Bupe Suboxone/Buprenorphine Mega Thread and FAQ v16.0

[Not Again]

Welp, today went by without a hitch. In good shape and had a great day.

This is the first day in a while that I am opiate free. This is the first day of my life on the outside.

Whatever happens will happen. Bad days / good days. I think all will be good. With the way I tapered.

 

[Tommyboy]

No offence but how can you use sub unless to Help with addiction. It doesn't make you high. Try codeine instead better still DONT! That shit ruined my life. I don't like it when people underestimate codeine. It's extremely addictive but I'm going off topic so I'll leave it there.

It's an extremely potent opioid, so plenty of people use it to get high. Since it's extremely over-prescribed now in the US it's becoming one of the main opioids being abused, and for those with little to no opioid tolerance that take sub they get very high. In fact, most of the people that I know that usually took around 30mg of hydrocodone to get high ended up getting very sick from sub since they took either 4 or 8mg which is way more potent than 30mg of hydrocodone. When I started on sub I had been clean for a few weeks, so 8mg got me very high for the first few days on it, but after that I was just stable on it and just got more energy and a slight buzz.

Anybody that is used to taking suboxone would be extremely underwhelmed with codeine. 1mg of suboxone is equal to 400mg of codeine, and since you are comparing one of the most potent opioids with one of the weakest opiates I don't think that most people would feel codeine in the slightest once they got stable on sub. I never got high off of codeine, probably since I had worked my way up from hydrocodone to oxycodone before ever trying codeine, so my tolerance played a large role in it.

 

[Jabberwocky]

it may be an extremely strong opioid but it is helping many kick a habit that is killing many. sure, maybe bupe is the next epidemic/problem but for now its kicking the latest. so let's see how it all plays out. I know my life has changed for the better since; alot of people have said the and been on it for quite sometime. i can understand how after a while it become a hassle and a bit aggravating to be bent over serving the subox but however you can get by, get by.

 

[Not Again]

So after this sub treatment( BTW I'm feeling great on the end of the first day) Is my tolerance through the roof now? I started at 16mg(sub)went down 2 mg every 3rd day.

I was taking between 350and 400mg/oxy/hydro(just 8-10 hydro due to the apap) mix a day sometimes a little more. Would my tolerance be above that now? Or is it lower because I haven't done any oxy in a month?

I read that people say sub raises their tolerance to much higher levels. I'm must be misunderstanding it.

Edit: Also neruontin. Yea or nay.

 

[Tommyboy]

So after this sub treatment( BTW I'm feeling great on the end of the first day) Is my tolerance through the roof now? I started at 16mg(sub)went down 2 mg every 3rd day.

I was taking between 350and 400mg/oxy/hydro(just 8-10 hydro due to the apap) mix a day sometimes a little more. Would my tolerance be above that now? Or is it lower because I haven't done any oxy in a month?

I read that people say sub raises their tolerance to much higher levels. I'm must be misunderstanding it.

Edit: Also neruontin. Yea or nay.

It jacked up my tolerance when I was taking around 160mg of oxycodone a day, but since your tolerance was higher it's probably a bit lower now. Some people get on suboxone with a habit of 80mg of oxycodone a day, so for those people their tolerances get jacked up so much. For people with big habits though it probably just stays about the same or goes down a little bit.

Neurontin can help with withdrawals. I also wanted to say that I hope you are not looking to get high right after getting off the subs. It would be a waste of a taper since you would be back to square one if you used a few days in a row.

 

[Not Again]

I also wanted to say that I hope you are not looking to get high right after getting off the subs. It would be a waste of a taper since you would be back to square one if you used a few days in a row.

NO EFFING WAY!!! I would not ruin what I just worked my arse off for. These are just questions. I think about all kinds of stuff. Since I'm living it I might as well know wtf I'm doing. Thank you for the concern, seriously.

