Well I guess I'll start here, this past wednesday I suffered a pretty severe episode of serotonin syndrome, I had to stay over night in the ER. What caused it was too much MDMA, too soon, and the addition of the 5-htp I was taking daily, what really kicked it in were those bongs rips.... I'm lucky to be a live I really thought wednesday was going to be the end. I feel okay now but my mood however has definitely been altered, everything just seems a little... bland. The question i reframed from asking my doctor was when I'll really be able to smoke again. I've heard of people having what are almost like flashbacks to the syndrome smoking too recently after the incident.. in all honesty im just too scared. Anyone's thoughts are welcome but I'd really like to hear from someone who has suffered from serotonin syndrome and smokes as well. My legs have been so shaky and I know benzo's are often prescribed to people after they get this in order to stop that, but i dont want benzo's i just want to smoke, if anyone can shed any light on this for me It would really help.
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Serotonin Syndrome aftermath
- Thread starter gooballs
- Start date
First Bad Comedown
Bluelighter
- Joined
- Nov 26, 2010
- Messages
- 562
Your thread is devoid of detail for a person who experienced the most harmful endocrine experience possible...
When I see threads like these I often feel like someone is trolling, trying to get me to write.
As if I could be somehow distracted or even exhausted.
Either you are a troll or you did not experience 'severe' SS.
Share a few details about what happened - not just the cause, but the symptoms.
If you sound sincere, I may be willing to share my experience on what SS is and why you CANNOT smoke weed for a very long time.
As well as what drugs you CAN use...
When I see threads like these I often feel like someone is trolling, trying to get me to write.
As if I could be somehow distracted or even exhausted.
Either you are a troll or you did not experience 'severe' SS.
Share a few details about what happened - not just the cause, but the symptoms.
If you sound sincere, I may be willing to share my experience on what SS is and why you CANNOT smoke weed for a very long time.
As well as what drugs you CAN use...
Well, i'm not sure what a troll is but i guess thats what i am, heres the whole story. After rolling twice in 3 days, and taking 100 mg of 15 hour time release 5htp daily for quite some time prior, i continued using 100 mgs of 5htp for another two days. Than I decided to take 200 mgs... about 2 hours later i was house passing a bong, at first everything seemed good i got as high as i normally did while on 5htp and it started with heat flashes. My heart started racing and I felt waves of coldness hypertension and heat (yes i no is contradicting but it what was happening ) going through my body, i asked my friend for water and he could tell something was wrong. He got it quickly but by time he came back downstairs i could barely move my hand to grab the cup, my whole body was stiff, yet at the same i was shivering and the lower half of my body would not stop twitching, i suddenly felt like i was going to puke. I managed to make it to the bathroom and coughed up nothing but blood, my nasau was than replaced with diarhea, as i was going through this the walls around me in the bathroom started to wave as if i was one lsd or something, that when the auditory hallucinations which were nothing but buzzing and crashing noises this startled me and i jumped up from where i was sitting..which is also where i was shitting. i ran out of the bathroom and back into my friends room, thats when my vision became consumed with blackness and the next thing i know my friend was lifting me up and telling me i was going to the hospital, there i told the doctors that i had used 5htp increased the dose and smoked weed as the previously mentioned symptoms would all hit me in waves about every 15 or so minutes. Yeah i left out the mdma but they told me what i had was serotonin syndrome, which i had heard about already and was pretty sure was what i had. I stayed there for 24 hours as i was pumped with water and on some drug that numbed me pretty well.
The only reason i did not share all that is because i was not trying to relive my expirence, typing all this has literly made my whole body start shaking again, and i see that you do not want to either but i am sincere and dont want anything like this to ever happen again so please share whatever it is you can
The only reason i did not share all that is because i was not trying to relive my expirence, typing all this has literly made my whole body start shaking again, and i see that you do not want to either but i am sincere and dont want anything like this to ever happen again so please share whatever it is you can
First Bad Comedown
Bluelighter
- Joined
- Nov 26, 2010
- Messages
- 562
I got your message.
From your initial description, it doesn't sound like 'severe' serotonin syndrome - although I will admit that ANY serotonin syndrome can feel VERY severe to the person going through it.
