Well the 700 was definitely stronger (obviously), and yes I puked both times, a little sooner with the 700 mg. I also know people who have gotten visuals, although they had actual peyote. Tbh though, reading the reports on erowid, I don't think my experience is too unique, there's only one entry for a bad trip on there, the other bad trip entries were all combos, not mescaline alone. Its pretty easy going, warm and nice. I've heard statements like "its impossible to have a bummer on mescaline". It felt like a psychedelic I would be comfortable retiring on when I get old and if my mind is too twisted from the acid, hahah. It was the most similar to acid of any psychedelic I've taken, as far as the buzz went, but warmer rather than the cold feeling of acid. More "light". The problem was it didn't do anything WITH the light. What acid feels like to me, is it has the energy-light of mescaline (although colder and not as magnanimous-feeling), with the intellectual content of mushrooms (but not as anxious mind fuck confusing as mushrooms), and it fuses to something better than either of them. Not that taking mushrooms and mescaline simultaneously would be anything like acid, I just find acid has qualities of both.
I will say I haven't eaten mushrooms in a couple years though, and I was in a less mature headspace then. Now I might like them better. I don't think so though, they make me feel "crazy" even in low doses, acid doesn't, even in high doses.
I don't think your experience was too unique either. It being easygoing and warm mirrors everything I've ever heard about, but that's not just because it's weak at those doses.... I've heard people say that even at doses where there ego vanished so fast that they didn't even notice. I just can't shake the feeling that it sounds like you're trying to make a fair comparison using full doses of LSD and low doses of mescaline... which obviously wouldn't work. LSD wouldn't do a whole lot with the light either at a dose that only produced a nice high and some sparkly-ness, you know?
I completely get your analogy between mushrooms, LSD, and mescaline though, and it actually does a pretty good job at explaining part of why I'm so interested in mescaline to begin with. Now again, I love both mushrooms and LSD... but I love what LSD does that mushrooms don't do so much more than what mushrooms
do do that the idea of getting to try something that does
only those things (i.e., mescaline) is actually more tantalizing than the thought of having them combined together. An example using something already mentioned in this thread... is that I like my hallucinogens to tend toward the realistic, if you know what I'm saying. I mean, don't get me wrong; mushrooms can obviously be quite realistic, that tryptamine breakthrough potential. But they're so... alien or virtual, at the same time. LSD is realistic like a dream is realistic. Mushrooms feel like they take me to an extremely trippy other world; LSD feels like it takes me an extremely trippy version of the world we already inhabit. Now, there's obviously some of those crazy abstract properties as well, because I mean like you said, it has qualities of mushrooms too... but it has way more of that realism for me than mushrooms do. From all that I've heard about mescaline, it just sounds like it's even further down that road... a very high amount of the latter compared to the former. Even MagicalKat777's first post in this thread supports that, saying that the visions follow logical patterns unlike the abstract concepts of DMT. Reports of high doses reinforce this feeling in me as well. That's part of what makes me so intrigued in it.
That's another thing too, about the spectrum of mushrooms to mescaline. Just as LSD is more lucid than mushrooms, mescaline sounds significantly more lucid even than that, which sounds magnificent to me... though I actually do love the craziness of mushrooms too, hehe.
I think mescaline is often misunderstood and mescaline-containing cacti also contain other alkaloids that turn it into a more potent psychedelic covering all bases. These latest posts mostly confirm that mescaline doesn't really seem to do a whole lot, but this does require some input of your own. A desperate soul would probably be much more likely to recognize its utility.
If you are just basically interesting in yet another psychedelic it may fall short if you don't have much use for it. Use like help with emotional dysfunction or the mission or goal of your life. MDMA also help with that, but it is very potent in a lot of ways which can easily make a person strive past core problems.
Be careful hoping that upping the dose of mescaline makes it deliver the rest at last... instead you would be better off finding a psychedelic more suited to your expectations and needs.
P.S. my 450 mg dose was with the HCl and my 300 mg dose was with an unknown form of gorgeously sparkling microcrystalline material.
I think that's a pretty quick jump to conclusions, Solipsis.... The very small handful of people in this thread saying they didn't get much out of it doesn't even come
remotely near the number of reports of pure mescaline I've heard where people got thoroughly powerful psychedelic effects. I'm actually quite surprised to hear you say that considering how you spoke about mescaline earlier.
This is from a report on 900 mg of mescaline acetate, the very first link that comes up on Google if you search for "high dose mescaline".
"i lay down and let the visions/trance take me. i saw amazing patterns, mostly in red and gold, but all other colors, deeply saturated, were there. Strange and gorgeous patterns, like Mayan meeting ultra-futuristic. There was also a coptic theme to the imagery - kind of like the cross in this link http://ukmidcopts.org/ho...mp;id=26&Itemid=38. i saw a electric, glowing cactus, with outline waves of light coming off of it - perhaps an image of the cactus that produced the mescaline but in its natural state. Also there was a fantastic spinning molecular structure that looked like (I don't have the language!) unspun alien DNA. As i lay on the bed, i felt like i was afloat on a gentle sea . . . moving with gentle fronds caressing and weird noises surrounding. At times i curled into a moaning ball, sometimes with a few tears, and felt distinctly like i was dying. My limbs shook literally for hours with what can only be described as resistance. i had visual, audio & tactile hallucinations throughout the height of the experience. After like 6 hours i thought i had to use the bathroom, but getting to the toilet was like venturing through an alien spaceship, and after sitting there for an interminable time, i could not get my bladder to work. This is only a taste of the tip of the mescaline experience iceberg.
i watched my fat brown cat, slowly transform in front of my eyes into a shiny, hard-shelled, purple, spherical alien!"
