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Lysergamides [LSD Subthread] Extremely High Doses & Receptor Saturation

^rofl.

i find around 1mg to be my limit. i cant even imagine anything beyond that. o_O
 
I've done 1000 and 1500 ug doses and don't think I could differentiate between the two. Personally I see no reason to go above 600-750 mics - pretty much at plateau by then.

As far as this whole "thumb printing" business goes, as far as I can see it only comes from chinacat and a few of his fluffers. He has hundreds of stories, lotsa contradictions ("Only a sacred few were allowed the thumb print ritual" then on other occasions he's known literally hundreds of people who safely survived a thumb print.)

And then some of it just nonsense. Like the Oakland story. He laid 50000 hits in front of a guy he did not know well. Then was going to give some crystal to his buddy to take home so he just dumped it out on the table. Then strange guy thumb printed himself from the pile and began to freak. Chinacat freaked and threw the trays, crystal, and 50000 hits outta the hotel window because he was afraid someone would call the cops?

First of all, lay 50000 hits in front of strange person? Right. This guy supposedly did this shit for years and stayed outta jail. Then give some crystal to your buddy - not in another vial, but dump it out on a hotel room table. Then do what? Scrape it into something else with your credit card? Then toss all the shit? Uhh. Right. Assuming any part of this really happened, why not just grab the trays, the sheets, the vials in 5 minutes, put them in your backpack, leave someone to babysit, and split immediately with goods and take a cab to another hotel?

And all these "close calls" - always a comment that he made it through because of the "protective kind karma of the thumb print family".

Get real folks. Use some common sense. I doubt anyone even does the kind of utterly stupid shit, much less does it for years without getting busted that this claims to have done.

Personally I've been going to Dead family shows for almost three decades. The last time I saw a show was three days ago - taped Phil Lesh up in Philly.

I've known hundreds of deadheads, still meeting new ones. Don't know about the Rainbow Family , but I am the Dead Family - the real family about going to shows, taping the shows, lotsa of other things that make us Family, but not thumb printing LSD. In all my years, and all my many acquaintances, I never met anyone who had done a thumb print, or for that matter anyone who had every heard of anyone who had done a thumb print.

If you think it is cool or glamorous or exciting and you really just want yourself to believe it;s true, hey be a heady kind believer in the kind heady protective karma of the holy thumbprinted ones whose counts apparently range from the sacred few to hundreds depending on who you ask, no wait depending on the story the same person happens to be telling at the time. BY all means, enjoy the story.

My own opinion? The "thumb print" is a total crock of shit.
 
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Can anyone actually confirm that the thumb print story originates with chinacat? I didn't think it did.
 
Can anyone confirm anything about the whole thumb print story?

Not saying it has never have been done, just saying that I don't think it was exactly the brotherhood as it has been presented of people associated with Dead tours and LSD.

And china cat seems to have a lot of outrageous anecdotes, and although I used to know guys who got shitloads of sheets of what you saw on the tour, they were always mailed pre-dipped from the west coats, not laid by amateurs in seedy Oakland hotel rooms. I know they never did any thumb prints and I personally have never met anyone who was part of the Dead "family" who has done it much less even heard of it being done.
 
I don't think anyone who was involved in thumbprints/crystal distribution/et cetera would be wise to admit to this on a public forum. This thread was originally about thumbprints and I shut it because I don't think it's a discussion we need to be having. Let's please steer away from this angle of discussion. Thank you. We now return to our regularly scheduled programming.

Very high dose LSD. My highest dose was about 5mg, accidentally consumed out of a vial (8)). I did not notice many subjective effects that were different from lower dose LSD, to tell you the truth, other than an obvious increase in intensity...honestly, though, I can't really tell you if it felt "fifty times" stronger than 1 hit, or "five time" stronger than ten hits ... I mean, needless to say, I was pretty damn spun. I know this is not the most helpful anecdote, so I'll retreat back from this thread now. :)
 
My apologies to get off topic, it just bothers me that so many people seem to not critically question some pretty questionable and often contradictory allegations.

I have to agree. As I said, I don't think I could differentiate between 1000 and 1500 ug and see no advantage of dosages beyond the 1000 ug range.
 
Well, the original topic of the thread was: Why do some people (other than chinacat!) report different subjective effects from very high dose LSD (10-50mg), when in theory, subjective effects should be more or less the same after ~1-1.5mg.
 
I think to do a valid study you would have to remove the "set" aspect of set and setting. Give a group 1000ugs in a setting. Then later give part of the same group say 5000 ugs in the same setting without prior knowledge that they were actually given 5000 ugs.

Without that foreknowledge, I cannot definitively say what the results would be. But my hunch is that without the knowledge of the higher dosage you might not see dramatically different responses.

