Positive The Tapering Support Thread v 2.0

[ElBarone]

Tapering notes:

First and foremost, you need to sleep. Plan whatever you’re doing so that you can get at least 4 hours of solid sleep every night.

Second, if you feel great at any point of the day then you’re probably doing it wrong. You got here by feeling high. Then it just made you feel normal. Now you’re going to need to feel a bit low basically all of the time. How much you feel ‘low’ is determined by how fast you taper. CT means feeling absolutely horrible for a week or two. Dropping by 5% per week means feeling lethargic and irritable every day for months.

As for percentages:
Let’s say you decide to cut by 10% per week. If you are at 1000mg per day, then next week you move to 900 mg per day. Then you recalculate.

Now you’re at 900mg per day. 10% is 90 mg, so you drop to 810 mg per day, then you recalculate.

The next week you start with 810mg per day. 10% is 81mg, so you drop to 721mg per day (it doesn’t need to be exact).

You just keep going until you’re ready to jump off. But if you keep cutting by 100mg per day, on week 8 you’ll go from 200mg to 100mg and that’s HALF. Hug mistake. Tapering correctly takes fucking FOREVER!!!

NEXT PROBLEM:
When do you enjoy your drugs? At work? With dinner? On Friday nights? You need new habits. It’s best to write yourself a hand written schedule on paper with a pencil. DONT DEVIATE FOR ANY REASON!!! Family, work, weather, doesn’t matter. I don’t care if there’s a funeral. If you feel like shit and the drugs are the only thing that will make you OK to do it…. tell everyone your friend got COVID and start coughing. Stay home. One slip-up and your brain will tell you that it’s OK to cheat in an emergency. Then it will tell you to cheat when you want to relax. Then it will tell you to cheat because work was extra stressful. Then you’re just cheating ALL OF THE TIME. This is why in-patient rehab works. They don’t let patients have any contact with the outside world.

Next one:
Get your excuses ready in advance. Nobody wants to say “I can’t make it to work because I’m in withdrawal”, right?
I hurt my back. I have a new Dr and he put me on a new medication for high blood pressure and it’s making me dizzy. My neighbor is a meth addict and he kept me up all night working on his truck. Doesn’t matter. (Food poisoning is fantastic occasionally but you need to point to a specific food from about 12 hours ago)

When you’re scared of what to say when that moment comes…. when you are faced with the choice of taking more of the drugs you’re trying to taper off from… versus disappointing those people in your life who are important to you (boss, mom, child, etc)…. You will usually chose the drugs because you are afraid to expose yourself as a loser and you will be scared of what they will think. GOOD EXCUSES ARE IMPORTANT!!!. Plan ahead for Armageddon.

Last:
Addicts (And I mean any person who has become physically addicted to the drug, but also has become reliant on that drug sustaining their life), can’t taper well. There’s always a reason to deviate from the plan. EVERYONE IS ADDICTED TO SOMETHING. You’re just addicted to something that is either illegal or socially unacceptable. Caffeine is a drug. Starbucks is a drug dealer. Caffeine withdrawals last for months. It’s important to realize that you’re not a “junkie”. Stick with the plan at all costs.

————-

There’s usually someone close to you that will be willing to help. Ask for help. Even if they can only offer emotional support. Doing it on your own is sooooo lonely that you’ll probably fail, over and over for years. That’s what happened to me.

What a brilliant, thoughtful and informative post, i thoroughly enjoyed reading it!

i would like to add a few comments from my experience, although i’m not exactly the greatest success story

First is to sort out a schedule and stick to it, my usage is historically very sporadic, i just take it when i want to feel great or i’m feeling withdrawals, i.e very random, so a taper needs to start with a strict regime which, as you say, you do not cheat on. For me my day starts at 5am and i dose 3 times (240mg a time) .. last night i woke at 2am in pretty severe withdrawals, sweats, aches etc.. i just had to stick it out, tossed and turned for 3 hours with my little bottle of pills by the bed…and with great relief swallowed them at 5am exactly! - as soon as i tell myself, ‘don’t worry, you can have them early tonight’ - then that’s it, same the following night, same with the next dose, and the wheels fall off-BE DISCIPLINED