The thought that got me thinking about it is. I went for an upper GI and for the procedure they use a twilight sleep. Welllll the amount of opiate and what ever else they were using didn't do it. At that point I told them I was opiate tolerant , well I

told them before but I guess they just didn't believe me. They asked me a bunch of questions I guess I wasn't supposed to be able to answer so many, usually the patient falls asleep by the second question. Anyways the DR had to get permission to use more and then I was in la la land. For the whole day !!! Why can't I get high for a whole day of the oxys I was taking!!?? Well I guess I was more sleepy but I was certainly high and didn't have to take any oxy for a good 18-20 hours. Was it the

iv? Fuck guess I missed that. Glad I never iv'd but that day(week) had me thinking. Being a business man and family man I couldn't start doing that. Seems like your whole lifestyle changes at that point. Taking 400mg oxy you can still maintain a clean living and look. As long as you have a DR giving you enough of um.So I just wondered if I ended up in the hospital whenever. Do I tell them I am opiate tolerant( If they must use an opiate)

Stupid thinking I know. But you should see what my brain has been thinking since before I started subs. No no high for me. I actually feel great and am constantly getting goosebumps when I play my music. I'm a musician and I've been nonstop playing. 10 hours today. I know it's rebuilding my brain. My guitar's been with me since I can remember at least 30 years. To bust out some awesome tunes really soothes me.

Anyways.. it's been 36+ hours since I took the last .125 . There can't be much sub left in my system..?..

And one more question. I was clean for 4 months, when I took oxy again my tolerance did not go down at all. Am i to be opiate tolerant for life?

Thanks guys. You are prolly tired of all my questions. But I'm close to the end of um. I hope to stay around and maybe offer help even after all this is over.

 

[Eveleivibe]

Tommy that makes a lot of sense. Mind you I never felt high off suboxone, just normal which is why for a long time I felt completely empty n flat which was why I turned to alcohol in the evenings. That kinda frightened me though because once I'd start drinking I couldn't seem to stop. I'd drink 2-3 bottles of wine a night easy or a bottle of vodka n coke. Now I'm up yo 12 things are better n I don't feel empty but never high do doctors really prescribe suboxone if someone just takes 4-5 Vicodin in the US? Not judging but I'd have thought that dangerous?

Not again - we're not tire of your questions at all that's the whole point to suboxone mega thread, Bluelight itself actually. It's a harm reduction site so ask away.

That's ace about your playing n goosebump. You're playing music n listening to music will help those endorphins come back quicker n probably lessen your withdrawals.

What exercise are you doing as it's important. If you find you've no energy you have to try n force it a bit. Nothin strenuous - a walk, even walking back n to across the room which listening to some music. If you are standing up which you are playing apparent you can burn 144 calories per 3 hours standing (I'm not mentioning exercise because of weight , of course, just thought I'd thrown that out there).

So ask away n don't worry ok?!!

Evey

 

[FlawedByDesign]

Has anyone felt stiff on suboxone? Every morning I'm getting up n feeling stiff it takes ages to turn over or get out of bed. Im only 33 (well 34 next Monday) should not be feeling stiff? Plus im so tired n it's really hard exercising though I try very hard. Also in the mornings im walking my child to school n im out of breathe. I feel old. Is it the suboxone doing this?

These sound like typical symptoms of being on too high of a dose. Less really is more with sub, I would suggest you strongly consider slightly reducing your dose for awhile and see how you feel. I felt so much better on 8mgs compared to taking the full 24mgs I was prescribed. I also want to remind you that if you stay on bupe for any considerable amount of time the withdrawals from it are likey to be way worse than what you experienced from codeine, even with a proper taper. I'm in no way belittling your addiction, just speaking from experience. I spent two seperate years on suboxone, during one of which I did a decent taper that still resulted in pretty shitty w/ds. After the second year I jumped off at 4mgs(insufflated) which resulted in w/ds almost as bad as the ones I experienced from the oxymorphone that I was doing before I started the suboxone.

 

[RTrain]

^Yeah but its also kind of a symptoms of needing to dose in the morning. Could also be a sensitivity to naloxone. I will take like 2 mg a day and when I wake up before the Subs I took in the AM kick in, I walk down the stairs and when I turn its like clockwork that my right knees poops cause its so stiff. It goes away once the Sub ick in.

 

[Zerrr]

I remember people complaining of stiffness in a group I attended. It usually happened to people who were doing a taper and just dropped their dosage. (meaning a sign of withdrawal)

Seems more likely that muscle aches, stiff joints, etc. is caused by not enough suboxone rather than too much suboxone.


Hope everyone is doing well..

 

[Eveleivibe]

Tommy could I please pm you? I need to clear something up in private it that's ok?

