Who here would do a thumbprint?

[BreakingSet]

I found this link from an old thread here, a good read if you want to know more about this: http://www.shroomery.org/forums/showflat.php?Cat=&Number=1427364&page=&view=&sb=5&o=&fpart=all&vc=1

Bump. Do yourself a favor and check out the link.

 

[nanobrain]

so as y'all have figured out by now, printing is for those select few who have committed to the evangelical lifestyle.

this right of passage is not something you seek out, but is something that is offered to you by the higher ones if you are being considerd for bigger things. otherwise, you will most likely not ever see the little glass bottle in this lifetime...

companionship becomes irrelevant for the voyager, as is the possibility of a bad trip - the receptors are saturated so quickly, there is almost immediate merging w/the white light, complete OOB - no body awareness or body to worry about.

but a sitter who will clean up your excretions and water you for about 3-7 days is essential.

for those considering, it is a one-way ride, really.

 

[Psychedelics_r_best]

I always thought that the effects of LSD lasted about 12 hours no matter how much you took. But I suppose taking so much would reasonably last a long time.

Does it really matter how you take the dose though. Drinking a vial would be the same, as would eating 100 hits.

 

[fastandbulbous]

What's the point in taking 10mg+ of LSD in one go? You reach a 'saturation' effects with a dose somewhere between 500-1000ug (0.5-1mg); beyond that the effects don't get any more intense, they just go on (and on and on). You're not gaining anything by taking a dose that goes beyond a saturation dose, but you are putting yourself at a much greater risk of developing a whole load of psychotic symptoms and basically your life turning to shit.

As glog mentioned, some people do it with thoughts towards some sort of evangelical mission in life, but for the most part I'd say that most people wanting to take a single dose exceeding 2mg (well beyond a 'saturation' dose) are in some degree indulging in 'acid machismo' the way that some people do with other drugs - the 'I can take more than anyone/watch how much I can handle' type of mentality.

If anyone disagrees, please feel free to explain what possible advantage there is to taking such a massive dose that is way beyond that needed to get the strongest possible effects from LSD - I'd be fascinated to hear why someone would want to risk their mental health with doses in the 10's of milligrams

 

[nanobrain]

^^eating a sheet and a print are an order of magnitude different.

as mentioned, it is a right of passage for the chosen - usually not for the choosing. whether it has any 'advantages' over just eating 1mg is questionable.

receptor saturation (5HT2x) happens when you eat a good 10 strip to a sheet. when you print, the saturation extends to all other receptor subtypes AFAIK, there are latent LSD effects that manifest strongly, you are out for days (tabula rasa), scrambled for about a week, changed for life.

any 'imprinting' you may have had is wiped clean. you have been reborn, it is up to you as how to channel your new karma. or so i am told.

 

[fastandbulbous]

I've attached a chart of LSD receptor affinities (from BilZ0r's gallery) that I've modified to show which receptors would be activated by doses of 1000ug & 1500ug. The original chart had marked (black line) those activated by a standard (100ug) dose of LSD. As LSD isn't highly lipophillic, it will not be subject to absorbtion & subsequent slow release from body fat, such as THC & PCP for example, are subject to so there will be a linear correlation between the dose ingested and the concentration achieved at the given receptors in the CNS.

At 1500ug all but 5HT3, 5HT4, beta-2 noradrenergic and H1 receptors are activated. Now the two 5HT receptors are mainly concerned with the GI tract (5HT3 primarily causing vomiting & 5HT4 being involved with peristalsis), the beta-2 noradrenergic with cardiovascular and smooth muscle (such as the muscles causing broncioconstriction) and H1 with immunological responses/injury (H1 antagonists causing drowsiness as seen with the older antihistamines). In any case, the affinities for these receptors are off the chart in terms of the concn needed.

As such, it's difficult to see how 'thumbprint' doses (10-40mg) could cause activation of any significant receptor types that wouldn't already be activated by a dose of 1500ug. The only real difference would be the duration of the effects, which would be much longer for doses in excess of 10mg as it would take more half-lives to reduce the concn of LSD to one that had no significant effect on the main receptors involved in it's action on the CNS.

 

[andruejaysin]

I guess I probably would, not that I'll ever have the chance, but what a waste.

 

[Bolt]

At this point in time, no.
But here's a story I read a while ago about it:
http://www.nerdshit.com/briareos/final.html

 

[Jamshyd]

I'm sorry, if someone thinks they have the authority to "choose" someone for some kind of divine right of passage, then that person is a huge waste of LSD.

 

[CatfishRivers]

Yeah I would much rather spread that as far as it could go and turn as many heads up as it could. But I still wouldn't turn it down. Theoretically speaking...I'd have to run into Morpheous or some psychotic break delusional dream come true...

 

[fastandbulbous]

Actually, w/ a thumbprint of impure poorly synthesized LSD, the impurities could conceivably do so significant damage. If there is an ergot alkaloid impurity in your batch that is a vasoconstricter, an ordinary recreational dose may not give you enough of it to have effects. But if you do a thumbprint with such an impurity in it, you might come down and find a few of your limbs converted to gangrene. Ouch!!

