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What is wrong with the MDMA available today?

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G_Chem

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Joined
Apr 17, 2015
Messages
3,090
At this point, it has been 15+ years since I have definitively smelled safrole.

I have encountered products that smell, and for some of them, I assumed the smell was safrole. Doubting that now.

Sometimes the smell seems more like a chemical root beer than I recall pills smelling like. Almost like the smell was added afterwards or something.

Right now, I have three different products that smell. One is the piperonal synth. One claimed to be a safrole synth, but honestly, it smells like the piperonal. The other is a very dark MDA. The MDA smells different than the other two, and probably smells closest to the old pills.

That makes sense as MDA is very often made via safrole, not always but in the US it’s common for MDA to be impure and smell of safrole. The last batch I came across was a brown crystal that smelled of safrole.

MDMA is probably often sold as safrole made when it isn’t.

I had the pleasure of being in the presence of safrole over a decade ago (back when you could still buy sassy on eBay) and once you’ve been subjected to the smell long enough it’ll never leave. Spill a tiny bit on the carpet and it’ll permeate your very being for eternity. My girl can’t stwnd the smell now cuz of it.

-GC
 

user666

Bluelighter
Joined
Feb 13, 2020
Messages
261
I tried to do a column chromatography of 10g of brown Meh MDMA HCl from DW today.
I was alone at work and could play with it without anyone asking questions.

I have to report a failure of the separation because of two major reasons.
First, I did not use a silica gel with a fluorescent additive in a UV transparent column and I could not see what was going on except for the colored impurities.
I did not use enough tubes for the collection and dividing/group fractions blindly or with staining afterwards.

The Second reason being, that the flow of the solvent/sample front through the column was too slow because gravity alone was not strong enough to make it move any faster.
Because of the slow flow I was able to see the brown impurities to diffuse over a volume much larger than I intended. I should have used compressed air to push the solvent front faster, like 5cm/min (1inch/min), but by the time I learned my lesson my shift was over and coworkers were on their way to relieve me.

I though I would share this failure so others can learn from it.

OTOH: I have several Guinea Pigs ready to evaluate the separated fraction "in vivo", if I am ever successful with it.
 
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majk13

Bluelighter
Joined
Sep 16, 2019
Messages
36
I tested them two weeks ago, but now I have time to write something.

I took half the pill. 30 minutes after consumption, a pleasant feeling of lightness and bliss.
After an hour! the effect began to weaken and I immediately wanted to throw in more, I ate another half and again a feeling of bliss and lightness. Overall the best mdma from all the meh I consumed in the last year but still a lot missing from the best I had in 2003-2007 (red hearts, mitsubishi, white and red mtv and MX)
There is a lack of happiness and vividness of colors and that was something that made me love mdma.

My wife who rolled with me had similar feelings. Pupils at 50% -60%.
Another disadvantage is that it takes a long time to recover from the adventure with modern mdma ... but it can also be the fault of my age :)
 

G_Chem

Bluelighter
Joined
Apr 17, 2015
Messages
3,090
I tested them two weeks ago, but now I have time to write something.

I took half the pill. 30 minutes after consumption, a pleasant feeling of lightness and bliss.
After an hour! the effect began to weaken and I immediately wanted to throw in more, I ate another half and again a feeling of bliss and lightness. Overall the best mdma from all the meh I consumed in the last year but still a lot missing from the best I had in 2003-2007 (red hearts, mitsubishi, white and red mtv and MX)
There is a lack of happiness and vividness of colors and that was something that made me love mdma.

My wife who rolled with me had similar feelings. Pupils at 50% -60%.
Another disadvantage is that it takes a long time to recover from the adventure with modern mdma ... but it can also be the fault of my age :)

I can attest that the days after actually get easier in my “old” age.

When I first started rolling I’d often take a week off afterwards cuz I wanted a good amount of time to chill between experience and real life. I wasn’t necessarily unable to do life but definitely preferred not to.

These days I just need 1 good day of rest afterwards and I can head back to work feeling pretty damn chipper the rest of the week.

