Kratom Withdrawal

I used about 30-40g very high quality Kratom per day over the last month´s, I take Kratom since 2013 at first only amounts of about 10-15g per day which slowly increased over 15-25 up to 30-40g.

Over the last half year I also took about 1g U47700 every 1-2 month´s, usually just about 10-20mg per day. If I went out of it but had enough Kratom I even felt somehow better psychologically, I just didn´t have that heavy body feeling but with enough Kratom it was no problem.

I also take Phenibut since 2013, starting at about 1-2g per day which increased to 3-4g over the last years.

Now I went out of Kratom this week for the first time since I used the 30-40g doses, when I "only" took 20-30g I could quite easily replace it with U47700 for 2-3 days if I didn´t had enough money in the last days of the month or if the order came too late. But now even a combination of U4, Tramadol, Phenibut and Pyrazolam somehow doesn´t cut the withdrawal from the Kratom, for example today when I woke up I drank at first 2 cups of light coffee (I´m a very heavy coffee drinker too, usually 3-4 cups when waking up and then every half to one hour another cup over the day and also into the evening), 1g Phenibut, 50mg Tramadol and about 5mg U4 in each cup of coffee. I didn´t felt too bad but it just doesn´t stop the "hot"/fever like body feeling of the Kratom wd which is my biggest problem, I don´t have any flu like symptoms or something else, just that annoying hot feeling which stops me from doing anything at all besides sitting in front of my computer.

Now I have taken all in all since 9:30 25mg U47700, 1,8g Phenibut, 100mg Tramadol XR and 0,5mg Pyrazolam. I feel ok but have still that annoying heat feeling. The only time it really stopped was yesterday when I had about 60-75mg U4, 4,5g Phenibut, 400mg Tramadol and about 2-4mg Pyrazolam over the day, but the "heat" only stopped in the evening when I took 30mg of the total amount of U4 I used that day in a short time along with 150mg Tramadol and 1mg Pyrazolam.

Has anyone else experienced those hot/fever like wd symptoms from Kratom? Why doesn´t an opioid as strong as U4 along with all the other stuff stop the withdrawal completely? 1 year ago I could easily switch from my 20-30g Kratom per day to 300-400mg Tramadol without any problems. Tramadol sometimes also induces a bit of an uncomfortable feeling in the first hours before the metabolites kick in, could it be that this potentiates the hot feeling? But when I drank the first cup of coffee with 5mg U4 in the morning a also had almost the same fever symptoms.
 
Oh man. That is quite the habit. I'm sorry your not feeling well man. That last 48 hours have been rough for me too. All the classic opiate withdrawal symptoms, except for nausea/vomiting. Thank God I don't have that. I caved today and took 15 g of red bali. Just needed some relief. I rly hope it doesn't set me back to square one... Does anyone have experience with this? I rly want to be off the stuff. I was going to NA meetings for 8 months and working a solid program before I got sucked into Kratom the last month. I'm depressed af and just want my "normal" self back. I hate being a slave to any substance just to feel normal.
I don't plan on taking any more Kratom, just going to ride it out with some gabapentin and seroquel for sleep. I can't smoke weed or do benzos because I'm on probation and get ua's a lot. Any helpful comments/support is most welcome.
 
Oh man. That is quite the habit. I'm sorry your not feeling well man. That last 48 hours have been rough for me too. All the classic opiate withdrawal symptoms, except for nausea/vomiting. Thank God I don't have that. I caved today and took 15 g of red bali. Just needed some relief. I rly hope it doesn't set me back to square one... Does anyone have experience with this? I rly want to be off the stuff. I was going to NA meetings for 8 months and working a solid program before I got sucked into Kratom the last month. I'm depressed af and just want my "normal" self back. I hate being a slave to any substance just to feel normal.
I don't plan on taking any more Kratom, just going to ride it out with some gabapentin and seroquel for sleep. I can't smoke weed or do benzos because I'm on probation and get ua's a lot. Any helpful comments/support is most welcome.

