AmErICanS

Why can't the AmErICans spell PrOperLY aNY mORe?
And they want to bring back the Star Wars Defence system why??? Thank god for the Aussie Discussion Board.
Hope everyone has a rollicking good weekend..

My apologies for the grammatical inconsistancies from my side of the "other pond"...but I've seen some hideous butcherings of the English language on your side as well. We haven't attained the monopoly on it yet, although we're well on our way.
Ya know, I really think without the United States around for you guys to bitch about, your country would implode...dingos and sheep would co-exist, Koalas would finally peer through their eucalyptus-induced haze and annex Queensland...we're talking some serious anarchy. Oh, and you guys wouldn't feel nearly so good about yourselves without us idiots around for comparison.
BTW, the rationale behind the Star Wars Defense System? The government leaders feel that nuclear-capable "rogue states" pose a risk of isolated/limited ICBM launch (which is the best scenario this tremendous waste of money can hope for), and we "need" a defence. Since they are mostly brownish in color and fanatical of faith (to Allah or The People's Revolution), the U.S. government feels they will show no rational "cause-effect" logic and launch their piddly 3 missiles against us, knowing that a massive retaliation will only further the revolution or hasten their meeting with said Allah. This is the benefit of being the Great Satan...everybody likes to take a shot at you.
The real reason? Our government likes to give defense contractors billions of our tax dollars because we (like an annoying child) have to have all the niftiest toys before the other children. That's what makes us "cool," even though we annoy all the other kiddies on the block.
BTW, try to find a better way to insult us. That's just a wretched attempt by you. I would expect better of cultural/intellectual superior.
------------------
Entropy requires no maintenance. -- Robert Anton Wilson
[This message has been edited by Mr. Sticky (edited 26 May 2000).]

you really have far too much time on your hands, mr stick

Thank you johnboy...I'll take that as a compliment.

i just have to add that although poor spelling is annoying to look at, it isn't nearly as annoying as condescending self-righteousness
geez i hope i spelled that properly
------------------
got glue?

I agree with the American 'constitutional' right to arm themselves......so hopefully they can knock eachother off and make this a happy place
(my god, how did a Tuesday comment make it into my brain on a Monday.....)
------------------
Beat it like it owes you money.....
[This message has been edited by Wookie (edited 29 May 2000).]

Watch it wookie...if it wasnt for us Americans you lot would be eating rice cakes and singing the praises of the Rising Sun and the Emperor. Just leave the thank you card for WWII in the postbox.

We paid you back for WWW2 in Vietnam!!!
and i know a lot of people including myself who are still paying for it.

ah true and if it wasnt for you guys then vietnam would have fallen to communism and the whole asian domino box would have...
um hang on, lemme just go check my history book again...

Oh Come ON! People!!!!!
Do we HAVE to???

aah why the hell not.. might as well do it somewhere in one thread... make this the official "sick up to the back teeth of being drowned in american culture so havin a go at them" thread...
oh yeah and i was going to post this by spencer, its great how it took an american to fuly take the piss out of what brisgrrl was complaining about

I DID I DID!!! Hi Im 15 AnD iM aLmOsT a JuNiOr In HiGh ScHoOl AnD i SSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO LoVe E. i MeAn, I aM sO aLl AbOuT tHe
PLUR aNd LoViNg EvErYoNe AnD StUfF. i TaKe E aLl ThE tImE aNd I aM hArDcOrE cUz I tAkE lIkE 7 aT a TiMe!!!
~SpEnCeR*AkA*SuPeR*dUpEr*31337*RaVeR*PlUr*KaNdI*Do0d

Click to expand...

[This message has been edited by johnboy (edited 29 May 2000).]

The founding fatherS were absolute legends. They were so incredibly intelligent and it is unbelievable what they achieved. Now if only they could have seen the outcome, they wouldnt have even bothered! But we owe way too much to the americans to bag them so badly. Only parts of American society are shit, just as it is every where. What do we have to feel proad about? Australia are a fucking embarresment. Think republic, think reconciliation, think of that tiny tiny little piss ant of a prime minister we have. He is a fucking disgrace. I have so much resent for that man. Fucking useless. I wish he would just piss off and let fat kim take over. I'm sick of his bullshit. I'm sick of his shifty little ways of turning everything around. I'm fucking sick of the GST, and that isn't even in place yet. AND I'M SICK OF HIS FUCKING EYEBROWS!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!John Howard is the most embarrising thing that has ever happened to Australia. No questions. Little twat head. Fuck I hate him!! *rrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrr*
But above all. Look what Australia has invented: The most outrageous, most disgusting thing the world has ever seen. Something that has no apparent use except to distinguish Moe from the rest of the world. You know what i'm talking about: Mockasins. How many of you have them? Shoot yourself. Right now. I'm serious. Or move to Moe. Damn.
I am, from this moment, turning this thread in to the "Australia is fucked and I am embarresed to live here" thread.
ps: you all might hate me now. Good. I don't care. I hate John Howard. He ruined the whole :Australia as a repectable country" thing for me. Grrrr. I'm upset now!
------------------
"There are no differences but differences of degree between different degrees of difference and no difference."
- William James, American philosopher

