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  • EADD Moderators: axe battler | Pissed_and_messed

Eitzolam tolerance thro the roof - will modalert straight me out?

Ok, general consensus pretty clear.

Another consensus is that you don't just drop from a gram of eitz overnight.

Has anyone experience of Flumazenil treatment? Is it available on the NHS? How much would it be to do it privately?

I rose this topic because I'm not keen on continuing this path. The modalert did actually make me feel more alert today. Not by much, but noticeable. I gave a solid presentation and the day went well.

I have looked into all this reduction, I was probably floating in and around 250 pink 2mg pills (although I think they are stronger than 2mg's - or the powders a little weaker) I bought a liter of PJ, baby syringes, 25ml syringes. I was set to taper but the PG didn't arrive for 6 weeks.

Anyway Flumazenil treatment - experiences?
 
I can confirm this is an excellent combination for staying sharp and relaxed.

Better living through chemistry
 
Any benzo treatment you get on the nhs will be on diazepam. You'll be lucky to get sripted anything over 40mg a day, you'll have to get yourself down to there. Go to your local drug services and get on their books, see what they say. If you are going to be scripted over that you'll be looking at a few weeks on apsych ward whilst they convert you to diazepam, but I think even that's unlikely.
 
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Having looked at the wiki page, I'm telling you now there's no way you're going to get that stuff to takeaway and use yourself on the NHS, and probably not private either.
 
Has anyone experience of Flumazenil treatment?

I reckon this could be sourced privately - I would just like to know if it's actually worked for anyone
 
I'm actually starting to shit myself a little bit about this. I did a casual canvas of a couple of friends and my gf - and they all said my driving was terrible.

I didn't think it was, despite the obvious. The modalert does cause slight withdrawals. The other thing is i've been through so many interviews and 2 weeks of really really intensive training - weeks really intensive training - I'm looking at the gram bag and theres probably only 200mg left - its the 16th - I worry so I take more.

Whats next 1.5 grams a month and 25 flubro- this can't go on.

I have to stop completely as soon as humanly possible. I might have had a Blase attitude to begin with, but half of that's forum banter. I wouldn't of raised the issue unless it was an issue - so how do I get the fuck of this shit as quickly as possible? Flumazenil treatment seems to be for benzo overdoses.

Although the net does seem full of contradictory reports

http://www.benzobuddies.org/forum/index.php?topic=49699.0

If I could afford it and justify it, I would consider a private rehab. But I couldn't spend over a grand.

You might think - oh just another junkie banging benzo's for kicks - but it wasn't like that in the beginning, I had to leave a well paid job in Australia to live with my mother who has been diagnosed with cancer - I'd lost 2.5 years of friends, a girlfriend, a great job, and now I was back in my old bedroom I grew up in with a clinically depressed mother on bupe.

I really needed somthing and I couldn't turn to the bottle.

Family life is still the same, but i've moved out and built a career again. I can't have it undermined by a drug

http://www.benzobuddies.org/forum/index.php?topic=49699.0
 
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The thing is with etizolam is that if you do gradually trim bits off your daily dose, your tolerance will readily start to lower. Ive got down to 15mg from 25-35mg and barely felt a thing. If you're not measuring how much you are taking daily then it would be worth starting. I need to step up my own taper as have been stuck on 13-15mg for months.

Thank you, This has to be the very first step realistically.
 
doombadger, you've opened a terrible can of worms. Serious benzodiazepine habits are very difficult to come off.

If I was you I would:

0) Stop thinking you can sort this out with flumazenil - it's meant for acute overdoses and not for sorting benzo addictions.
1) Get in touch with the local drug services/GP/anyone and be as brutally honest as you can.
2) Plan a sensible withdrawal strategy. I've never, ever, see one taper down eitzolam. You may be different (I doubt it).
3) Depending how bad you are (it sounds you are really in the deep end) plan to take 1-3 months off work. I would imagine if the withdrawal symptoms are resembling meningitis then you will need a hospital/residential detox program
4) Never take benzos/booze/GABA drugs ever again.
 
Etiz is a thing of the devil. I'd only be taking the fucking things a few weeks and coming off them I felt like putting my head through a steel wall.
 
