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Women. Religion’s longest running victims.

There's also the unfortunate stereotype, brought on by Rand and her followers, that women should be allowed to posses any significant amount of power because of their "hormones".
 
Gnostic Bishop said:
Jesus is a myth within a corrupt theology that demands embracing a corrupt judge.

How will you get yourselfinto heaven? On your own merit or via a scapegoat?

Revisit substitutionaryatonement or vicarious redemption and scapegoating with me just to refresh yourmemory.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uNtBkOXItqw

I am not an atheist but Satanand Christians want atheists to embrace barbaric human sacrifice and the notionthat we should profit from punishing the innocent instead of the guilty.Scapegoating IOW.

In reality, if God did demandsuch a barbaric sacrifice, he would be sinning as we all know that it isimmoral to kill the innocent. God knows this yet Christians do not seem to. Youdo. Right?

Those with good morals willknow that no noble and gracious God would demand the sacrifice of a son just toprove it's benevolence. When you die, Satan will ask you; how was your ticketto heaven purchased? With innocent blood?

If and when you say yes, youbecome his.

-----------------------------------

The other option inscriptures, a moral one, is shown here. 2 Peter 3:9 The Lord is not slackconcerning his promise, as some men count slackness; but is longsuffering tous-ward, not willing that any should perish, but that all should come torepentance.

Scriptures indicate that Godprefers repentance to sacrifice and as God’s will is supreme and cannot bethwarted, this will come to pass.

---------------------------------

It is a special distortedChristian view of love that sees, --- as the greatest act of love possible, ---their God condemning them, and then turning anddemanding his son’s deaths and thus corrupting God's perfect justice. Abribe set by God as judge himself for himself. This is of course ridiculous.

Christians have an insaneview of love, IMO.

Would you express your lovefor humanity or those you love by having your own child needlesslymurdered?

Or if convinced that asacrifice was somehow good, would you have the moral fortitude to step upyourself to that cross instead of sending your child?

Your cowardly God did not.

Regards
DL
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I think the problem with arguing the "word" of a supposed omniscient, omnipresent, primordial God using reason, is that "God" does not work within the confines of pure reason. Granted, I don't like that argument and I'm not of Abrahamic faith, but I do understand that it is a solid argument in the sense that we can never understand what God's reasoning is because it surpasses ours so entirely. It also states that "Thou shall not kill", which is said by God to man. So it's not really a contradiction. How can we define whether God sins if sin only pertains to man and is defined by God himself?
 
To clarify, I used the wrong word. God does not have reason because he is confined to no parameters. And sin is classified by the disobedience of God's word. So if he told someone not to kill someone, and they didn't, they would not be sinning, but later on, if he told them that they needed to kill someone and they didn't, they would be sinning.
 
RichardMooner said:
There's also the unfortunate stereotype, brought on by Rand and her followers, that women should be allowed to posses any significant amount of power because of their "hormones".
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To be that foolish, one would have to ignore 3,000 years of war thanks to testosterone.

There is a chemical problem for sure but it is what is in men and not women.

Regards
DL
 
RichardMooner said:
I think the problem with arguing the "word" of a supposed omniscient, omnipresent, primordial God using reason, is that "God" does not work within the confines of pure reason. Granted, I don't like that argument and I'm not of Abrahamic faith, but I do understand that it is a solid argument in the sense that we can never understand what God's reasoning is because it surpasses ours so entirely. It also states that "Thou shall not kill", which is said by God to man. So it's not really a contradiction. How can we define whether God sins if sin only pertains to man and is defined by God himself?
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God himself says that we are quite able to think as he does. They have become as God's in knowing good and evil.

If God did not lie then he is subject to the same morality as man.

To follow a God who says do as I say and not as I do, when scriptures tell us to emulate God, is telling ourselves to do as we like and screw everyone else.

Then again, that is what that bible prick of a God does.

