AmErICanS

[Mr. Horse]

um, I have read this thread (well, most of it.) cool... um, I dont really know what to say. Interesting, and a lot of topics were covered. Well done!
Anyway, I know I'm opening up a little bit of a pandoras box but I can't help it, I'm half British

http://www.bluelight.ru/ubb/Forum9/HTML/000552.html

 

[Fuzzzone]

Syke- you man be correct, but I doubt it. My country tends to throw its weight around far more with its allies and close friends than it does with others. Americans who get into legal/political trouble in third world nations rarely receive any help what-so-ever from our government. Either way it is all a matter of conjecture since Singapore is a country in which we have a vested interest (and vice-versa) and probably always will be.
Fuzzy

 

[Mr. Sticky]

For everyone's edification: Comparison of cultural diversity in the USA and Australia.
Australia: Caucasian 92%, Asian 7%, aboriginal and other 1%
United States: white 83.5%, black 12.4%, Asian 3.3%, Amerindian 0.8% (1992)
In this listing, white Americans also include Latinos/Hispanic. When you count the Latinos as a separate group, you're looking at approximately 72% white and 11.5% Hispanic. Hispanics are such a large portion of the population that Spanish is now considered a secondary national language.
These figures are from 1998-1999, so there is a slight margin for error.
------------------
~This space for rent~

 

[Mr. Sticky]

Shit, I didn't notice the 1992 at the end of the US population ratios. In the article attached to it (I thought) it said 1998.
Oh well, draw your own conclusions; my data is fucked.

------------------
~This space for rent~

 

[xtcxtc]

mr sticky :
i wonder how many read this far ( or will now ) -- anyway your numbers don't really seem fucked up at all and were indeed extremely interesting. i had pondered sometimes after someone had claimed aust. was more culturally diverse and probably doubted it a little.
i had thought america had p'haps 30% black so was very, very surprised it was as low as 12.4%.
still it seems aust about 92% white c/f to 72% for usa, so not very close really.
thx for the numbers.
------------------
power tends to corrupt and absolute power corrupts absolutely. lord astor

 

[johnboy]

hmmm i was about to pull mr sticky up on his numbers... i dont doubt their accuracy, well i do a bit

, but i'm more interested in breaking down a bit more.
the figure of "white" people in america, specifically europeans, is more about people who are descendants of immigrants in the early part of the century.
this is different from australia's european migrant experience, which was much more of a post-war phenomenom. this means that the bulk of these european immigrants are only now having second or third generation children which could be thought of as assimilated.
and i was speaking originally about the ethnic diversity of melbourne, the city where i live, and just today i was walking up bourke street, marvelling and all the different sorts of people i saw.
lies, damn lies and statistics is an old cliche i know, but the evidence in front of my eyes is far too compelling to ignore
*johnboy goes off to find some statistics that will help prove his point*

oh and i should also mention the situation with illegal immigrants and the new waves of "boat people". the late 70s and early 80s saw a great many people from IndoChina, by way of the refugee camps in HK and Thailand, make the perilous journey to our northern shores, often in incredibly ramshackle boats and horrible conditions.
Recently there has been an upsurge in the discovery of illegal immigrant boats up north, only this time it seems the bulk of the people are not from SE Asia at all. They have set sail from Indonesia of course, but a lot of these people are Kurds, originally from Iran/Iraq/turkey...
good luck to em i say. these are a people without a country, who have been persecuated by every nation who got a slice of their homeland.
ever heard the story of Churchill's hiccup?

 

[Mr. Sticky]

Well jb, I would try to respond, but I can't seem to find a single web site from a single source that lists both American and Australian demographics. Hence my results would probably be skewed one way or another.
I'm sure there is a site out there, but I only have so much time and energy to pursue it (contrary to popular belief

). Agree to disagree yet again?

the figure of "white" people in america, specifically europeans, is more about people who are descendants of immigrants in the early part of the century.
this is different from australia's european migrant experience, which was much more of a post-war phenomenom. this means that the bulk of these european immigrants are only now having second or third generation children which could be thought of as assimilated.

Well, I think if you went to Boston and saw the Irish culture, Chicago and saw the Slavic/Polish culture, and New York and saw the Italian, Irish, and Jewish cultures, all of which have been established for 100 years or more, I think you might change your mind. There is still a segregated feel to these areas, even though the communities have existed long enough for total assimilation.
I think the problem lies in one thing: I've never been to your country and I assume you have never been to mine. We can't see the other side and we're hell-bent on proving the other wrong. So bite me, jb.

BTW, the US gets it's fair share of boat people from Haiti, Cuba, and just about every other Carribean island...not to mention the ground traffic across the Texas-Mexico border.
And we have our own Kurds...they're called Jews.

Although they now have a homeland (by blackmailing the USA and Britain into declaring one...goddamn that puts a smile on my face

), they didn't for quite some time.
------------------
The cheese stands alone
[This message has been edited by Mr. Sticky (edited 15 June 2000).]

 

[flux]

eYe DuNno WhAt yOu PEePs iZ aLL tALkIN aBouT.
AmErICanS iZ aLL hEllA coOL aN helLA sMArT aN sHiT.
YoU GUyZ sUcK, yO.
HuGgLeS!
~*PLUR*~

 

[BeanQueen]

What the hell happened to you Flux? I went away and you were so sweet and innocent, and now I come back and you're all dark and sarcastic. A GOOD american. There's hope for you yet

------------------
"I'm good enough, I'm smart enough, and DOGGONE it, people like me"

 

[flux]

Goodness, why didn't anyone tellme that I may have appeared to be sweet and innocent? I would have immidiately set any such moron (No offense, BQ

) straight....
Alas, I am forever stuck with being referred to as "cute" by the Northeast Bluelighters. I scowl and try to impress them with my sarcasm and cynical views on life and then they start calling me "fluxy." Woe is me.
[This message has been edited by flux (edited 16 June 2000).]

