Why are drugs illegal?

[Runner]

tobacco and alcohol historical drugs?? bullshit
the mummies had traces of marijuana and cocaine in them, not to mantion oracles using the ibis for hallucinogenic properties

Tobacco and alcohol are deeply entrenched in Western culture. Other drugs are NOT. This is the explanation why one can buy tobacco over the counter and one cannot buy a 50 of smack. I do not agree with this since tobacco causes way more damage to the body than heroin and is very addictive due to nicotine content, but I accept this as I do many other things that I would change if I had a magic wand. (Get a hint that I hate smokers yet? Of course, one cannot realistically OD on tobacco, but one can easily OD on heroin.

Many cultures around the world have used various drugs from the beginning of time - this doesn't mean that they have become entrenched in societies. Very few drugs have. Alcohol and tobacco are examples of Western cultures' drugs. I believe Khat is used during the Muslim Ramadan period, so it is probably part of some Muslim cultures in the Middle East and Africa.

as if the fucking god people of any denomination should have their rights over mine. especially when the greatest crock-o-shit fraud in history is the existence of any "god."

As much as I agree with what you are saying in that last part of the sentence, I have to say that many religious groups do not believe that they have "rights" over anyone. There are many "semi-religious" people many of who do not actually believe in God, but still follow certain traditions of the religions they were born into as a cultural thing. It also must be said that the Judeo-Christian moralism just happens to coincide with the values of the majority of the world. This has nothing to do with the 10 commandments or whatever. There is no causality. And if there was, the morality comes first and THEN the 10 commandments. What is right and what is wrong comes from the social evolution of the speices, just like organised societies and just like rules, laws and traditions. This works for the whole animal kingdom.

 

[SteveElektro]

"It also must be said that the Judeo-Christian moralism just happens to coincide with the values of the majority of the world."
Just happens?
Fact is that Judeo-Christian moralism is the foundation of western moral thought. It's no coincidence that activities such as sex and drug taking are seen as taboo in western civilisation, it is precisely because of our Judeo-Christian roots.

 

[dfi]

my opinion is plain and simple.....
no-where near enough research has been done on these substances.... alcohol+tobbaco have been around for centuries and we know what they will do to you.
where am i going to end up in 30 years down the track, heavy recreational drug use? no-one knows yet.... and untill that is established, an air tight explenation of what each one of us will end up doing with ourselves then nothing will be done about legality......
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Yr 12 class of 2003 - 4 exams down, 2 to go

DfI

 

[.dR spgeddi]

It also must be said that the Judeo-Christian moralism just happens to coincide with the values of the majority of the world.

firstly i'm not really sure this is true.
secondly people believe whatever they are told to believe because unfortunately most people prefer not to think for themselves.
thirdly they are wrong... there is no reasonable foundation for a belief system that includes a supreme being outside our bodies.

 

[Runner]

thirdly they are wrong... there is no reasonable foundation for a belief system that includes a supreme being outside our bodies

Again, I agree completelly. But what has the morals have to do with God? What has "Thou shalt not steal" have to do with God? Just because someone a long time ago wrote that "God" said this, doesn't mean it so BECAUSE "God" supposedly said this. It is true because if it wasn't, the society would fall apart and slip into Anarchy and Chaos. The stronger would steal from the weaker, but the weaker would also steal from even weaker, which ultimatelly would lead the strongest to again implement some kind of a law agaist stealing but of course exclude themselves. We've seen this many times in history. "Thou shalt not steal" moral works to benefit a society whether fairly, like mostly today, or unfairly like in the Middle Ages. It works to benefit a society not because someone said that it does, but just because it DOES. Just like if you have 2 apples and you want 4, you have to add another two apples - not because someone said that's how you get 4 apples, but because when you add 2 apples to 2 apples and count them, you find you have 4 apples.

