Why do addicts go to AA?
- Thread starter lozgod
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Jabberwocky
Frumious Bandersnatch
I encourage people to give meetings a try and to not judge "the program" by a single meeting or experience.stuckinaloop said:
But stating that AA/NA is NOT religious is more a wish than a reality. Meetings have a repetitive format also called ritual. AA/NA has tenets or dogma. It has literature filled with talk of God. Also called scripture. Meetings address a higher power in prescribed fashion. This is called prayer. OK we have tenets, ritual, scripture, and prayer. Give me a trait of a religion that AA/NA lacks. Its not precisely the same as some other religions. Penguins, falcons, and ostriches are categorized as birds by their possession of bird traits. If you want to argue that one of those groups is not a bird you would do it by defining birds. Just saying "Owls aren't birds, cased closed!" seems weak to me.
The OP aint asking about why do addicts go to 12 step meetings. He is asking why would a drug addict go to ALCOHOLICS anonymous instead of NARCOTICS anonymous.
The question here aint "Why would a person go to one of these groups" but just asking why when there is a program just made for addicts, why they would go to the program centered around alcohol. I think like 90% of the people replying here are totally missing the point of his question.
The question here aint "Why would a person go to one of these groups" but just asking why when there is a program just made for addicts, why they would go to the program centered around alcohol. I think like 90% of the people replying here are totally missing the point of his question.
lozgod
Bluelighter
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Great reply. Due to my religous beliefs I do not pray, I only meditate, well I did before I was a junkie but you are correct. Wow, never thought of it that way,. You did the right thing though stating give it a chance before defining it from a religious aspect.
Jabberwocky
Frumious Bandersnatch
And the thread took on a life of its own as they tend to do but the vast majority of the timelacey k said:
Its that AA is more available plus some like the style or community aspects better at AA most of the time. Most AA meetings accept that we live in a poly-drug using now though some odd meetings still get bent out of shape about the alcohol distinction.
lozgod
Bluelighter
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You are correct but I ran with the ball because the conversation got interesting. Still interested in an answer but I don't think anyone that answers even attends 12 step fellowships.lol.
SubDude
Bluelighter
In my city... there are at least 10-1 AA vs NA meetings which makes it much more convenient to catch the AA. Since both focus on total sobriety... no big difference. Many yrs ago I went to a few CAA meetings. But don't see them around anymore??
A lot of people that I was in rehab with preferred AA over NA even though they were drug addicts.
They said that the parking lot of the NA meetings was full of flashy cars, and the people were all about showing off what they had now that they had money to spend.
I realize that is a trend amongst many of the drug addicts that I know that are now clean.... They all have flashy cars, listen to rap music that is mostly about drugs and violence, and still talk like they are in "the game".
They said that the parking lot of the NA meetings was full of flashy cars, and the people were all about showing off what they had now that they had money to spend.
I realize that is a trend amongst many of the drug addicts that I know that are now clean.... They all have flashy cars, listen to rap music that is mostly about drugs and violence, and still talk like they are in "the game".
blues runner
Bluelighter
Nope, it was on. I suggest turning yours on and exercising skills such as learning how to read between lines, using dictionaries to discover the definitions of words like 'euphemism' and 'semantic'. Or perhaps you don't like to not only increase reasoning and interpretive skills, you also have a disdain for improving your vocabulary.
QUOTE=stuckinaloop;9033145]
it would be AGAINST aa/na rules to close a meeting with the our father prayer. I have been to probably atleast 1000 na/aa meetings, never once have we broken out into prayer from the catholic church and started worshiping some bullshit lol. don't spew a bunch of crap when you have no idea what you're talking about.
[/QUOTE]
Truly, you really should get out more. Where do you live? How much do you travel? I've lived in three different continents (I won't count the countries), lived everywhere from New York to Newport Beach in the states, and the two thousand or so meetings of all 12 step sorts that I've been to all have something in common. They share a percentage of how often they close their meetings with Christian prayers (in particular the Our Father). In Belgium, in Holland, in Germany, in Portugal, in Singapore, in India, in Brazil, in New York, in Delaware, in Idaho, in Tennessee, in sunny California. Shall I go on? You travel much buddy?
Why are you so angry? By your own admission you're a 12 stepper. Is cursing and defensive rudeness the kind of recovery they encourage at the meetings you attend? I've got an idea. How about you don't spew a bunch of crap when you have no idea what you're talking about because a) you haven't done your homework, b) you haven't explored a fraction of the world that I have, and c) your anger isn't a very admirable quality coming from the mouth of a 12 stepper, and last but not least d) you don't know how to watch your manners like a civilized human being.
SubDude
Bluelighter
hmmm... another know it all world traveler. Ok I'm going to stop before I say something regretful. Anyway, suggest you go over to the BL lounge so you can discusss all your impressive journeys there. Don't believe it's relevant to this discussion.
blues runner
Bluelighter
No, I'm not a know it all. Hardly. I've got a lot to learn. I'm an addict in a bad way. But I don't like it when people rudely assert that "I had my brain turned off," throw in a bunch of accusatory profanity, and shamefully misrepresent the kind and helpful organization they're supposedly a part of and defending.
