictives drugs' thought they had won the battle................ - They thought WRONG. IBOGA! (this film has no yet been rated)


Anyway so....let's say Ibogaine works in an amazing way, which I do believe is more than just chemically...(not simply working purely on just a chemical level). But instead I believe ibogaine must work on deeper "spiritual" level as well.....with powerful visions taking people back to childhood memories, and glimpses of who they once were long ago before they lost sight of that light. So let's suppose ibogaine enables them to re-establish some deep roots of spiritual self---- their real self which they never knew they lost until Ibogaine helps them see,.....and see how drugs caused their view to get hazy.....and then finally blind to who they are truly. Perhaps Ibogaine helps one somehow remember and reconnect to their inner truth & light of which they were once fully *rooted* in-- inside . Now maybe this is what makes it truly "anti-addictive"......and enables them to sort of **SNAP!** back... back to their real truth, enabling them to "grab" onto it inside again! Maybe its the the "personal enlightenment" ITSELF (whether it is a truly 'harsh' awakening or not)....is the "actual" anti-addictive mechanism in ibogaine. ? Ibogaine only helps the person re-connect to what they once lost touch with altogether, but its the individual who makes the real change inside which Ibogaine merely helps make possible. Its up the the person to hang onto that change for as long as they choose!
-------
BY the way.........NOT EVERYONE's Ibogaine experience is alway ROUGH! There are a good number of reports from people who have had experiences with ibogaine which you might even call GLORIOUS! Not to say they were "EASY" or fun.......but very deeply meaningful and profoundly rewarding! It seems (from people such as like- Dr. Deborah Mash) that it often seems to be those people with the most solid spirituality- belief system going into the Iboga experience as the ones that are most often less grueling and more positive & rewarding, or meaningful!
But there are no solid rules as to what a person's experience will end up being like!

So I think its best to go into it with gratitude and humility! That is my plan.

 

[anonymous_mouse]

Ibogaine safety questions

I am wondering if it would be safe for someone to take Ibogaine (a small dose) under these circumstances. If they...

-Have abused amphetamines for several months and may have weakened their heart because of this (heart rate is fast/hard, but that might also be anxiety)
-Are suffering from severe depression/anxiety
-Also, can ibogaine safely be taken while the person is on medication for the above disorders? Medication is Wellbutrin and Abilify. And, if they have to stop the medication for the trip, how long should they wait before the medication has cleared their system and they can take the ibogaine?

Despite the possible hazards, I believe this person could highly benefit from the spiritual powers of ibogaine (as well as the anti-addictive properties) and they feel that the substance could correct their mind and energy levels.

Thank you!

 

[tobala]

1. The best approach would be to get an EKG and a liver enzyme panel. The EKG will indicate if there are any conductive anomalies within the heart that may have been caused by amphetamine usage, and the enzyme panel will indicate the liver's ability to normally (or otherwise) metabolize an ibogaine treatment. Ideally, you'd want to get an echocardiogram or other test to check for structural defects, but if you don't have a history of such things, my guess is that the odds of it being a problem are small.

For perspective, the relatively few deaths associated with ibogaine treatment seemed to be related to the drastic reduction of opiate tolerance caused by the drug, and when the subjects shot up their normal dose during or shortly after treatment, they effectively overdosed themselves. One or two other factors may have been heart structure problems in people who died without returning to opiate use.

I can say personally that ibogaine seemed quite easy on the body at ~10mg/kg, with a barely-perceptible increase in respiration and heart rates, either of which could be attributed to the anxiety of a first-time experience.

2. You raise interesting questions with regard to the antidepressants. My suggestion would be to consult your prescriber regarding what a normal taper/discontinuation from these medications would be, and once it was completed, wait a few weeks more before taking ibogaine.

Regarding spiritual growth and/or addiction cessation, be prepared to do a lot of work before and after the experience. Ibogaine is a worthy catalyst, but is most effective when used as part of a more holistic protocol.

3. It's not cheap, but for a once- or twice-in-a-lifetime experience, it's--as they say--priceless.

 

[fastandbulbous]

Yeah, well, I still wish there was a consensus on Ibogaine. There seems to be so much saying its either a scam or a Godsend...

Well it's a serotonogic psychedelic and an NMDA antagonist in one and if my experiences with LSD & ketamine (a Shulgin ++++) and DOM & ketamine (stopped my ketamine habit there & then! Weird I know, but it happened!) are anything to go by, I can easily imagine it being quite active in producing spiritual experiences and causing cessation of compulsive drug use.

Also of course, nobody know for certain which other receptors it interacts with - remember the other very complex indolic hallucinogen LSD? It's a complete tart of a drug which interacts with just about all of the 5HT receptors as well as with those for dopamine, noradrenaline & even histamine, so I wouldn't be surprised to find ibogaine acts on a shit load of other receptors

I just lost my legs, i.e., stair-climbing would have become a hazardous activity.

Well that sounds like classic NMDA antagonism that ketamine is famous for (if you take enough, you get zero sensory input from the body and it effectively disappears - the infamous k-hole), so your earlier comment about no ketamine like activity might need revising!

The reports I hear from the extract don't sound nearly as powerful as those I hear from the Root Bark

That's sounds like the ratio of extracted alkaloids isn't the same as those in the root bark due to extraction processes not being perfect, not because the ibogaine is in any way different (but just the main one of several other pharmacollogically active alkaloids)

 

[PxDxA]

What would be the anti-addiction drug to use to cure an ibogaine addiction? Sounds like one of those Zen 'imagine the sound of one hand clapping' type things to ponder

Thats a very interesting thing to ponder....

Its like pondering the meaning of life (for me), because when I do, my mind just toally goes blank, its like, I'm not "supposed" to know.

 

[RhythmSpring]

^ What's the meaning of life? Well, what's the meaning of a possum? What's the meaning of a galaxy? You saying what's here and now implies something else? As if there is something separate, outside of the entire universe? You silly goon.

@ Sherwin: I appreciate your thoughts and perceptions, and they resonate with me. Addiction isn't a separate condition, it's related to some internal imbalance, or disconnect with some aspect of the divine. And you're probably right--the mechanism of Ibogaine isn't going straight to the mechanism of addiction, but something deeper and more divine, thus making addiction appear more clearly as something one must stop. It is still the self that stops the addiction, not another chemical.

And though I've never been addicted in the traditional sense, I surely have a host of non-"drug" addictions, such as egoic thoughts, food, sugar, salt, laziness, slouching and probably a bunch more. And I don't doubt that Ibogaine could also address those issues.

It's on my long-term to do list, for sure. I'm afraid I'll have to actively seek it, though. Ibogaine doesn't seem like the type of thing that finds you, like mushrooms or LSD would.

 

[w01fg4ng]

Not sure how difficult it would be to make 18-MC, and if it is something worthwhile to investigate:

"18-Methoxycoronaridine

Synthetic iboga alkaloid congener

The ibogaine research team at Albany Medical College has developed a synthetic iboga alkaloid congener, 18-methoxycoronaridine (18-MC). Animal research shows that 18-MC shares ibogaine's anti-addictive properties, possibly without ibogaine's hallucinogenic effects."

http://www.ibogaine.org/abstract-18-mc.html#zhang


What do you guys think? Would taking the hallucinogenic effects out of the equation go against some of the therapeutic properties of Ibogaine? Still sounds interesting to me.