It is a clever coincidence that many things that make our society work appear to have roots in religion. What if there was no religion? What if no one has ever heard of "God"? Do we think that our society's values would be very different? I think not - "Thou shalt not steal" and many others would hardly remain altered. In respect to Judeo-Christian beliefs, whoever knew that many of these values HAVE to form a functioning society 4000 years ago (which is where the Hebrew roots lie I believe, correct if I am wrong) had great power - greatest power the world has ever seen, for they created God.

 

[eccitude]

The stronger would steal from the weaker, but the weaker would also steal from even weaker, which ultimatelly would lead the strongest to again implement some kind of a law agaist stealing but of course exclude themselves.

Ooops .. thought you were slagging off the root course of all evil but then realised you were referring to God, and not the farken Americans. 8)

 

[BigTrancer]

Yeah... righto... so in summary drugs are illegal because religion and the Americans are evil?

BT

 

[Tabernacle]

People should check out:
Rouse, J. & Johnson, B. (1991). 'Hidden paradigms of morality in debates about drugs: historical and policy shifts in british and american drug policies in J. Inciardi (ed) THE DRUG LEGALIZATION DEBATE. Newbury Park, Ca.: Sage pp 183-214.
For a complex and informed account of the debate that isn't so reductionist as this debate here.

 

[sixthseal.com]

Here's what I think...drugs are illegal due to the potential social problems it can cause eg crime rate and the potential health issues. Personally, I think truly responsible users and experiemental users is by far the minority of the drug use scene. I guess this goes without saying, but the majority of drug users do not post on bluelight and they certainly do not research the drugs they're taking, nor do they give two shits about it. This is just a qualitative observation and personal opinion though.

 

[Runner]

^^^ It's not just your opinion - its a FACT. To prove it, all one has to do is count the unique user visits to the major harm reduction sites and compare this to the total estimate of drugs users.

Yeah... righto... so in summary drugs are illegal because religion and the Americans are evil?

This discussion has strayed from the topic, but to bring it back and make it clear, my opinion is that certain drugs ARE LEGAL because they have historically entrenched themselves into the Western society. (eg. tobacco, alcohol). Other drugs are prescription only because of potential for abuse and drugs that have no medicinal value and have potential for abuse that leads to anti-social behaviour (as proven over the years in current Australian society - NOT Dutch, they are obviously different, and not Mull, hence current law reforms) are outright illigal.

Someone else brought up religion and tied this debate to the Judeo-Christian moralism.

 

[Nice Tits]

Runner - you still havn't explained wat all that moral/religion stuff had to do with drugs.

Why can't drugs be sold legally in pharmacies or something with a leaflet inside with all known information about that drug - leaving it up to the end user to make a decision for themsleves - but a decision based on fact rather than rumours and uncertainty like it is at the moment. Government could tax the drugs and spend that money on drug education or rehab clinics.

Have u ever noticed when reading government sponsered drug education pamphlets they always say that one of the major risks of any drug is not knowing what your getting. How easy is that to solve?

Niec Tits

 

[Runner]

Runner - you still havn't explained wat all that moral/religion stuff had to do with drugs.

Ask that of whoever tied religion into this. I didn't. Everything I wrote in regard to religion has nothing to with this thread, but was only a RESPONSE to a few posts trying to erroneously tie religion into this debate.

Why can't drugs be sold legally in pharmacies or something with a leaflet inside with all known information about that drug - leaving it up to the end user to make a decision for themsleves - but a decision based on fact rather than rumours and uncertainty like it is at the moment.

Because if meth or smack was sold in pharmacies without prescription with a nice informative leaflet, we would have as many smack addicts and meth addicts as cigarrete smokers. Notice how everyone these days is well and trully informed about the dangers of cigarrete smoking (effects of which are much more harmful to the body than the effects of heroin), but everyone still seems to smoke - even when their smoking is interfering with non smokers (ppl smoking in outside areas in restaurants when one is trying to enjoy a meal in fresh air). This is a drawn out explanation of a common sense concept.

Have u ever noticed when reading government sponsered drug education pamphlets they always say that one of the major risks of any drug is not knowing what your getting. How easy is that to solve?

