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Injecting Extracts

psychetool, it is pretty obvious that it might be safe to shoot psilocybin crystals in a close to pure form, however, this kid(and large percentage of people) do not posses the skills and knowledge to extract pure psilocybin. With that said he is talking about 'shroom tea'. Here is the evidence...

"Boiling mushrooms would destroy some alkaloids. I would not boil them, I would put them in water that was recently boiled. Psilosin/cybin do not instantly break down in heat, but rather, they deteriorate quicker in oxygen and heat, the hotter the quicker the deterioration. So I would soon ingest/IV the solution after the mushrooms have been exposed to heat."

" was considering however, to make a mushroom tea as described, using very little water and perhaps just one stem. Strain shroom a few times, and use a cotton filter while loading the syringe. Inject IV and see if any effects."

See, it's pretty fucking clear that he's asking about the tea not a pure form, otherwise he would inquire about the procedure to isolate the psilocybin(which is not done by boiling and straining).

As for the heroin thing, please tell me where heroin was mentioned in this thread, you can't cause it wasn't, it's not part of this argument, so your point is not valid.

As for placing judgement on this guy, search all his posts, they contain nothing but misinformation and ignorance, he said "there was nothing wrong about IVing APAP" in another thread. The reason why i'm passionate about this debate is in my 3+ years i've never seen such moronic questions and answers by anyone(and there have been many trolls here), this guy is worse than epharmacy. It's simple, if you ask if shooting shroom tea is safe and almost everyone except you say that it's not then you post that your gonna try it anyway:

"I think what would happen if I tried to IV mushrooms this way is that I probably wouldn't feel anything, given that there may not be enough psilocyin in the syringe to create a trip. Who knows. I'm considering doing this though sometime soon."

If you don't think that that's plain dumb then your plain wrong. psychetool, I respect you as you have contributed to this community, but this guy has not he has set us back, and i'm wondering why your sticking up for him.

Basically, if the question from the begining was "can i iv a pure form of psilocybin?" then there would be no discussion as that would be safe, however, he did not ask that question, he asked if he could bang shroom tea. It's all plain and simple, do me a favor read through his posts and tell me this guy isn't plain stupid and it pisses me off when amongst inteliigent drug discussion this guy comes with this garbage and reenforces the brain dead druggie stereotype. If you want to make this a serious discussion respond to every point each side has and not omit the shit i'm clearly right about and don't bring up shit that has nothing to do with this debate i.e. heroin.

Edit: You mentioned that the extraction can be done "easily", maybe if your a Czechoslovakian scientist or Shulgin, even Shulgin says "Efficient extraction apparently requires patience." You and me both know this kid doesn't have what it takes to do an efficient extraction. Also Shulgin isn't even sure if the crystals are pure, he just guesses that they are as said here.

"As to the identity of the crystals that were drifting around in the cooled Soxhlet receiver, from their being insoluble in ethanol, and white, and transparent, I would guess that you are seeing pure psilocybin."

So not only is the extraction a whole process but then IVing what may or may not be pure is just dangerous and stupid to attempt escpessially by this kid. Also, can you tell me why just eating the shrooms isn't satisfactory, and have you(psychtool and Creative) ever IVed psycadelics it's not something everyone can handle.
 
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God damnit twice I made huge replies and both times it says "you aren't logged in or you posted in a read-only post". Ignore that last comment, out of frustration.

Basically, if the question from the begining was "can i iv a pure form of psilocybin?" then there would be no discussion as that would be safe,
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YES THAT IS CLOSE TO THE QUESTION! GENUIS! PAY ATTENTION TO THE THREAD! The question was Can I IV pure *desirable isolated compound of choice* succesfully. NOT how to go about isolating the compounds (though that could be related in advancing this subject). That may not be the exact words, but that IS the question.

I ask mushroom tea as it's simple and I do not see how it would bring catastrophic results if I were to filter it, and cotton filter it, plenty of times. Say having the shroom in a tea bag, using 1/2 oz hot water, using a coffee filter to filter it, and then a cotton filter before being sucked into the syringe. Perhaps some undesirables will make their way into it, but acceptable levels I would assume.

