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Why is life so unpleasant?

If there was no such word as "unpleasant" there would be no discussion on this and no wallowing in self pity. Life is enjoyable if you think you are worth it. Philosophy is funny like that, it is easy to change your views if you are open to do so.
 
thenightwatch said:
but (philosophically/spiritually/religiously) why does harm/hazard have to exist in the first place? why death?
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philosophically: it creates value.
spiritually: it gives us purpose.
religiously: it motivates us to be good people (nb. some people have a fucked up sense of the good, and this results in the persecution of others on arbitrary notions of allegiances).

all basically mean the same thing. if there were no harmful consequences, we (or any species) would not have evolved to enable the emergence of complex life, let alone intelligence. if we spontaneously appeared in our current state except without death/harm, we'd have no reason to do anything. nor would life be with any value, since it could then be taken for granted. comfort too. these things means much more when effort is required to achieve and maintain it. if you could produce the same quality food as you would get from a restaurant, your own creation would taste better.

if we could not be harmed, then we could not produce harm. social interaction would be neutralised by this too, because we'd have nothing to gain from one another (no protection in groups, no need for procreation, etc). hell, with this restriction we wouldn't even have a capacity to interact, for interaction revolves around the stimulation of the personal sensorial inputs of others. in every personal exchange with others, we can hurt them (quite badly too), but we choose not to. in a place where everyone is the philosophical stranger, this daily decision is pretty amazing imo. we are all lost, and we can't ever be certain of the cognition of any other. anyone and everyone can be a philosophical zombie, but we assume that this is not the case. we trust one another, and are rewarded daily with reciprocal behaviour.

consciousness, if it could exist in a place without harm/death, would be completely foreign to the human experience we currently share. it wouldn't be humanity. we couldn't be individuals. we couldn't form society.
 
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This is really a gorgeous thread. I love reading people's ideas about suffering.

Nietzsche talked about it. Buddha talked about it. Suffering is huge in philosophy and many philosophers have tackled it.

Joe Rogan,a comedian that I like, says in his 2007 stand-up special that human beings are just a very complicated form of bacteria.

"I think we are here to phuck shit up."

The older I get, the more this seems true to me.

original poster: do a search about suffering and read some of the philosophies that address suffering.

keep reading them until you find one that stands out to you.
 
malaise wouldn't be needed to make the good look better if everything just got better all the time

a universe with no upper bound on happiness, where pleasure just constantly got better for eternity should be possible imo

idk if it is possible in this universe, but in a perfect universe thats the way it would be. an infinite ascension.
 
I don't pretend to understand the universe but I guarantee there is a balance. Of everything. Happiness and unhappiness included. Whether it balances out in one persons one life, or through their connection to other people (others' happiness), or if it balances through past/future lives, I don't know

The highs ain't high if the lows ain't low, the lower the lows the higher the highs
 
Life is just shit. If your poor, you suffer in physical, tangible ways. If you are rich, you suffer existentially. There's no winning. We were all born to suffer and there's no way to beat the system, as when you try to do it you just make shit worse. Suffering just is, and there is no way to escape it. Anybody who claims to be happy is just a ticking time bomb waiting for the moment when they are reminded that life in general is pretty shitty, that moment when they perceive the true nature of the universe.

If there's a reason, it's because every single one of us is being punished for something we did in some other universe, or plane of existence. But I don't really believe in all that. We are simply biological constructs forged in a harsh and unforgiving universe by complete accident, just like every other biological construct, every one of us is our parent's* mistake that just happened to be for some fucked up and entirely unintentional reason.

*God, although not necessarily a conscious one. By God, I am simply referring to the chain of events responsible for the universe, and none of us really knows what that is, which is another cruel joke played on a bunch of sentient beings that got too smart for their own good. If there is a god, he doesn't give two fucks whether you had pork for breakfast or not, or raped a bunch of kids last week, homeboy just likes watching stars explode. Dude is permanently on LSD.
 
3,4- while i agree with your somewhat cynical viewpoint, and share a similar outlook, i believe suffering is optional [for most]. its a result of desire. end your desire (psychologically) and you end suffering. sure life can be unpleasant. but if youve a genuine, vested interest in bettering yourself and your way of life, your life will be better than shit and more akin to something like sliced bread or a really satisfying home made meal
 
trees_please said:
3,4- while i agree with your somewhat cynical viewpoint, and share a similar outlook, i believe suffering is optional [for most]. its a result of desire. end your desire (psychologically) and you end suffering. sure life can be unpleasant. but if youve a genuine, vested interest in bettering yourself and your way of life, your life will be better than shit and more akin to something like sliced bread or a really satisfying home made meal
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Yeah, I was having a really bad day and drunk off my ass when I made that post. While there is considerable truth in it, I usually try to remain more optimistic.

It's unfortunate that it is necessary to choose between truth and happiness.
 
Hang in there hydroxy, I know life can be tough sometimes!

IMO it's not about choosing truth or happiness, it's that truth necessitates that happiness be seen for what it is: a transient emotion. When all emotions are stilled along with the mind, then inner peace always prevails. Happiness is portrayed as a fish you can catch, whereas inner peace is what you always are underneath the changeable emotions. It's the "ground state".

Don't get me wrong, I love feeling happy, but it never lasts just like sadness or other feelings never last. So what's the point of pursuing a goal that you can never really hold onto?
 
Foreigner said:
Don't get me wrong, I love feeling happy, but it never lasts just like sadness or other feelings never last. So what's the point of pursuing a goal that you can never really hold onto?
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There's no point in pursuing anything impermanent? Nothing lasts forever, not even the universe as we know it.
 
Applecore, i dont know that foreigner was implying the pursuit was futile, but maybe attachment to such impermanence is. attachment to a feeling is a guarantee you will suffer. case in point: the junky
 
Powerful engagement with desire and emotions. These phenomena become a thick fog through which the serene peace at the centre of the universe is shrouded; our desires as individuals overpower our understanding of the interchangeability between the phenomena we place so much faith in as being real however which at their core, are not.
 
Who suffers?

The one, imperishable Self does not suffer.

And that is who you are.

Really, nothing but the Self occurs.

All your suffering has been a misunderstanding.
 
It is pretty unpleasent to a large degree. I find bits and pieces that give me enjoyment or happiness but on the whole it's kind of just a chore. But what's the alternative? We'll all get to be dead for a long time so we might as well suck it up and plow through the small alive bit we get.
 
^ I agree, in a sense. Pursuit of happiness is actually a pretty futile activity. It's better to pursue things like skills or careers. Happiness will inevitably follow.
 
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