You buy a test kit and visit sites such as this

 

[Psychadelic_Paisly]

Don't you read the news? They're bad for you

 

[banga]

i love politicians

why are some drugs illegal?

i suppose it boils down to what is perceived as acceptable.

alcohol and tobacco are harmful.... yet their use is accepted because they have been around for a long time. better the devil you know i suppose.

with drugs like ecstasy, coke, heroin and speed their use is again perceived as harmful, but because they are 'new' drugs they are an unknown quantity which scares our pollies.

the funny thing is, as i see it, is that the pollies have no problem endorsing gambling addiction yet shun drug addiction!

 

[nickthecheese]

Goddamn moral-crusaders, stop ruining my fun, I dont belive in your false god!

Steve has hit the issue right on the head. People enforcing their moral values on others, without right or permission, becuase they belive that they are doing the right thing. The media and spin-doctors have been impregnating the culture of FEAR about drugs. "ooh junkies will beat you for their next hit ect ect" just look at any of the old american propaganda films about drug control, like reefer madness....

It all stems from control. All of the impregnated(or dare I say programmed - mainly from television) values I had, I lost when I undertook a healthy regiment of psychedelic drugs I belive that I've come out the other side, a better and more well adjusted person. No-longer am I quick to judge based on appearance, creed, race. I don't unnecessarily criticize as a 'joke'. I don't believe in the widely circulated social taboo's - because really, there is no right and wrong, only (moral) and/or popular opinion. Maybe the right-wing 'powers-that-currently-be' don't want an enlightened, educated populous... why?

...they think for themselves, ergo, they're much harder to control...




(or maybe I've just taken too much acid )

 

[dimmo]

^

MMMM Acid

 

[Raving Loony]

If you buy a product from a pharmacy it must have an approved medical purpose. Street drugs in almost every case dose not serve such a purpose at all. However, one 'could' potentially get a 'trippers perscription' *grins*. Where you local Doctor looks at your record to see how often you have been issued 'medicine' and using from their judgement the can issue a perscription. You have the legal hassle that 'medicine' would have a lengthy impearment on your judgment, most notably when it came to driving. The number of people who would rock up to work on a monday or a tuesday still spangled from the weekend would certainly make employers angry and apply pressure to have 'trippers perscriptions' removed by simply applying pressure to the government. The solution in my opinion is that the pescribee must present proof that he/she will not be doing any work over the next three or four days. Therefore there is a need for the doctor to know exactly how many employers you have.

However, simply buying street drugs in pharmacy will simply never work in a world where you can be sued for serving coffee that was too hot without warning labels. Eating just half a pill for some people is too much. These ideas of legalisation have been thought of for long time. Take the 60's and the early 70's for example. There were doctors would just hand out drugs like candy because item represented more money. For instance, Freddie Prinze killed himself in front his manger in his room aged 22. He got hooked on Quaaludes after he was just allowed to munch them down at will until he went insane. It was incidents like this, a worrying media and the Christians *wink* that has played it's part to where we are today even though the young people of 60's and 70's now run the countries around the world.

But I like the idea that people should be able to just do what they want with drugs without the fear of criminal charges. Decriminalisation takes away the harsh edge that a criminal record creates, but is still legislated such that fines can be issued to those who's abuse becomes a hazard to those around you. I'm all for handing out fines to the really stupid people. Hit them where it hurts, their hip pocket.

 

[dexter_stayne]

if all 'safe' users post on here.. i reckon drugs should be lagalized.. just for bluelighters... hee hee

 

[eggo]

what we need is someone in the senate who is willing to pick up our cause, its a damn site more sensible than pauline hanson's chop at politics with one nation. this is the pinicle of free speech, we will either end up with legit drugs or get alcohol and cigarettes banned. Vote 1 p_d.

 

[UnSquare]

Hypocritical

I think alcohol causes me twice as much harm
as any other drug I take, so at least one
other should be legalised.
It just doesn't seem fair.