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What is wrong with the MDMA available today?

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Sure, I think that combined with that study would basically be case closed. Why would crypto need to be involved? Unless these compounds are readily sold on DNM? if so that adds another layer of weirdness here

Crypto simply keeps the means of money anonymous. Thats all. Privacy is key. It has nothing to do with dnm in this regard. The compounds are not being sourced from there, and they arent illegal according to glub.
 
Why would crypto need to be involved?
Because some crowdfunders value their privacy and would like to stay anonymous. e.g. see below:
I am not opposed to crowdfunding, if I can somehow do it anonymously.
Crypto simply keeps the means of money anonymous. Thats all. Privacy is key.


The purchaser/submitter might want to stay anonymous, too.
Unless these compounds are readily sold on DNM? if so that adds another layer of weirdness here
Vendors of these RCs take fiat currency, so the purchaser would have to exchange the crypto for fiat, eventually.

Do you have a better idea?
 
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Ah I see what you're saying glub, didn't have the background there, sure I'd chip in ?

Xtc data will come back MDMA.

You need a private lab.. I HAVE 1. WE have cosy NMR, PROTON etc. Polerimeters for entiomers etc. But i need both meh and magic multiple samples

Yeah, so i've been beating myself up about this but I brought my samples with me to the festival that does the testing this summer so I could present them with both sampled and give them my spiel. Didn't get around to it, and when i spoke to them offhand about it they had no idea wtf i was talking about, the people running the thing are volunteer FTIR trainees. We had a lot of leftover drugs that we didn't want to take back with us (99% chance of a police checkpoint or two on the way back, its canada), so we geocached them. I didn't realize I put my samples of the MehDMA and MagicDMA in the geocache... So, won't have access to those until next August unfortunately...

That said, my friend goes through batches like crazy and lets me know when ones stand out, I usually collect a sample from every batch he gets
 
Maybe I don't quite get geocaching...but I thought other people could find those things and take the treasure?
 
Drugs Data have received all of the recent updates, and they are looking into it.

I am hoping that they will be willing to order these substances to check them, add them to their catalog etc. If that is the case, maybe we can make donations to them to fund this project. If not, then I am all for buying the substances and sending them in and seeing what happens. It would only take a few examples to prove the point.

@Hilopsilo I just read the full article you posted. It really makes me wonder if it is possible that MehDMA is a mix of various regioisomers/isobaries and MDMA. That would explain the subtle differences people report in their MehDMA experience. Everyone agrees that it lacks the characteristics of MDMA (euphoria, empathy, pro-social behavior, enhanced tactile/auditory sensation), but it seems that some people have more negative side effects than others. Different ratios of MDMA to contaminant would produce a variety of effects, but the full effects of MDMA would be blocked in all scenarios.
 
It really makes me wonder if it is possible that MehDMA is a mix of various regioisomers/isobaries and MDMA. That would explain the subtle differences people report in their MehDMA experience.
It is possible if the testers were watching Nyan Cat instead of doing their jobs well.
 
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@Glubrahnum - The impression I am getting is that they have to order the GCMS file for the chems they want to test for. So, if they have not added a particular chem to their database, it is not going to show up as a possible result. Am I getting the right impression?
 
Ah I see what you're saying glub, didn't have the background there, sure I'd chip in ?



Yeah, so i've been beating myself up about this but I brought my samples with me to the festival that does the testing this summer so I could present them with both sampled and give them my spiel. Didn't get around to it, and when i spoke to them offhand about it they had no idea wtf i was talking about, the people running the thing are volunteer FTIR trainees. We had a lot of leftover drugs that we didn't want to take back with us (99% chance of a police checkpoint or two on the way back, its canada), so we geocached them. I didn't realize I put my samples of the MehDMA and MagicDMA in the geocache... So, won't have access to those until next August unfortunately...

That said, my friend goes through batches like crazy and lets me know when ones stand out, I usually collect a sample from every batch he gets
I do not trust FTIR or Energy control UltraViolet–Visible Spectroscopy (UV/Vis). To bad you dont have both any more. if you still have meh. I can DEF get a better analysis and that could lead to something.
 