Regards
DL
 
RichardMooner said:
To clarify, I used the wrong word. God does not have reason because he is confined to no parameters. And sin is classified by the disobedience of God's word. So if he told someone not to kill someone, and they didn't, they would not be sinning, but later on, if he told them that they needed to kill someone and they didn't, they would be sinning.
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Yes and God especially likes to order men to murder and take slaves of women.

He also has this thing about killing children and babies that seems rather draconian.

Regards
DL
 
Gnostic Bishop said:
To be that foolish, one would have to ignore 3,000 years of war thanks to testosterone.

There is a chemical problem for sure but it is what is in men and not women.

Regards
DL
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Yeah, well we're talking about a group of people that are convinced that equality destroys individuality and want nothing more than to abolish the state and let the free market run the planet. They have bigger flaws than just their misogyny.
 
The serpent says that man will be like God with knowledge of good and evil. God said that man had become "like" one of "us". He does not say that man has the knowledge of God, he just has knowledge of good and evil in the same way that God, Angels, and fallen Angels do. He is "like" God in the sense of knowledge of good and evil, but that refers to a specific aspect of God's knowledge, but not God's knowledge entirely.

"For when the priesthood is changed, the law must be changed also.". It is said that when the Messiah came, a new law would come with him. The law must be changed. It is not said that we walk in the footsteps of God until after the Messiah had come and changed the law. You cannot intertwine the two laws and say that the laws of the old testament still applied, nor can you say that all of the laws of the new testament applied to the times of the old testament.
 
Gnostic Bishop said:
Yes and God especially likes to order men to murder and take slaves of women.

He also has this thing about killing children and babies that seems rather draconian.

Regards
DL
Click to expand...

Certainly. I'm not arguing that the Abrahamic God is not a genocidal murderer. I'm just saying that he is not necessarily a "sinner" for being a genocidal murderer. The Bible is extremely complex, and when one digs deeper, they will find that a lot of what is seemingly a contradiction is not actually a contradiction. I have serious problems with Bible, and for that reason I am not a Christian, but I don't believe that the Bible is just a children's fantasy book written by a bunch of nihilist jokes. More like nihilist intellectuals that were extremely intelligent; if it is in fact untrue. But, I do not know that, and I never will, so I don't try and discredit the book because it is essentially not discreditable at this point in time.

In comparison to a lot of other religions, it is structurally set up with a defense that is rarely found in other religions, to the extent that it is found in Christianity. I do believe that there are moral rights and wrongs, but all ethics are derived from religion and I am not going to discredit any religion because it is not only endemic to man, but also necessary to establish any ethics. I believe in a God, not sure what that is, but I believe that it does exist and from that there is meaning that has been given to man from a source outside of pure reason, but because I cannot define God, I will not discredit Christianity entirely.

I can choose to believe or not believe, but both take faith, and that is what it comes down to. I won't know until I die (assuming there is an afterlife), and because I am still alive, I'm not going to try and argue with a text that is not confined to reason; using reason.
 
RichardMooner said:
Yeah, well we're talking about a group of people that are convinced that equality destroys individuality and want nothing more than to abolish the state and let the free market run the planet. They have bigger flaws than just their misogyny.
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No argument.

I have yet to se the argument for your "people that are convinced that equality destroys individuality".

Do you have a link?

Regards
DL
 
RichardMooner said:
The serpent says that man will be like God with knowledge of good and evil. God said that man had become "like" one of "us". He does not say that man has the knowledge of God, he just has knowledge of good and evil in the same way that God, Angels, and fallen Angels do. He is "like" God in the sense of knowledge of good and evil, but that refers to a specific aspect of God's knowledge, but not God's knowledge entirely.

"For when the priesthood is changed, the law must be changed also.". It is said that when the Messiah came, a new law would come with him. The law must be changed. It is not said that we walk in the footsteps of God until after the Messiah had come and changed the law. You cannot intertwine the two laws and say that the laws of the old testament still applied, nor can you say that all of the laws of the new testament applied to the times of the old testament.
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God. ----- I change not.

It is said that the tree of knowledge is basically the source of almost all knowledge since good and evil apply to almost everything.

Hurt your head on this by trying to name even three things or issues where good and evil do not apply.