Tachycardia is the first symptom in most cases and the chest pain can be so severe it resembles a heart-attack.
Since you didn't mention an immediate fear of death....I am going to assume the chest pain was moderate.
Mine scared the SHIT out of me. I literally thought my heart stopped then started again, racing faster than sprinting a mile could cause!
In addition to initial tachycardia, 'severe' SS normally involves STRONG stomach and intestinal cramps.
For me the pain began just below my stomach and the swelling was externally visible. I literally thought my liver was going to EXPLODE.
I WISH I had gotten diarrhea - instead my intestines filled with fluid yet remained paralyzed.
To this day, they seem to be recovering muscle tone and rhythm.
Then there is the greatest sign of all - FEVER.
Anything above 101.4 is considered serious.
At 104 brain cells begin dying, and serotonin toxicity is greatly potentiated.
At 108 most humans expire no matter what.
A mild fever, say 99 degrees F, is still a sign of SS.
But we are talking a matter of degree.
If your tachycardia was not absolutely shocking and your body temp didn't go over 100 degrees...
And you managed to shit your guts out...
You are probably going to be MUCH better off than myself.
The fact that you got to the hospital might have prevented more serious complications such as hyponatremia, stroke, renal and liver toxicity...
That is good news for you, but the question remains - what have you done to your brain?
I would begin by asking you how you FEEL?
The first few days after MDMA toxicity, whether it is SS or not, are very surreal.
Many people describe feeling disconnected from their bodies at least at some point.
They feel dizzy, disoriented, and FULL of anxiety.
The tone of your thread seems to lack this anxiety factor.
The panic is so strong in the people I have met that they plead with the BL community for help and visit multiple doctors in a short period of time.
How is your vision?
How is your appetite?
Are you sleeping?
For myself and many others, lack of sleep is the most OBVIOUS symptom.
The first week after my SS, my head was ringing like a tuning fork!
Sleep disturbances are seen in research and have been shown to be a universal symptom of MDMA toxicity in humans.
Loss of sleep also worsens cognitive ability and increases anxiety substantially.
I was able to feel an appetite, but eating produced EXTREME suffering and anxiety for the entire first month or recovery.
And this became obvious the very first day!
BL and Erowid contain many examples of people drastically altering their diet.
We are talking about fast-food eating stoners going VEGAN.
Quite a change.
And then there is the anxiety and obsession.
They will spend HOURS searching the internet for an answer about what kind of 'brain damage' has occurred to them.
And they will be shocked and disappointed at doctors who know nothing about serotonin!
Where do you fit into this equation?
How do you FEEL?
SS can cause severe and crippling anxiety, changes in vision, appetite, sleep, and the ability to socialize.
As the serotonin network is rewired, the brain maintains a high level of the stress hormone cortisol.
Prolactin may also be elevated, which can be linked to anhedonia - including the ability to experience ANY pleasure during orgasm.
Or feel libido in the first place...
Along with these hormonal symptoms, dopamine imbalance may also occur.
The higher brain is deprived of it, and the limbic system receives an abundance!
This type of imbalance is seen in psychotic disorders like schizophrenia.
Serotonin inhibits dopamine and damage to the network causes improper serotonin transmission, and therefore dopamine suppression.
Dopamine imbalance, combined with elevated cortisol and prolactin...
It is a horrific combination - a soul destroying recipe.
Ironically, this same combination of events occurs during MDMA use!
Just to a lesser degree and in the right sequence.
Recovery from MDMA can feel strangely like MDMA does - but only the worst parts.
Drugs you cannot use:
Anything that agonizes or releases serotonin.
All psychedelics are out - mushrooms, LSD, MDMA, RCs, etc.
Tramadol, DXM, high dose benedryl...
You need to be checking ALL drugs for serotonin activity prior to taking.
Of course, tryptophan and 5-HTP are OUT.
So is weed.
Smoking cannabis causes serotonin activity in the brain - NOT what you want.
Some of the worst panic attacks and episodes of depersonalization/derealization occurred after smoking just a few hits of weed.
It took me over six months to be able to smoke, and even then it was TWO HITS max.
Since I had no tolerance it was plenty...
And even at 14 months now I have lost interest in the stuff.