The second thing i’ve learned is only to drop when you are stable and ready, there is no point for me planning a drop every 7 days, i just have to wait until i’m feeling normal, then give it 2 days or so, then drop, otherwise i get a wave of withdrawals on top of existing withdrawals, and then give up inevitably.. i mean when i say normal i mean not in full blown wds, i agree with your point that you are
going to feel low most of the time

What is really frustrating this time is i am struggling to stabilise, today is day 11 from a 20% drop and i still don’t feel great, which is frustrating as i’m trying to launch a business at the moment and i’m not in the right headspace at all..anyway fingers crossed

would be great to hear from others who struggled to stabilise , always get comfort from those in the same boat

Thanks again for a great post

 

[ElBarone]

Tapering notes:

First and foremost, you need to sleep. Plan whatever you’re doing so that you can get at least 4 hours of solid sleep every night.

Second, if you feel great at any point of the day then you’re probably doing it wrong. You got here by feeling high. Then it just made you feel normal. Now you’re going to need to feel a bit low basically all of the time. How much you feel ‘low’ is determined by how fast you taper. CT means feeling absolutely horrible for a week or two. Dropping by 5% per week means feeling lethargic and irritable every day for months.

As for percentages:
Let’s say you decide to cut by 10% per week. If you are at 1000mg per day, then next week you move to 900 mg per day. Then you recalculate.

Now you’re at 900mg per day. 10% is 90 mg, so you drop to 810 mg per day, then you recalculate.

The next week you start with 810mg per day. 10% is 81mg, so you drop to 721mg per day (it doesn’t need to be exact).

You just keep going until you’re ready to jump off. But if you keep cutting by 100mg per day, on week 8 you’ll go from 200mg to 100mg and that’s HALF. Hug mistake. Tapering correctly takes fucking FOREVER!!!

NEXT PROBLEM:
When do you enjoy your drugs? At work? With dinner? On Friday nights? You need new habits. It’s best to write yourself a hand written schedule on paper with a pencil. DONT DEVIATE FOR ANY REASON!!! Family, work, weather, doesn’t matter. I don’t care if there’s a funeral. If you feel like shit and the drugs are the only thing that will make you OK to do it…. tell everyone your friend got COVID and start coughing. Stay home. One slip-up and your brain will tell you that it’s OK to cheat in an emergency. Then it will tell you to cheat when you want to relax. Then it will tell you to cheat because work was extra stressful. Then you’re just cheating ALL OF THE TIME. This is why in-patient rehab works. They don’t let patients have any contact with the outside world.

Next one:
Get your excuses ready in advance. Nobody wants to say “I can’t make it to work because I’m in withdrawal”, right?
I hurt my back. I have a new Dr and he put me on a new medication for high blood pressure and it’s making me dizzy. My neighbor is a meth addict and he kept me up all night working on his truck. Doesn’t matter. (Food poisoning is fantastic occasionally but you need to point to a specific food from about 12 hours ago)

When you’re scared of what to say when that moment comes…. when you are faced with the choice of taking more of the drugs you’re trying to taper off from… versus disappointing those people in your life who are important to you (boss, mom, child, etc)…. You will usually chose the drugs because you are afraid to expose yourself as a loser and you will be scared of what they will think. GOOD EXCUSES ARE IMPORTANT!!!. Plan ahead for Armageddon.

Last:
Addicts (And I mean any person who has become physically addicted to the drug, but also has become reliant on that drug sustaining their life), can’t taper well. There’s always a reason to deviate from the plan. EVERYONE IS ADDICTED TO SOMETHING. You’re just addicted to something that is either illegal or socially unacceptable. Caffeine is a drug. Starbucks is a drug dealer. Caffeine withdrawals last for months. It’s important to realize that you’re not a “junkie”. Stick with the plan at all costs.