 

[spazznut]

Well well.
I have reviewed my posts and found them wanting a bit! Too much party!!
I think I am being a little idealistic in my approach in this debate and now fully withdraw all my arguments on the basis of the fifth amendment.
Mr Sticky you are quite well educated and left-wing for an american!!! he he.
But I am just a silly dumb convict!
This whole thread I think could be simplified down to:
"I know you but what am I? I know you are but what am I?, etc, etc"
NAh fuk it, you are all earthlings and I am just a friendly Jovian coming down to this part of the s.system to check out the competition. AHHHH SHUT UP SPAZZY!
Luv ya's all
S
PS *Bump*

 

[johnboy]

nah i dont really want to prove you wrong mr stick, its just that i would hate you to think that i am lying when i say that my little bit of oz is an incredibly diverse bit, and as far from white breadedness as you can get...
i think it does come down to just seeing it for yourself. anytime you are in my hemisphere consider yourself my guest, i will show you all our exotic antipodean delights

 

[k2436]

Geez people get with the program. Do u think it really matters who is in power? No matter what face the government wears, the governemt is still in control and does what it wants. U know as soon as we realise one guy is a t#sser they just put in another t#sser, like things will actually get better!
It doesnt matter who is in charge, the gov't still does what it wants. Before a politician gets into a position to get elected, he has long since been trained and taught to heel, rollover, and play dead. Just look at the American president, that guys told what to wear, say, how to walk, sh!t, and even wipe his @ss.
Politicians have been quoted saying that the elections make little to no difference to the government. And u know what? they laughed while they said it cause they knew it would not make a difference. The whole voting thing is just a show to keep us monkeys happy.

 

[Mr. Sticky]

Mr Sticky you are quite well educated and left-wing for an american!!!

Thank you! I'm a college dropout.

nah i dont really want to prove you wrong mr stick, its just that i would hate you to think that i am lying when i say that my little bit of oz is an incredibly diverse bit, and as far from white breadedness as you can get...

jb, I never considered you to be a liar...it just doesn't seem to be in your nature. I think we both come from exceptionally diverse countries and have a difficult time thinking any place else could be any more diverse. We're both city boys, and cities will aways be more diverse than rural areas (in which a sizable portion of the population resides); hence, our perceptions about our own countries' demographics will be somewhat skewed. It's all good.

 

[Miss Peks]

I know this is going to shit some people, but I was looking into some old threads and found this one. I've just read the whole thing and thought I'd add a few things onto it.
I promise I'll try and keep these points short and sweet

.
Personally I have nothing against American's. Actually quite a hell of a lot of them are brainwashed, just like some of us Aussies. (Thank god we're not brainwashed). I happen to have a few American friends, and I plan to go there next year.
We both have fucked up goverments. What more can I say. John Howard the ugly bastard who won't say sorry. Sure maybe he didn't personally have anything to do with the stolen generation, but he should say sorry for the WHOLE of the country. Also I'd like to say thanks a fucking lot for the GST.
As for Bill Clinton well he can have his Monica Lewinsky while these crazed up psycho's run around all over the country bombing buildings and kids killing any other school kid that just happens to piss them off. Yeah great weapon control there.
Weather you like it or not Australia would not have survived world war 2 without the Americans. Be realistic here do you really think we would have stood a chance against the Japanese. Of course not. Anyone who thinks that we could have are either
A: A 2 yr old toddler
B: Died in 1915 or
C: Did not ever go to school
Think about it compare their population to ours. Big difference right??. If anyone wants exact figures of their pop in say 1941 compared to ours then I'll put it up in say a more sutable hour. I can't be bothered at 2 in the morning.
Back on track. The Brits were trying to save their own skin. They couldn't help out the Aussies cause they were getting attacked by the Germans. So really comapring the Australians to the Japanese, well we look quite miniscule comapred to them don't we?????? That's why we had to have the American's involved.
I haven't actually studided much on Vietnam so I can't really make much of a comment except this. Why is it always that Western societies are so scared of Communism. You probably have your own theories and I have mine, but I'll talk about that another time too.
The Gulf war would have to be the BIGGEST LOAD OF SHIT I have EVER come across. Our govt's didn't give a shit about the Kuwaiti's, they only went into the war cause of 1 thing. OIL. What the fuck we're we doing there. Oh yeah if you want to see a movie that takes the piss out of that war then hire out The 3 Kings.
Us Australian's seem to feel bombarded by American culture every day. We see Nike ads, Macca's all over the place, KFC in every main road, American food all over the supermarket, American stuff everywhere, but we should not be blaming American's for this cause we let it happen.
There are a lot more points I want to put in, but I'm too tired so I'll get back on and follow up.
I know I've mainly said a lot of things that everyone else has been saying, but I'm an opinionated person and I wanted to get my points of view across.
Anyone who wants to discuss this any further please feel welcome to

 

[liquidocean]

pretty fucking powerful, huh?
I think it boils down to imperial capitalism, and America was the first society to be fully dominated by this new mutant culture. Don't blame America, it is a beautiful land filled with some beautiful people.
Blame the culture of greed, aggressiveness, arrogance, ignorance, power, violence, domination, hatred, and short-sightedness.
It is not specific to America, shit, corporations have been divorcing themselves from nation/states for the last decade!
Give a big "FUCK YOU" to this culture and its minions whenever you can. You're the host, kill the parasite virus within you.
[This message has been edited by liquidocean (edited 03 October 2000).]