When my recovery is fully complete, I may revisit pot - but not like I ever smoked before.
Long-term use of cannabis is associated with increased psychological problems among MDMA users.
While the extent of MDMA use predicts the cognitive deficit, it is the extent of cannabis use that predicts the psychological deficit.
This could be due to the fact that cannabis alters the shape and size of the prefrontal cortex, the highest brain region and the ultimate dopamine target of MDMA.
Loss of serotonin in this region is a long-term feature of MDMA toxicity.
Eventually some recovery of serotonin DOES occur, even in the distant PFC.
But it is the last region to recover in the network.
That is the good news from research - there is hope for all.
Even among heavy, long-term users 'clinical' recovery occurs between 12-18 months.
In some cases it goes to 2 years, but this is unusual.
Clinical recovery is defined as a cessation of anxiety and depression and a restoration of normal activity.
There are still lingering cognitive alterations....and changes in endocrine function.
Some BL members concede that the effects can linger for many years....but most will state that around the ONE year mark, things improved significantly.
I agree with that statement - between months 11-13 I noticed a big improvement in sleep.
And the ability to walk away from research and posting for days/weeks in a row.
Drugs you can take:
Alcohol in limited amounts.
It kills nerve growth factors in the brain, but it acts upon the GABA receptors which are safe for you.
Continued or heavy drinking will only halt your recovery, so I recommend strict limitations - like 3 beers, 4 tops.
Benzos also act upon GABA and are quite safe.
They are administered during acute MDMA reactions to shut down toxic glutamate activity.
Note - continued use of benzos will result in higher levels of glutamate!
More than a few days use is enough to cause aggression in most people.
And long-term use causes people to feel like they are having heart-attacks when they stop taking it.
There is only one more option for you - opiates.
In higher doses, many of them have modest effects on serotonin.
So I recommend taking very small doses, but hydrocodone and oxy seem to be acceptable options.
Again, moderation is the key...
Your dopamine system might not respond much to them, and heavy or continued use is only going to make you feel much worse.
Tramadol is not an opiate, it is an opioid with strong serotonin and noradrenaline releasing properties.
Stay away from that one!
Those are the three drugs you can use now alcohol, benzos, and opiates.
Ketamine is a possibility, but MICRO doses are the only recommendation I will offer.
Higher doses do have a marked anti-depressant effect, but they also cause schizophrenic symptoms and dissociation from the body.
The 're-emergence phenomena' is not pleasant at all.
But some BL members claim that regular low dose IM ketamine regrows brain cells...
Your best bet is to EXERCISE.
I guarantee this will make you feel better.
You have to do it.
Exercise releases a serotonin growth factor, BDNF.
It resprouts axons and increases the plasticity of existing ones!
Twenty minutes per day, five days in a row.
I PROMISE results.
It is time to start taking care of yourself - eating right, sleeping right, exercise, sunlight, socializing.
And the harder these things are to do, the MORE important they are to your brain function.
If you have to FORCE it, good.
It will benefit you in ways you cannot imagine.
I'm done for now, be sure to let me know if you have any other questions.
You know where to find me.
FBC
From your initial description, it doesn't sound like 'severe' serotonin syndrome - although I will admit that ANY serotonin syndrome can feel VERY severe to the person going through it.
Tachycardia is the first symptom in most cases and the chest pain can be so severe it resembles a heart-attack.
Since you didn't mention an immediate fear of death....I am going to assume the chest pain was moderate.
Mine scared the SHIT out of me. I literally thought my heart stopped then started again, racing faster than sprinting a mile could cause!
In addition to initial tachycardia, 'severe' SS normally involves STRONG stomach and intestinal cramps.
For me the pain began just below my stomach and the swelling was externally visible. I literally thought my liver was going to EXPLODE.
I WISH I had gotten diarrhea - instead my intestines filled with fluid yet remained paralyzed.
To this day, they seem to be recovering muscle tone and rhythm.
Then there is the greatest sign of all - FEVER.
Anything above 101.4 is considered serious.
At 104 brain cells begin dying, and serotonin toxicity is greatly potentiated.
At 108 most humans expire no matter what.
A mild fever, say 99 degrees F, is still a sign of SS.