As for my 'world traveling', I had no choice. And the journeys weren't "impressive". I brought up my travels and experience of various places to illustrate my having seen, everywhere, the common thread of religious undertone I've found to be the case to the backbone of 12 step philosophy in general. No need to be jealous of me for my travels either pal; I've been through hell and back. And they're nothing to brag about, that's for damn sure. You think I'm trying to show off? You don't know anything about me. So please, do me a favor and don't smugly "suggest that I go elsewhere because my points aren't relevant here."
Or maybe you just enjoy defending a bluelighter who's rude and hypocritical, and prefers shortcuts to thinking?
lozgod
Bluelighter
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lol. True sometimes. I think addicts come from different backgrounds economically. We focus on economic recovery first. We can afford an Acura and apt and we are doing good, still manipulating our way through life. Eventually going down the 12 step path changes people. I know before I relapsed I was changing. The 4th step was so painful I gave up on it and stopped going to meetings and ended up relapsing. I remember getting clean and buying a Maxima and hooking it all up an I thought that was recovery. lol. 4th step showed me different.
In my area NA meetings start at 7:30am and go until 9:00pm. And there are true people in recovery. I guess I am lucky to have that if I live long enough to make it back.
Psychedelic Jay
Bluelighter
stuckinaloop
Bluelighter
@@blues runner
what the fuck are you talking about stop spewing a bunch of bullshit
that's your argument? attack my vocab and name off the different states and shit you've been to? way to keep on point!! you've got me so beat
what the fuck are you talking about stop spewing a bunch of bullshit
that's your argument? attack my vocab and name off the different states and shit you've been to? way to keep on point!! you've got me so beat
peteypablo
Bluelighter
AA meetings can be more convenient(more times, places). Back in the day you couldn't even mention drugs at AA but that's changed. Of the AA meetings I've attended in the Chicago area in the past it seems like a majority of participants are cross addicted to other substances besides booze and talk about it freely.
SubDude
Bluelighter
^ wasn't aware of that. Thats good because I've always liked to mix up some booze with my other drugs... will feel more comfortable if I go back.
blues runner
Bluelighter
OK stuckinaloop. I'm gonna make this real easy to understand (at least for most people; hopefully you'll qualify too). Actually, come to think of it, I'll answer your very mature post to me in two different ways. Choose whichever you prefer. And please, do me a favor and try not to answer this by something like, "I don't give a fuck what you think, you shit spewing motherfucker!", or something like that. It's just so pathetically childish.
Answer #1:
Grow up, would you? This isn't a competition, a fight or a bragging board. It's (hopefully) a place where people engage in meaningful conversation that helps, informs, prompts others to think.
It's obvious to me that you rather become aggressive, defensive and (hopefully unintentionally) - incredibly confused.
If your brand of 'spiritual awakening' is the kind they foster at your meeting hall, remind me to avoid it like the plague.
Way to represent 12 step philosophy like a pissed off, jealous, cognitively-challenged, clueless child.
Answer #2:
I wasn't 'spewing a bunch of bullshit'. I wasn't 'attacking' anyone or anything. And, for the second time, I certainly wasn't trying to show off by naming the places I've traveled to. Do you attend 12 step meetings? If so, I'm amazed at how knee-jerk your reactions are, how angry you seem, and how resistant to thinking out different points of views you apparently are. (Actually, I'm amazed at how either opposed to or incapable you are of thinking, period). No offense. Just an observation. I could be wrong and you could be the greatest guy in the world (though I just kinda doubt it).
If I had never been to a 12 step meeting and was considering it, then read one of your posts...I think I'd decide to avoid it like the plague. I'd probably think something along the lines of, "Wow, is that the kind of result going to AA brings about in people? No thanks, not for me." Stuckinaloop: if you like your meetings and what they do for you, it might be a good idea to not come across on an internet discussion board like a pissed off, defensive, stubborn, insulting asshole. Just a thought.
As for your having said, 'Way to keep on point, you've got me so beat,' my words went over your head faster than Homer can eat donuts didn't they? I named off the different meeting locations I've been to over the many years I've been to meetings in order to illustrate how they all had my observation of religious flavor in common. That's called keeping on point. When I posit something, I always make an effort to back it up with evidence, either theoretical or empirical, in order to give my statements some credibility.
Lastly, it's not about "getting anyone beat". It's about meaningful communication and honest communication that hopefully prompts more meaningful communication. A discussion board like this one isn't about housing fora in which people purposefully post information to "beat out" other posters. It's about observations, experiences, concerns, info-seeking on the very serious issue of addiction.
Oh, and you never answered my question...Your interpersonal style, your anger, your evident feeling that this is about competition and put-downs - not about idea-sharing, making points backed up by personal experience, about curiosity and concern...
Is that the kind of "spiritual awakening" they're about at your 12 step meetings? Is that what your higher power is all about? Sounds like it's all working out miraculously for you buddy. Congratulations, and keep coming back.
stuckinaloop
Bluelighter
I am still an addict...barely in recovery. It hasn't worked for me...but I keep going.
You guys, seriously... enough of this 12 step BS... "powerless over drugs and alcohol for life?" what a bunch of shit. Whatever emotional trauma that one has endured to cause one to seek substances to soothe over the trauma should be dealt with and resolved instead of this admitting defeat over substances for life nonsense, haha. These guys that are going to meetings for 43 years is just retarded.8)