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The Big and Dandy 4-AcO-DMT Thread

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I got to test the romantic qualities of 4-aco-dmt the other evening. My girlfriend and I spent a quiet evening alone with some (15mgs for her and 18mgs for me).
The sex was O.K. but it lacked the electrical charged energy that things like LSD and phens seem to generate. The head space and visuals were cool it was easy to get lost in the moment of pleasure but it just didn’t have as good as energy and orgasmic body rushes that other substances produce.
My girlfriend and I discussed the experience for a while after wards and we both had a really good time. It was a good headspace for a quiet romantic evening, just not as sexually charged as other substances.
 
Is there someone in with erowid here that can get this sentence changed on the main page of the 4-AcO-DMT Vault (below), because according to pretty much everyone thats taken it they are very different.

DESCRIPTION
4-Acetoxy-DMT is an uncommon synthetic psychedelic. Like psilocybin, it is metabolically converted to psilocin and is therefore thought to be nearly identical to psilocybin in effects.
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I think that is very misleading. There is no way you could give me 4-AcO-DMT and tell me its psilocin/psilocybin and have me believe it. They felt totally different, and when I used it as a substitute for mushrooms in a situation they'd have been fine I had an extraordinarily hard time functioning it was so different.

And if not, it should at least be cited... because I don't think it can be.
 
In the past I've argued that mushrooms are mushrooms are mushrooms, and psilocin alone was responsible for the effects. Plenty of experts seemed to think the same way, and the lack of studies on norbaeocystin and baeocystin made them seem mysteriously non-psychedelic just like the lack of studies on bufotenin made it seem like a toxin instead of a psychedelic. I now know different, and 4-AcO-DMT is further evidence to support the hypothesis that different alkaloid ratios in mushrooms make for different effects. Mushrooms are a combination of differing ratios of psilocin, psilocybin, baeocystin, norbaeocystin, DMT, and perhaps other alkaloids.

fizzacyst, I don't think it's accurate to say that you can tell the difference between psilocin/psilocybin and 4-AcO-DMT. You've never taken pure psilocin/psilocybin before I'm guessing? 4-AcO-DMT is definitely distinguishable from mushrooms, but until these chemicals are studied more I think it's quite possible that you wouldn't notice the difference between 4-AcO-DMT and psilocybin in a blind taste test.
 
^ Well, nevertheless this statement (in erowid) is misleading. Most people read that and think 4-AcO-DMT is identical to mushrooms in effects (even though it doesn't say that). It would be much better if they said the experience can be very different from mushrooms experience. I don't think there are many people who have tried pure psilocybin (or even psilocin for that matter, even though it is less rare these days), and as far as I understand, 4-AcO-DMT is different in effects from even psilocin (haven't tried the latter though to speak from personal experience).
 
i agree with you 100% fizzacyst - i have tried 4-aco-dmt a few times now and i really love it - but i don't really enjoy mushrooms anymore (haven't touched them in several years) - the 4-aco just seems alot smoother/gentler than shrooms ever did. (even though i had some great times on shrooms)
 
I've taken both pure 4-AcO-DMT and 4-HO-DMT and psilocybe mushrooms (cyans and cubes) a number of times each. They are all different experiences.

I've written before on the differences, but 4-HO-DMT is much more like DMT than mushrooms are like DMT. Psilocin is a heck of a lot more colorful than mushrooms.

With mushrooms you have to remember that the absorption timelines are much different compared to eating a pure compound (I take the 4-sub-Ts sublingually usually). The effects are more drawn out since the digestion of the mushroom body takes a bit longer and spreads the absorption out a bit, which imo affects the experience a good bit.
 
^ I don't think absorption rates have a lot to do with differences in experiences. Take mushroom tea for example - it is absorbed very rapidly by the body (the timeline is very comparable with 4-AcO-DMT when you take shrooms that way IMO), but the character of the experience stays pretty much the same. I think the fact that mushrooms actually contain a coctail of alkaloids (as opposed to pure psilocin) has much more to do with the unique type of experience they produce.
 
Coolio said:
...

fizzacyst, I don't think it's accurate to say that you can tell the difference between psilocin/psilocybin and 4-AcO-DMT. You've never taken pure psilocin/psilocybin before I'm guessing? 4-AcO-DMT is definitely distinguishable from mushrooms, but until these chemicals are studied more I think it's quite possible that you wouldn't notice the difference between 4-AcO-DMT and psilocybin in a blind taste test.
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I have taken 4-AcO-DMT, 4-HO-DMT, assorted species of mushrooms (well over a hundred times, and I can feel a diff between those and plain 4-Ho-DMT), and extracts of mushrooms.

4-AcO-DMT feels very different to me. Everything about it feel different, aside from that common tryptamine drug feeling. The come on is susbtantially longer for me, the experience reaches a peak and descends in a smooth manner (psilocin/fugus TAKES OFF! for me, then fades quickly around 5 hrs). The visual element is a lot different.
 
^ I suppose everybody's very different when it comes to reaction to psychedelics, because in my experiences with it, 4-AcO-DMT had very similar visuals to mushrooms, at least in terms of OEVs. CEVs where quite different however, in fact even at 30mg, the CEVs where very mild for me while OEVs were easily comparable to 4-5g of cubensis, whereas CEVs have always been very strong for me on mushrooms.