But we are talking a matter of degree.
If your tachycardia was not absolutely shocking and your body temp didn't go over 100 degrees...
And you managed to shit your guts out...
You are probably going to be MUCH better off than myself.
The fact that you got to the hospital might have prevented more serious complications such as hyponatremia, stroke, renal and liver toxicity...
That is good news for you, but the question remains - what have you done to your brain?
I would begin by asking you how you FEEL?
The first few days after MDMA toxicity, whether it is SS or not, are very surreal.
Many people describe feeling disconnected from their bodies at least at some point.
They feel dizzy, disoriented, and FULL of anxiety.
The tone of your thread seems to lack this anxiety factor.
The panic is so strong in the people I have met that they plead with the BL community for help and visit multiple doctors in a short period of time.
How is your vision?
How is your appetite?
Are you sleeping?
For myself and many others, lack of sleep is the most OBVIOUS symptom.
The first week after my SS, my head was ringing like a tuning fork!
Sleep disturbances are seen in research and have been shown to be a universal symptom of MDMA toxicity in humans.
Loss of sleep also worsens cognitive ability and increases anxiety substantially.
I was able to feel an appetite, but eating produced EXTREME suffering and anxiety for the entire first month or recovery.
And this became obvious the very first day!
BL and Erowid contain many examples of people drastically altering their diet.
We are talking about fast-food eating stoners going VEGAN.
Quite a change.
And then there is the anxiety and obsession.
They will spend HOURS searching the internet for an answer about what kind of 'brain damage' has occurred to them.
And they will be shocked and disappointed at doctors who know nothing about serotonin!
Where do you fit into this equation?
How do you FEEL?
SS can cause severe and crippling anxiety, changes in vision, appetite, sleep, and the ability to socialize.
As the serotonin network is rewired, the brain maintains a high level of the stress hormone cortisol.
Prolactin may also be elevated, which can be linked to anhedonia - including the ability to experience ANY pleasure during orgasm.
Or feel libido in the first place...
Along with these hormonal symptoms, dopamine imbalance may also occur.
The higher brain is deprived of it, and the limbic system receives an abundance!
This type of imbalance is seen in psychotic disorders like schizophrenia.
Serotonin inhibits dopamine and damage to the network causes improper serotonin transmission, and therefore dopamine suppression.
Dopamine imbalance, combined with elevated cortisol and prolactin...
It is a horrific combination - a soul destroying recipe.
Ironically, this same combination of events occurs during MDMA use!
Just to a lesser degree and in the right sequence.
Recovery from MDMA can feel strangely like MDMA does - but only the worst parts.
Drugs you cannot use:
Anything that agonizes or releases serotonin.
All psychedelics are out - mushrooms, LSD, MDMA, RCs, etc.
Tramadol, DXM, high dose benedryl...
You need to be checking ALL drugs for serotonin activity prior to taking.
Of course, tryptophan and 5-HTP are OUT.
So is weed.
Smoking cannabis causes serotonin activity in the brain - NOT what you want.
Some of the worst panic attacks and episodes of depersonalization/derealization occurred after smoking just a few hits of weed.
It took me over six months to be able to smoke, and even then it was TWO HITS max.
Since I had no tolerance it was plenty...
And even at 14 months now I have lost interest in the stuff.
When my recovery is fully complete, I may revisit pot - but not like I ever smoked before.
Long-term use of cannabis is associated with increased psychological problems among MDMA users.
While the extent of MDMA use predicts the cognitive deficit, it is the extent of cannabis use that predicts the psychological deficit.
This could be due to the fact that cannabis alters the shape and size of the prefrontal cortex, the highest brain region and the ultimate dopamine target of MDMA.
Loss of serotonin in this region is a long-term feature of MDMA toxicity.
Eventually some recovery of serotonin DOES occur, even in the distant PFC.
But it is the last region to recover in the network.
That is the good news from research - there is hope for all.
Even among heavy, long-term users 'clinical' recovery occurs between 12-18 months.
In some cases it goes to 2 years, but this is unusual.
Clinical recovery is defined as a cessation of anxiety and depression and a restoration of normal activity.
There are still lingering cognitive alterations....and changes in endocrine function.