————-

There’s usually someone close to you that will be willing to help. Ask for help. Even if they can only offer emotional support. Doing it on your own is sooooo lonely that you’ll probably fail, over and over for years. That’s what happened to me.

something else came up reading this again, the notion of ‘needing to feel low’ all the time

i get the logic here, but difficult to achieve all the time surely? the reality is you are still dosing, and at levels not far off where you were, so while i feel pretty crappy most of the time there are brief glimpses of euphoria, normally at that sweetspot
an hour or so after dosing, of course it barely lasts and the overall tapering withdrawals
kick in

as an example from my last post, when i eventually took my dose after 3 hours of feeling awful, i have to admit i really enjoyed the relief it gave!

but i’m still on track, thats the main thing

 

[Psychlone Jack]

The second thing i’ve learned is only to drop when you are stable and ready, there is no point for me planning a drop every 7 days, i just have to wait until i’m feeling normal, then give it 2 days or so, then drop, otherwise i get a wave of withdrawals on top of existing withdrawals, and then give up inevitably.. i mean when i say normal i mean not in full blown wds, i agree with your point that you are
going to feel low most of the time

What is really frustrating this time is i am struggling to stabilise, today is day 11 from a 20% drop and i still don’t feel great, which is frustrating as i’m trying to launch a business at the moment and i’m not in the right headspace at all..anyway fingers crossed

would be great to hear from others who struggled to stabilise , always get comfort from those in the same boat

Thanks again for a great post

Hey. Hope you're doing well, and I wish you luck with the business!

But yeah, this is the biggest thing that's helped me - just listening to my body. I'm currently tapering bupe, at 4mg/day from 16. It sucks lol. But instead of having a set, concrete schedule - "I drop x amount every y days" or every week or whatever - just pay attention to how you feel. I know with bupe having such a long half-life, I'm going to experience peak shitfeel 3 or 4 days after a drop, it just depends on how long AFTER that it takes me to normalize. That said, I do typically drop on Mondays, but I'm not going to rush it to meet some self-imposed deadline.

So far it hasn't been terrible, the only really rough patch I've had so far was between 8 and 6mg, and I'm aware that's probably about to change lol, but I know what you mean about struggling to normalize. If I'm not diligent about my headspace and my just general health, rough patches of a taper can effect every part of life - work, family, etc.

The biggest things that have helped me are trying to eat well, sleep well which is hard, I know, and this may not apply for everyone, but WEED lol. My doctors won't help, so self-help it is. By tapering I'm trying to bring my body and my chemistry back to a normal, stable state, so do your best to do and feed it normal, healthy things.

Good luck man, stay safe. You got this.

 

[ElBarone]

Hey. Hope you're doing well, and I wish you luck with the business!

But yeah, this is the biggest thing that's helped me - just listening to my body. I'm currently tapering bupe, at 4mg/day from 16. It sucks lol. But instead of having a set, concrete schedule - "I drop x amount every y days" or every week or whatever - just pay attention to how you feel. I know with bupe having such a long half-life, I'm going to experience peak shitfeel 3 or 4 days after a drop, it just depends on how long AFTER that it takes me to normalize. That said, I do typically drop on Mondays, but I'm not going to rush it to meet some self-imposed deadline.

So far it hasn't been terrible, the only really rough patch I've had so far was between 8 and 6mg, and I'm aware that's probably about to change lol, but I know what you mean about struggling to normalize. If I'm not diligent about my headspace and my just general health, rough patches of a taper can effect every part of life - work, family, etc.

The biggest things that have helped me are trying to eat well, sleep well which is hard, I know, and this may not apply for everyone, but WEED lol. My doctors won't help, so self-help it is. By tapering I'm trying to bring my body and my chemistry back to a normal, stable state, so do your best to do and feed it normal, healthy things.

Good luck man, stay safe. You got this.

Thanks man, appreciated

yeah i don’t know why its taking so long to stabilise this time, especially as DHC has a relatively short half life, i guess its because I’ve been doing this for so long..the way i see it is that tapering is basically cold turkey lite…so a 20% reduction effectively means 20% of the severity of CT, and that feels about right, CT for me would be beyond horrific, last time i tried was nearly 3 years ago and it was very tough..my usage has steadily risen SINCE then and another 3 years under my belt, (prob 5 in total of daily use).. i had a taste of it the other day when a delivery was late and i got to about 20 hours without and beginning to feel worryingly bad, and day 1 is the easiest!

so back to my point, 20% of CT feels right for what i am going through, but the duration remains the same, and that’s around 10-14 days for physicals to pass, (from previous experience)..