My only other thought is maybe the product I was getting in my early days as a kid wasn’t as pure hence the longer recovery times, but either way with high purity MDMA used correctly it only seems to get easier.

I notice a similar pattern with people around me, could also be cuz we have a ton more responsibilities too and no time to put a week pause on life lol.

But yea festivals as a youngin meant a solid week after of puddling on the couch, but I can do a festival roll two nights and be to work on Mon or Tuesday much easier these days.


Sad news though, my experience that I’ve been planning all summer got squashed a week before by a new health diagnosis. I won’t be using MDMA now for at least a year if not more :/ A bitter pill to swallow with all the amazing product I’ve gotten recently. (And not the kind I was hoping..)

-GC
 

fasterfb

Bluelighter
Joined
Apr 7, 2020
Messages
135
I can attest that the days after actually get easier in my “old” age.

Same. I'm in my 60's now, and I just feel tired the day after. After that, I'm back to normal.

my experience that I’ve been planning all summer got squashed a week before by a new health diagnosis. I won’t be using MDMA now for at least a year if not more :/

Ah that is sad news @G_Chem I hope it's nothing too serious. Get well soon!
 

user666

Bluelighter
Joined
Feb 13, 2020
Messages
261
What is the estimated number of MDMA users in your country or worldwide ?
I would appreciate links to any credible data about this.
 

Sopp1

Greenlighter
Joined
May 9, 2018
Messages
3
Have been following this post for some time. Either mdma dont work on me or i have never had good mdma.
I have been thinking that maybe Hamilton Morris could be interested in this subject .
Hamilton Morris released a video on YouTube where someone makes mdma, dmt and more. They even check animal brains to see if they find dmt. Maybe it would be interesting for some of you. Not sure if im allowed to share the youtube link.
But the video is called “the chemistry of hamilton`s pharmacopeia” so its easy to find.
 

G_Chem

Bluelighter
Joined
Apr 17, 2015
Messages
3,090
Have been following this post for some time. Either mdma dont work on me or i have never had good mdma.
I have been thinking that maybe Hamilton Morris could be interested in this subject .
Hamilton Morris released a video on YouTube where someone makes mdma, dmt and more. They even check animal brains to see if they find dmt. Maybe it would be interesting for some of you. Not sure if im allowed to share the youtube link.
But the video is called “the chemistry of hamilton`s pharmacopeia” so its easy to find.

Na he doesn’t give a shit..

What’s been your not so great experience with MDMA?

-GC
 

Sopp1

Greenlighter
Joined
May 9, 2018
Messages
3
they have been okey. I can have good open conversations, but not that love and euphoria people are talking about.
Felt the magic once on a hippie flip for maybe 15 minutes. I have felt the magic og mushrooms and ayahuasca.
So now i take it with psychedelics when i dont want to have a challenging experience.

But I suspect the problem could be me. Emotional or lack of serotonin. I often get this “knot” in my stomach that i feel is standing in the way of something(when on mdma). But i have never been able to “release“ it or figur out what It is.
I have had depression for the last 8 years. Did ayahuasca 3,5 years ago that did alot to me, felt love like never before.
And i was more open and had more feelings for a long time, but it faded over time and know it feels like I’m back inside my prison for good.

Is there a letting go element like with mushrooms and lsd? Letting go doesn’t come easy for me.
 

G_Chem

Bluelighter
Joined
Apr 17, 2015
Messages
3,090
they have been okey. I can have good open conversations, but not that love and euphoria people are talking about.
Felt the magic once on a hippie flip for maybe 15 minutes. I have felt the magic og mushrooms and ayahuasca.
So now i take it with psychedelics when i dont want to have a challenging experience.

But I suspect the problem could be me. Emotional or lack of serotonin. I often get this “knot” in my stomach that i feel is standing in the way of something(when on mdma). But i have never been able to “release“ it or figur out what It is.
I have had depression for the last 8 years. Did ayahuasca 3,5 years ago that did alot to me, felt love like never before.
And i was more open and had more feelings for a long time, but it faded over time and know it feels like I’m back inside my prison for good.