Some BL members concede that the effects can linger for many years....but most will state that around the ONE year mark, things improved significantly.
I agree with that statement - between months 11-13 I noticed a big improvement in sleep.
And the ability to walk away from research and posting for days/weeks in a row.
Drugs you can take:
Alcohol in limited amounts.
It kills nerve growth factors in the brain, but it acts upon the GABA receptors which are safe for you.
Continued or heavy drinking will only halt your recovery, so I recommend strict limitations - like 3 beers, 4 tops.
Benzos also act upon GABA and are quite safe.
They are administered during acute MDMA reactions to shut down toxic glutamate activity.
Note - continued use of benzos will result in higher levels of glutamate!
More than a few days use is enough to cause aggression in most people.
And long-term use causes people to feel like they are having heart-attacks when they stop taking it.
There is only one more option for you - opiates.
In higher doses, many of them have modest effects on serotonin.
So I recommend taking very small doses, but hydrocodone and oxy seem to be acceptable options.
Again, moderation is the key...
Your dopamine system might not respond much to them, and heavy or continued use is only going to make you feel much worse.
Tramadol is not an opiate, it is an opioid with strong serotonin and noradrenaline releasing properties.
Stay away from that one!
Those are the three drugs you can use now alcohol, benzos, and opiates.
Ketamine is a possibility, but MICRO doses are the only recommendation I will offer.
Higher doses do have a marked anti-depressant effect, but they also cause schizophrenic symptoms and dissociation from the body.
The 're-emergence phenomena' is not pleasant at all.
But some BL members claim that regular low dose IM ketamine regrows brain cells...
Your best bet is to EXERCISE.
I guarantee this will make you feel better.
You have to do it.
Exercise releases a serotonin growth factor, BDNF.
It resprouts axons and increases the plasticity of existing ones!
Twenty minutes per day, five days in a row.
I PROMISE results.
It is time to start taking care of yourself - eating right, sleeping right, exercise, sunlight, socializing.
And the harder these things are to do, the MORE important they are to your brain function.
If you have to FORCE it, good.
It will benefit you in ways you cannot imagine.
I'm done for now, be sure to let me know if you have any other questions.
You know where to find me.
FBC
wow that was by far the best information I have ever seen on this subject, thank you so much man. My sleeping pattern has defintely been changed I haven't been asleep before 6 a.m. since this happened, and even then i usually wake up by 10 and feel restless and have to get up. My anxiety is low, but it is definitely there and it never was before, like you said I've been researching what kind of brain damage could have happened non-stop, usually during my sleepless nights but I think your response may allow that to seize. As for my vision I've actually been squinting at my computer and other things the past couple days but never thought too much of it.. maybe it's time to visit the eye doctor. I'll be going for a run first thing tomorrow morning, this really helped thank you again.
First Bad Comedown
Bluelighter
- Joined
- Nov 26, 2010
- Messages
- 562
Skip the eye doctor visit - it will reveal nothing.
The visual cortex is a very serotonin rich brain region, and it is subject to long-term effects from many psychedelic and serotonergic drugs.
The good news is that visual changes do NOT persist for the vast majority of people, and only LSD is documented to cause such changes in a significant percentage of its users.
Not being able to sleep is going to cause further harm - but I believe it is part of the brain re-wiring itself.
It cannot be avoided.
It took me EIGHT months to finally return to restful sleep at night.
I doubt it will take nearly as long for you.
My experience on BL has shown me that many people recover from acute MDMA reactions within weeks or a few months.
If you are still suffering anxiety and sleep issues past three months, you may require one year.
But so far your symptoms sound like you are in the first group.
I'm glad you are going running.
I recommend weight lifting more, actually.
Aerobic exercise is a great lower-body workout and increases bloodflow to the brain, so it should be done.
But resistance training and lifting will tear muscle fibers.
Focusing on particularly large muscle groups by doing pushups or squats will cause the pituitary to release growth factors.
The pituitary is the center of the endocrine system and it is controlled by the hypothalamus.
Serotonin activity in the higher brain interacts with the hypothalamus and the pituitary to produce the 'magic' of MDMA.
It is also the site of ultimate 'brain damage' and re-wiring.
