Bupe Suboxone/Buprenorphine Mega Thread and FAQ v17.0 + v18.0

[eteezy915]

I told you, twice now, do you just not believe me our something? If you feel withdrawal from sub you definitely wont waste the done by taking it now, it should provide much relief. Just get yourself comfortable, no more no less, start low and work your way up. I find done much more pleasurable than bupe so it should feel great.

 

[Floridagirl85]

@Eteezy, Thank you. I'm just going through it. Sorry. Do you know if dones safe to take with adderall?

 

[Mr.Scagnattie]

As Eteezy said...you can take it anytime after taking sub...
But your not going to avoid WD by taking meth, all opiates are interchangeable and you will still have WDs...

This.


You can take methadone anytime after being on bupe.. but you obviously want to wait till most of the bupe is out of your system so it wont block the methadone. And, switching to methadone is not going to allow you to avoid withdrawals.. who told you that? If anything, it'll be worse.

 

[eteezy915]

No worries, been there (too many times). 10-20mg done should put you right, coming from 2mg bupe right?
Im not sure about that combo as amps have never been my cup of tea but as long as doses are moderate i think it would be okay. It can't be worse than a Speedball (which aren't safe any way) but maybe wait for someone with experience with that combo or just more knowledge about it to chime in. Good luck if you took that done i berry your already feeling better?
Just be sure to take no more done than you need as its a full agonist and could very easily up the tolerance you have been working so hard to reduce
start low, stay low, taper even lower, then jump.
Good luck

 

[Floridagirl85]

I am only taking the methadone for pain while I'm withdrawing for the 1st week & a half. Then I'm done taking them. I know for a fact that when I didn't have my suboxone for 7 days. I went through the worst w/d I've been through in a while. I know methadone w/d are bad and last for a while. I personally had horrible pain in my hips for about 2-3 months. I'm by far a newby. I've been on opiates for 10 years and I'm over it. I just am trying to get through the worst of the withdrawal. I know methadone was not the smartest to get but that's all I could get. I am trying to get back to work asap. So if you have other suggestions that have worked, please let me know. Thanks

 

[Mr.Scagnattie]

1000 posts. Onto the next one peopleeeee.

v 18

 

[Mr.Scagnattie]

Suboxone/Buprenorphine Megathread and FAQ v. 18.0

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What: Suboxone = buprenorphine/naloxone. Bupe is a partial agonist(mu) and antagonist(kappa). Bupe has higher mu affinity that most opiates, including some antagonists(naloxone, naltrexone). Its higher affinity allows you to shoot suboxone tablets. It also may cause precipitated withdrawals if you are dependant on other opiates. Also, its higher affinity blocks the affects of other opiates when taken in conjunction with bupe.

Dose: Depends on tolerance. .25-1mg(max) is a typical recreational dose for someone with no tolerance. Bupe is incredibly potent and those with no tolerance report many ill effects like vomiting, sweating, headaches, etc, if exceeding those doses. If you're using bupe to taper off of another opiate, you should dose once you're experiencing wd's(typically 36-48 hrs. for most opiates). Start with 2-4mgs and dose at 2mg increments every 30-45minutes until a dose holds you. Most people take their full dose once a day.

Withdrawal: Typical physical and psychological symptoms associated with opiate withdrawal. Insomnia, chills, diarrhea, depression, anxiety, lacrimation, sweating, increased heart rate, etc. They are not as strong as a full agonist's symptoms, but may last longer. Physical symptoms last 1-2 weeks on average and psychological symptoms may last months.

As most opiates, it's recommended to taper down to the lowest dose possible before stopping. <1mg is ideal. The best way to dose at that level is to crush up a tablet and divide the powder into lower doses.