These sound like typical symptoms of being on too high of a dose. Less really is more with sub, I would suggest you strongly consider slightly reducing your dose for awhile and see how you feel. I felt so much better on 8mgs compared to taking the full 24mgs I was prescribed. I also want to remind you that if you stay on bupe for any considerable amount of time the withdrawals from it are likey to be way worse than what you experienced from codeine, even with a proper taper. I'm in no way belittling your addiction, just speaking from experience. I spent two seperate years on suboxone, during one of which I did a decent taper that still resulted in pretty shitty w/ds. After the second year I jumped off at 4mgs(insufflated) which resulted in w/ds almost as bad as the ones I experienced from the oxymorphone that I was doing before I started the suboxone.

That's ok I know you're not belittling my addiction - I really appreciate it. Mind you, a few months ago n I'd have taken it the wrong way n jumped down your throat, how things change, eh lol). I'm staying on it for another 6 months n then I'm tapering. I don't think my treatment centre would allow me to stay on it for longer than that. I'm not ready yet n I'm worried that I will go backwards. I've worked so hard to get back where I am. I'm no longer drinking every night, not having cravings for codeine. I'm exercising which is a passion though at the moment it's torturous n that's coming from someone who loves exercise. I'm losing weight. I'm getting my assignments done(arranged tutorial to discuss work that I'm struggling with). I'm volunteering n attend a weekly recovery meetings for people who have quit drugs or drink. I'm also getting along with people on the forums n not p**** people off for once........ So at mo I want to stay on suboxone if I have to put up with harder withdrawals then it's a lesson for me what happens if I touch opiates again, a nice little reminder for the rest of my life.

I did ask a question yesterday but no one has answered so I'm assuming that people didn't see it. I will be drinking Christmas Day so is it a good idea to take 8mg that day instead of 12? Or will I be ok on 12mg?

Evey

RTrain: that's the thing - it doesn't ease up once I've taken suboxone. I was having my legs waxed other day n turning over from on my back to on my stomach was hard as I was really stiff.

 

[Ziggy stardust]

Anyways.. it's been 36+ hours since I took the last .125 . There can't be much sub left in my system..?..

Congratulations! Sounds like you used Sub the way it was originally meant to be used...a quick low dose taper. I really hope you have a soft landing. BUT! Just cuz you skated this time, don't let that little devil on your shoulder convince you to use opiates again. It's just not safe.
So happy for you NA!

 

[Tommyboy]

Speaking of stiffness, I was getting horrible pains in my gut from sub, and they would wake me up at night to the point of me having to change positions every few hours in order to alleviate the pain. It seemed to be from the constipation though, because after a few more times back and forth resulting in the bupe barely working anymore the constipation was gone, and so was the pain.

 

[Ziggy stardust]

Day 5

only 5 symptoms of WD persist; some of these might not go away though; I'm thinking I need to see a doctor re: a health condition that may be causing the majority of the symptoms (these I experience easily before oipate use).

I could bitch about the withdrawal but I'm not going to.

I'm trying to contrive a sense of "acceptance" about all of this.

There's no coincidence about the time I'm getting off of this either. I think I'll have to let you all know how I end up; be safe guys.

Hey... How you doing?
Everything hurts and withdraw. My hair hurt!
All the aches that opiates covered up come out with a vengeance in WD...but I'm guessing you know that by your name.lol
My back hurt SO bad in the first month off opiates that I thought about going back on methadone. But it got much better.
Hot baths and LOTS of ibuprofen.
Hope your doing ok....

 

[BlueHues]

Hey... How you doing?
Everything hurts and withdraw. My hair hurt!
All the aches that opiates covered up come out with a vengeance in WD...but I'm guessing you know that by your name.lol
My back hurt SO bad in the first month off opiates that I thought about going back on methadone. But it got much better.
Hot baths and LOTS of ibuprofen.
Hope your doing ok....

^Word! When I did go through a 2 week sub detox in rehab, I spent half my time out of the month sitting down in the shower with the hot water running, it was the only thing I could do. That was a rough experience, it was this really fancy 30 day rehab in Pennsylvania that provided detox as well, but they'd move you into the regular part of the rehab while you were still detoxing....That's where I saw them giving the suboxone detox protocol to young kids chipping on Vicodin and non-daily users who didn't even have habits...those people were fucking bombed from the Suboxone! It was fucking ridiculous!