Lopermide helps wonders with Kratom withdrawal, just one or two of them. Your gasatrointestinal tract has opiate receptors as well. Don't try to cross the BBB because it's only been reported by few users to have done so, i've personally tried it and felt no different effects than if I took one or two, taking more also didn't seem to block me out as one would assume. It blew my mind when I found out the gastrointestinal had opiate receptors, it can almost make small withdrawals managable it's almost euphoric releif when you dont feel the need to go to the bathroom and wipe every 15-20 minutes.

Doesn't kratom have a ceiling? for instance taking 20 grams of the plant isn't going to get you anymore lit than 15 grams, you'd end up puking trying to reach desired effects, unless you're just taking it for phychological reasons, it really puts my head where it needs to be when I am craving dope or even just having a crappy start to the day.


Gabapentin is great, it's always done better for me when I space the dosages out every thirty minutes, first initial dose with food. I strongly recommend you read about this before trying it, there is potential for abuse and dependecy there as well, which are not fun.

Last little bit of advice, a hydrated user of Kratom will most definitely have less severe withdrawal symptoms than the dehydrated one, common sense to most but it's really easy to forget to drink when you're in the state you're in.
 
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Lopermide helps wonders with Kratom withdrawal, just one or two of them.

Do you mean to say that lope helps with other symptoms as well not just GI issues? I've heard that lope rly helps with opiate withdrawal in general, and when i took it once when i was kicking H cold turkey it did seem to help me out a little bit. Some people say its a life-saver for w/d. As for the gabapentin, iv been prescibed it for anxiety which it rly doesnt do much for, 600 mg, twice a day. and i have noticed that if i go to far between doses (sometimes i forget to take it) i get SEVERE anxiety/sweating. so, im going to start tapering myself down slowly after i get thru this w/d.

anyways, its been 10 hours since i took that 15 grams of bali and i only feel a litle sweaty but its very minor. it seems i havent been set back too much which i was worried it would do because i know if u go score some smack 48 hours into withdrawal, it just put u back at square one for beginning withdrawal all over again. I will go get some lope in the morning and take some jsut to be safe because i have to work a part day tomorrow and i need to function lol. thank you very much for the helpful advice PoisonDuban. I really appreciate it bro. hope ur feeling better.
 
Loperamide will definitely help with coming off Kratom, just use it only when you need it. Also some low dose DXM will really help as well. I used both of those successfully when I finally let go of my UEI addiction a few years ago.
 
what dose of dxm would you reccomend? and what dose of lope to start off with? thank you very much for your help. it is much appreciated.
 
It varies from person to person, I would try 80 mgs Lope and 150-200 mgs DXM to start. The key is to start low and increase slowly until you find relief or your sweet spot. You do not want to go too high too fast, I made that mistake and it is not pleasant, good luck and let me know if I can be of more assistance.
 
Is there any proof that the excess loperamide beyond the recommended dose will be any better than taking maybe 2-5 of them?
Not sure how much it takes to fill the receptors in your GI tract, but I got relief on a pretty big opiate addiction, and when I took 2 of them it relieved my feeling of running to the bathroom every few minutes which is a big part of w/d to be taken care of to make it easier on the user, almost makes you happy in w/d when it kicks in and your stomach is feeling normal.

I've taken uncounted handful amount on another attempt at detox and got the same relief as I did with only taking two.

I know that taking excess doesn't make you any more constipated than taking the recommended dose, at least in my experience and most others I've read.
 
Do you mean to say that lope helps with other symptoms as well not just GI issues?.

It might create a placebo like effect once you get stomach relief, making the user happier, I haven't seen any proof that it's going to ease any other symptoms. If there is i'd be interested in knowing.


I am doing much better today thanks for asking, it was a rough one man.
 
I also have finally to admit, that I am addicted to Kratom. I am currently on 8g daily (not a high dose for some of you but still probamatically if you take it for a long time, which is the case for me right now, but it has to end asap).