As to Jesus returning. He is us.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=alRNbesfXXw&feature=player_embedded

It is to man to elect a new God and yes, his law might change some existing laws.

Do not expect the genocidal son murderer though. Man has already done better than that immoral construct. We can create a better God.

Regards
DL
 
RichardMooner said:
Certainly. I'm not arguing that the Abrahamic God is not a genocidal murderer. I'm just saying that he is not necessarily a "sinner" for being a genocidal murderer. The Bible is extremely complex, and when one digs deeper, they will find that a lot of what is seemingly a contradiction is not actually a contradiction. I have serious problems with Bible, and for that reason I am not a Christian, but I don't believe that the Bible is just a children's fantasy book written by a bunch of nihilist jokes. More like nihilist intellectuals that were extremely intelligent; if it is in fact untrue. But, I do not know that, and I never will, so I don't try and discredit the book because it is essentially not discreditable at this point in time.

In comparison to a lot of other religions, it is structurally set up with a defense that is rarely found in other religions, to the extent that it is found in Christianity. I do believe that there are moral rights and wrongs, but all ethics are derived from religion and I am not going to discredit any religion because it is not only endemic to man, but also necessary to establish any ethics. I believe in a God, not sure what that is, but I believe that it does exist and from that there is meaning that has been given to man from a source outside of pure reason, but because I cannot define God, I will not discredit Christianity entirely.

I can choose to believe or not believe, but both take faith, and that is what it comes down to. I won't know until I die (assuming there is an afterlife), and because I am still alive, I'm not going to try and argue with a text that is not confined to reason; using reason.
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"so I don't try and discredit the book because it is essentially not discreditable at this point in time."

If you believe this then you are certainly not well read.

And if you think that the morals and ethics that come from the bible are worthy, to the point of accepting a genocidal God who kills when he could just as easily cure the afflicted he created as is, then your religious beliefs have corrupted your morals just as Christian morals have been corrupted by their beliefs.



Regards
DL
 
RichardMooner said:
I can choose to believe or not believe, but both take faith, and that is what it comes down to. I won't know until I die (assuming there is an afterlife), and because I am still alive, I'm not going to try and argue with a text that is not confined to reason; using reason.
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Then you allow evil to grow and show you have no social conscience.

For the evils of religion to grow, read any scripture literally.

Any and all harmless beliefs areallowed by Gnostic Christians. We know that any myth can be internalized forgood results and as esoteric ecumenists, we enjoy knowledge of all the mythsthat man has created about Gods.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oR02ciandvg&feature=BFa&list=PLCBF574D


When there is a victim is whenthat view changes. Then you see why Christianity annihilated GnosticChristianity. We do not let the evils of forced literalism go unopposed. To atyrant like Constantine, we were poison. One of his first commands to his newChurch was to kill off the free thinkers and of course, his new tool, hisChurch, did as bid. It was quite a ride for free thought for the next 1,000years.

For the evils of religion togrow.

How can a Gnostic Christian, ---and any other free thinking moral person, --- not judge other's morals whenseeing someone hurt other because of the same Church's teachings today?

Can you ignore such things if youhave decent morals? Impossible. Especially with Islam pulling the samemurderous, freedom stifling ****.

We must discriminate and judgeconstantly. Every law is a compulsion on all of us to judge.

It is my view that all right wingliteralists and fundamentals hurt all of us who are moral religionists, --- aswell as those who do not believe. Literalists hurt their parent religions ---and everyone else, be he a believer or not. Literalists and the right wing ofreligions make us all into laughing stocks. Their God of talking animals,genocidal floods and retribution has got to go. So must beliefs in fantasy,miracles and magic. These are all evil.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5HKHa...x=0&playnext=1

They also do much harm to theirown fellow adherents.

African witches and Jesus
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MlRG9...eature=related

Jesus Camp 1of 3
http://www.liveleak.com/view?i=48b_1185215493

Death to Gays.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RMw2Z...eature=related

For evil to grow my friend, allgood people need do is nothing. Fight literalism when you can. It is your dutyto our fellow man.