incidentally the previous time i got to about 16 days, all physical withdrawals gone, but relapsed due to sheer and utter boredom..nothing gave me any joy whatsover, couldn’t read, watch TV, do anything with any interest at all…so that’s all to come

 

[PharmaTrain]

I get mostly psychological wd’s. I only have about 5 days of my perc’s. I did figure out that I’m actually having wd’s from the Tylenol too. If I take a gram of regular Tylenol after I run out, I hate life a little less. But mostly, I just get used to the pills and I get depressed when they’re gone. My tolerance starts out each month super high. I take 10 perc’s and feel nothing but normal. Yesterday I took 16 in two hours and I just felt no wd’s, very little pain relief and zero high.

It does take me about 2 weeks to feel ‘normal’ after even just 5 days of 20-30 Percocet’s per day. The constipation from the heavy oxy use has become my way of measuring the wd’s. And that takes a solid 10-14 days before that returns to normal.

My guess is that if I was using them as an average person would (i.e. 3 or 4 per day), it would be roughly 2 days of not feeling right for each day of use.

I hate the constipation from bupe but H was much worse 20 years ago. To clarify I do use the bathroom everyday/2 days: #2. It hasn't been 20 years since dropped the kids off at the pool! That being said the more you take the worse the constipation is no doubt. I eat a lot of greens and fiber to combat this. The dope s**ts were the worst back in the day. Once a week maybe. I needed to use enemas to get the bolder out.

 

[Squeaky]

I hate the constipation from bupe but H was much worse 20 years ago. To clarify I do use the bathroom everyday/2 days: #2. It hasn't been 20 years since dropped the kids off at the pool! That being said the more you take the worse the constipation is no doubt. I eat a lot of greens and fiber to combat this. The dope s**ts were the worst back in the day. Once a week maybe. I needed to use enemas to get the bolder out.

My record was 14 days between bathroom visits.

 

[ElBarone]

Sorry for the boring posts, i hope its ok to ‘journalise’ here but if not, and its really just for questions and advice, someone please tell me

So i woke this morning- day 11 after first major taper drop of c20%, tentatively trying to detect and ongoing withdrawals, i dosed at 5am per my schedule so wasn’t in full withdrawals, sadly legs still aching and feeling very irritable.. pity, will keep pushing on

Getting to a place i’ve been on previous tapers where i start to think, ‘could this actually be a cold/flu/virus now, i mean it is that time of year and loads of other people are ill, its been 11 days after all, i know i’ll take an extra handful of pills
and if i feel better i’ll know its the withdrawals, but if the symptoms still linger then its obviously not’

the old mind playing tricks, and i know not to fall for that, for now anyway!

Really hoping to normalise enough by next Monday as have a week stuffed with work meetings i specifically put off for 2 weeks as knew i wouldn’t be feeling up to it after the drop- i mean i know i won’t be flying but need to be well enough,
fingers crossed

my plan is to stay where i am to at least get through next week, then go again-

 

[ElBarone]

i just worked out my first drop was in fact 23.8%, at least from my usage over the 5 weeks prior, that makes me feel better

 

[PharmaTrain]

My record was 14 days between bathroom visits.

That's a record no doubt. Were you eating much?

 

[PharmaTrain]

Sorry for the boring posts, i hope its ok to ‘journalise’ here but if not, and its really just for questions and advice, someone please tell me

So i woke this morning- day 11 after first major taper drop of c20%, tentatively trying to detect and ongoing withdrawals, i dosed at 5am per my schedule so wasn’t in full withdrawals, sadly legs still aching and feeling very irritable.. pity, will keep pushing on

Getting to a place i’ve been on previous tapers where i start to think, ‘could this actually be a cold/flu/virus now, i mean it is that time of year and loads of other people are ill, its been 11 days after all, i know i’ll take an extra handful of pills
and if i feel better i’ll know its the withdrawals, but if the symptoms still linger then its obviously not’

the old mind playing tricks, and i know not to fall for that, for now anyway!