Useful things but the rebound after low amounts for 4-ish days is bad enough, i use em as a last resort these days, fucking things indeed. then again i shouldnt be taking any benzo days in a row, been gapping it all out better now etc. nasty things when abused
 
I'm actually starting to shit myself a little bit about this. I did a casual canvas of a couple of friends and my gf - and they all said my driving was terrible.

I didn't think it was, despite the obvious. The modalert does cause slight withdrawals. The other thing is i've been through so many interviews and 2 weeks of really really intensive training - weeks really intensive training - I'm looking at the gram bag and theres probably only 200mg left - its the 16th - I worry so I take more.

Whats next 1.5 grams a month and 25 flubro- this can't go on.

I have to stop completely as soon as humanly possible. I might have had a Blase attitude to begin with, but half of that's forum banter. I wouldn't of raised the issue unless it was an issue - so how do I get the fuck of this shit as quickly as possible? Flumazenil treatment seems to be for benzo overdoses.

Although the net does seem full of contradictory reports

http://www.benzobuddies.org/forum/index.php?topic=49699.0

If I could afford it and justify it, I would consider a private rehab. But I couldn't spend over a grand.

You might think - oh just another junkie banging benzo's for kicks - but it wasn't like that in the beginning, I had to leave a well paid job in Australia to live with my mother who has been diagnosed with cancer - I'd lost 2.5 years of friends, a girlfriend, a great job, and now I was back in my old bedroom I grew up in with a clinically depressed mother on bupe.

I really needed somthing and I couldn't turn to the bottle.

Family life is still the same, but i've moved out and built a career again. I can't have it undermined by a drug

http://www.benzobuddies.org/forum/index.php?topic=49699.0

For a start stop dabbing from the bag. Measure your doses and try and keep to a consistent amount every day.
 
^ Definitely. Dabbing benzo powders is not so wise - far too easy to be taking waaaaaaaaaaaaaaay more than you realise. If using powders make it into a solution with propylene glycol and - as that other thread on the front page - keep a diary of every single dose you take, how much you dose, when you dose. This way you can find out for sure exactly what needs to be done. A gramme a month (or more) is a shitload and there's not getting around that. That's a major dependency and will take a very long time to get out from under. As has been said, don't think in terms of quick fixes cos there are none. It's a long taper down and sticking to it rigidly.

Normally I suggest people use The Ashton Manual as it is the standard approach to benzo addictions and has proven successful time and again. However, you are on a helluva lot of benzos and will need to be careful. I would seek medical attention and advice given the sheer quantities involved. Alternatively you can try tapering yourself but you need to be very strict with yourself, need to know exactly how much you are taking at all times, and need to take your time. I know the feeling of just wanting out of an addiction but that is not an option with benzos cos it's extremely dangerous - especially at those kinda levels. Research tapering - the Ashton is a good place to start and I see you've been checking benzo forums too. Make a tapering plan and stick with it - obviously allowing for any alarming symptoms cos you don't want to be pushing it too hard cos it will push back and that can be very risky.

It's a slog but it is doable. Best of luck <3
 
My group worker has advised me to change GP surgery as the ones im at currently will not prescribe benzos. He was on about the problems with possible inconsistent strengths of batches from one to the next which is potentially gonna be a hiccup in any taper. Realistically though if you make a large batch it wont matter once you are adjusted to it, as it will be a consistent strength throghout. I thought that my last 2g purchase and 1 litre PG mix would be my last batch and that i would complete my taper on it. This hasnt gone to plan atall. If and when i finally get down to 1 or 2 mg of etiz i might see about transferring to a diaz script, or if no Dr will assist me in that with a legitimate script I'll probably switch to flubromazepam for the last few steps.
 
Agreed that if you have a large benzo addiction you really should seek professional medical help as it's going to be extremely hard to deal with getting clean and if you don't something bad is going to happen at some point along the line.
 
Agreed that if you have a large benzo addiction you really should seek professional medical help as it's going to be extremely hard to deal with getting clean and if you don't something bad is going to happen at some point along the line.

I'm hoping that if i do follow the Ashton method that things wont be too bad and that I'll be able to get off them myself. If it proves to be too much i may have to check myself into Rehab or something for the last couple of steps. All this is quite a long way ahead into the future, atm im not really making any inroads into my taper. If i quit some things (kratom and ecigs) then cravings for some other replacements spring up, this time round it has been alcohol. It's like something doesnt want to let me go and wants to keep me down.
 