If a thumbprint is say 20mg, and the acid was poorly manufactured such that it contained 5% ergotamine tartrate, then that's 1mg; that combined with the fact that the alpha-adrenergic activity of LSD (at that sort of dose) would also cause vasoconstriction might well be enough to reduce the blood flow to the extremities to a level that caused tissue death & necrosis - which is what turns into gangrene. While that might only cause enough to lose a few fingers & toes, people talking about 50mg+ would most probably end up losing all four limbs...

 

[euphorically]

According to that graph taking 60-70ug in theory ain't any different to taking the standard 100ug dose. Tho all the times I've taken half a tab (or even slightly more) its effects are certainly alot less than a full tab.

Also is that graph displaying a human brain?

 

[BilZ0r]

The graph is what should be the brain concentration, it's never been measured in humans, but the plasma concentration during recreational usage has been measured, and MDMA should distribute roughly equally between the plasma and the brain.

Those are affinities for human and/or rat and possibley some even bovine receptors, but they don't really differ.

Still, it's quite an interesting modification. If you think about it, if LSD is roughly at the concentration in the brain, as it's 5-HT2A receptor affinity then you're going to 50% receptor occupancy, and 9x the affinity, you have 90% binding, and at 99x the affinity, you hae 99% occupancy.

Seeing as LSDs affinity for the 5-HT2A receptor is something like 5-10nM, once you get brain concentrations much past 100nM, you've pretty much saturated the receptor.

 

[euphorically]

^^ Are the receptors just on and off switches? Or work more like a transistor?

 

[B9]

Actually, w/ a thumbprint of impure poorly synthesized LSD, the impurities could conceivably do so significant damage. If there is an ergot alkaloid impurity in your batch that is a vasoconstricter, an ordinary recreational dose may not give you enough of it to have effects. But if you do a thumbprint with such an impurity in it, you might come down and find a few of your limbs converted to gangrene. Ouch!!

This is a highly relevant point, obviously one would have to be absolutely certain of the purity of the product before even considering doing such a thing.






zophen

 

[nanobrain]

you are also getting major a1 adrenergic agonism @ those levels, NE reuptake is way down and yo' interaction interface between the GPCRs and other proteins in the signaling cascade is de-regulated, yo' selective PDZ binding aint so selective, ie sticking their proverbial tongue in the light socket.

 

[Fwoosh]

In a word, No.


psychosis is not cute or cool or fun, it's the distilled essence of frustration and nightmare. taking a chance at it with something like that is not something anyone should take lightly, or take at all.


my 0.02

 

[BreakingSet]

If a thumbprint is say 20mg, and the acid was poorly manufactured such that it contained 5% ergotamine tartrate, then that's 1mg; that combined with the fact that the alpha-adrenergic activity of LSD (at that sort of dose) would also cause vasoconstriction might well be enough to reduce the blood flow to the extremities to a level that caused tissue death & necrosis - which is what turns into gangrene. While that might only cause enough to lose a few fingers & toes, people talking about 50mg+ would most probably end up losing all four limbs...

And that individual would definitely "wake up" changed.

Either I'm projecting myself in to the dream pool or I have a point in saying that some of the answers here remind me of how folks respond to questions of past lives and reincarnation: no one ever sees themselves as a no-one, or a minor character in the grand scheme. Printing seems like it would require a mentality that could create a new and better world post print, and most of us do a bad job of making the world better pre-print. The solution to the equation isn't the crystal itself; the crystal is the catalyst. If you cannot make a better world than the only other alternative, post-print, would be to continue to live in this one, insane.

 

[fastandbulbous]

This is a highly relevant point, obviously one would have to be absolutely certain of the purity of the product before even considering doing such a thing.

zophen

That's the thing though; on top of the worries about the purity/standard of manufacture you're getting, you're not activating any more/other receptors in the CNS when you go from 1.5mg to 20-40mg (aprox weight of thumbprint from waht I've read), so the experience is going to be qualitatively similar - it's just the duration/chronology that going to be hugely altered. You will 'go up' & reach the plateau a lot quicker with the 'print' which may make it less likely to induce a negative experience. That's probably comparable to the difference between DMT & psilocin (DMT onset is so quick that you don't have the time to work yourself into an anxious state/'bad trip'; psilocin on the other hand comes on a lot slower and having time to dwell on the ongoing ego-death can result in some hideous anxiety, even florid psychotic symptoms).

As I mentioned previously, considering that you're not going to be activating any extra receptor types/subtypes in the jump in dosage from 1.5mg to say 30mg I can't see that they could be so different except in terms of time to peak, duration of trip etc. Although it may be a very good way of excluding DEA agents from infiltrating the higher echelons of the LSD manufacure & distribution, it also seems to seriously increase the possibilities of long term psychological damage due to the duration of a trip from a 30mg dose.

IMO it's simply not worth the risk - but then I'd be very wary of taking 1500ug in one go; the largest dose I've had is probably about 500ug (4 dots of stronger than average dose in the early 80's) and that left it's mark on me!

 

[nanobrain]

As I mentioned previously, considering that you're not going to be activating any extra receptor types/subtypes in the jump in dosage from 1.5mg to say 30mg I can't see that they could be so different.....

^i'm not so sure we have enough basis to state that with certainty as many receptor subtypes have yet to be identified, much less linked to specific ligand activation. plus receptor agonism/antagonism i believe are far from the only mechanisms taking place in biological action of LSD at the extreme doses.