Ceiling: 24-32mgs

Bioavailability: Buprenorphine bioavailabilities:

intraduodenal: 9.7%

intrahepatoportal: 49%

intramuscular: 68%
"The observed mean intramuscular bioavailability was 68%"
"Studies of buprenorphine bioavailability have also examined the intramuscular (bioavailability, 50%–100%)"

intranasal: 50%
"Studies of buprenorphine bioavailability have also examined the [...] intranasal (bioavailability, 48%)
"The bioavailability of buprenorphine, HCl (BPP) in sheep after nasal administration of two formulations has been studied. 0.9 mg BPP in 150 microl was administered nasally and compared to 0.6 mg i.v. The test solutions were formulated with 30% polyethylene glycol 300 (PEG 300) and 5% dextrose, respectively. The bioavailability for PEG 300 was 70% (S.D.+/-27%, n=6), whereas the bioavailability for 5% dextrose was 89% (S.D.+/-23%, n=6)."
"Mean intranasal bioavailability was 48.2 +/- 8.35% (mean +/- s.e.m.) of the intravenous value"

intrarectal: 54%
"bioavailability of the drug was found to be: [... ]intrarectal (54%)..."
"Relative to the 100% bioavailability from the intraarterial route the mean bioavailabilities were [...] intrarectal, 54%..."

intravenous: 98%-100%

oral: 10%
"the oral bioavailability for buprenorphine is state to be 10%"
"due to extensive first-pass metabolism, buprenorphine has very poor oral bioavailability (10% of the intravenous route) if swallowed"

sublingual: ~30%
"Buprenorphine is well absorbed sublingually, with 60% to 70% of the bioavailability of intravenous doses"
"Study results indicate that bioavailability of sublingual buprenorphine is approximately 30%"
"Literature on bioavailability of sublingual buprenorphine presents variable numbers ranging from. 19–58% of the administered dose."
"Relative to the 100% bioavailability from the intraarterial route the mean bioavailabilities were [...] sublingual, 13%"

transdermal: 15%



Other Notes:

• Bupe is CIII in the US.
• Metabolized by CYP3A4(see potentiation thread for potentiators).
• Half-life: 37 hours.
• Drug tests: Not detected by regular 5 panel tests.
• A interesting thread by 'medicine cabinet' about a new version of Suboxone that's currently being tested can be found here.
• Buprenorphine gets metabolized into norbuprenorphine and into conjugated buprenorphine and norbuprenorphine.

Images:

Subutex

Suboxone

Generic Subutex Manufacturer: Roxane

Generic 2mg Manufacturer: Teva | Generic 8mg Manufacturer: Teva

12mg Suboxone Film Strip

4mg Suboxone Film Strip

8mg Suboxone Film Strip

2mg Suboxone Film Strip

Temgesic, 0.2mg

Buprenex Ampules

Zubsolv 1.4mg/.36mg and 5.7mg/1.4mg

Zubsolv vs Suboxone Comparison

Locate a doctor that prescribes Suboxone.

Suboxone Assistance Program - Free Suboxone for Low Income Patients
[/QUOTE]

Alcohol and Suboxone - Alcoholic Solutions for Higher BA With Sublingual Use**
Buprenex - should I IM or IV?
Buprenorphine and Antihistamine IV FAQ
Buprenorphine as a recreational drug?
Buprenorphine dosages commonly prescribed are unnecessarily high
Buprenorphine for depression?
Buprenorphine patches
Buprenorphine withdrawals?
Ketoconazole Potenation of Suboxone
Mephedrone and Buprenorphine
Micron Filtering Mega Thread and FAQ - How to Micron Filter Suboxone
Nasal Administration of Suboxone - Issues
Rectal (Plugging) Buprenorphine
Suboxone in place of Naloxone in the event of an opiate overdose*
Suboxone sublingual film official thread
Subutex has gone generic
Tramadol and Suboxone

Discussion in the Suboxone mega thread goes along quite quickly, so we have a few other threads to promote intermediate/advanced discussion of buprenorphine and its formulations. These threads are meant to divert some of the more advanced discussion that otherwise becomes buried in the mega thread.

If there's another link you think which would go well in this list of related buprenorphine threads, please let me know. We're trying to reserve extra threads on buprenorphine for more intermediary/advanced discussion mostly to reserve the mega thread for a place for questions that can be answered quickly, and the other threads for a place for questions which will otherwise not get the same discussion going on in the mega thread, due to its quick pace.