Since exercise releases BDNF, serotonin nerves in front of the hypothalamus are encouraged to grow, which lowers HYP serotonin content.
This restores HPA axis function, or hypothalamus-pituitary-adrenal axis.
Exercise really is the greatest tool for recovery - and this holds true for ALL types of brain injuries.
So go for a run.
But don't skip on the hard exercises.
Lifting weights definitely causes more improvement for me than cardio.
The most important thing you can do is REPEAT.
Exercise has limited benefit in limited amounts.
But the more days in a row you push yourself, the greater the reward....the greater the relief.
By day three I was always feeling restored, reborn.
Alas, it does not substitute for the re-wiring that must occur anyways.
There is still suffering - but working out is a GREAT way to control and influence the process.
Trust me on this, you have NO choice but to start working out and running on a regular basis.
I only take two to three day breaks to let my muscles heal....then I am right back at it!
At least when it is over you will be in better physical shape.
And you will get better.
Eventually everyone does.
The brain is not a static organ - it is constantly changing and rewiring itself.
The plasticity is truly incredible, and I personally cannot believe how much cognitive function I have managed to maintain despite the most difficult year of my entire life.
But without exercise, who know what I would say...
Start getting as much sunlight in the daytime as possible.
The super-chiasmatic nuclei is in communication with the raphe nuclei.
This means that two ancient structures in the brainstem are connected - one that is affected by light exposure and the other being the origin for all serotonin in the brain.
Daytime sun exposure combined with COMPLETE darkness at night is by far the most effective way at combating your sleep problems.
Even in normal people, this is the recommended approach by sleep specialists.
But for you, it is critical.
If you are going to be awake and online, DIM your screen to the lowest level.
Same with TV.
Turn off ALL lights in the house.
You should even go to the bathroom in the dark.
ANY light exposure interferes with the process.
If you have roommates or family that make this difficult, wear sunglasses.
I am dead serious.
No matter what, around 9:30 PM you need to kill EVERY light source in your environment.
And minimize the computer monitor - do not forget this.
You sit a few feet from it, so this is a critical step.
Even on the dimmest setting it will interfere.
Start taking melatonin too.
It encourages what the light therapy is trying to accomplish.
Sunlight at day, darkness at night.
This is how we evolved for millions of years.
All life expects this rhythm, and only modern humans could be retarded enough to SCREW it up.
You know what you need to do now.
I'm glad your anxiety isn't extreme - that is a very good sign.
If it gets worse, remember I'm here and come back to post.
No matter what, you are going to be OK.
Anecdotal reports and medical research both agree with this statement.
For some it is a VERY difficult and long road, but recovery does occur.
That much is known.
Good luck.
The visual cortex is a very serotonin rich brain region, and it is subject to long-term effects from many psychedelic and serotonergic drugs.
The good news is that visual changes do NOT persist for the vast majority of people, and only LSD is documented to cause such changes in a significant percentage of its users.
Not being able to sleep is going to cause further harm - but I believe it is part of the brain re-wiring itself.
It cannot be avoided.
It took me EIGHT months to finally return to restful sleep at night.
I doubt it will take nearly as long for you.
My experience on BL has shown me that many people recover from acute MDMA reactions within weeks or a few months.
If you are still suffering anxiety and sleep issues past three months, you may require one year.
But so far your symptoms sound like you are in the first group.
I'm glad you are going running.
I recommend weight lifting more, actually.
Aerobic exercise is a great lower-body workout and increases bloodflow to the brain, so it should be done.
But resistance training and lifting will tear muscle fibers.
Focusing on particularly large muscle groups by doing pushups or squats will cause the pituitary to release growth factors.
The pituitary is the center of the endocrine system and it is controlled by the hypothalamus.
Serotonin activity in the higher brain interacts with the hypothalamus and the pituitary to produce the 'magic' of MDMA.
It is also the site of ultimate 'brain damage' and re-wiring.
Since exercise releases BDNF, serotonin nerves in front of the hypothalamus are encouraged to grow, which lowers HYP serotonin content.
This restores HPA axis function, or hypothalamus-pituitary-adrenal axis.
Exercise really is the greatest tool for recovery - and this holds true for ALL types of brain injuries.
