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MDMA damage - need some help fast

It's been about three years since my last dose and I am starting to make some real progress. My dp/dr seems to have subsided quite a bit. I'm not depressed all the time. Sometimes I have a hard time articulating what I want to say, but it's getting better. The supplements that I have tried that have helped are:

curcumin (bcm-95)
ashwagandha (sensoril)
ECGC
piracetam (though I don't take this the same weeks I am on curcumin/ashwagandha)
stablon (I take this the weeks I don't take any of the aforementioned)

so basically, I have been cycling these things - taking the first three for a few months, then the piracetam for a month or so, then I'll do a month or two of stablon. I'll take lion's mane with any of them.

I think lion's mane has been the most effective tool in my recovery arsenal. I have more vivid and complex dreams/thoughts when I take it - and when that happens, I don't know how to explain it, but I feel like something in my brain is just clicking back together.

I'm not sure if I'm ready to wholeheartedly agree with bben, but I do think abuse of mdma has some long-lasting negative consequences that you can't really anticipate until you experience it. I'm kinda thinking that a large part of the problem has to do with reduced sensitivity to normal neurotransmitter levels. I've been thinking this recently because I am finally starting to feel a happiness from normal everyday experience such as taking a shower or watching a tv show. Like, I know this is really subjective so it may sound weird, but I can kinda feel my mind becoming more sensitive to normal neurotransmitter levels/releases. I'm still not back to normal, but I'm holding out hope I can sustain the recovery process and further it. I think First Bad Comedown is on to something as well. I think long periods of time are crucial to restoring some sense of normalcy and the long time periods may be reducing some sort of panic response resulting from mass serotonin depletion and long term deprivation/reduced sensitivity).

I must note however that I was a polydrug abuser. I did various drugs for various time periods (no horror story abuse though). I don't think I exceeded 40 mdma pills total - and that was spread out between 6-8 years. Long story short, but during this period I started taking larger doses of mdma because my prior cocaine use resulted in impulsive behavior (I treated mdma like cocaine - not doing it days in a row, but over the course of the night taking one pill after another wore off). I knew this was counterproductive but I think I developed that behavior as a result of my cocaine use and that's where I really started running into problems.

I think the best things really for this whole mess other than ect (which seems like a last resort) are exercise, the above supplements and staying away from negative posts that make you feel like you have sustained irreparable brain damage. Anytime I log onto this forum and read a bben post (no offense to him btw - I know he's been dealing with some difficult issues as a result of this drug, and I hope some major healing comes his way soon), I start feeling worse - and symptoms just start manifesting. If I don't read about any damage or mdma problems, I usually feel at least somewhere in the range of "normal".

Another thing that has helped me personally is to stay away from other drugs. Sometimes other drugs provide a quick fix to the mdma damage problem. However, the drugs are like sticking glass coated bandaids into a bullet wound. I think my recovery time has been delayed and delayed because of my turning to other drugs such as GBL or weed. And for what it's worth - I graduated with honors from a four year university AFTER the majority of my drug abuse. I think it was a little bit (or maybe a lot) harder than it would have been had I not abused drugs, including mdma, but I guess that it means I came out of this whole thing without turning into a complete etard/polydrugtard. Ironically, my LSAT score went up substantially two weeks after I took my last dose of mdma. I had the worst comedown after that dose, but I was so determined to bring up my score that I didn't give up. Piracetam helped with that I'm sure. But, that being said, I would caution those reading to heed bben's warnings about the havoc this drug can wreak, because recovery is not a cakewalk - it's a long long LONG drawn out process with many ups and downs (and unfortunately - more downs and temptations to indulge in quick-fixes).
 
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Clay that's some great, and probably accurate, information. I've also improved a lot and it's only been a year. But still, I just want this to be over.
 
bben said:
However, higher dose mdma has given me permanent brain damage and altered my perceptions and emotions. This has NOT improved after 4 years. I never expect it to and have learned to accept that i must live as an emotional cripple
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I'm gonna go out on a limb here and say ^^this^^ is your biggest problem.