If you have an idea for a new thread on buprenorphine, it's probably best to figure out by talking to a moderator first to see if it's thread worthy or should be discussed in the mega thread.

*Not Advised. Opiate antagonists are the only safe thing to do in case of an opiate overdose. Please do not give people Suboxone if they have overdosed.
**also known as "6/7's method" or "SixPartSeven's method"

 

[Mr.Scagnattie]

These bupe threads move fasssttt.

Welcome to version 18, peepz.

 

[Eveleivibe]

Thanks Mr.scag. sorry just posting to subscribe to new thread xxxx

 

[Mr.Scagnattie]

^^^

You can subscribe to a thread without posting, ya know. Just for future reference.

 

[smokemctoke420]

MR. Scag, my nukka. i have a suggestion of change/ or add another link in.

instead of http://www.suboxone.com/patients/here_to_help/find_a_doctor.aspx, which is not a full list. for example my state has 5 programs near my zip code and 1 of them doesnt even do subs anymore. there is a government website that has tons of docs. for example i search near my zip code again and 10 of them pop up within 40 mins away from me, which is how far i go already. That part of the website is http://buprenorphine.samhsa.gov/pls...rocess_query?alternative=CHOICEG&one_state=DE and there is 10 locations near me i can afford to go to.

so the sites i want you to add if its possible are http://buprenorphine.samhsa.gov/bwns_locator/ (all docs and treatment programs, unlike the sub website which isnt really updated and incomplete. and then add back in (if you want) http://www.suboxone.com/patients/here_to_help/find_a_doctor.aspx

Just a suggestion. IMO i see no reason for it not to be added.

edit: and to add, im not sure if the first post just doesnt really get updated or what but they have 4mg strips and 12mg strips now. You only have the 2's and 8's but nbd. just pointing it out, in case it was'nt on purpose

 

[Eveleivibe]

^^^

You can subscribe to a thread without posting, ya know. Just for future reference.

Yes you're right. I was being lazy, really sorry - I'll do it the proper way next time. You can delete my first post if you want.

Seeing my key worker on Thursday so will be getting my next suboxone script. I wonder if she'll tell me when I'm to see the doctor next as they want me to reduce. I know it's April / May time but no exact date yet xxxx

 

[smokemctoke420]

Whats good eve? feeling good today?

I was gonna make a new thread and will if this gets not many replies but i expect Scag to have a good answer. anyways, i know that the benzo opiate combo is a lethal one. i have a opiate tolerance and i used to take 8mg of sub a day and now im at 2mg 2X a day. now someone said to me that even with a real low dose benzo you can still harm yourself. ok thats cool but im taking a maintenance drug that im used to and it doesnt get me high and im only dosing 1-2 mg of etizolam at a time (just got 30 1mg). How can this put me at any risk? even a month and a half ago when i ate 40 of em in like 10 days or a little less so iwas taking like 5+ mgs at a time binging while still taking 4mg of sub 2X a day at that point. ( i actually just got the vivotrol shot and he loaded me up with 18 strips in a week) so there was days i was taking 32 mgs in a day plus 5mg of etizolam (no tolly for etiz, i can feel 1-1.5 mg). i was fine during that so how the fuck is sub and benzos harmful if you already have an opiate tolerance and are used to the drug you're taking that doesnt get you high. i guess the effects can stilll be present even if you dont feel it but still. wtf?

 

[Eveleivibe]

keep nodding off at mo. was up late last night.
I expect Mr.Scag (as you mentioned) or one of the other moderators / members will help you.
Sorry I don't really know much about benzos but I think that OD has a benzo thread if that's any help. Also I'm subscribed to a good diaz taper thread which someone made awhile back. I'm not sure if I can put links up for you with this being a suboxone mega thread.
Sorry I can't help in any way xxxx

 

[smokemctoke420]

its no problem. i doubt the benzo thread has the answer im lookiing for as this is a bit more specific. alls good tho. thanks for trying

 

[eteezy915]

When i was on sub maintenance and during MMT i took my daily klonopin 1-2mg with no problems. Just my experience

 

[waydone]

