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  • EADD Moderators: axe battler | Pissed_and_messed

What if Money Was No Object?

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It's all just ideas and planning at the moment, would need a massive landmass and of course the big thing "money" to create the first of the cities, and yeah, would most likely be a lottery or some selective picking to decide who gets to live in the first cities, it would probably cause some chaos on it's own, but if they could prove that it would work with just a few of these cities they have in mind then maybe the rest of the world would start to think that they would like to live like that and prepare and lobby for progressive change like the venus project.

If I could get a ticket I'd be there right away.

Thanks for the nice comment too :D <3
 
Anyone can make pretty pix, Mugz. Dunno much about the Venus Project specifically but know a smidge about Jacque Fresco and seems to be an extension of stuff he's been working on for years. It's not a bad idea but the problem is with attitudes as mentioned. Yes it could work if everybody mucked in... but everybody doen't muck in which is kinda the problem. It's the mindset that's the problem not the economy.
 
I ninja edited some words after the pics, it would need a massive mindset change, for sure, but I'm saying that if some selected people were chosen to make the first few cities of this kind work then maybe the mindset of the masses would change
 
we read it SHM just because it wasn't responded to doesn't mean it wasn't read. Bhutan is a great example of one country becoming self sufficient in organic food, I think that will serve as something for people to think about if it was more publicised to the masses and read and digested by them, it's the whole world that needs to change their attitudes though and believe that a resource based economy can work, scrap nations, live as a planet, not as lots of squabbling little nations, some bigger than others admittedly but all still fighting over things that in the big picture are very very small.
 
Totally agree on scrapping nation states, Mugz. Been saying that for years. Backward idea that's long outlived its use are nations. But given the state of most governments around the world I'd not trust the political classes not to just turn it into one really big, really shitty country. Change of mindset - whatever that change is - needs to happen first, I'd say.
 
^ I agree that nationhood is a farce, but regional cultures still exist and those create divisions. If you want nationhood done away with then you need to address the human condition. We can't just be one world, one dream. Every part of the world sees the universe and life differently. As far as most indigenous cultures are concerned, things were fine the way they were before colonization happened. The only reason why we can globalize at all is because of the European Empires who implanted their cultures all over the world. Now of course it's Europeans and their offshoots who suggest things like the Venus Project. Every generation seems to have a "vision" of how the world should be - why not just scale back, and then leave it alone?

As for what I would do if money were no object... probably travel, learn more about healing, do a lot of healing work to cure people of different diseases, and ultimately I'd teach new healers. That's my dream really. Unfortunately the current system makes my dream incredibly complicated and expensive, which is a great source of depression for me.
 
We need to stop seeing growth as desirable. Growth is only really desirable for capitalism. Not for our well-being.
 
Depends how you define growth I'd say, SHM. I think growth is somewhat intrinsic to the human condition - and a desirable thing. However, Capitalist-style growth seems to be more stretching than growing. And you can only stretch stuff so far before stuff snaps.

Foreigner: You make good points. My views tend to be somewhat simlistic due to being a simpleton. An idealistic simpleton, mind :D
 
As defined by the dominant culture. Economic growth. Growth in the gap between rich and poor, the inevitable but fashionable consequence.

Not to mention the destruction of the natural world.
 
That would be the shitty kinda growth then. But I don't think growth as a concept is a bad idea at all. I don't think we could avoid it if we tried. Switching to sustainable growth is just common sense though - laying off the planet rape would be a good start, for sure. Of course common sense ain't so common amongst our overlords...
 
In Greek times, intellectual growth was considered a priority. The case of education for the sake of it. I think that's natural, it's the same as our inherent desire to take drugs, to explore. But everything today is about financial growth. Think about it, in a recession nothing has changed in the people's ability has it? Wed still work the same given the chance. It's the system that has collapsed, through artificial means. But it's those artificial means we cherish right now, an artificial economy.
 
Mugz said:
if some selected people were chosen to make the first few cities of this kind work then maybe the mindset of the masses would change
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Therein lies the massive dilemma at the heart of any utopian ideal. You're proposing the division of the populace into an elite and 'the masses'. That's dangerous thinking, however pure your ideals.

I genuinely believe that there is some hope for humanity, but it's going to take more than good intentions. Materialism and its current expression in allegedy-post-industrial consumer society is an inevitable result of the flaws in basic human nature. It takes a seismic shift in consciousness to transcend that. I'm sure it's possible, but don't underestimate the capacity of homo sapiens to fuck up The Dream big-time. Even when the best precautions are taken.

History is littered with examples. I don't need to cite 'em. Just a warning, not a condemnation.
 
Albion said:
I would buy bluelight some new servers.
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lolz, so it's not just me then, has been super slow today.


Good point raised above too above growth and the benefits and negative aspets of it. If we can grow as a worldwide consciousness and begin to agree on the big ideas and then affect positive change, whether it be the venus project or some other great idea for a future economy that doesn't damage the world so badly then that is good growth. Hard to come by though.
 
StoneHappyMonday said:
In Greek times, intellectual growth was considered a priority. The case of education for the sake of it. I think that's natural, it's the same as our inherent desire to take drugs, to explore. But everything today is about financial growth. Think about it, in a recession nothing has changed in the people's ability has it? Wed still work the same given the chance. It's the system that has collapsed, through artificial means. But it's those artificial means we cherish right now, an artificial economy.
Click to expand...

That's more or less what I was meaning by growth being natural and desirable, SHM. You - and others - tend to be much better on specifics than me so I tend to stick with broad brushstrokes and hope for the best ;)

Also, the Greeks did cherish knowledge for the sake of knowledge, and invention for the sake of invention... but only for a tiny minority. They had slaves to dig the garden, carry the shopping and cook their tea and stuff too which probably made it somewhat easier. Slaves are a Bad Thing but technology can do drudgework - at least some of the drudgework. And will only do more as time goes on. Problem being that takes away jobs from people. In the long run I'd say let the robots do it all while wee frolick in jetpacks and stuff (it will happen sooner or later - been promised for long enough :!). What to do in the meantime seems to be a problem though. And how to avoid everybody ending up working in call centres and fast food places selling shite to each other and fielding complaints about said shite.
 
Myshkin said:
Therein lies the massive dilemma at the heart of any utopian ideal. You're proposing the division of the populace into an elite and 'the masses'. That's dangerous thinking, however pure your ideals.

I genuinely believe that there is some hope for humanity, but it's going to take more than good intentions. Materialism and its current expression in allegedy-post-industrial consumer society is an inevitable result of the flaws in basic human nature. It takes a seismic shift in consciousness to transcend that. I'm sure it's possible, but don't underestimate the capacity of homo sapiens to fuck up The Dream big-time. Even when the best precautions are taken.

History is littered with examples. I don't need to cite 'em. Just a warning, not a condemnation.
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I really do agree with you there mate on a lot of things you just said, it's like the minority is trying to make the majority join it so it can become the majority and then what happens to the minorities then, well we have seen in history what can happen.

I think that the way the world is set up today it will take something like an atomic war or a massive meteor to do some more damage than the last one for us to change, we wont change by choice, it will be something that people do out of fear, which saddens me as it should be something that people want to do out of love.
 
Well we're perfectly set up for cataclysmic meltdown, that's for sure. My record collection tells me so every day.
 
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