Really hoping to normalise enough by next Monday as have a week stuffed with work meetings i specifically put off for 2 weeks as knew i wouldn’t be feeling up to it after the drop- i mean i know i won’t be flying but need to be well enough,
fingers crossed

my plan is to stay where i am to at least get through next week, then go again-

The war is in the mind. The thoughts of "what if" or a combo of the thought and a stressful situation will try to hinder your goal. Our emotions play a key role with this. Any negative thought can bring on a negative action. Stick to your goal and don't let the "what ifs" win. Focus your mind and replace the thoughts that will keep you down. You'll doing great.

 

[Squeaky]

That's a record no doubt. Were you eating much?

Yep. Eating somewhat normally. Only have one bathroom in my house.

I plugged the toilet so badly once at 2am that I unbolted it and had to take it outside and unplug it in the grass (pretty disgusting).

Good thing I’m handy.

 

[Squeaky]

Sorry for the boring posts, i hope its ok to ‘journalise’ here but if not, and its really just for questions and advice, someone please tell me

So i woke this morning- day 11 after first major taper drop of c20%, tentatively trying to detect and ongoing withdrawals, i dosed at 5am per my schedule so wasn’t in full withdrawals, sadly legs still aching and feeling very irritable.. pity, will keep pushing on

Getting to a place i’ve been on previous tapers where i start to think, ‘could this actually be a cold/flu/virus now, i mean it is that time of year and loads of other people are ill, its been 11 days after all, i know i’ll take an extra handful of pills
and if i feel better i’ll know its the withdrawals, but if the symptoms still linger then its obviously not’

the old mind playing tricks, and i know not to fall for that, for now anyway!

Really hoping to normalise enough by next Monday as have a week stuffed with work meetings i specifically put off for 2 weeks as knew i wouldn’t be feeling up to it after the drop- i mean i know i won’t be flying but need to be well enough,
fingers crossed

my plan is to stay where i am to at least get through next week, then go again-

Not boring at all.

We have all been told that “withdrawals” last for a day, or a week. It’s all wrong. Diarrhea, nausea, insomnia… that’s what they’re talking about. But the people who are telling you what it feels like haven’t lived it. It’s a very long process.

You’re here because you want your life back, right? A life beyond whatever your using.

It took me about 2 years before I could say that I was back to normal. This is the fight of your life and I couldn’t even see it until the fight was over. And I’m still fighting EVERY DAY.

Stop trying to be happy. Just keep trying to ‘not die’. Every day is one more day that you lived through this. Eventually you will realize that has been a week, then a month, maybe a year.

Just do as much as you can today. Push yourself to your limit, and then go a little bit further every day. Some days will be diamonds. Some days will be rocks. But to keep with the metaphor….. Do not judge yourself based on how many rocks you found today. Judge yourself on how many diamonds you found this week/month/year. EVERYONE FAILS OCCASIONALLY!!!! But don’t say any of this to your mom/boss/wife/etc..

It’s OK to slip and fall, as long as you’re able to pick yourself back up and fight. And if you discover that you can’t do it by yourself, then ask for help. Most of us have someone who can help. We just need to be quiet about the ask.

It’s an unbelievably long process.

 

[ElBarone]

Not boring at all.

We have all been told that “withdrawals” last for a day, or a week. It’s all wrong. Diarrhea, nausea, insomnia… that’s what they’re talking about. But the people who are telling you what it feels like haven’t lived it. It’s a very long process.

You’re here because you want your life back, right? A life beyond whatever your using.

It took me about 2 years before I could say that I was back to normal. This is the fight of your life and I couldn’t even see it until the fight was over. And I’m still fighting EVERY DAY.

Stop trying to be happy. Just keep trying to ‘not die’. Every day is one more day that you lived through this. Eventually you will realize that has been a week, then a month, maybe a year.

Just do as much as you can today. Push yourself to your limit, and then go a little bit further every day. Some days will be diamonds. Some days will be rocks. But to keep with the metaphor….. Do not judge yourself based on how many rocks you found today. Judge yourself on how many diamonds you found this week/month/year. EVERYONE FAILS OCCASIONALLY!!!! But don’t say any of this to your mom/boss/wife/etc..

It’s OK to slip and fall, as long as you’re able to pick yourself back up and fight. And if you discover that you can’t do it by yourself, then ask for help. Most of us have someone who can help. We just need to be quiet about the ask.