Regards
DL

 
Gnostic Bishop said:
No argument.

I have yet to se the argument for your "people that are convinced that equality destroys individuality".

Do you have a link?


Regards
DL
Click to expand...

My people? I can't stand Ayn Rand, nor her followers. She's an ignorant pile of rubbish, but if you'd like to read her, be my guest.

"Collectivism does not preach sacrifice as a temporary means to some desirable end. Sacrifice is its end—sacrifice as a way of life. It is man’s independence, success, prosperity, and happiness that collectivists wish to destroy." -Ayn Rand
 
Gnostic Bishop said:
Then you allow evil to grow and show you have no social conscience.

For the evils of religion to grow, read any scripture literally.

Any and all harmless beliefs areallowed by Gnostic Christians. We know that any myth can be internalized forgood results and as esoteric ecumenists, we enjoy knowledge of all the mythsthat man has created about Gods.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oR02ciandvg&feature=BFa&list=PLCBF574D


When there is a victim is whenthat view changes. Then you see why Christianity annihilated GnosticChristianity. We do not let the evils of forced literalism go unopposed. To atyrant like Constantine, we were poison. One of his first commands to his newChurch was to kill off the free thinkers and of course, his new tool, hisChurch, did as bid. It was quite a ride for free thought for the next 1,000years.

For the evils of religion togrow.

How can a Gnostic Christian, ---and any other free thinking moral person, --- not judge other's morals whenseeing someone hurt other because of the same Church's teachings today?

Can you ignore such things if youhave decent morals? Impossible. Especially with Islam pulling the samemurderous, freedom stifling ****.

We must discriminate and judgeconstantly. Every law is a compulsion on all of us to judge.

It is my view that all right wingliteralists and fundamentals hurt all of us who are moral religionists, --- aswell as those who do not believe. Literalists hurt their parent religions ---and everyone else, be he a believer or not. Literalists and the right wing ofreligions make us all into laughing stocks. Their God of talking animals,genocidal floods and retribution has got to go. So must beliefs in fantasy,miracles and magic. These are all evil.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5HKHa...x=0&playnext=1

They also do much harm to theirown fellow adherents.

African witches and Jesus
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MlRG9...eature=related

Jesus Camp 1of 3
http://www.liveleak.com/view?i=48b_1185215493

Death to Gays.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RMw2Z...eature=related

For evil to grow my friend, allgood people need do is nothing. Fight literalism when you can. It is your dutyto our fellow man.

Regards
DL

Click to expand...

You are confusing the teachings of the teachings of Christ, with the teachings of Christ. You point out misconceptions and ignorance taught by the Church and believe that what they say is the word of God; is the word of God. Untrue. For example, "Death to Gays".

"If there is a man who lies with a male as those who lie with a woman, both of them have committed a detestable act; they shall surely be put to death. Their blood guiltiness is upon them. -Leviticus 20:13

But, Leviticus is in the old testament, before the the law had changed.

It is mentioned again in Romans 1: 26 "For this reason God gave them over to degrading passions; for their women exchanged the natural function for that which is [r]unnatural, 27 and in the same way also the men abandoned the natural function of the woman and burned in their desire toward one another, men with men committing indecent acts and receiving in [t]their own persons the due penalty of their error.

28 And just as they did not see fit to acknowledge God any longer, God gave them over to a depraved mind, to do those things which are not proper, 29 being filled with all unrighteousness, wickedness, greed, evil; full of envy, murder, strife, deceit, malice; they are gossips, 30 slanderers, [v]haters of God, insolent, arrogant, boastful, inventors of evil, disobedient to parents, 31 without understanding, untrustworthy, unloving, unmerciful; 32 and although they know the ordinance of God, that those who practice such things are worthy of death, they not only do the same, but also give hearty approval to those who practice them."

But, proceeding this, is Romans Chapter 2 "Therefore you have no excuse, everyone of you who passes judgment, for in that which you judge another, you condemn yourself; for you who judge practice the same things. 2 And we know that the judgment of God rightly falls upon those who practice such things. 3 But do you suppose this, O man, when you pass judgment on those who practice such things and do the same yourself, that you will escape the judgment of God?".