You guys are saying this is ridiculous. You do not point out exactly why, but let me try to make a stab. You are saying it's ridiculous because there must be a water soluble poison in magic mushrooms, that is INSOLUBLE in ethanol, that when orally or rectally or sublingually administered, it is 100% destroyed, yet if IV'd it would cause harmful effects?

I can see no way this extra-filtered mushroom tea would be harmful. There is no oils in it. Not any solids big enough to cause damage. Perhaps very miniscule amounts, but on par with the solids that don't dissolve with successful heroin or cocaine or crack slams done.

And how do you know what resources I have and the time I have? Gee your good.

This thread could easily be changed to about slamming salvinorin A or mescaline. The question is just the posilibity of shooting desirable isolated compounds. So far, we have crossed THC as it's an oil and therefore impossible to isolate into a shootable solution. But why can't these other chemicals be injected? Mushrooms just seem to be the topic at hand as it's something we can focus this question on.
 
sorry, but no matter how much you clean up your mushroom tea through 'filtering' (especially through such primitive methods such as a COFFEE FILTER) it will not be safe to inject. Just extract an ounce of cubies, use the pure crystals, and give us the results.

BTW : Many animal trials were done with THC injected IV, but it is very hard to get the chemical to a 'shootable' state. It *is* possible if you have the right equipment and know-how.
 
Why exactly would it be unsafe to inject this primitive extraction? Psilocybin/sin is water soluble, and there is no horribly bad agitants or poisons in mushrooms that provide harmful results. Or would it be better to do the same extraction using ethanol instead, then diluting the final product with water as high percentage of ethanol will hurt veins?

I would like a very specific answer to this regarding the chemistry of such a product. If no big chunks are in it, and no known water-soluble alcohol-insoluble agitants/poisons that are immediately and 100% removed by non-needle administrations, what's the problem?

Or should I do this, but instead, IM it? Or SC it?

I think that if I did this it would just end up not being concentrated enough and strong enough, and the crystals, then mixed with water, would be a much more effective way.
 
It seems utter madness that you're carrying on with this idea. I do actually think you're a troll now.

If you do decide to inject your mushroom juice, after filtering it through cotton and coffee filters, then you will die.

Your body will create antibodies to what you've injected, called immunoglobins, which will relax blood vessels and cause swelling and narrowing of airways. You will hope to experience such delights as fainting, unconsciousness, low blood pressure, hives, itching, swelling and of course unconsciousness; a severe allergic reaction. All of this will be going on while you're tripping your balls off. Anapyhlactic shock will most likely result in your death.

Sound good? If so, try it.

I think the strength of your "juice" would probably be the last problem you're facing with this little project. Something far more urgent springs to mind, such as researching for yourself what happens when you introduce something like, oh, I don't know, a fungus directly into your bloodstream!

This is something I wouldn't even try. The thought of choking to death while peaking on a psychedelic just somehow puts me off. Really.

Crystals, yes. Pure psilocybin crystals, yes! Poorly filtered mushroom "juice", no.

"Anyphylaxis is a severe and rapid allergic systemic reaction to contact with an allergenic trigger substance (atopic or anaphylactic hypersensitivity). Minute amounts of trigger substances may cause a life-threatening anaphylactic reaction. Anaphylaxis may occur after ingestion, inhalation, skin contact or injection of a trigger substance" - http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Anaphylaxis
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"Crystals, yes. Pure psilocybin crystals, yes! Poorly filtered mushroom "juice", no."

Thank you kerrigan, this is what i've been saying, yet after all of these responces this kid still wants to continue thus a troll. Thanks for the detailed account on what may happen if he attempts this, I hope this matter is finally settled.
 
Your body will create antibodies to what you've injected, called immunoglobins, which will relax blood vessels and cause swelling and narrowing of airways. You will hope to experience such delights as fainting, unconsciousness, low blood pressure, hives, itching, swelling and of course unconsciousness; a severe allergic reaction. All of this will be going on while you're tripping your balls off. Anapyhlactic shock will most likely result in your death.
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THANK YOU. If one of you critics had said this in the first place it wouldn't have been carried on so long! I won't inject mushroom juice because now there is a reason why I shouldn't besides "durgh its a fungus".

My body will create antibodies... to exactly what would trigger this? I realize something in mushroom juice would trigger this shock, but what exactly in it?