It’s an unbelievably long process.

Thanks, great advice again

May i ask what your DOC was and how long you took it for, + approx dose

just interested really, if you can be bothered

 

[AlphaMethylPhenyl]

I think the taking things one day at a time helped me a lot in getting off methadone. If it's too much, than do it by hour. Hell, do it by five minutes if you have to.

@Squeaky I find your advice very wise also. I think the stop trying to be happy idea is really powerful too. Instead, maybe try to do things that have practical value and give yourself little rewards for those minor victories at times, like a candy bar or something. Eventually, they will pile up, and you feel good about yourself because of all the hard wrk you put in. It's really a gratifying existence in functioning. It may not seem like it would be that great to live a "normal" life, but once you're clean and there, it really feels better than it looks.

Jumping back into things socially is good too, with people who don't use. We need other people. Socializing is largely what makes us particularly human, and it offers reward that no drug really matches, imo.

 

[ElBarone]

I totally agree on the social point..

so its day 14 for me today, since i started my taper,
and i think, maybe, i must just be over the withdrawals from my first drop.. problem is i ended up drinking too much yesterday so feel pretty crap, but definitely feels like a hangover rather that wds, no aching legs for a start.

i am still feeling withdrawals as my next dose beckons, i.e 6 hours or so after my previous, and i really hope these will dissipate at some point, but generally feeling them all day long seems to have lifted

Will probably reserve judgment till tomorrow though,

Thanks all

 

[ElBarone]

So, on day 16 today and still not feeling great… very lethargic, heavy boned and lacking motivation..mood is ok. I think one of my issues is adjusting to a routine with set dosing times, my usual style is just to take it when a) I’m in a great mood, having a great time and what to maker it even better, or b) when I’m feeling creeping withdrawals and want to feel better..so all over the place, different time, different amounts…whatever

trying to get sorted on dosing in 8 hourly intervals and 240mg each time is new to me (other than previous taper attempts) and i think that plays its part, as well as the drop in dose

can’t help feeling though that if i went CT the physical withdrawals would probably have subsided by now, and I’ve still got them after a relatively small drop, that’s frustrating, but on the flip side i suspect the PAWs would be horrific if i had gone CT

 

[PharmaTrain]

There is also the spiritual war in the mind. First the negative thought comes in and tries to trick and deceive one to give up or go back. Than the action we decide goes from the battlefield (mind) to the physical realm. I've been battling addiction in some form since I was a child. At this point I know I can't do this alone and need the help of God (Jesus) for deliverance from these meds and cigarettes. I'm gong to a deliverance/healing session soon to deal with the evil spirits of addiction. Once they are cast out than it's up to me to keep this healing. The thoughts will still be there but it will be much easier after dealing with the spiritual component. Usually there is something we've went through that allows the evil spirits to enter and keep one in bondage. I know from personal experience this to be true. Evil opens the door for more evil but honesty, goodness and the will to change opens the door to recovery.
Remember the NA/AA program is centered around God so why is it a revolving door? They don't pray in the name of the son of God which is Jesus Christ. If medication is recovery than why can't someone on prescribed meds host a meeting? I like NA and used to go until they closed down in person due to the plandemic same as the Christian churches. In fact I left the church system years before the cv-19 hoax. When any gathering is 501c-3 they cannot speak the whole truth cuz they are in an agreement with the government. The denominational church system didn't help me. They judged me. That's why many turn to the rooms where there is no judgement. You may not agree with everything said here but keep an open mind my friends..

 

[Larimar]

Hey everyone ! I was here a few years back for getting off oxy .. Nice to still see Squeaky around sharing his wisdom . So i used Kratom to get me thru losing my oxy connect .. Worst mistake of my life . Been on Kratom the last 2 years and it turned bad on me . Started getting panic attacks , heart palpitations, hair breakage , twitches in legs at night , just all around feeling shitty all the time , constantly feeling in withdraw no matter how much or when i take it etc. Had a bad "attack" with my heart ended up at the er , all tests came out fine but deep down i knew it was the Kratom . Im on day 7 since my last dose and it has been a hell of a week that has brought me to my knees , way worse than any oxy withdraw !!! Go to reddit and see there is a ton of other people going thru similar things with kratom . Yeah it was my fault for escalating my dose and being the addict i am , but i didnt research the health effects of longer term use and i regret that deeply . So please be very careful with it and only use it to get off something else for a week or so !!!! Its poison and will ruin your life !!!