bring back hawkey!! i reckon hawkey would've legalised MDMA long ago... oh i admit i am indulging in rosey-tinted ALP nostalgia... but its a nice thought
i think its funny how suddenly world war 2 is relevant but no one will approach the issue of guns and kids.
australia had one the worst shootings ever and we did something about it. number of massacres since: zero
america had one of the worst shooting incidents at a school ever and so far has done nothing. number of shootings at high schools since: averaging about one a week...
ancient history of battles is all well and good, its the current affairs that have me deply worried... was i alone in being sickened to the stomach watching charlton heston waving that gun about and screaming about his "cold dead fingers"?
who exactly are you defending yourselves from anyway? other americans i guess... what does that say about a society?
this is not a flame, i want to talk about this stuff...

Ever since my last post defending the incredibly out numbered americans in this forum I have decided to never touch an 'American bashing' type thread again... So thats what i'm doing, leaving, good bye, have a nice night.

Well we are still angry at you lot for Yahoo Serious and Mel Gibson, but Nic Kidman makes up for it a bit. Seriously though. Johnboy raises some interesting questions.
Is it a matter of guns being common and accessable that makes them be used in such violent horrible ways with ever increasing frequency? I think that it certainly adds to the ease of expressing one's anger filled emotions in a violent way. Im all for handguns being licensed, registered and having to have permits to own one, as I have. I had to go through an FBI check, local and state police check, and a check of my military record. Would this type of licensing for all owners help? I think it would. A major problem is that there are still so many guns out there that its not at all hard for someone to buy one illegally.
And of course those idiots who own a gun and dont lock the damn thing up. Somethinglike 70% of those that use guns in violent crimes as juveniles get those guns from their own homes. Thats sick.
But perhaps the greater issue is why we as American culture celebrate violence as an acceptable means within our movie, music, and television industries. Kids see this shit, see the hero blast 20 people in a gunfight, or see some hero get their "revenge" by killing the bad guy with a gun, and I believe that subconsciously that becomes an acceptable method of getting their anger out. Society accepts it, so they act out on it.
What says ye, the citizens of OZ?
And forget all that ancient history stuff. That was just something to get the discussion going.
peace
soulwatcher

Excuse me johnboy, do you really want to discuss this or are you looking to set up an ambush? For somebody who takes MDMA, you sure seem to be angry at a lot (at a lot that happens to be American, at least)...it's almost as if you search for new avenues of attack in dealing with us immature, idiotic, Americans (and if you use the discussion 2000 forum as a justification for your beliefs about us, keep in mind that most of the Americans that post there are <18 and wacked out of there gourds on MDMA once a week or more).
I don't own a gun. I don't believe I could ever use one unless I was on the shit end of another gun. I have a remarkable respect for life of all kinds, but I think this is due more to my own fear of death and my annoying tendency to apply my feelings to others, than an actual love for life other than mine. I guess you could relate it to the Christian tenant, "due unto others..." blah blah blah.
On the otherhand, I don't want the US police and armed forces to be the only Americans with guns...that idea scares the screamin' Jesus outta me. I don't want easily manipulated or bribed authority figures to hold that kind of a trump card over us...that's a recipe for disaster.
"america had one of the worst shooting incidents at a school ever and so far has done nothing. number of shootings at high schools since: averaging about one a week..."
What would you have us do? We are installing metal detectors at schools...hell, we are even ratting out "depressed looking" students and receiving merchandise for doing so. What else would you have us do? It's already approaching Stalinist levels...would you suggest something a tad more draconian?
"australia had one the worst shootings ever and we did something about it. number of massacres since: zero"
Enlighten us to how your country dealt with this problem. Perhaps I could pass it on to my congressman and we could follow your example. I will even attribute it to Australia if you wish. C'mon, johnboy, you can't make a statement like that and then not clue us in about it.
Children today are slowly being choked off from any kind of expression or instance of emotion. My country is raising a generation of TV fed, love-starved, nihilistic thugs whose only method of expressing hurt, anger, frustration, or love is to destroy something or someone. They are "cared for" (if you could call it that) by everyone except for their parents (teachers, nannies, day care, TV, etc.)...how can we hope for them to connect to anyone if they don't even know their parents?
Many of these school shootings were initiated by depressed, artistic, intelligent teens who have spent their whole lives as the butt of every joke in the class. Sometimes it hits a point where you no longer want to be the world's whipping boy. I know what it feels like, I was that kid who spent his entire childhood fending off the insults and attacks. Luckily I didn't snap, but I blame that more on genetics than the strength of my own character.
You speak of how your country deals with these situations better, and you site the low numbers of repeat circumstances, but let's keep in mind that your country's population is 18.9 million, as compared to approximately 270 million for the United States...that means Australia has about 7 % of the US population, so by all rights, we should have at least 14x the instances of anything your country experiences. When you take into consideration society's exponential growing pains as the population increases geometrically, then the disparity starts to make sense. Not to mention you guys have an outside aggressor to pull together over (dingos)...while we don't have the Red Menace anymore.
johnboy, I have no problem with you raising these topics for discussion (if it is really for discussion), but when you use it as one more brick in your wall of cultural, intellectual, and moral superiority, frankly it irritates the piss outta me. I know my country has done some really shitty things...I know my country has done some very noble things; I know there are stupid, short-sighted, self-centered, ignorant people who call themselves Americans...but I also know of many brilliant, caring, philanthropic Americans.
To be quite honest, your across the board, highly negative assumptions about Americans are really becoming quite tiresome. My country has the capacity for great good and evil. Seeing only one or the other, johnboy...how enlightened is that?
------------------
Entropy requires no maintenance. -- Robert Anton Wilson
[This message has been edited by Mr. Sticky (edited 29 May 2000).]