If you were to concoct STERILE mushroom tea, then perhaps injecting mushroom tea would be a safe possibility (this may be an oxymoron, but IF you could do that, would it be possible).

Also, when people have shot heroin/meth/any commonly shot up drug (well shooting isn't common at all but substances that shooters commonly shoot) that had high levels of *whatever triggers these immunoglobins* have people suffered anapyhlactic shock?

Does this shock from that way happen commonly, or is it rare?

Or does it happen to people trying to do experiments like shooting mescaline juice or liquid salvinorin A extract?
 
how about a little amount of paracetamol (APAP)? If on decided to do a CWE on product containing oxycodone and APAP? How harmfull woul that be?
 
Do you look at the replies

You guys are saying this is ridiculous. You do not point out exactly why

I had a post yesterday explaining that foreign protein material can cause a severe anaphylactic shock. Did you not know what anaphyactic shock was? Do you have access to a dictionary? Do you read posts that don't agree with what you want to do? In the course of that post, I also explained that it is protein like materials from the mushroom tea that would trigger this.

I know the last post I'd said "one last time", but now I'm posting this to show that people are wasting their time as it appears that you're not willing to do any reading on the subject for yourself (like finding out about anaphylatic shock)

If you were to concoct STERILE mushroom tea, then perhaps injecting mushroom tea would be a safe possibility

The anaphylactic shock can still happen with sterile materials as they're not from a bacterial/viral source. Can you not take that into your fucking head.


No wonder members of the medical profession treat everybody who has used drugs as a fuckwit. It only takes one person with your attitude to do this. I've never before being so exasperated at someone's "blinkered" approach that I've taken to insulting them (at least online), so congratulations, you're another first for me
 
"foreign material" is not clear enough. Coke, heroin, and morphine injected are all foreign materials. Eating an apple is putting a "foreign" material in your body.

I do not understand exactly what triggers this shock. Bacteria and viral stuff seem to, but you say other things can to.

protein like materials from the mushroom tea that would trigger this.
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So all protein like materials can trigger this shock as well? What about proteins themselves? Are there set compound categories that trigger shock, or is there no set categories that cause shock but a wild cariety of many things?

how about a little amount of paracetamol (APAP)? If on decided to do a CWE on product containing oxycodone and APAP? How harmfull woul that be?
Click to expand...

It's not too harmful but it'd be best to get rid as much of the APAP as possible. Check out the "Injecting Oxy" post I made, which happens to have alot of flames as well. If you want, I can post exactly how I extracted it since I took some extra measures to make sure the water was very cold and get the APAP out.

It is possible too.
 
Proteins and shock

If you looked, I said foreign proteins, not foreign materials. The immune system recognizes proteins and protein like materials (such as glycoproteins) as these occur in the cell walls of bacteria and the protein coat of viruses. Any proteins produced by the body itself are ignored by the immune system (except in diseases like rhumatoid arthritis, but that's why they're classes as autoimmune diseases). As mentioned above, protein like materials consist of a chain of amino acids (the protein part) attached to other groups of compounds (with sugars to give glycoproteins, fats to give lipoproteins etc).

Apples etc don't cause such a reaction as in the gut, they are broken down to their constituent parts (amino acids) before absorption, then the body uses them to make it's own proteins. Bypassing the digestive system and putting pulped apple straight into the bloodstream by injection is just as likely to result in anaphylaxis as mushroom tea is. In terms of the immune system, any proteins in the bloodstream that don't occur by the body's own production are seen as pathogenic organisms, and produce the appropriate immune response. Part of that response is for mast calls to release histamine, which causes narrowing of the airways, a drop in blood pressure and inflamation. Get a severe enough response and you're dead.

Any plant preparation put straight into the bloodstream will cause such a reaction. That's why drugs prepared from plant sources that are used by injection (eg the anti-cancer drug vincristine from Madegascar periwinkle) are so expensive, because of the cost of isolating the drug from all other materials found in the plant
 
Thanks. If someone had said that beginning it would've made me look alot less dumb and persistent....

That explained alot to me, not just about this question but learned a few other things as well.

So besides foreign proteins being injected, what else causes this shock? Can you get this shock by other administration methods?