I still have anxiety issues, and some depression issues after being clinically depressed for 7 or 8 years, but you know when things got better? When I decided that I REFUSE to be an emotional cripple.


EDIT: My depression is not due to MDMA, it began in Jr. High, long before I had ever even smoked weed.
Also, of course MDMA abuse has significant risks and consequences, but moderate use is not going to cause any serious damage unless you have some sort of underlying health/mental health problem. People who want to recover, eventually do so.
 
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I'm not a doctor nor anyone else on this thread, but if what you are saying is true I would say it is a result of underlying mental health issues. Millions of ecstasy pill get consumed around the world every day and you would have to be one unlucky son of a bitch to get " brain damage " from a few small binges.

With that said, and I'm not trying to sound unsencative, but this guy sounds like a bit of a wack job or he could just be pulling the piss.....

" I had one particularly bad experience when I was messing with computer duster while rolling, and had an unexpected trip-out where I had a complete loss of ego. For a couple minutes, I was unable to comprehend time, space, self, anything, didn't recognize my girlfriend of 5 years, yeah, SCARY shit for a drug-naive person not expecting such an experience."

^^^^that is frickin ridiculous.
 
I assume this means he inhaled air duster which is usually butane or a similar mix. I've done gas before including whilst on acid and it can give an incredibly intense trip not unlike DXM. The freaky shit I experience makes most acid or shroom trips look like childs play. Insanely dangerous and stupid thing to do of course. I had an invisible man who I could only see by his shadow. He was made out of super slippery and clear gel and could reach into your body. he reached into my head and I could feel his gristly finger in my mouth so I bit it and spat out a bit of his finger. It sort of dried up into a white speck on the carpet. When I came down there was a white speck exactly in that spot! How my brain engineered all that I don't know. So I can believe the loss of ego and not recognising people.
 
brindle88 said:
I'm not a doctor nor anyone else on this thread, but if what you are saying is true I would say it is a result of underlying mental health issues. Millions of ecstasy pill get consumed around the world every day and you would have to be one unlucky son of a bitch to get " brain damage " from a few small binges.

With that said, and I'm not trying to sound unsencative, but this guy sounds like a bit of a wack job or he could just be pulling the piss.....

" I had one particularly bad experience when I was messing with computer duster while rolling, and had an unexpected trip-out where I had a complete loss of ego. For a couple minutes, I was unable to comprehend time, space, self, anything, didn't recognize my girlfriend of 5 years, yeah, SCARY shit for a drug-naive person not expecting such an experience."

^^^^that is frickin ridiculous.
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Who's the whack job? Me? Your post is poorly written and gives virtually no contribution to the discussion. Are you saying I'm making this story up? What's ridiculous about it? What the hell does 'pulling the piss' mean?? Explain yourself trollface.

I understand my computer duster thing was dumb, it was a one time and one time thing only! It was by the advice of a 'friend' whom I no longer speak to, due to his exponential levels of stupidity and his undying efforts to inflict said stupidity on others. Funny, because he was the same person to introduce me to MDMA in the first place, as well as inhaling NOS from canisters as well as duster, and gave me all of the MDMA I ended up abusing. In no way do I BLAME this person, I'm a big boy I can make my own choices, however I'm saying that I understand these were DUMB MISTAKES and I will not repeat them as I have learned better! I hope this doesn't classify me as a 'whack job', because we've all done dumb shit! I mean c'mon, this is a drug forum for cryin' out loud...calling someone else a whack job for their choices they made while high on drugs is hypocritical, whether you meant it towards me or not.

As a matter of fact, when I see a can of computer duster, I get goosebumps and the hair stands up on my arms and neck. I honestly asked my roommate for a can of it the other day, to honestly dust out my computer, and the whole time I'm spraying it, hearing the sound, smelling the 'irritant' they put in there, I felt like I was facing a demon or something! No doubt that shit fucked me up!