One more thing, jb...you mention being "sick up to the back teeth of being drowned in american culture so havin a go at them..."
But whose fault is that? Get irritated at your government for allowing us that kind of access...get irritated at yourselves for apparently accepting it (rule # 1 of cpaitalism is supply and demand...if there was no demand, there wouldn't be a supply of it heading to your country)...get irritated at your own marketing companies for apparently not being able to compete in the market that spawned them.
*the American pomeranian yaps incessantly and the room falls quiet*
------------------
Entropy requires no maintenance. -- Robert Anton Wilson
[This message has been edited by Mr. Sticky (edited 29 May 2000).]

*the australian chihuahua yaps incessantly*
why am i doing this? well because it makes for good debate. the other thing i'm sick of on this board is all the endless plur-talkers who get all scared and disturb when people disagree... i see nothing wrong with holding another point of view with someone, it makes for lively debate.
if i started a thread saying how much i enjoyed an easpect of american culture where exactly could that discussion go? um ah yeah i really dug the dukes of hazzard.... next topic?
without contention there is no interest for me.
ta soulwatcher for that response. i truly am curious as to what y'all are thinking. remember my thing about being drowned in your culture? well one problem with that is that all my views of your society are mediated by the mainstream culture, which means i seldom get to hear the actual views of real people.
so this is what i want to hear, your views. and one of the best ways of getting people to say what they are really thinking is to get them emotinal. well its one of the quickest anyway
mr sticky: um sorry for that reference to what australia did in response to guns, it was a major issue here and did make world press, i uess i thought you might have known about it.
what happened was after the port arthur massacre (i assuming you know about that, if not i will explain) our governement heard the cries of public outrage and acted. it banned all semi-automatic weapons completely. you can now only get bolt action rifles and revolvers if you want to have a gun. also it is increasingly difficult to buy any sort of gun.
now our farmers and country folk had a conniption fit, of course, but luckily for australia they dont hold as much political clout as the NRA and for once on this issue popular opinion had the day.
funnily enough after this all happened the UN didnt swoop down in black helicopters and take away the rest of our rights, we just got one with our lives. farmers shooting pigs had to reload maybe a couple of times and you could only shoot a maximum of two ducks in one go.
so thats what we did and i am some how proud of that. i just find it increasingly hard to believe that so many children are killing eachother now and still nothing is being done, at least nothing decisive. i couldn't beleive all the bitching and moaning that happened when someone had the audacity to make your citizens wait a whole 3 days before they could pick up their handgun purchase. 3 days?? such a band aid "solution" and still it got fought tooth and nail.
oh and as for our population difference, even done on percentages americas violent crime rate is way off the scale compared to us, always has been, but strangely is actually getting better..
but i think soulwatchers point about the culture of violence is far more important than worrying about how accesible guns are. that is one reason perhaps i am worried by the hegemony of american culture...
[This message has been edited by johnboy (edited 30 May 2000).]