@Glubrahnum - The impression I am getting is that they have to order the GCMS file for the chems they want to test for. So, if they have not added a particular chem to their database, it is not going to show up as a possible result. Am I getting the right impression?

This is very MUCH correct. Energy control doesnt have isobate for meth. n-isopropylbenzylamine and alike and it fools and says high purity meth but its not
 
The impression I am getting is that they have to order the GCMS file for the chems they want to test for.

It is more complicated than that. Good analysis techniques employ two stages:
a) Separation (e.g.: GC or TLC or HPLC)
b) Identification (e.g.: MS, CAD, IR absorbance, UV fluorescence, Stokes/AntiStokes emission).

So in the step a the sample is separated into different components and later in step b these components are identified one-by-one.
(Note: the time of elution or distance of separation is/can be used for identification, too....or aid in it).

Without good separation, you get overlapping identification spectra that are hard to correlate automatically. They look like this:
xBBrK0A.png


Note, that certain detectors used for identification (like the one that made the graph above) can "see" the bonds of intact molecules, while some of them, like e.g. MS can only infer them because by the time molecule gets to the detector they are mostly fragmented and their bonds are broken, so it is an educated guesswork how these fragments were bound originally.

Also, most of the time the sample is prepared somehow by dissolving it in a solvent and trituration/filtering or reacting with a derivatizing agent or both. This preparation affects the results of a & b.

The results from a and b can be correlated automatically be a computer, when the machine is calibrated well but it still the job of a human to spot poor spectra correlation (erroneus library match), overlapping spectra or poor calibration.

The authors of the paper that Hilopsilo quoted, did just that. They spotted closely overlapping peaks on their chromatograms.

Other analysts might use different separation techniques, that are not able to resolve closely related regioisomers or identification methods such as Mass Spectrometry which can easily confuse regioisomers when the relative abundances of their fragments are not accounted for diligently ...or just happen to be identical.

It is not a coincidence that we prefer to use HPLC with Raman and IR absorption detectors at work rather than GC/MS ...and when due diligence is required we even try several HPLC columns for separation ...just to be sure. You'd be surprised, that even with multiple columns sometimes certain components elute at the same time (do not separate well) and only after reacting the sample with derivatizing agents (e.g. PFPA ), a well defined separation occurs.
 
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@ThreePointCircle
What you have done was an analysis by this classic technique on a shoestring budget, because you separated your sample into its different components by TLC and identified the individual components by a reagent ...if "reagent testing" counts as identification.;)

If you have $2k laying around and a desire to go beyond reagents, take a look at this.
 
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This is very MUCH correct. Energy control doesn't have isobate for meth. n-isopropylbenzylamine and alike and it fools and says high purity meth but its not
I agree if they have monkeys interpreting the results. Any decent analytical chemist would eventually see the peaks, that just do not make sense ...even if the library match is made with a correlation coefficient in the 0.90s.

...unless they are watching Nyan Cat instead of doing their jobs.

P.S.
Of course, if they had their machines calibrated with a forensic sample of that isopropylbenzylanamine, then even a proverbial monkey could interpret the result correctly.
 
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https://community.dnstars.vip/t/var...pparently-not-observed-in-other-labs/26979/35 Posted about this on DNstars, the founder seems very open minded about all this. Said they went down this same road with 2/3/4-MMC with Energy Control, which are structural isomers of each other with different effects which further supports our hypothesis about MDMA. They basically just crowdfunded the money for EC to purchase the references, which was cheaper considering it was only a couple references, not like 20+. Would we rather crowdfund to purchase the references, or try to fool their tests with them first to get their damn attention lol. Either way, we've been talking about crowdfunding the samples for a while, DNStars founder said they used a crypto crowdfunding service, lets get that started?

Feel free to chime in that thread
 
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P.S.
Of course, if they had their machines calibrated with a forensic sample of that isopropylbenzylanamine, then even a proverbial monkey could interpret the result correctly.

yeah people tried to chip in to get the file for n-iso meth :/
 
n-iso meth

Not sure if isopropylbenzylamine is as common as a lot of methamphetamine users seem to believe. It's difficult to find any solid information about.

There is a product being sold as 'eria jarensis extract'. It's just synthetic
n,n-dimethylphenethylamine (C10H15N).

Not sure how that would look on MS..
 
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