Meanwhile, I'm attending groups and everything...taking the rehab seriously throughout the whole sub detox....They're dropping me down every other day for 11-12 days or so....They cut me off at 2mgs...and I fell the fuck apart!

They were being stingy douchebags with their punk-ass "comfort meds"...I was like "dude, I'm coming off a 4 year IV heroin habit, withholding that extra .1mgs of clonidine from me when I'm dead fucking sick is not doing anyone any good!

And that's how they were at this place...The medical director had this big hard-on for not letting anyone take anything that may even remotely give you a buzz...Once you were supposed to be done detoxing it was "Have a cup of chamomile tea and shut the fuck up!"

There were all kinds of professionals there for alcohol and shit like that...those people were skipping around with their notebooks feeling great!

Out of over 120 or so people at this rehab, there were only 4-5 other people who were kicking as hard as me, and we were all just sitting there everyday like the tin-man from the wizard of OZ like "Whhhhy?!"

It was funny, because the whole time you're on the sub detox, you're watching the people who got there before you get tapered and drop to zero! 2 days after that last dose, bam!

but like I said, there were a bunch of people that were doing the thorazine shuffle from the suboxone...The suboxone detox was the worst habit they ever had!

 

[RTrain]

^The pain does suck, but I would take 4x the pain from opiate withdrawal if it meant there was no depression/boredom or general malaise/nausea/RLS. Of course its all the combined sum of a bunch of awful feelings. That is why comparing it to the flu is aggravating, because it plays it down in the mind's of those who never went through it. You might have equal pain and malaise from the flu compared to some moderate habits, but that can be dealt with.

If there is one symptoms that I wouldn't gain much form taking away during w/d its the aches/pains. I am sure that is different for people with chronic pain issues, though. Maybe I should digress, seeing as all symptoms seem tolerable until you are actually going through them, then its hell. Like when you are high and thinking about kicking it seems like a piece of cake, but then you get there and are wondering how on earth you will get through it.

Speaking of stiffness, I was getting horrible pains in my gut from sub, and they would wake me up at night to the point of me having to change positions every few hours in order to alleviate the pain. It seemed to be from the constipation though, because after a few more times back and forth resulting in the bupe barely working anymore the constipation was gone, and so was the pain.

I can kind of relate to that. I'd wake up and have some bad pains in the colon area, typically the descending side. It seems because the bupe causes some constipation, but not enough to completely limit motility that you are moving those rock hard stools which hurt like a bastard.

I remember people complaining of stiffness in a group I attended. It usually happened to people who were doing a taper and just dropped their dosage. (meaning a sign of withdrawal)

Seems more likely that muscle aches, stiff joints, etc. is caused by not enough suboxone rather than too much suboxone.


Hope everyone is doing well..

Yup that seems to me to be the case. I think signs of too much include headaches, excessive tiredness, some irritability, maybe lack of appetite.

I get the stiff joints when starting Subs, too. When my tolerance is still too high for the Sub to make me well.

 

[Not Again]

Reading some of the posts of how sub detox is, I feel lucky. Eventhough I'm so friggin lethargic today and I woke up at 1 am tossing and turning ( RLS) I had to take 1 mg xanax to put me back out last night. Thank God I have these tools as I need them. Today day 2 and I'm Tired and don't feel like doing anything.But I'm going to do something.

 

[chrisinabox]

NO EFFING WAY!!! I would not ruin what I just worked my arse off for. These are just questions. I think about all kinds of stuff. Since I'm living it I might as well know wtf I'm doing. Thank you for the concern, seriously.