This is what I have -I'm joining this site benzo buddies-

Look , there is no way I can give up this job for 1-3 weeks just after starting. This is my career, I cant afford it - financially, mentally it would put me in a hole. I suppose I am in a hole. I could take a week max. But that would be pushing it so far.

I'm actually a very strong willed person - I left everyone to start a new life in Australia with one goal - sell solar PV - I was great at it, they sponsored me to 2016 then i could of applied for permenate residency.

But one week I got a call saying my dog died, pretty much a week later I got a phone call about my mum. - It was the worst possible timimng as well, the sponsership was approved - I handed a lawyer a dog shit CV and she turned it into gold - but the next week was the big bosses birthday - swimming pool in Brighton Melbourne - proper chefs on the BBQ's, mmulti mililion dolar house and of course unlimited drink - I got so drunk angry, confused, First of all I dating the operations manager who had a casual meth habit - she seen it first and said look just go - I was mean, she burst into tears and ran off, i couldnt fuck up talking about my dead dog, Then I squared up to my line manager and hit me. Sack very next day - job, visa, friends, life, 28 days to leave the country.

A couple of times I drank after that catching uo with ones at home, until a nite fucked up and I decided thats it -no drink - havn't drank in coming on 2 years. All my brothers drink. I don't. I just stopped.

Codiene was harder - infact im popping 4 now ffs, but that will hopefully do me till 2 tonight.

These benzo's - I don't know - I don't know what the fuck I've gotten myself into or how i'll get out - but I will get out - honestly, i'm terrified.

There is evidence that Flumazenil treatment can help repair the gaba receptors - but its a residential treatment. I don't know if they do it in the UK, Ireland or Scotland or Wales - I have heard that it is far far from painless - but you wont take a seziure. I know I have to taper but I just want to quit. The modalert has precipitated withdrawals, I can feel them. I know what they feel like. But It's also woken me up that this is the biggest thing - bar my mother - in my life - if I killed a person, I would devastate her last days on this earth. And destroy my life, I couldn't live with the guilt.

I need the fastest possible taper - there is evidence that Flumazenil is effective in serious addiction and repairing Gaba cells- I'll sell anything I have to get in rehab. It's like the modafinianl has just lifted me 2 foot out of the bubble and I can see a bit clearer now.

The abuse on this thread was also justified and heartfelt. No body knows just how high my usage has climbed. My Da knew id get the odd envelope of pills. He didn't like it, but relationships were being mended and I was able to sit and listen to the hell I put them through - now, I was on benzo's, but they needed to say that to me. If I wasn't I couldn't of sat and absorbed so much justified criticism. I had to make peace with my mother.

I won't even say some of the stuff that happened when I eyeballed half a gram of phenaenzapam and they had to get there son sectioned - who talked his way out in 36 hrs - I can blag - it's good and its bad - but back against the wall i needed out of there - first thing I did was destroyed their car - I was out of it for nearly a month, i got a half way house but live ferrel pretty much. I don't remember. Thank god.

Our relationship had to be built from below zero. We have a good relationship now. I've worked for them. My dad wants me to go into rehab and he doesn't know a 1/10th of it - but then ADHD and dyspraxia run thro our family and my Pa at 60 is on 32mg concerta that i know he doubles up on now an again, my youngest bro is on dextroamphetimine - this modafinial - which god forbid becomes another habit... it's opened up doors in my head that were closed completely.

This is a harm reduction site. And I've been here long enough to really feel the tragedy's that have occured. To this end - if someone would spend a little time trying to create as rapid a taper as possible - remember I have the long half life of the Flubro as well - 4mg's. I promise I will try to help someone out in a similar situation - because nobody has a clue what the scale of the problem is - and what it could become should these become unavailable in the future.

I know this will hurt - but I need to work - I have to - my tolerance is through the roof - but if it can be brought down as fast as possible while still allowing me to function. I'm not expected to excel in my first few weeks - just turn up.

This is what I have - http://imagizer.imageshack.us/a/img839/5486/j2cy.jpg - 1 liter bottle of propylene glycol - 500ml of the same. frig all eitzolam, some flubro, a 25ml syringe, a 5 ml syringe. Have to get a gram in Monday but this time I'll do it properly and hope fully between here and benzo buddies someone could advise a fast, uncomfortable but not impossible taper.