I started it as self medicated pain treatment for a serious injury, which involved a fracture and which symptoms come and go in waves (but the waves got less and less over the last years). My plan is to taper 1g every week from now on until I am down to 1g daily (plain leaf) and then I look how I proceed. So in 2 months (The 1st of september) I want to be down to 1 g daily (let's say 0.25g * 4 each day).

I will write about problems and probably aids, that can help others to overcome their addictions (I see myself as a stim addict rather than a opioid addict but I may be wrong, the next week will tell everything about the character of my addiction).

I wish any bluelighter luck with overcoming their own addictions and want to add : You just have to believe in the strength of your own spirit. Dig deep into meditation (and the proper postures) and anything, that is related to moderation of desire (of the the *!ego!*) can be achieved, I am certain of that. I will apply those techniques myself, which I ignored for the last months, what I consider as the main reason for my slip into addiction territory.

Good luck to anybody ! We can make it.

Ziiirp
 
I'm wishing you the best of luck Ziiirp. I've started and went into that free fall of no taper and that isn't working. I am so lost. So lost. I've read most of this thread and I am so grateful to those who have contributed to the information on how they've managed. I love opiates, the feeling of well being. I grew up percolated in fear soup and grief (mom died in front of my brother and I when I was 4) and although I think I'm not a success, I haven't fallen into the things my brothers did. (Murder and child abuse.) I am a success if you set me next to them, but in my mind I'm a huge failure. I've been married for 31 years to a wonderful man and unfortunately he doesn't understand any of this. So I find myself very isolated and without the support I need. I am going to sit down and structure a plan but I think I actually need to go to the doctor and get a physical done and see where I'm at on certain issues.


I am wishing all of you good luck in this, and my hopes that we can all get to where we'd like to be. For me that would be a kratom, nicotine and caffeine free life. I have a progressive illness and not a lot of time left to get it right....
 
@Schobski86 - I am doing better, thanks a lot for asking. I hope you are doing better as well.

My Kratom leftovers went to the trash 2 weeks ago and stayed there. I haven't gone back nor I intend to. While my WDs are pretty much gone, I've experienced sever constipation (after about a week). I guess Kratom has given me a good-bye gift - a goddamn fissure! And this thing is hell! I am still recovering (I read it could takes weeks/months for some it takes years and in some cases, you need to a surgery to get it fixed), I lost more than a week of work for this ongoing episode... really sucks, but I am trying to be positive, I know I am getting better, I know it'll (eventually) make me stronger. For sure it made me smarter.
I am thankful for the fact that I don't have cravings and the thought of taking some now actually terrifies me. I am also thankful for not going thru the same WDs like others in this forum (especially those who suffered WDs of stronger opiates).

For everyone who's getting off this stuff - stay strong! I know it's very hard for some to quit, some need this to be able to go thru the day. But if you decide to quit - make sure you don't have more to take (either finish what you have or throw it away). For those who can taper down - be careful, it's very easy to give yourself a break 'just this time'...

I found myself focusing on the bad WDs (when I was going thru these) and I am just terrified to feel like shit (that's an understatement) again. The constipation and the fissure are here to remind me that Kratom isn't some harmless leaf, it could be dangerous if you abuse it, And we can all agree that humans are abusive in nature.

I wish you all the best!
 
I am thankful for the fact that I don't have cravings and the thought of taking some now actually terrifies me.

Try to keep this in mind as long as possible. I know how it feels after WD. At this moment you hate Kratom but cravings could come back. Be prepared and stay strong. Good luck! <3
 
Try to keep this in mind as long as possible. I know how it feels after WD. At this moment you hate Kratom but cravings could come back. Be prepared and stay strong. Good luck!
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Thank you @ Kauna. I'll keep that in mind. I know that life after crawl back slowly. But I'm keeping myself busy. Work, gym, hobbies, gaming, hiking, family etc. I keep my days busy and when I don't have anything do to, I play my drums or watch a movie on Amazon/Netflix/Whatever.
And I don't know if you ever had fissure... I shit you now - that's the most horrible pain I've ever had. I read I am not the only person who suffers from this after Kratom abuse. And the pain is just too much to do this to myself again.
 