And would mushroom tea IM'd be a bad idea? Or would the proteins be broken down enough for it to be safe? What about SC'd? I bet those are also bad ideas, but I'm not sure.

That really narrows down this topic question.

I guess those proteins ARE alcohol-insoluble water-soluble poisons that would hurt if IV'd in small amounts.
 
Firstly, anything can cause an allergic reaction. Anyphylaxis is an allergic reaction. Secondly, the human digestive system is more than capable of digesting an apple. Injecting an apple, however, would be quite dangerous. I certainly advise against it.

The human immune system has developed to combat foreign bodies that appear in the bloodstream. These include bacteria, viruses, FUNGI and parasites. The result of the immunoglobin, IgE (I think) being released, are the symptoms of allergy; histamine release, lowering of blood pressure etc, that result in the swelling that will kill you. Your own cells won't be attacked by your immune cells, because, let's say they're just "marked" for the sake of simplicity. However other cells aren't, including other human cells. That's why transplanted organs can be rejected etc etc.

Read up on the immune system. Read up on the digestive system. Google is your friend, use it instead of asking these questions over and over. Actually try and find out an answer for yourself; it's YOUR life that you seem to be so willing to put in danger due to ignorance.

Acetaminophen can be administered intravenously, and has been for post operative pain etc. However, in hospitals it will most likely come in the form of a solution. Other insoluble substances such as diazepam come in the form of a solution in ampoules, so the idea certainly isn't strange.

But at home you'll have simply tried to dissolve it in a tiny amount of water, and with it not being very water soluble, it's dangerous, especially if you're dealing with large numbers of pills. Apart from the fact that injecting pills is very dangerous, throwing the possibility of too much APAP into the mix (afterall, you're going to be using around 1ML of water...) sounds quite risky indeed. I would advise against it...

Edit: seems like I was beaten to it, and it's a lot better than my explanation. Still, CreativeRandom, if you want it all explained to you in simple terms then try this site: http://press2.nci.nih.gov/sciencebehind/immune/immune00.htm
 
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So.... The only resonable thing to do is inject a little bit, and if you start going into shock, stop immediately ;)
 
No no no

In what you deem a small amount, there could be enough protein like material to cause a severe reaction (bee sting can cause anaphylaxis and what sort of volume do you think they "inject"). And once you go into shock, even if you stop the injection, you've probably already got enough in your bloodstream for it to all end very unpleasantly

Yes IM and SC, as well as IV, all bypass the body's barrier to the outside world (think as the human body as a long hollow tube, and the contents of the gut are still outside the body, in the strictest sense). As I mentioned previously, if you want to get any solution of plant extract absorbed into your body (safely), the best method is rectal administration (as long as you don't have a problem about that route of administration).

There are some compounds that are not stricly protein that can cause the same result (antibiotics are most probably the worst ones), but as they are not broken down in the gut, they can pass through the gut wall, into the bloodstream, then anaphylaxsis (only these compounds can produce a non-fatal reaction. I'm allergic to all penicillins; if I get some on my skin it turns red. Equally, my wife cannot have contact with sulphonamide antibiotics).

Not sure about this last bit, but it seems that an amide bond (the way amino acids are joined to form proteins) is important for antibiotica to produce degrees of anaphylaxsis (penicillins contain a beta-lactam bond - a cyclic amide)
 
Dude, I tried it and I'm fine. Thank GOD im not alergic to bee stings or penacillin. :):):):):):):):)The rush offa straight mushroom tea is about a million times stronger than Diluad...

I WAS JOKeING
 
Thanks for all the info. This post is all the sudden gettinf very productive.

That answers all my questions about injecting anything about mushrooms (as well as mescaline, salvia, etc.)

What about DMT? I know there are chemical suppliers with synthetic DMT (or a huge toad farm....) , but what about DMT obtained from bufo alvarius toad poison sacs? I assume their very bad and filled with proteins unless isolated right... And is normal DMT from chemical suppliers fine?
 
Toads and their wily ways

Yes the same applies to an animal source as well as plant sources (although the drug from toad venom is actually 5-methoxyDMT).

DMT from chem supply houses is generally synthetic, so free from protein like material (although you'll need a Home Office licence, or equivalent in other countries, before they'll do anything but laugh at an attempt to purchase DMT)
 
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