what separates the animals from you?

[Manifespo]

-social technology.. cant think of any that would have other purposes other than to aid practical things but there are symbolic things apes use to show theire superior status within their group. and your computer could easily be compared to sticks and shit they use.

Social technology, such as written and spoken language, market systems, mathematic symbols...these aren't practical in themselves?

 

[fungal_one]

There are some good responses here. I just have to add opposable thumbs for one. Another is that to the best of my knowledge animals don't kill other animals just for the heck of it like some people do. I know there is no way to be sure of this, but I've never heard of an animal serial killer.

 

[elemenohpee]

I don't think there's going to be one difference that we have that no animals have. We both manipulate our environment, build shelter, communicate, etc. Humans just do these things in a more complex and organized manner. We just do all these things better than all the other animals (for the most part).

 

[PinholeStar]

There are some good responses here. I just have to add opposable thumbs for one.

Although humans can move their thumb farther across their hand than other primates, we are by no means the only species with such an adaptation.

Chimpanzees, gorillas & orangutans have them, & many of them have opposable digits on their feet too, which aid in climbing.

 

[vegan]

we create a big frontier between animals and us because they lack the ability to talk/clearly communicate ideas-feelings

if animals could say "stop, it hurts, don't kill me, let me go free", many people would boycott their exploitation


i'm not sure if any animals laugh. maybe some monkeys?
i don't think they feel guilt (maybe they have less reasons too also)
i don't know if any are sensible to music

I think the main difference between us and animals is that we can walk on two legs, they can't.

someone posted on bluelight an article about a monkey who after a harsh illness had started walking on his back legs
that's evolution!

 

[Manifespo]

I don't think there's going to be one difference that we have that no animals have. We both manipulate our environment, build shelter, communicate, etc. Humans just do these things in a more complex and organized manner. We just do all these things better than all the other animals (for the most part).

I would say an 100+ year autobiographical lexical memory sets us apart.
I would say our social technology- physical like electrical circuits, cars, computers, buildings and SpoRituals like language, social coordination, capital differentiates us from the rest of the hanimals.
I would say our free will proves our difference.
I would say long term cold hard logic is distinct in our species.

Awareness of death, objective science, entrepreneurship, agriculture, letters, numbers...shall I go on? SOCIAL TECHNOLOGY SETS US APART

But that's just my experience, which doesn't get much R
in this joint anywayas.

 

[redeemer]

I would say our free will proves our difference.

Animals have free will. A dog, for example, can choose not to run after a stick that is thrown if it's tired, is that not free will?

I would say long term cold hard logic is distinct in our species.

What, exactly, is "long term cold hard logic" and how is it different from just "logic"?

Awareness of death

How can you know animals don't know they can die?

 

[Manifespo]

You anthropomorphize the dog.
The dog doesn't have a "choice" per se. It just is.
It doesn't think "I want to chase the ball,"
Instead the interacting neural systems in its brain determine its next action.

Humans are able to meta-program ourselves,
to go beyond neural determination.
We can choose to alter our own parameters.

Long term cold hard logic is the ability
to plan and organize processes
for decades and centuries into the future.

Animals don't understand death,
just as some indigenous tribes
don't understand that
Sexual intercourse produces babies.

They just don't have schemas or symbolic language to be aware of it.

Animals are all intuition and instinct.
Humans have these, but learn
to think abstractly and objectively (though not all do).

We begin our lives as merely
intuitive instinctual h-animals with big brains,
literally pheral children.
However our sociobiological kulture
molds us into auto-SpoRitual machines.

 

[redeemer]

You anthropomorphize the dog.

I disagree.

The dog doesn't have a "choice" per se. It just is.
It doesn't think "I want to chase the ball,"
Instead the interacting neural systems in its brain determine its next action.

Humans are able to meta-program ourselves,
to go beyond neural determination.
We can choose to alter our own parameters.

How is an animal reacting as a result of its neural activity different from a human acting as a result of its neural activity?

It doesn't think "I want to chase the ball" because it can't speak English, but does it have to be able to describe its choice in order for it to be free? I agree that it's action is determined on a more unconscious level since it can't reason with itself like humans, but I don't think that makes it not free.

Long term cold hard logic is the ability
to plan and organize processes
for decades and centuries into the future.

Wouldn't that just be called "planning ahead"?