Is there a letting go element like with mushrooms and lsd? Letting go doesn’t come easy for me.

Most often no, it’s the reason a lot of different types of people really take to the drug. It’s malleable, and reliable (or was..). The type of drug you can take anywhere and it’ll be a good time. Of course once you’ve become veteran level it’s nice to get set and setting right to maximize the experience you only get rarely, but in the beginning especially you should get the full effects no matter what.

My first time trying it I was a depressed closed off mess myself and it showed me what love and happiness really are... In fact my first roll is probably my only true ++++ on the Shulgin scale experience, life changing. I know others who’ve said the same thing.

Nowadays people’s first roll is just whatever, back then it was like this big event cuz it was likely going to be one of the peak experiences that person has ever had. There was a lot more excitement around giving people that first experience because it was so profound, and of course there’s nothing more boosting to a roll than being around a newbie rolling for the first time.

I’ve had quite a few people have their first or best roll with me, it feels good.

-GC
 

FuckinAcidMan

Bluelighter
Joined
Feb 13, 2016
Messages
854
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they have been okey. I can have good open conversations, but not that love and euphoria people are talking about.
Felt the magic once on a hippie flip for maybe 15 minutes. I have felt the magic og mushrooms and ayahuasca.
So now i take it with psychedelics when i dont want to have a challenging experience.

But I suspect the problem could be me. Emotional or lack of serotonin. I often get this “knot” in my stomach that i feel is standing in the way of something(when on mdma). But i have never been able to “release“ it or figur out what It is.
I have had depression for the last 8 years. Did ayahuasca 3,5 years ago that did alot to me, felt love like never before.
And i was more open and had more feelings for a long time, but it faded over time and know it feels like I’m back inside my prison for good.

Is there a letting go element like with mushrooms and lsd? Letting go doesn’t come easy for me.
Good MDxx makes you forget you were ever trying to hold on, it would be a struggle to not let go of worries and hatred and doubt for me personally. But I have only started up again recently after a 7 year abstinence from all amphetamine type stimulants.
 
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Hilopsilo

Bluelighter
Joined
Jun 30, 2016
Messages
572
they have been okey. I can have good open conversations, but not that love and euphoria people are talking about.
Felt the magic once on a hippie flip for maybe 15 minutes. I have felt the magic og mushrooms and ayahuasca.
So now i take it with psychedelics when i dont want to have a challenging experience.

But I suspect the problem could be me. Emotional or lack of serotonin. I often get this “knot” in my stomach that i feel is standing in the way of something(when on mdma). But i have never been able to “release“ it or figur out what It is.
I have had depression for the last 8 years. Did ayahuasca 3,5 years ago that did alot to me, felt love like never before.
And i was more open and had more feelings for a long time, but it faded over time and know it feels like I’m back inside my prison for good.

Is there a letting go element like with mushrooms and lsd? Letting go doesn’t come easy for me.

There is sort of an element of letting go, but if the dose is sufficient, MDMA will just sort of force your hand, its inevitable and thats the MDMA we know and love. With sufficient and proper MDMA, the positive-emotional-buildup as it starts to take effect will overpower and likely gain majority control over your thoughts and willpower. Just judging by how incredibly uncomfortable and shitty my MDMA comeups are ("meh" or "magic"), I imagine not enough could leave you in that intense limbo state where you're resisting and it doesn't fully over power you (then dying back into a bit more enjoyable but lackluster experience). My MehDMA experiences can be described exactly as that; usual stressful comeup, that doesn't quite burst, leads to this uncomfortable intensity (positive doesn't overwhelm the uncomfy), and then it mellows out into a more enjoyable but still wanting experience. It's like, I let my knuckles go white holding on since the MDMA couldn't pull me down, eventually it pries me loose sort of, but its lost velocity and wasn't strong enough of a force.