As for your comment about millions of pills around the world, do you have any proof that all those people are A-OK after those pills? How do you know that every single ecstacy user in the entire world doesn't suffer from some varying level of mental problem? Sure, they can hook us all up to machines, do their research, their tests, and try to make mathematical sense of it all, but there's some problems with that. They don't know everything about our brains, they actually know very little. They also can't test for emotional or other mental shifts that are potentially caused by MDMA and other drug use. How many people say they 'just feel different' after first experimenting with MDMA? Pretty much every person I've spoke to agrees on some level, whether it's bad, good or a lateral shift, pretty much everyone agrees there is some level of change in their head, and many can't even explain it. There is absolutely no scientific evidence to prove or disprove this, or to even elaborate on it. How can you say what you said in your post with literally NO basis, and then turn around and call other people whack jobs in the same post?
 
dezz said:
It's all in your head. Trust me. You put yourself where you are right now. You don't have any "braindamage" from a drug you did 3 years ago, trust me on this.
You said that you've already rolled the previous day AND took about 13 beers. The beer alone can skyrocket your anxiety levels.
It sounds to me like the horrible experience the night after just put your brain way into overdrive.

Your brain has gotten used to thinking this way, and now you need to un-learn the habit.
Why are you experiencing symptoms now after 3 years? It's because YOU are doing this to yourself. You say yourself that it's most certainly brain damage from MDMA alone. That kind of thinking alone will STOP you from recovering, ENTIRELY.

All the symptoms are easily explained by simple anxiety. If you're too anxious all the time, your brain will become "confused" in a way.
Wait until your fully at peace with yourself and free from anxiety before you start blaming a drug.

Reading about your symptoms and trying to find a solution on the internet is doing nothing for you. It only convinces your subconsious mind that it's "damaged".
I suggest you take a break from everything and find a new hobby, an activity. Something that takes your mind off things. Try playing an instrument, you'll notice that the second your focus has switched to playing the instrument... POOF symptoms will be gone.

Also, try to stop all medications.
You're fine trust me :)
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I have abused MDMA badly in conjunction with heavy alcohol use and been through the "dark times" and the anxiety and the "oh my god I did permanent damage to my brain" thing before, and I have to say dezz has nailed it here. Life changes as time goes on and you change with it. Your anxiety and memory could be worse from any number of things including drinking alcohol or simply aging. You can't blame all of your problems on a drug you've taken only a handful of times several years ago.

Also, couldn't you attribute some of your apathy, lack of energy and depersonalization to the anti-depressants? Those drugs are designed to make you numb. If they made you happy they would be illegal. There are too many contributing factors here.

Now of course you could always be like bben and dwell on the past, fight with people on bluelight forever and let the self loathing consume your life rather than try and make positive changes to your daily regimen and be happy with who you are and what you can be.

You're in control of your life and your emotions, don't forget that and end up like bben.
 
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Don't dog bben. He's tougher than you could imagine. He has tried to do those things but he also is looking out for other people. He's not purposefully antagonistic; he simply wants to help other avoid the life-altering mistake he made.
 
No offence but I have to agree with dezz on this one. bben doesnt offer advice to anyone, nor have I ever heard of him even speaking in a positive light with helpful words to anyone thats even in his situation, other than "your fucked for life, adapt, you won't ever be the same".

I've read a majority of his posts and out of all the people suffering mdma abuse, he's the least helpful.

His posts remind me of a cold pessimistic schizoaffective type personality, tbh I think he has unerlying problems and is trying to spew his hatred on other members.

Not to mention i've seen posts of his in other forums claiming hes autistic and other saying his schizo. A bit fucked up if you ask me, I just skim his posts im sick of reading that assholes input, he's needs a hobby instead of claiming himself as "an MDMA expert" considering that naive person claims to understand how the brain "works", when in reality the cumulative knowledge of our universes greatest beings couldn't even propose such a statement, other than pure speculation.

We know 4% of how the brain functions, how the fuck could he be an "expert" on a psychoactive drug?

I think he's thought himself too deep into his own situation and no matter if his damage is fully reparied by now or not he's wired/convinced himself into a life of misery.