Thank you for reading this. I think this is a problem that's going to keep popping up with legal benzo's, the scale of the problem could already be huge.

Any help I receive I will reciprocate.
 
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Edited your post as it looks like you copypasted the same thing three times over. Let me know if there's a problem with me cutting something out but don't believe I did - was just repetition and you'll be more likely to get responses with a more readable post.

I do understand wanting out of addictions but that is a bad way to be thinking about things. It's not practical and you can end up doing a lot more harm than good. Crash tapers are not especially known for their effectiveness. There's only so much body and mind can take and if you push to hard you bounce back and rebound and end in a worse position than you started out from. And that's one of the least iffy outcomes given it's benzos in this case. The early stages of a taper are not too bad and you can cut surprisingly large amounts off daily. Once you get down to lower levels is when you need to be more cautious and take it more slowly. You will probably find it almost seems easy initially cos you should be able to cut fairly significant amounts off relatively rapidly. Don't push too hard though cos it's the longterm goal you need to keep in mind. And if you're planning to work whilst doing it you really have no other option cos won't be physically capable of getting in to work if you push too hard.

I don't know anything about Flumazenil treatment but I do know of vaguely similarish sounding opiate treatments and they don't work at all. That's opies though and a different thing. I suspect there are probably some similarities though - only opi w/d is a helluva lot easier.
 
I'm hoping that if i do follow the Ashton method that things wont be too bad and that I'll be able to get off them myself. If it proves to be too much i may have to check myself into Rehab or something for the last couple of steps. All this is quite a long way ahead into the future, atm im not really making any inroads into my taper. If i quit some things (kratom and ecigs) then cravings for some other replacements spring up, this time round it has been alcohol. It's like something doesnt want to let me go and wants to keep me down.

Where you at at the moment in terms of dosage (apologies if you've mentioned this before)? I was using ~200mg diazepam daily earlier in the year (as well as loads of other shit) and I had to seek help because my life was just absolute carnage, disaster wherever I went.

It's definitely possible to do it yourself if you've got the motivation and will power to go through the process. I'm not strong enough to do that alone and needed help though, I was walking around in a daze, suicidal and thinking about stepping out in to every busy road I came to. I was told they wouldn't script me anything more than 40mg diazepam a day so I had to reduce myself down to there but I managed that really quickly and easily with no pain. Only took me about six to eight weeks to get from 200mg to 50mg and then I asked for a script for 40mg. When you're on really high doses of benzos you can chop off large amounts really quickly without much pain (although it might be different if you've been using at that level for a very long time) at all and as long as you've got 40mg of diazepam in your system a day there's no risk of seizure. That's the reason they wouldn't prescribe me any more than 40mg, no interest in making me comfortable just keeping me safe (which is fair enough).

When I was using at a similar level about six or seven years ago they were happy to script me the equivalent dosage of diazepam but wanted me to spend time in a psych ward over christmas whilst they titrated my dosage from the mix of different benzos I was using on to diazepam. That was a different time though so maybe things have changed, different area of the country too and everywhere's different. Foolishly I didn't take them up on their offer and ct'd from that level at the same time as from an IV smack habit and it was absolutely harrowing.
 
Around 14mg. Since i stopped taking kratom ive been adding booze to the mix though. I need to stop drinking as soon as ive polished off this current 20 pack box. Then i can start getting to grips with the etiz taper properly. Ive been on this kind of dose and higher for 2 years or more now i think. I reduced back down to 6mg at one point. At one point i was having the same problems as the OP in that i had blown out my tolerance completely, my bedtime dose of ~12mg currently knocks me out completely, i suspect there is a lot of leeway to slash that dose without hardly any issues atall. The main thing that i need is for something to occupy myself with.
 
Yeah that's a fair fucking dose.

It would do you a lot of good to switch over to diazepam as it's much easier to taper due to the long half life. Tapering on drugs with short half lives is always going to be difficult as the concentration in your blood is fluctuating far more often. Standard Ashton Manual procedure. I imagine you could probably just jump straight to ~70mg at night or even less and nothing else and start working from there. That's just my personal opinion through my experiences though.
 
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