 

[PharmaTrain]

Hey everyone ! I was here a few years back for getting off oxy .. Nice to still see Squeaky around sharing his wisdom . So i used Kratom to get me thru losing my oxy connect .. Worst mistake of my life . Been on Kratom the last 2 years and it turned bad on me . Started getting panic attacks , heart palpitations, hair breakage , twitches in legs at night , just all around feeling shitty all the time , constantly feeling in withdraw no matter how much or when i take it etc. Had a bad "attack" with my heart ended up at the er , all tests came out fine but deep down i knew it was the Kratom . Im on day 7 since my last dose and it has been a hell of a week that has brought me to my knees , way worse than any oxy withdraw !!! Go to reddit and see there is a ton of other people going thru similar things with kratom . Yeah it was my fault for escalating my dose and being the addict i am , but i didnt research the health effects of longer term use and i regret that deeply . So please be very careful with it and only use it to get off something else for a week or so !!!! Its poison and will ruin your life !!!

Thanks for the advice but I'm also troubled to hear your pain. Kraton comes from the East no? Maybe there's a doctor out that way who can assist you in the way to detox without these symptoms online.
Also have you ever thought about deliverance from addiction physically and spiritually? Unfortunately many of them charge money which is wrong. Freely given freely receive. I looked it up yesterday and there are many that have sprung up. Make sure they are using the name of Jesus Christ or it won't work. Also after they should offer some support on how to keep your deliverance. I didn't mention the mind because that is where the thoughts come in which we must say no to. The mind is the battlefield.

 

[Iceman1216]

How did I get off of it? I cut myself off. We all have a drug dealer. They prey on our addiction. We are good customers. Are you making your own pills or growing your own plants?

Nope. They need your business, so they act like they’re helping you. Addicts are fantastic customers. My dealer was a Pain Management Doctor. He was a drug dealer that took my insurance.

I got away by cancelling my next appointment. I knew that I should do that for over a year (maybe more like 2 years). I spent thousands of dollars on co-payments. I was in horrible pain because of the withdrawals that came only hours after taking a pill that said it would stop my pain.

Bartenders rarely get sober. You need to cut yourself from the bar, the booze, and everyone who hangs out at the bar. It’s miserable. It’s lonely but you’re going to need someone who will hold your hand through it. And prepare yourself for the longest fight for your life. (Same for opiates. But the bartender reference was too perfect)

Opiates: The first 5-7 days are BRUTAL. Nausea, diarrhea, sweating, insomnia. Prepare your affairs. Pay all of your bills. Stock up on food (that you’ll be too sick to eat). And tell anyone who asks that you have Covid. Find something to binge-watch on Netflix. And strap yourself in for the crappiest roller coaster on Earth.

I tried tapering dozens of times. I was so focused on NOT feeling like s**t that I always cheated. Then I would run out of pills at the end of the month and ‘treat’ myself when the bottle was full again. Then the cycle started over. Tapering is a hopeless game for me.

If you’re reading this, find a way to cut yourself off from access to whatever your using that you want to quit. Even if it means you have to change schools, jobs, leave town, or go to rehab. This started out as the tapering thread, but the lady who started it has moved on to a better life. Now it’s the thread for people who can’t taper but still need an answer.

Thank you! I hope you have had a wonderful holiday season?
I really can not call my behavior a {Taper} !!
I Get a couple of weeks clean, and feeling better, been a long time since I have felt 100%., then take 5-10 mgs of Norco /WTF???

I needed to have complicated oral surgery ( I am a throat cancer survivor, and Radiation to my mouth has caused long term difficulties.
So even though my surgeon only gives 2 Tylonal and 2 Alive , i had my Norco.
So I am back to my 20-30mgs a day??

I really do not know what to do?
63 male cancer survivor
sober from alcohol for a very long time (came in to AA @22) not all in a row,but 95% 0f it