If you want to stop the horrible things being done by the church, you need to argue their beliefs inside of their own paradigm. Change the way they look at the Bible, and expose them to the things they are clearly missing. You cannot argue that God does not exist, or that he is "made up", you'll get no where, however, you can change the way that someone looks at God and interprets the Bible if you expose them to their flaws within their beliefs, and help the understand their literal interpretations and ignorance of some vitally important verses. But you have to do it within their own paradigm. Just as Christian would have to argue with you inside of your own paradigm. It's a dichotomy that can not, and will not, change anyone's beliefs without first understanding their beliefs and stepping inside of their paradigm and altering the way they look at their beliefs, but not through exposing hatred and violence; by exposing love and compassion for all regardless of their life style.
 
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Numbers 23:19 God is not man, that he should lie, or a son of man, that he should change his mind. Has he said, and will he not do it? Or has he spoken, and will he not fulfill it?"

God does not change his mind because God is omniscient. He knows all, and therefore knows everything he thinks and will do. He knows everything that will and has happened and always has. He didn't "change his mind", he knew exactly what he would do long before it happened. His mind works in order, it's not that he decided something different, he already knew that he would do it.

And once again, you are intertwining the Old Testament with the new testament. Start reading your Bible, and thinking about it, before you go and watch Youtube videos about it. What God did was not immoral because God cannot do evil, and morality was created by God himself. Good and Evil were created by God himself.

Colossians 1:16 "for in him were all things created, in the heavens and upon the earth, things visible and things invisible, whether thrones or dominions or principalities or powers; all things have been created through him, and unto him;"

We have knowledge of Good and Evil, of what is of existence, that does not mean that we know what is good and evil. We know of them, not what pertains to them unless that knowledge is given to us from God. How can I give you three things if I don't have a definition of what is good and what is evil? I simply know that certain things are good or evil. Is that some sort of rhetorical question? I mean, without a God, nothing is right nor wrong anyway, it simply is.

If your one of those people still digging around for a core ethics system that can be defined by reason, I'm done with this argument entirely.

Oh, and I never said anything about all of the ethics and morals in the Bible being valuable. I do believe that a lot of them that are taught in the New Testament are, but my argument for not discrediting any given religion being that without religion, or God, we would all be a bunch of Nihilists. And because I do not know whether any God is of existence, and I do not know that any religion is true, I will not discredit them. I may not follow them, I may not agree with them, and I may not believe them, but I'm not going to try and argue that they're untrue because there's absolutely no way to do it. They might seem "illogical", but we're talking about something that is not confined to pure reason, so pointing out logical fallacies isn't going to prove anything at all. You cannot even disprove or prove your own existence, so you certainly can't disprove God.

You're complaining about the literalists and then reading it like a literalist, except you're not going nearly as deep as 12 year old children raised in The Church Of Christ.
 
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RichardMooner said:
My people? I can't stand Ayn Rand, nor her followers. She's an ignorant pile of rubbish, but if you'd like to read her, be my guest.

"Collectivism does not preach sacrifice as a temporary means to some desirable end. Sacrifice is its end—sacrifice as a way of life. It is man’s independence, success, prosperity, and happiness that collectivists wish to destroy." -Ayn Rand
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I just wanted to see how it was delivered. Relax now.

I agree that she is out to lunch with her view. To say that man can live without other forgets that a baby needs a woman's breast and that we need someone to make our shoes as Socrates said.

Regards
DL
 
Gnostic Bishop said:
I just wanted to see how it was delivered. Relax now.

I agree that she is out to lunch with her view. To say that man can live without other forgets that a baby needs a woman's breast and that we need someone to make our shoes as Socrates said.

Regards
DL
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Ironically, she's a Christian. I guess she forgot about the Body of Christ.
 
There you go. Christianity has lost any credibility it used to have with the corrupted and immoral views that they have decided to put to their myths. They call evil good.

Regards
DL
 
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