Like really, FBC is the most knowledgeable person ive talked to about MDMA and even HE has optimisim for the future and alot of caring words to offer, so it can't be the MDMA making bben such an arrogant cold unhman piece of shit. Anyways, I don't know if its just me but I get joy out of offering helpful advice to those walking in my footsteps, not the oppisite way around.
 
bben said:
i could post about 25-50 studies showing irreversible neurotoxicity regarding mdma. I mean its kind of like the tobacco- cancer connection. No one admitted it caused cancer for decades because the burden of proof was so high. In science its almost impossible to be 100% sure of anything.

After half a decade of mdma research and talking to neurologists the facts seem obvious to me. I dont expect unbiased answers on a drug forum, and neither should any of you.

However, higher dose mdma has given me permanent brain damage and altered my perceptions and emotions. This has NOT improved after 4 years. I never expect it to and have learned to accept that i must live as an emotional cripple.


As far as comparing weed to mdma, thats just a god dam joke. Weed has never shown even a hint of any significant toxicity in any study, animal or human. MDMA shows full toxicity in animals, and it would be unethical to try it on humans so we cant do controlled studies. Not that I think we need to as anecdotal evidence and current evidence is strong enough IMO.

So basically comparing weed to a substituted amphetamine is the pinnacle of stupidity.
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As for comparing weed to MDMA... Maybe weed hasn't shown any toxicity in any study, but it's been proven to cause mental problems and panic attacks/anxiety. You've just missed the point of my post entirely. It just shows how you go about dealing with your issues. Weed doesn't cause neurotoxicity in the brain, yet I still developed similar problems to that of MDMA abuse. I've had it all, depression, altered perceptions, DR/DP you name it. After a year I was done focusing on my problems and instead started distracting myself and basically started saying FUCK YOU to all the strange sensations, panic attacks and such. If I had your personality I would probably still be an emotional wreck today. Thank god I'm not.
 
somedud said:
No offence but I have to agree with dezz on this one. bben doesnt offer advice to anyone, nor have I ever heard of him even speaking in a positive light with helpful words to anyone thats even in his situation, other than "your fucked for life, adapt, you won't ever be the same".
he's needs a hobby instead of claiming himself as "an MDMA expert" considering that naive person claims to understand how the brain "works", when in reality the cumulative knowledge of our universes greatest beings couldn't even propose such a statement, other than pure speculation.
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zomg!
 
Have you all forgotten that the OP had 12-13 beers with his mdma? Does that not mean anything? (It does.)

Alcohol is ALSO a neurotoxin. Combining alcohol with something that drastically changes the body's neurochemistry is DANGEROUS. Combining.

Com

Bining.
 
A very similiar thing happened to me. Took some xtc and got a very bad anxiety/loss of personality/reality reaction and went through hell in the last 2 years.

It is certainly not just "in your head". I quiet drastically improved after 1 year, but things are definitly not like they have been before. my memory is very bad, and I while I don't have full blown panic attacks anymore. there is this allthough not constant, but always lingering around the corner feel of dread and anxiety.

sure, I thought about that it maybe has more something to do with PTSD. basically I've send my brain to war and it overwrote a lot of normal responses to normal situations, but I am pretty certain that I've suffered brain damage. even after 3 years now, my concentration is absolutly horrible and I always have this tension on my head/scalp, like my brain is sort of burning.
 
Op

OP - Brother I hear you. Don't over analyse. Life is beautiful, stop worrying about what damage you may have caused. Travel, get fit, learn something new, do good in the world. Realize you are a spiritual being , not a body. Get out there in the world, explore, give something back, breath deeply, ignore your thoughts, meditate. Listen to Mooji - Peace
 