@Schobski86 - I am doing better, thanks a lot for asking. I hope you are doing better as well.

My Kratom leftovers went to the trash 2 weeks ago and stayed there. I haven't gone back nor I intend to. While my WDs are pretty much gone, I've experienced sever constipation (after about a week). I guess Kratom has given me a good-bye gift - a goddamn fissure! And this thing is hell! I am still recovering (I read it could takes weeks/months for some it takes years and in some cases, you need to a surgery to get it fixed), I lost more than a week of work for this ongoing episode... really sucks, but I am trying to be positive, I know I am getting better, I know it'll (eventually) make me stronger. For sure it made me smarter.
I am thankful for the fact that I don't have cravings and the thought of taking some now actually terrifies me. I am also thankful for not going thru the same WDs like others in this forum (especially those who suffered WDs of stronger opiates).

For everyone who's getting off this stuff - stay strong! I know it's very hard for some to quit, some need this to be able to go thru the day. But if you decide to quit - make sure you don't have more to take (either finish what you have or throw it away). For those who can taper down - be careful, it's very easy to give yourself a break 'just this time'...

I found myself focusing on the bad WDs (when I was going thru these) and I am just terrified to feel like shit (that's an understatement) again. The constipation and the fissure are here to remind me that Kratom isn't some harmless leaf, it could be dangerous if you abuse it, And we can all agree that humans are abusive in nature.

I wish you all the best!

How much did you take before cold turkey ? Did you take opiates/opioids before ? Thanks for the info.
 
I just weighed my usual dose (that is taken as desired) and it is about 0.7g. I try to downregulate those doses instead of the overall daily dose.
 
@Ziiirp - My daily average dose was about 4grams. But sometimes (not too often) I'd take 8-12 grams throughout the day (morning, afternoon + evening). I could go for a week or two taking this dosage, especially when life wasn't so great and some depression kicked in. But I never went more than two weeks. I never thought Kratom was addictive and I never made the connection of physical symptoms (chills mostly) to my Kratom consumption. I just thought my body is getting old and weird and it'll pass.

It's been about a month since my WDs and I am still not 100%, I am close, but still feel some symptoms I am pretty sure relate to my Kratom consumption.

I haven't taken any opiates/opioids in my life, Kratom is the hardest drug I've ever used (besides pot). I am trying to stay healthy, watch what I eat, I work out etc.

Stay strong man!
 
@Ziiirp - My daily average dose was about 4grams. But sometimes (not too often) I'd take 8-12 grams throughout the day (morning, afternoon + evening). I could go for a week or two taking this dosage, especially when life wasn't so great and some depression kicked in. But I never went more than two weeks. I never thought Kratom was addictive and I never made the connection of physical symptoms (chills mostly) to my Kratom consumption. I just thought my body is getting old and weird and it'll pass.

It's been about a month since my WDs and I am still not 100%, I am close, but still feel some symptoms I am pretty sure relate to my Kratom consumption.

I haven't taken any opiates/opioids in my life, Kratom is the hardest drug I've ever used (besides pot). I am trying to stay healthy, watch what I eat, I work out etc.

Stay strong man!
Have you tried taking stem & vein powder?? Its the bottom of the plant, it doesnt get you high, but it virtually relieves all kratom WD symptoms.

The worst part for me AFA kratom WD symptoms are concerned is the restless legs and sleepless nights. S&V powder relieves all of that, so you can get a good nights sleep!
 