Don't even get me STARTED on supply and demand...
American society is just a reflection on rampant consumer capitalism; Australia is tagging on not far behind.
Sure there are some cultural differences but we're both sitting on the same raft down the same river, only us Aussies are holding an oar and the yanks have got themselves and outboard motor, and we look pretty stupid trying to paddle against the flow.
Anyway, australian companies like BHP and North Ltd are proof that we can rape and pillage with the best of the US multinationals.
It's only a matter of time 'till Channel One inflitrates our state schools with Coke commercials, and if Petie Reith's new reforms go through, we can look forward to a wealth gap to rival our Big Brother's (although Brazil is ahead of us both in that goal).
Do you wear Nike? No way, I dress classy like Hilfiger and Calvin Klein...
But remember, y'all, when you gripe and whine about US cultural overload.. AMERICANS in Seattle on November 30 1999, then Washington in April 2000, started a new opposition to consumer culture that will continue in MELBOURNE ON SEPTEMBER 11 (BYO gas mask, giant puppet, dancing shoes...)
and remember, consumer culture is like a yoghurt culture gone bad...
..and our oar will float if we decide to swim
dear me if that wasn't a basket full of mixed metaphors...
TOM

Sure there are some cultural differences but we're both sitting on the same raft down the same river, only usAussies are holding an oar and the yanks have got themselves and outboard motor, and we look pretty stupid trying to paddle against the flow.

Click to expand...

I like this analogy, Tom... and you seem to recognize the traits in us humans that are reprehensible *and* positive. I like to see balance.
johnboy,
Hey, as long as you're trying to stir up debate, please bring up all sorts of topics of discussion. I only felt you were using it as another excuse for attacking Americans, which frankly is getting a little played out. We know you despise or are annoyed by the vast majority of us, it comes through loud and clear, mate.
No I didn't know about the massacre and subsequent ban on semi-automatic weaponry. I don't read as much as I should. Of course I only take the time to read events that will somehow affect me, since reading everything would force me to cut sleeping, showering, shaving, and shitting out of my daily routine. Unfortunately, any kind of limited gun ban in Australia ranks pretty low on my list, since I neither own a gun or give a shit about other countries' stance on guns. I know, provincial and shallow of me, but I'm a mile wide and an inch deep, if you haven't figured it out yet.
I think where the American public (or at least the NRA) gets nervous about gun laws is one thing and one thing only: when will it stop? Will it stop with assault rifles, or will the ban eventually broaden to pistols, revolvers, target rifles, etc? Too many governing bodies (both political and religious) in the past and present have lost perspective over a period of 50 years or less. This is their concern.
I don't know if I share their concern or not...it is still an open issue for me. I don't think anyone needs the capability to kill hundreds of people, but neither do I think that government is omniscient enough to keep a clear headed view about the (il)logical outcome over time. I think it could push the US closer to a police state, as opposed to the military-industrial, Pokomon buying state it is now.

funnily enough after this all happened the UN didnt swoop down in black helicopters and take away the rest of our rights, we just got one with our lives.

Click to expand...

That's because they base the black helicopters about 150 miles from my home (and hence, a very long distance from Australia)...and they aren't UN financed, it's all American, baby! Besides, they're too concerned about keeping tabs on me.
BTW, I think we can attribute a chunk of America's crime rate on one thing (other than drug convictions): cultural diversity. I'm going to make the (unsubstantiated through lack of references) statement that the US has greater cultural diversity than any other nation on the planet. Cultural diversity translated into 19th cetury terms? "Ass kickin's just waiting to happen."
Look at any country that has any real diversity...like say the former Yugoslavia. Do you see a little tension there? Shit, I'm glad it's only organized on a gang level here, and not on a truly huge scale, like ethnic cleansing in some African conflicts.
Besides, nothing more fun than shooting and bombing brown people, now is it? Nope...nothing in the world quite like subjugating those with a better tan. Just ask your Aboriginal tribes. I'm sure their stories are almost as good as some of the Native American stories.
Face it, caucasions as a group suck...so do Asaitics, Africans, Arabs, Jews, etc. We all suck, just in different, identifiable ways of varying quantifiability (shit, that can't be a real word).
Well, this thread has gotten lively, although I still don't understand why it hasn't been closed, seeing as it has nothing to do with MDMA or any other drug. *wink wink nudge nudge, johnboy*
*the US pomeranian growls self-righteously, even though he know he has done nothing deserving of a self-righteous growl*
...hmmm, do the self-righteous ever deserve to be self-righteous? That's one to ponder.
------------------
This is one of those times I have nothing to say.
[This message has been edited by Mr. Sticky (edited 30 May 2000).]