The thought that got me thinking about it is. I went for an upper GI and for the procedure they use a twilight sleep. Welllll the amount of opiate and what ever else they were using didn't do it. At that point I told them I was opiate tolerant , well I

told them before but I guess they just didn't believe me. They asked me a bunch of questions I guess I wasn't supposed to be able to answer so many, usually the patient falls asleep by the second question. Anyways the DR had to get permission to use more and then I was in la la land. For the whole day !!! Why can't I get high for a whole day of the oxys I was taking!!?? Well I guess I was more sleepy but I was certainly high and didn't have to take any oxy for a good 18-20 hours. Was it the

iv? Fuck guess I missed that. Glad I never iv'd but that day(week) had me thinking. Being a business man and family man I couldn't start doing that. Seems like your whole lifestyle changes at that point. Taking 400mg oxy you can still maintain a clean living and look. As long as you have a DR giving you enough of um.So I just wondered if I ended up in the hospital whenever. Do I tell them I am opiate tolerant( If they must use an opiate)

Stupid thinking I know. But you should see what my brain has been thinking since before I started subs. No no high for me. I actually feel great and am constantly getting goosebumps when I play my music. I'm a musician and I've been nonstop playing. 10 hours today. I know it's rebuilding my brain. My guitar's been with me since I can remember at least 30 years. To bust out some awesome tunes really soothes me.

Anyways.. it's been 36+ hours since I took the last .125 . There can't be much sub left in my system..?..

And one more question. I was clean for 4 months, when I took oxy again my tolerance did not go down at all. Am i to be opiate tolerant for life?

Thanks guys. You are prolly tired of all my questions. But I'm close to the end of um. I hope to stay around and maybe offer help even after all this is over.

No offense, but you sound very naive/ignorant when talking about Suboxone/buprenorphine/etc..

Do you know what the half-life of buprenorphine is? Well, it's roughly 36 hours, that means it takes roughly that long for half the drug to leave your body, so, including the everyday dosing you were doing, which definitely stacks up to a point, I think it's very fair to say, NO, there is plenty of sub still left in your system, and of course you don't feel all that bad yet, like you said, it's been 36 hours. Wait a few more days, a week, and tell me you still feel this way.

To all moderators, after reading this thread the past week, I think this Suboxone mega-thread has almost entirely turned into 'Suboxone taper thread', and other people with more general or other questions about Suboxone in general, are finding their questions over-looked, including myself. Maybe it's time to have a seperate thread, one for questions, one for tapering down. Just a thought.

MODs, please delete prior post, it was supposed to contain the quote that this one has, but for some reason did not.

 

[RTrain]

^You can delete the post yourself, just click edit button on it and then the delete button in the bottom right of the text box. Then you need to click a bubble saying you want to delete it and save changes. haha, I literally just did it because I wanted to consolidate this post with the one I just made below.

Reading some of the posts of how sub detox is, I feel lucky. Eventhough I'm so friggin lethargic today and I woke up at 1 am tossing and turning ( RLS) I had to take 1 mg xanax to put me back out last night. Thank God I have these tools as I need them. Today day 2 and I'm Tired and don't feel like doing anything.But I'm going to do something.

Yea its creeping up on you. Depending on the dose the full w.d won't hit for somewhere between 1.5-4 days.

 

[Not Again]

No offense, but you sound very naive/ignorant when talking about Suboxone/buprenorphine/etc..

Do you know what the half-life of buprenorphine is? Well, it's roughly 36 hours, that means it takes roughly that long for half the drug to leave your body, so, including the everyday dosing you were doing, which definitely stacks up to a point, I think it's very fair to say, NO, there is plenty of sub still left in your system, and of course you don't feel all that bad yet, like you said, it's been 36 hours. Wait a few more days, a week, and tell me you still feel this way.

Well first thanks for your positive words and for calling me names. We definitely need someone like you building confidence in someone like me. So thanks again.Oh yes I am very aware of that. I just went through a rehab that educates you pretty good on that. Not to mention the million questions I've had here in the very thread over the past month. The quote you quoted. 36 hours since .125 would leave how much in a system? Practically nothing. or a .06 which is absolutely nothing at all.

^You can delete the post yourself, just click edit button on it and then the delete button in the bottom right of the text box. Then you need to click a bubble saying you want to delete it and save changes. haha, I literally just did it because I wanted to consolidate this post with the one I just made below.



Yea its creeping up on you. Depending on the dose the full w.d won't hit for somewhere between 1.5-4 days.

Well lest see. 48 hours ago I took .125/ 72 hours ago I took .3 and 96 hours ago I took .5 and 120 hours ago I took .5

So if you look at that. I'm sure the .5 are gone. and I'm sure the .3 is gone or very little by now. there might be a little of the .125 left but it's got to be microscopic. So I think it's fair to say 95% of it is gone.