I think that there is a possibility that brain damage and mental trauma are separate but inter-related issues that people can confuse when talking about MDMA abuse. I had a ten year stint with MDMA that eventually led to several years of abuse. The final shout for me was at a rave where I was having a seemingly normal albeit high dose experience on some random E pills when suddenly without warning the experience went full on psychedelic for a brief moment and I was plunged into the deepest, darkest abyss you could imagine and I was overcome by a feeling of being in the wrong place at the wrong time in a life that was spiralling out of control. It was so intense and so dark that something inside of me died in that moment. I lost my spark for life and headed into a world of anxiety and depression with no feelings of interest in life or any type of creativity left in me. After months and even a year of recovery the deadness persisted and I had resigned myself that it was gone forever and I would always be a shell of my former self. I just soldiered on and get engaging in life and it was a miracle for me at around the two year mark when I realized what seemed almost overnight I had rebounded to my pre-ecstasy abuse connection to life. Maybe I'm splitting hairs here, but for me I don't see my experience as damage from MDMA abuse but rather the repercussions of an overwhelmingly intense experience while on MDMA. I think MDMA recovery has little to do with actual neurotoxicity related effects but is a complex and multi-faceted recovery from mental trauma that happened while on MDMA but that may have little or nothing to do with the actual MDMA itself.

I find in discussions with other drug abusers that it's quite common to have that "one time" where everything "went sideways" which acted as a catalyst for people to begin recovery which is one of the reasons I started to view MDMA associated problems as more psychological in nature instead of some type of organic brain damage.
 
It is very unlikely this has been caused by you using MDMA on 3 or so occasions.
It would probably have happened anyway and blaming yourself for taking a couple of pills
Is wrong. Your just unfortunate enough to suffer anxiety. Physiologically we have changed little
In 10000 years but social pressure as rocketed in modern times and our poor brains can't keep
Up. I have used MDMA in the past a lot more than you I might add. I too suffered from quite bad
Anxiety around the age of 27. I know there is a family history of it and that generation weren't popping
Pills. I'm not naive and think it probably didn't help. But the drugs didn't cause it.
There is help, I got prescribed fluoxetine and it saved my ass. They do work and give you your life back.
 
Drinking 13 or 14 beers and then taking 3 pills of so-called MDMA is irresponsible - you'll find in early days of Rave only water was sold at the Raves because alcohol and MDMA do not mix. In my experience alcohol will cancel out the positive effect of MDMA - perhaps what you took was not 100% pure, or cut with other drugs or perhaps the 1/2 pill you took the day after wasn't pure( could have been mixed with Ketamine/Amphetamine)! If you smoke cannabis stop this as it will aggravate these symptoms you have!
 
vancbc said:
I think that there is a possibility that brain damage and mental trauma are separate but inter-related issues that people can confuse when talking about MDMA abuse. I had a ten year stint with MDMA that eventually led to several years of abuse. The final shout for me was at a rave where I was having a seemingly normal albeit high dose experience on some random E pills when suddenly without warning the experience went full on psychedelic for a brief moment and I was plunged into the deepest, darkest abyss you could imagine and I was overcome by a feeling of being in the wrong place at the wrong time in a life that was spiralling out of control. It was so intense and so dark that something inside of me died in that moment. I lost my spark for life and headed into a world of anxiety and depression with no feelings of interest in life or any type of creativity left in me. After months and even a year of recovery the deadness persisted and I had resigned myself that it was gone forever and I would always be a shell of my former self. I just soldiered on and get engaging in life and it was a miracle for me at around the two year mark when I realized what seemed almost overnight I had rebounded to my pre-ecstasy abuse connection to life. Maybe I'm splitting hairs here, but for me I don't see my experience as damage from MDMA abuse but rather the repercussions of an overwhelmingly intense experience while on MDMA. I think MDMA recovery has little to do with actual neurotoxicity related effects but is a complex and multi-faceted recovery from mental trauma that happened while on MDMA but that may have little or nothing to do with the actual MDMA itself.

I find in discussions with other drug abusers that it's quite common to have that "one time" where everything "went sideways" which acted as a catalyst for people to begin recovery which is one of the reasons I started to view MDMA associated problems as more psychological in nature instead of some type of organic brain damage.
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I couldn't have written it better myself. I totally agree.

I'm also very glad to hear you've regained your pre-MDMA state. I think rediscovering yourself is a huge step here, not to mention most of these abusers are in their early twenties or late teens, which is when life is changing the most, and when most mental illnesses come to surface.
 
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