But you're right I think, animals live more "in the moment" than humans, their level of planning ahead is occuring on an more unconscious level I'd say.

Animals don't understand death,
just as some indigenous tribes
don't understand that
Sexual intercourse produces babies.

They just don't have schemas or symbolic language to be aware of it.

I don't agree that you have to describe something linguistically to be aware of it. Animals can be aware that an offspring has died without being able to describe it with words.

 

[knight_marshall]

and so after the agreements and disagreements... i'm curious to know if anyone agrees with me that insanity is the only difference?

 

[DoubleTrouble]

The main difference between humans and other animals is the ability of time-binding. Simply, this means that humans are more adept at planning/acounting for events in the future than other animals are. We take the repurcusions of our actions into account when making decisions.

We also have more evolved social structures and liguistic abilities. Carl Sagan is good to read if you are interested in these topics.

 

[DoubleTrouble]

Also, for a long time it was assumed that humans were the only animals that used tools. This is not true. Jane Goodall and other scientists have observed primates using simplistic tools while hunting, such as dipping a stick into an ant hole in order to collect ants. The tools humans use are more complex, but we are not the only animals that can manipulate the environment to our own benefit.

 

[redeemer]

and so after the agreements and disagreements... i'm curious to know if anyone agrees with me that insanity is the only difference?

If insanity was the only difference I think there would be a broader term, a prerequisite for insanity, that would be the only difference, like the ability to reason.

 

[Manifespo]

We are techno-monkeys.
We could be techno-cats or techno-dogs,
or techno-birds!
Generally it is our social technology
that has fueled our success.
We have the trappings of
past generations Progress,
as we are born with
a rich tapestry of knowledge
of the world around us.
We are born
into a technological capitalist society,
and must unlearn our animal impulses
and relearn societal impulses to get cash
money that is required to get food and other needs/wants of life.

 

[qwedsa]

and so after the agreements and disagreements... i'm curious to know if anyone agrees with me that insanity is the only difference?

this would imply there are no non-human neurological diseases that influence the organism's ability to reason. i find this hard to believe, can you back it up?

 

[Manifespo]

what about parasitic organisms which subvert host neural systems, causing them to die and become food for the parasitic offspring?

 

[L2R]

or kangaroos

edit: in response to the "no mammals can walk on 2 legs"

Kangaroos are marsupials (or however it's spelt (damn fine chinese liquor))


Manifespo, animals know of death. Elephants go to special areas away from their herds to die. One of my cats recently passed and on his last day, his presence freaked his brother out. His brother wouldn't stay in the room with him.

I think the only difference is the functions of the body, which has little or nothing to do with the functions of the mind. These meatsacks we all use, along with animals, have their inherited strengths and weaknesses, which greatly influence but do not completely control what we do with them.

 

[SardonicNihilist]

Not a god damned thing. An animal living away from it's natural environment, eg. a pigeon in a city, a rat in a sewer, or an elephant in a zoo; they are all merely adapting to their surroundings. Humans do exactly the same thing.

Humans were not meant to live in concrete jungles with electricity, television, packaged food and all the rest of that consumerist crap. We simply created that life for ourselves- just like an ant farm will grown beyond the confines of it's aquarium, or a weed will spread to the point where it will out-compete all other species and leave themselves no other resources upon which to survive. Call me a cliche;d pop-culture regurgitator, but we are indeed a virus on our planet, we seek no equilibrium with our surroundings and seek only to exploit all that is available. I say available, and not given, as that is a whole different argument.

Most christians would argue that their god created everything for man to use (except a certain plant which just happens to be evil, and certain male (and female) bodily orifices which ought not meet in close contact) , but most of the rest is there for our use exploitation.

To answer the question- the ability to think beyond pure survival instinct is what separates us from animals. Had Eve, Adam, Mohammed, Pradeep or Chi Duong no eaten from the supposed 'forbidden' fruit' then we would (at least as far as the christian bible is concerned) be no more than eating, shitting, rooting machines- with no sense of morality, philosophy, or oven have the mental foresight to even have this conversation.


I still don't know if it was a good thing.

 

[ebola?]

>>Kangaroos are marsupials>>

All marsupials are mammals.

 

[Manifespo]

I think the only difference is the functions of the body, which has little or nothing to do with the functions of the mind.

You sure your mind isn't generated by your body?