Bolded above, this is what a come-up on MDMA can feel like for me, and then it sort of (hopefully) builds to burst. While it could be related to this magic versus meh MDMA, what you're describing sounds like what I imagine an insufficient dosage is. It just doesn't quite bust and leaves you with a bit of MDMA blue balls. I think this is exactly why lose-dose MDMA has a bad-rap, and just reading, the similarities between MehDMA experiences described in here and low-dose MDMA are pretty substantial. Low dose and "lost the magic" also have a lot of similarities, just reading. I know there plenty of anecdotes to go around that go against this as well, but food for thought.

On another related note, thread in general:

In stuff I've mentioned on here, I've certainly had friends where taking so-called mehDMA and upping the dose still doesn't do the trick, potentially ruling out weak or diluted product. My own experiences and the experiences of others around me with the same "Meh" product compared to other "Magic" product, the differences, it makes Meh versus Magic seem incredibly and almost obviously real. I won't get into this, I've written about it extensively in this thread if you want the details... In the moment, y'know what we all can remember about those times, the difference feels like night & day, it really does.

BUT...

These instances of my friends taking extra of the MehDMA, was extra after the fact; an attempt to redeem what had already reared its head as a weak roll. So redosing way more, even early on, can't truly be the same as all at once. As in, I can't say for certain that wasn't the case. But I always take 100mg (weighed myself, or by someone I watch do it or trust), so sometimes I wonder if my own MehDMA experience was just with product of such quality that 100mg of it doesn't cross some threshold. To this day, my strongest experience with MDMA was a cap of colorless-scentless MDMA I didn't get to weigh out from someone i didn't know, in fact I even eyeball-removed some since it thought it was looking large. This was also the strongest experience with MDMA for a lot of people I was with. As in, its also quite possible I took, we took, well over our usual dose if the caps were more than the assumed 100mg. The only experience tied with this was confirmed 100mg of colorless-scentless MDMA weighed by someone I trust who had set aside this specific batch of MDMA as their own experiences and reports they received about it were exceptionally and out-of-the-ordinary good.

Research is well and good, this is an interesting topic ive invested a lot of time into and learned a lot, but I fear this is becoming a scapegoat for other various reasons some people cannot enjoy MDMA like they want to, have in the past, or have been told it should be like. If someone pointed a gun to my head, and said, "if I give the MDMA you KNOW is 100% Magic, to the people who have been trying different MDMA batches for years on this forum that all doesn't work because its supposedly just Meh, will it work for them or not?" I'd gamble with no, its not gonna work for them. I have friends who can take, what is no less than what my large friend group of experienced psychonauts can say without a doubt is THAT GOOD SHIT, and still not have a good time for one reason or another.

EDIT: last thought here; it is 100% true across everyone I know, once you take two, one doesn't cut it anymore, no matter how long you wait. I have friends who actually weigh less than me, who early on took 2 caps or 200mg and since then 100mg is never enough.
 
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Jmoda

Bluelighter
Joined
Jun 11, 2020
Messages
106
There is sort of an element of letting go, but if the dose is sufficient, MDMA will just sort of force your hand, its inevitable and thats the MDMA we know and love. With sufficient and proper MDMA, the positive-emotional-buildup as it starts to take effect will overpower and likely gain majority control over your thoughts and willpower. Just judging by how incredibly uncomfortable and shitty my MDMA comeups are ("meh" or "magic"), I imagine not enough could leave you in that intense limbo state where you're resisting and it doesn't fully over power you (then dying back into a bit more enjoyable but lackluster experience). My MehDMA experiences can be described exactly as that; usual stressful comeup, that doesn't quite burst, leads to this uncomfortable intensity (positive doesn't overwhelm the uncomfy), and then it mellows out into a more enjoyable but still wanting experience. It's like, I let my knuckles go white holding on since the MDMA couldn't pull me down, eventually it pries me loose sort of, but its lost velocity and wasn't strong enough of a force.