Just a hunch. Too bad this kind of research is generally not available.
 
^Well, I don't know that 5mg counts as "very high dose". I'm talking about very high doses. As in 10+mg. Anyway, I was just looking to see if anybody had any theories as to why this might be the case other than set.
 
The only reason I made the effort to track down some crystalline LSD was to obseve it piezoluminecse (it emits light when subjected to pressure much like a lot of crystal produce an electric charge when compressed), but before the person who had it brought it out, I had donned a pair of safety glasses, a respiratory mask and latex gloves as I had no desire to be inadvertantly dosed should any accidentally become airbourne during the crushing process.

As it was, it was a fine powder, not crystalline so I'm still yet to see the phenomenon! :(


And china cat seems to have a lot of outrageous anecdotes... it just bothers me that so many people seem to not critically question some pretty questionable and often contradictory allegations.
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If it was concerning just about any other topic, drug related or otherwise, a lot of people would instantly decide it was utter bollocks, but for some reason a lot of otherwise sensible people get caught up in the whole mystico-bullshit aspect of LSD mythology
 
Well, I don't know that 5mg counts as "very high dose". I'm talking about very high doses. As in 10+mg. Anyway, I was just looking to see if anybody had any theories as to why this might be the case other than set.
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I think 5mg is a pretty fucking high dose, considering that it is active at 50-100 ug. I'd never venture that high--not due to perturbation about physical danger, just because I would be too afraid of wasting such a rare chemical (if spaced out, that's at least 10 decent trips...enough to last many moons).

But at least I can believe 5mg, whereas stories of people (like our asian feline friend) consuming 35-50mg seem like bullshit. When people are really tripping, I would imagine that a couple of mgs can easily turn into "a couple dozen mgs," like a psychedelic fish story.
 
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My highest dose was ~1.5mg. Just drank the remainder of a vial (~12 drops @ 125mics/drop).

Biggest difference i noticed to lower dose trips was the auditory hallucinations. Much more pronounced & distinct than on lower doses.
Visuals/hallucinations were not much different from a 800mic dose for me.
I think my 5HT2a receptors become saturated at around 800mics.
I've only had a handful of trips above this dose but i've had much more intense trips on 400/500mics.
Quantity is nothing. Set & setting is everything. Obey your set & setting! =D
 
^ any negative physical effects - bodyload & etc. Folks talk about histaminergic effects - any ideas what this means?
 
^^ i could atually feel the lsd running through every vein in my body. It was an unbelievably wierd sensation.
 
DMT4Blood said:
My highest dose was ~1.5mg. Just drank the remainder of a vial (~12 drops @ 125mics/drop).

Biggest difference i noticed to lower dose trips was the auditory hallucinations. Much more pronounced & distinct than on lower doses.
Visuals/hallucinations were not much different from a 800mic dose for me.
I think my 5HT2a receptors become saturated at around 800mics.
I've only had a handful of trips above this dose but i've had much more intense trips on 400/500mics.
Quantity is nothing. Set & setting is everything. Obey your set & setting! =D
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Interesting


& Definitely - tho I wouldn't go so far as to say quantity was "nothing"
 
DMT4Blood said:
^^ i could atually feel the lsd running through every vein in my body. It was an unbelievably wierd sensation.
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I LOVE that feeling it's really tremendous :) Like an electrical charge moving around your body I particularly feel it in the mouth & tongue - not surprising considering the amount of nerve endings in the tongue.
 
There are many other receptors LSD interacts with, to a smaller scale, namely the dopamine receptors.
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Iv tripped face on many a substance while on suboxone, what would the difference be? Im unsure their is any.
 
^ In my opinion (& several others I've talked to), opiates cause a form of emotional blunting that detracts from the experience


any negative physical effects - bodyload & etc. Folks talk about histaminergic effects - any ideas what this means?
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As in the sort of effects produced when histamine is releasd in your body eg rash, extreme itchyness - think hayfever etc along with things like gastric discomfort.

Not a desired state of affairs if you've just eaten enough LSD to put you in orbit around Neptune...
 
Not a pharmacologist, but my uneducated guess would be this is a highly individual reaction. I am not prone to allergies from pollen or bee stings. OTOH, a small mosquito bite, and I have not an itchy bump but literally a welt that can persist for days. (bot sure if that is wholly a histamine response though(.

At 1500 mics I observed no adverse histamine characteristic reactions.
 
The affinity for the histamine receptors is the lowest of the major ones LSD goes for. I can't remember the figures, but I think 50% occupancy requires a plasma level that equates to aprox a dose of 5mg+


That might also be way out, best to check yourself
 
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