Hello all, I am posting my first post after having read thousands of post from many different forums. I will tell you my short concise story. 2004-Feb.2014 sub pill/strips, 16mg daily.
Now Zubsolv is what my insurance wants me to have (umm yes, insurance knows best pulling my glorified drug dealer [doctor] by the tie) and that is what I am on. But during this switch a pre auth was required which left me without had I not had some on deck for such a problem where I might be stranded. In fear of having to pay out of pocket I have gone down to one zub 5.7 to one and a quarter zub.
Yes I have this slow taper going on which might effect this: what I'd like to know if anyone else here has experienced zubsolv not lasting (yes I am aware of bup 37 after life) more then 6 hours. I feel good for the 6 hours. I'm sure I'd get "impossible shouldn't feel any wd for 3 days" from my glorified drug dealer. Compared to sub this zub is fast acting but not lasting in my opinion anyone else?

 

[CaseFace]

Just wanted to share that I have switched from 8mg suboxone sublingual strips to 8mg generic subutex/buperenorphine - and I feel a lot better physically. I feel more stable and don't get as many random hot flashes as I got on suboxone. Not exactly sure if it's all mental or not, but I'm extremely happy with the switch. Not to mention to ridiculous price difference.

 

[Mr.Scagnattie]

Whats good eve? feeling good today?

I was gonna make a new thread and will if this gets not many replies but i expect Scag to have a good answer. anyways, i know that the benzo opiate combo is a lethal one. i have a opiate tolerance and i used to take 8mg of sub a day and now im at 2mg 2X a day. now someone said to me that even with a real low dose benzo you can still harm yourself. ok thats cool but im taking a maintenance drug that im used to and it doesnt get me high and im only dosing 1-2 mg of etizolam at a time (just got 30 1mg). How can this put me at any risk? even a month and a half ago when i ate 40 of em in like 10 days or a little less so iwas taking like 5+ mgs at a time binging while still taking 4mg of sub 2X a day at that point. ( i actually just got the vivotrol shot and he loaded me up with 18 strips in a week) so there was days i was taking 32 mgs in a day plus 5mg of etizolam (no tolly for etiz, i can feel 1-1.5 mg). i was fine during that so how the fuck is sub and benzos harmful if you already have an opiate tolerance and are used to the drug you're taking that doesnt get you high. i guess the effects can stilll be present even if you dont feel it but still. wtf?

There are a lot of people that are dual diagnosed with opiate addiction and an anxiety disorder, who are on suboxone and a benzo. Because bupe is only a partial agonist, combining it with benzos is not quite as dangerous. Many people are on opiates like methadone, oxy, etc, and a benzo as well.. just at low doses and they are closely monitored by a doctor.

So, it's not something that is never done, ya know? You just have to be very careful. The real danger comes when you're abusing opiates at high levels, and then taking benzos on top, with doses going up and down, redosing, etc.

So, provided you keep your benzo usage low, and don't add anymore full agonist opiates into the mix, you'll be fine.

 

[Eveleivibe]

Hello all, I am posting my first post after having read thousands of post from many different forums. I will tell you my short concise story. 2004-Feb.2014 sub pill/strips, 16mg daily.
Now Zubsolv is what my insurance wants me to have (umm yes, insurance knows best pulling my glorified drug dealer [doctor] by the tie) and that is what I am on. But during this switch a pre auth was required which left me without had I not had some on deck for such a problem where I might be stranded. In fear of having to pay out of pocket I have gone down to one zub 5.7 to one and a quarter zub.
Yes I have this slow taper going on which might effect this: what I'd like to know if anyone else here has experienced zubsolv not lasting (yes I am aware of bup 37 after life) more then 6 hours. I feel good for the 6 hours. I'm sure I'd get "impossible shouldn't feel any wd for 3 days" from my glorified drug dealer. Compared to sub this zub is fast acting but not lasting in my opinion anyone else?

There are a few people who take subzolv who come here. If you look at the last megathread to this (this mega thread is fairly new) you will see a few conversations discussing subsolv.

Welcome to BL. Hopefully some people on subsolv will be around later n can discuss it with you.

Evey xxxxx