Also, 4-AcO-DMT comes on very fast for me, much faster than mushrooms (except for when the latter are consumed in the form of tea). It has also been the case for most of my friends, so I was quite surprised to find that, as prior to trying it, I had mostly read about it coming on slower than shrooms. Go figure.
 
The come on is susbtantially longer for me, the experience reaches a peak and descends in a smooth manner (psilocin/fugus TAKES OFF! for me, then fades quickly around 5 hrs). The visual element is a lot different.
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There seems to be a lot of variation. Even on a small dose ~8-14mg, 4-AcO-DMT becomes noticeable almost immediately and within half an hour its ascending quite rapidly. I have yet to have a 4-AcO-DMT trip that lasts much more than 3 hours.

Perhaps people metabolize DMT differently? This idea could help explain things like inclination to spriituality/metaphysical things, certain mental health problems etc.

Also after recently discovering low dose n,n DMT I've become convinced that one of the biggest problems in the world today is that the human race is suffering from a massive deficiency in DMT. =D

DMT is the neurotransmitter of the future. :)


The last time I had 4-AcO-DMT I was totally shocked at how "clean" it felt. I took it on a completely empty stomach and the trip was totally clear of any body discomfort.
 
Nausea is the only physical side-effect I get on this chem and even that only on higher doses.
 
I have tried 4-aco-dmt a few times and mushrooms fresh and dried quite few times. I haven’t had a chance to try 4-ho-dmt yet. The difference between 4-aco-dmt and mushrooms for me is:
4-aco-dmt comes on faster a faster peak,
4-aco-dmt has a cleaner headspace that easier to control
4-aco-dmt has less body high
4-aco-dmt visuals have less color, less color spectrum, clearer, less dreamy and blurry.

Mushrooms give much more confusion and anxiety my thoughts tend wander from place to place but it give me a connection to very deep place.
Mushrooms make me tied and give me the yawns
Mushrooms come on in waves.

I haven’t done fresh mushrooms in a long time but I remember them being different then dried ones, but it is just to hard to compare a psychedelic experience from years ago to one months ago.
I think over all I like 4-aco-dmt better so far, it is friendlier and has a cleaner headspace.
 
Coolio said:
fizzacyst, I don't think it's accurate to say that you can tell the difference between psilocin/psilocybin and 4-AcO-DMT. You've never taken pure psilocin/psilocybin before I'm guessing? 4-AcO-DMT is definitely distinguishable from mushrooms, but until these chemicals are studied more I think it's quite possible that you wouldn't notice the difference between 4-AcO-DMT and psilocybin in a blind taste test.
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I have taken both... and yes, they're dramatically different. Honestly, I can't see how anyone who took both could not easily tell the difference. Also, each is quite different from mushrooms, although 4-HO-DMT is much closer.

I think this idea that the 4-HO- and 4-AcO- tryptamines are not substantially different is faulty, and comes from a few different places, including the B&D threads here being merged into a single one (for example, the 4-HO/-4-AcO-DiPT thread), as well as the opinions of several prominent members and Erowid authors who were of the opinion that they were all pretty much just like mushrooms. In my experiences, however, they're each pretty different from one another and much different from mushrooms. Just because they're all similar and may end up in the same place doesn't mean they're all the same. The ride to the void is just as important as the destination.

Anyway, fizzacyst, I have spoken with them about that before. Not sure if they listened.

I'm also one who finds 4-AcO-DMT to be faster than mushrooms or 4-HO-DMT, and also the duration is quite a bit shorter for me.
 
Just in the last few posts it's been established that what it is that's different between 4-AcO-DMT and mushrooms is different for each person.
 
^ Yet, almost everyone who has commented still says that they're different from each other to them. Sure, psychedelics effect us all differently. One person's mushroom exprience is different than another's, as is one's 4-AcO-DMT experience. But the fact that most people can easily tell the difference in themselves between mushrooms and 4-AcO-DMT seems to show that they are indeed quite different from one another, even if those differences vary between users.

I just don't get why it's so hard to believe that two different chemicals could be substantially different. Just because the only difference in abbreviated names is between the HO and AcO does not mean that they're the same or virtually the same chemical. 4-HO-DMT and 4-AcO-DMT are two separate, unique chemicals.
 
I've taken the stuff 3 times now, and it definitely is pretty blissful, great for people who might get paranoid on other psychedelics, and no body load when you start getting off. Just one thing seems to be missing. Where's the sense of awe? That was one thing you could always depend on on real LSD and mushrooms. That sense that there was some great truth you were not quite able to see entirely, and everything seemed to take on cosmic significance. This stuff is useful in high (25-30 mg) doses for meditating. I find it rather easy on it to shut off the internal dialog. But I really miss that sense of cosmic significance and inspiration.
 
^^ I've had 4-AcO-DMT produce loads of awe. But, I do agree that compared to 4-HO-DMT and mushrooms, it is less "amazing" and "awe-inspiring" and spiritual generally.

One of my most significant trips of my life was on 4-AcO-DMT. But it was in a different way than with my others (one of which was on mushrooms).
 
Has anyone tried snoking some n n DMT while on psilacetin?
i imagine the synergy to be fantastic and look forward to trying this in the coming weeks.
When i do, ill report back with what i hope to be a blissful experience.
 
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