That definitely doesn't sound like nothing to me.... I've found a lot more, but mostly in the form of short anecdotes. There are plenty of people out there who attest to the power of higher doses of mescaline.
As far as pushing the dose goes, here's another short quote from another forum....
"A person I know made a spectacular mistake one night many years ago. He misunderstood what a chemist had told him and he managed to swallow 8 grams of pure mescaline sulfate in gelatin capsules. He describes the trip as being like he was wide awake in a dream. Lots of imagery similar to Homer's Odessey. He recovered in a day or two with no notable ill effects."
It's this kind of stuff that makes me question the drug culture's view on mescaline as a whole.... Why are we even calling 400-700 milligrams a normal to strong dose in the first place when it can be pushed so much further and so many people get so much more out of it at higher doses than that? I can understand why it was
once set as that, but that was when people though that a gram or more could kill you. This quote is certainly the highest dose I've ever seen taken and it's a little ridiculous of course, but we've known for a long time that mescaline is safe in the order of several grams. Why are we still using such conservative doses and calling them "strong" when they could easily be only the very tip of the iceberg?
As for me
personally pushing the dose... I get what you're saying, but it's kind of like what I said to Ismene.... That advice really doesn't apply to me here. I'm not looking for a psychedelic suited to my expectations and needs; I'm looking for mescaline. I am interested in whether or not mescaline can do many of the things I like of course, but I'm not trying it because I'm looking for any specific effects. I'm trying it because it's a psychoactive with an extremely high therapeutic index and, like I said, I like seeing the absolute limits of human consciousness. I would gladly take it in high doses knowing only of its therapeutic index and nothing else; all these other potential effects and intrigues are just bonuses, reasons I've become even more interested in it since I've started researching it. I promise you, as long as I get anything at all out of it I won't be disappointed.
I'd also like to point out the one bad trip report on erowid with mescaline alone, is given a disclaimer that says the chemical most likely was not mescaline. So yeah, mescaline basically has no bad trip reports on erowid, its the chillest psychedelic out there. I like it! Its just way too expensive, and I get a lot more out of high quality LSD in sufficient doses, 200-300 ug. And man, MDMA I find synergizes purrrfectly with LSD in a way that it does not with others (I disliked MDMA+mushrooms), I never take LSD without MDMA. As for just taking more LSD....I've taken 600 ug (two hits of orange sunshine laid with needlepoint grade LSD, the highest quality). 600 was too much. I might take 1200 someday if I want an out of body experience, but at 600 I spent part of the trip in a semi-fugue state. 300 ug is the sweet spot for me. That trip did end well though, once I came down from the fugue part! But there was a bit of time when the world was just swirling and I didn't really know who I was. 300 ug I'd compare to like 5 grams of shrooms (but with way more to it), so 600 would be like taking 10 grams. Most shrooms I ever took was eight grams....600 ug LSD was a lot stronger than that. I don't trust the purported dosages of street acid anymore, cuz I'd taken 8 hits of decent street acid before, and just 2 hits of the orange sunshine at a guaranteed dose of 600 ug was much more powerful than that experience.
Well to each their own, but I think you should go for the 1200 ug.
I've taken enough to have an out-of-body experience.... It was pretty damn amazing. Still not at the limits of human consciousness though.... Further experimentation is required. >.>
Ok, but you were talking in your original post about getting a visionary experience - I'm suggesting you'd just get more physical side effects than psychedelic effects.
so it just makes me think that you'd probably have to dose higher on it.
I don't think a higher dose makes it that much more psychedelic tho. And I've dosed pretty high. It simply isn't that kind of drug. Taking a higher dose will just give more speedy physical effects and more nausea. Mescaline simply isn't as psychedelic as mushrooms or LSD. I'm not saying that makes it bad - it's just not the kind of thing that's going to blow your head off.
As maat said - there's no bad trip reports ever on mescaline - that's because it's so gentle you can't trip hard enough to have a bad trip.
I still just really don't think the physical effects will deter me.... Like I've mentioned before, I've taken monstrously high doses of 2C-I and it didn't bug me even slightly, and I used to use deliriants actively. I bet they feel way more shitty and dysphoric than mescaline does.
How high have you dosed? (Just out of curiosity.) Either way, I appreciate the input, but it's not going to stop me from trying.... Obviously some will find it more or less psychedelic just from person to person. As I said, I've seen a lot of variability... including people who probably dosed much less than you have and claimed that it was a powerful psychedelic. The only thing that could possibly deter me from it is trying it myself and finding that it doesn't vibe with me; there's no way to know how it will effect me until then.
As far as blowing your head off... that's not what I've been picturing it as anyway. The fact that it's unequivocally reported as gentle is one of the things I'm most excited about for it. I compared it to tryptamines like DMT in my first post because I've definitely heard peoples' accounts of mescaline having hyperspatial hallucinations, but even then it was just the hallucinations I was talking about, not the overall feel of it... even those trips people had involved incredibly easy and warm feelings to the experience.
I think mescaline is often misunderstood and mescaline-containing cacti also contain other alkaloids that turn it into a more potent psychedelic covering all bases. These latest posts mostly confirm that mescaline doesn't really seem to do a whole lot, but this does require some input of your own
This
Mescaline >>> much else.
I'm... confused about what you're trying to say here. Are those brackets supposed to be facing the other way?
It definitely does have tryptamine-y hyperspatial potential by those accounts.
I agree with the social thing, but I actually find mushrooms wonderful for that. It's not the same nootropic kind of communication as LSD, but it's still valid for me, but more spiritual or primal.... Even just sitting in nature and watching flowing water for example is something I would consider social.