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Why does only prozac prevent neurotoxicity?

2 bipolar: that is the right routine, you could leave some more space inbetween like 8/ 10 hours. i myself had 50 mg fluvoxamine. i took one at 5 hours and 1 8/ 10 hours later.

about the dopamin causing the neurotoxicity. this seems not to be true. research has shown neurotoxicity is more probably caused by an breakdown product of mdma inside the reuptake site of serotonin. hydrogen peroxide and heat/ body warming play an big role.
 
emkee said:
2 bipolar: that is the right routine, you could leave some more space inbetween like 8/ 10 hours. i myself had 50 mg fluvoxamine. i took one at 5 hours and 1 8/ 10 hours later.

about the dopamin causing the neurotoxicity. this seems not to be true. research has shown neurotoxicity is more probably caused by an breakdown product of mdma inside the reuptake site of serotonin. hydrogen peroxide and heat/ body warming play an big role.
Yes.. had readed the page of theDEA today and read some interesting things.. still going to take it for the assurance (it won't do any harm.. would it?)
 
The general assumption is that they will have similar effects, but until then it's only theory.

Prozac is the popularly mentioned SSRI in MDMA neurotox research because it has been the best studied. Several other SSRIs such as citalopram have also been found effective, and there is every reason to believe the effect is a quality of the entire drug class, not just Prozac.

I am uncomfortable with the idea taking of SSRIs to try to protect against MDMA neurotoxicity because at least if taken after the fact they are unlikely to offer more than partial protection if conditions for damage have otherwise been met. In rat studies, damage appears to be occuring in as little as an hour from giving them MDMA; the oft-quoted 'six hours later' figure is the latest time Prozac still had any effect; extensive damage had already occurred at that point.

Given the critical role of overheating and oxidation in MDMA neurotoxicity, the best advice I can give is to take antioxidants before use, avoid hot environments if you're going to be active (dancing) and never mix with other stimulants (or additional doses of MDMA for that matter.)

There is an enzyme called MonoAmine Oxidase present in the area of the axon in which seratonin is reabsorbed...it's job is to break 5ht (seratonin) back down. Well, it is incapable of effectively breaking down dopamine, causing the dopamine to behave as a free radical, damaging the axon

Producing oxidizers is actually normal for many enzymes that break down chemicals, including I presume MAO. (Converting sugar into energy is a major source of oxidizing chemicals in cells.)

The idea of dopamine as the source of toxicity has been clarified; rather than being the immediate source of oxidization, dopamine's role seems to be limitted to promoting the overheating needed for neurotoxicity. (Animals depleted of dopamine can suffer the same degree of damage as normal ones. Reference.)

My personal theory is that decomposition of MDMA itself by MAO is occurring, with that process being the source of oxidizing chemicals. (MAO is critical to neurotoxicity, and rat experiments have shown that something in the brain agressively breaks down MDMA.) It's only a theory at this point, but I'd put about 85% odds on it.

and causing it to curl away from it's associated dendrite. This increases the size of the synapse, requiring your body to produce more of any neurotransmitter in order to pass the same electric impulses from the axon to the dendrite.

In MDMA neurotoxicity, the axons appear to lyse (break open) and be completely destroyed. An 'injury' to the axon that still left it structurally intact should be recovereable.

Synapses are often drawn as open empty spaces, with the neurons just sort of 'floating' nearby each other. Fortunately for us, neurons actually anchor to each other across the synapse, making it very hard for them to come apart.
 
Thanx you for the great post.. but most of the stuff i have already readed on your site today :).. great site btw.

I think you can give some very, very good answers on this topic:
http://www.bluelight.ru/vb/showthread.php?s=&threadid=86543

I don't really understanded the stuff about the neurotransmitters.. but do know that vitamine b6 will produce more.. is this a good thing or a bad thing combined with mdma?
 
bipolar said:
I don't really understanded the stuff about the neurotransmitters.. but do know that vitamine b6 will produce more.. is this a good thing or a bad thing combined with mdma?

My understanding is that B6 was needed for the enzymes that produce a number of neurotoransmitters to work. (Basically the enzyme is half the machine, while the vitamin is the other half; when they combine, the enzyme becomes active.)

In people who aren't B6 deficient, I wouldn't expect a B6 supplement to have much if any effect...in theory, increasing neurotransmitter production could potentiate MDMA, causing the same dose to feel stronger. At worst, I don't think taking B6 can hurt.
 
Ok thanx.. but if the vitamine b6 will potentiate the mdma.. wouldn't it also be more neurotoxic (also because of the vitamine b6 creating more neurotransmitters where the serotonine goes threw?..or is that wrong..)
 
In theory, if B6 increased dopamine/serotonin levels it could increase the risk of heatstroke, which seems to be the key to neurotoxicity, so as a theoretical possibility yes. However, unless somebody was B6 deficient in the first place, I don't think B6 would have a significant effect; your body probably already has all the B6 it needs to maximize production. Sort of like adding more gas to a car's tank doesn't make it run any better unless it was almost empty.
 
TheDEA.org said:
In theory, if B6 increased dopamine/serotonin levels it could increase the risk of heatstroke, which seems to be the key to neurotoxicity, so as a theoretical possibility yes. However, unless somebody was B6 deficient in the first place, I don't think B6 would have a significant effect; your body probably already has all the B6 it needs to maximize production. Sort of like adding more gas to a car's tank doesn't make it run any better unless it was almost empty.
Ok thanx.. so b6 nearly do something.. i have took aloth of vitamine b6.. all a wasted?.. ah.. doesn't matters :p

The theory btw sounds very good.. i want to take a high-dose multi-vitamine tablet with 6mg vitamine b6 in it.. three times the Adviced Daily Dose.. the night before rolling.. (not because of the b6 ofcource but cause of the other vitamines.. would this be wise cause of your theory? and also cause of the many other vitamines in it that maybe could increase dopamine/serotonin or something?
 
I really wouldn't expect a multivitamin to have a significant effect one way or the other.
 
laovienax said:
can you get prozac in the UK and continental europe without a recipe?

If you lived in sydney I'd part with some of my old perscriptions (was on it not even a year ago). But I think its totally a perscription only drug.

If 5-htp is available at your local supermarket you could try that. Personally I post load prozac mainly because it puts me to sleep!!! and wake up a few hours later feeling really good like bizarely normal.
 
sydkiwi said:
If you lived in sydney I'd part with some of my old perscriptions (was on it not even a year ago). But I think its totally a perscription only drug.

If 5-htp is available at your local supermarket you could try that. Personally I post load prozac mainly because it puts me to sleep!!! and wake up a few hours later feeling really good like bizarely normal.
K.. i give the SSRI a shot :)... badly enough it's not prozac..
 
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