Bolded above, this is what a come-up on MDMA can feel like for me, and then it sort of (hopefully) builds to burst. While it could be related to this magic versus meh MDMA, what you're describing sounds like what I imagine an insufficient dosage is. It just doesn't quite bust and leaves you with a bit of MDMA blue balls. I think this is exactly why lose-dose MDMA has a bad-rap, and just reading, the similarities between MehDMA experiences described in here and low-dose MDMA are pretty substantial. Low dose and "lost the magic" also have a lot of similarities, just reading. I know there plenty of anecdotes to go around that go against this as well, but food for thought.

On another related note, thread in general:

In stuff I've mentioned on here, I've certainly had friends where taking so-called mehDMA and upping the dose still doesn't do the trick, potentially ruling out weak or diluted product. My own experiences and the experiences of others around me with the same "Meh" product compared to other "Magic" product, the differences, it makes Meh versus Magic seem incredibly and almost obviously real. I won't get into this, I've written about it extensively in this thread if you want the details... In the moment, y'know what we all can remember about those times, the difference feels like night & day, it really does.

BUT...

These instances of my friends taking extra of the MehDMA, was extra after the fact; an attempt to redeem what had already reared its head as a weak roll. So redosing way more, even early on, can't truly be the same as all at once. As in, I can't say for certain that wasn't the case. But I always take 100mg (weighed myself, or by someone I watch do it or trust), so sometimes I wonder if my own MehDMA experience was just with product of such quality that 100mg of it doesn't cross some threshold. To this day, my strongest experience with MDMA was a cap of colorless-scentless MDMA I didn't get to weigh out from someone i didn't know, in fact I even eyeball-removed some since it thought it was looking large. This was also the strongest experience with MDMA for a lot of people I was with. As in, its also quite possible I took, we took, well over our usual dose if the caps were more than the assumed 100mg. The only experience tied with this was confirmed 100mg of colorless-scentless MDMA weighed by someone I trust who had set aside this specific batch of MDMA as their own experiences and reports they received about it were exceptionally and out-of-the-ordinary good.

Research is well and good, this is an interesting topic ive invested a lot of time into and learned a lot, but I fear this is becoming a scapegoat for other various reasons some people cannot enjoy MDMA like they want to, have in the past, or have been told it should be like. If someone pointed a gun to my head, and said, "if I give the MDMA you KNOW is 100% Magic, to the people who have been trying different MDMA batches for years on this forum that all doesn't work because its supposedly just Meh, will it work for them or not?" I'd gamble with no, its not gonna work for them. I have friends who can take, what is no less than what my large friend group of experienced psychonauts can say without a doubt is THAT GOOD SHIT, and still not have a good time for one reason or another.

EDIT: last thought here; it is 100% true across everyone I know, once you take two, one doesn't cut it anymore, no matter how long you wait. I have friends who actually weigh less than me, who early on took 2 caps or 200mg and since then 100mg is never enough.


Can people expand on their experiences with comeups? I feel like ive heard/read about it being difficult, but I feel like this contrasts sharply with my experience. I definitely get nausea, but I kind of love the comeup on MDMA, its that excitement you get creeping up to the peak of a roller coaster...but with eaves of euphoric warmth setting in.
 

fasterfb

Bluelighter
Joined
Apr 7, 2020
Messages
135
Can people expand on their experiences with comeups? I feel like ive heard/read about it being difficult, but I feel like this contrasts sharply with my experience. I definitely get nausea, but I kind of love the comeup on MDMA, its that excitement you get creeping up to the peak of a roller coaster...but with eaves of euphoric warmth setting in.

Personally, I don't love the comeup (don't hate it either), but prefer the peak state after the MDMA "opens".
Lately, I've been taking a small dose of 5-MAPB beforehand. It smooths out the comeup and makes the peak last longer. It's a great combo. Thanks to @G_Chem for recommending this combo.
 

Jmoda

Bluelighter
Joined
Jun 11, 2020
Messages
106
Personally, I don't love the comeup (don't hate it either), but prefer the peak state after the MDMA "opens".
Lately, I've been taking a small dose of 5-MAPB beforehand. It smooths out the comeup and makes the peak last longer. It's a great combo. Thanks to @G_Chem for recommending this combo.

Definitely trying this combo next
 
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