So go for a run.
But don't skip on the hard exercises.
Lifting weights definitely causes more improvement for me than cardio.
The most important thing you can do is REPEAT.
Exercise has limited benefit in limited amounts.
But the more days in a row you push yourself, the greater the reward....the greater the relief.
By day three I was always feeling restored, reborn.
Alas, it does not substitute for the re-wiring that must occur anyways.
There is still suffering - but working out is a GREAT way to control and influence the process.
Trust me on this, you have NO choice but to start working out and running on a regular basis.
I only take two to three day breaks to let my muscles heal....then I am right back at it!
At least when it is over you will be in better physical shape.
And you will get better.
Eventually everyone does.
The brain is not a static organ - it is constantly changing and rewiring itself.
The plasticity is truly incredible, and I personally cannot believe how much cognitive function I have managed to maintain despite the most difficult year of my entire life.
But without exercise, who know what I would say...
Start getting as much sunlight in the daytime as possible.
The super-chiasmatic nuclei is in communication with the raphe nuclei.
This means that two ancient structures in the brainstem are connected - one that is affected by light exposure and the other being the origin for all serotonin in the brain.
Daytime sun exposure combined with COMPLETE darkness at night is by far the most effective way at combating your sleep problems.
Even in normal people, this is the recommended approach by sleep specialists.
But for you, it is critical.
If you are going to be awake and online, DIM your screen to the lowest level.
Same with TV.
Turn off ALL lights in the house.
You should even go to the bathroom in the dark.
ANY light exposure interferes with the process.
If you have roommates or family that make this difficult, wear sunglasses.
I am dead serious.
No matter what, around 9:30 PM you need to kill EVERY light source in your environment.
And minimize the computer monitor - do not forget this.
You sit a few feet from it, so this is a critical step.
Even on the dimmest setting it will interfere.
Start taking melatonin too.
It encourages what the light therapy is trying to accomplish.
Sunlight at day, darkness at night.
This is how we evolved for millions of years.
All life expects this rhythm, and only modern humans could be retarded enough to SCREW it up.
You know what you need to do now.
I'm glad your anxiety isn't extreme - that is a very good sign.
If it gets worse, remember I'm here and come back to post.
No matter what, you are going to be OK.
Anecdotal reports and medical research both agree with this statement.
For some it is a VERY difficult and long road, but recovery does occur.
That much is known.
Good luck.
So, you have SS from 5-HTP, ganja and MDMA, get brought to hospital for it, and all you wanna do is smoke again?
I'm no expert, but I think staying off all drugs, aside form prescriptions, like benzos for any anxiety, would probably be a wise idea.
I hope everything goes well for you though, and that you recover quickly!
I'm no expert, but I think staying off all drugs, aside form prescriptions, like benzos for any anxiety, would probably be a wise idea.
I hope everything goes well for you though, and that you recover quickly!
First Bad Comedown, after learning so much from what you've told me I'd feel wrong to not thank you once more, excersize is noticeably improving my well-being day by day the benefit was felt especially after only a couple days of straneuos weight lifting. As a college student it's relieving to see how much of your cognitive mind is intact if not the entirety of it. Your support and advice has been making all the difference, just took some melotonin, and hoping it does the job and that I sleep well tonight. I feel ya trammies.. I understand that, but up until now however weed has been a way for me to relax my mind and body, which really seems like what I've needed, but now that I somewhat understand its affect on the brain i get why it won't do that anymore, thanks for the support.
First Bad Comedown
Bluelighter
- Joined
- Nov 26, 2010
- Messages
- 562
Thank you for posting the reply.
I will forward a link to another person in need of hearing just how important exercise is.
You are welcome to PM me anytime you need to.
Whatever you do, don't stop exercising for more than two or three days to heal.
When you do, you will feel a return of the symptoms.
Exercise does not cure you, but it is a damned fine control mechanism.
And it sure brings relief.
I will forward a link to another person in need of hearing just how important exercise is.
You are welcome to PM me anytime you need to.
Whatever you do, don't stop exercising for more than two or three days to heal.
When you do, you will feel a return of the symptoms.
Exercise does not cure you, but it is a damned fine control mechanism.
And it sure brings relief.