I would like to add to this thread. It's gonna be lengthy... forewarned lol
I have created a serious habit and am on day 5 without kratom

Background: I struggle with chronic pain from a congenital defect, causing bone on bone contact in the sacral joint from an extra vertebra; that's the best I can describe it, I've seen so many doctors with varying opinions...
As well as degenerative disc disease and bulging discs. Suffer from a lot of myalgia between the shoulder blades. The sacral issue causes constant pain, in all positions. I'm constantly shifty or standing.
I work a professional job (not a knock to anyone that doesn't), live a fairly normal life and just want to function without excessive pain.

On to the drugs! =D
I have a hx of opiate abuse, heroin and all the others basically. Been clean about a decade, 8 years of that was continuous in NA. The pain increased over the years and I also developed a serious case of ibs, which I believe to be ibd due to Sx severity, age of onset, and presentation.
This, in conjunction with the chronic back pain led me to seek opioid therapy from doctors. I was shuffled around and basically told that I'm too young or my MRI's don't indicate the level of pain I'm expressing. I was given minimal narcotics but treated like a junkie and eventually every one stopped prescribing.

I found kratom. it changed my life. I have been using kratom daily for 2 years almost exactly. I have always stuckto red bali, or something similar, from one reputable vendor with quality products.
When I started I was using 7g doses twice daily, no days off. Somewhere in there, 6 months in or so, the effects lessened due to tolerance increase. Since then I've been ingesting at least an ounce/day, usually about 40g and over the last year I've used dxm regularly for potentiation in therapeutic doses; and for it's pain killing and anti inflammatory effects.
My timeline is hazy but over the past year at least my day was 12-15g upon waking, another 5-10g midday, and 12-15g evening. Sometimes doses up to 18g.

over the past 2 months or so it's as if the effects have turned on me; no change in product or supplier. I have begun to experience anxiety after dosing. An inability to regulate body temperature; this has lead to excessive sweating and fluctuations in body temp regularly. I look like a fucking sweaty pale ghost half the time sitting at the conference table hoping no one notices how ill I am.
The scariest part is that I started to almost feel trapped in the effects. The withdrawal symptoms began to present within 2 hours of dosing, so I'd take more. This caused excessive nausea, but if I didn't take it i would become completely unable to function within an hour or so. I began to dislike how it altered my personality and absolutely controlled my life. I also started to experience severe memory impairment and was just an ass hole to my wife, which isn't me.

Back to the pain. I still believe in, and feel my quality of life is better with opioids on board. therefore this, in conjunction with the now obvious crippling side effects and withdrawal symptoms kratom is producing daily, I've decided to quit and engage in pain management through a clinic as opposed to primary care. I was never willing to take a drug test before, therefore I never initiated services with an actual pain mgmt clinic. I am now a patient of one and they just so happen to test for kratom; this i found out after providing a UA, cuz i did not ask like an idiot. I have a follow up in a month.

My last dose of kratom was 10/1/17. Luckily I had about 150mg hydrocodone and used this to simultaneously jump off kratom at once (more alkaloids present and pharmacological action than only mu agonism), and down titrate my opioid dose by taking a small amount, much less than the equipotent kratom dose I'm used to 3x daily. I have ingested hydrocodone daily since 10/2 and took my last dose 7 hours ago.

There have been noticeable withdrawal effects all week while using small amounts of hydrocodone. It's clear I'm detoxing and have been experiencing classic symptoms, though minor due to conservative hydrocodone use.

As stated, I'm now 7 hours post last hydrocodone dose and beginning to feel the actual opioid withdrawal symptoms setting in. Nothing new, I've kicked a heavy H habit a few times, but still is not fun and is very real.

This thread has been very helpful in making the decision to quit kratom finally. It also really highlights just how serious a kratom dependency can be if abused or used chronically in a medicinal manner; our brains know no difference!

Thanks to everyone who has contributed.

~AS
 
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^^^ thanks for posting.

You're a classic case of someone who's abused kratom, instead of using kratom.
Thats not meant to be judgemental or to put you down, it is what it is.

When you get to the tolerance point where you were at, its vital that a user takes a 2 to 4 week break from kratom just to reset tolerance. After that you're good to go for another 6 months or so
 
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