First Bad Comedown, after learning so much from what you've told me I'd feel wrong to not thank you once more, excersize is noticeably improving my well-being day by day the benefit was felt especially after only a couple days of straneuos weight lifting. As a college student it's relieving to see how much of your cognitive mind is intact if not the entirety of it. Your support and advice has been making all the difference, just took some melotonin, and hoping it does the job and that I sleep well tonight. I feel ya trammies.. I understand that, but up until now however weed has been a way for me to relax my mind and body, which really seems like what I've needed, but now that I somewhat understand its affect on the brain i get why it won't do that anymore, thanks for the support.
Aye, regular smokers tend to feel anxiety and such when they go without grass, don't they? I see how that would be worse having suffered SS.
hey, first bad comedown, not to sound like a creep or anything but I've been reading some of your other post on some threads because they're just so informational.... I noticed you mentioned supplement called piracetam that has helped you restore energy and cognitive balance. Although every day is a little better there's still a somewhat overwhelming sluggish almost zombie like feeling that I've yet to shake it's kind of like this uncomfortably spaced/fried out sensation seemingly affecting my short-term memory and attention span. Would you recommend this supplement or any other for that matter?
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for example i typed up that post like an hour ago... i just realized now I never hit the post button and its just been sitting there.... these are little things yes but they are very very consistent and noticeable... I forget things that I'm about to do and simply go on with life unaware, it's just that im pretty sure I used to be a little shaper than I am nowadays
Senortrippington
Greenlighter
- Joined
- Jan 1, 2012
- Messages
- 12
I couldn't really be bothered to read through All the other posts but holy shit you took a ton of 5htp, at least in my opinion. I think the rolling contributed to it all, but had you rolled 2 times in three days, skipped the 5htp or taken significantly less you would have been way better off.. And prolly would of been fine smoking. Diving into 100mg just sounds disgusting to me lol.. Couldn't even think about taking multiple 200mgs. I normally take 30-40mg for about five days after I roll, and make sure I get plenty of water and nutritional value and i feel great after a few days. Good luck though, sounds like you did some damage :/. Sorry if this sounded lecture-ish
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Yeah 200mg is definitely a lot of 5-htp but heres the real fucked up part... the 5-htp I bought at target was 200mg per pill.. I cut them all in half because of what I've read online... than a couple days after rolling i decided I'd take a whole one, increasing my current dosage, thinking well this is how they sell em' so how bad could it be....now I know. Won't be obliviously messing around with stupid shit like that ever again... I wish it were only by choice and not more or less my only option.
I feel you man, I was .9 g or 5 HTP for two weeks, while I was on SSRI's, then rolled one night and sniffed some coke.
It was a weird experince, I deperosnalized big time, never got any euphoria though.
I slept fine that night and didn't seem tense, or hyperventilating or anything. So I might have suffered SS as well but ii'm not sure.
By the way, it doesn't matter how much 5 HTP you take. Regardless your body can only take so much. 5-Hydroxytryptophan is decarboxylated to serotonin (5-hydroxytryptamine or 5-HT) by the enzyme aromatic-L-amino-acid decarboxylase, which is limited because it's a rate determining enyzme, meaning that it can only process/convert a certian amount of 5 HTP at a time, rendering the rest useless, as 5-Hydroxytryptophan (5-HTP) has to be converted to 5-hydroxytryptamine (serotonin) before it can cross the BBB (blood brain barrier) to be used by your CNS.
It was a weird experince, I deperosnalized big time, never got any euphoria though.
I slept fine that night and didn't seem tense, or hyperventilating or anything. So I might have suffered SS as well but ii'm not sure.
By the way, it doesn't matter how much 5 HTP you take. Regardless your body can only take so much. 5-Hydroxytryptophan is decarboxylated to serotonin (5-hydroxytryptamine or 5-HT) by the enzyme aromatic-L-amino-acid decarboxylase, which is limited because it's a rate determining enyzme, meaning that it can only process/convert a certian amount of 5 HTP at a time, rendering the rest useless, as 5-Hydroxytryptophan (5-HTP) has to be converted to 5-hydroxytryptamine (serotonin) before it can cross the BBB (blood brain barrier) to be used by your CNS.