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What if I'm a psychopath? Afraid...

  • Thread starter Thread starter soeffedup
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soeffedup

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Hi all,

I know that the title of this may seem to be an oxymoron. Hell my shrink told me that someone who is a psychopath doesn't really question being one...

...but still I'm afraid. I feel like I have no real identity or sense of self. I was brought up in a family with constant fighting and as such I adopted early on to pleasing everyone and saying what they thought was best. Thus I didn't really develop a 'personality' as one might normally do.

I've had problems with drugs but I really think they're secondary. I can treat my alcohol abuse or dissociative abuse and, aside from a small amount of lingering neurological damage, I'll be right where I started.

My main problem is this. I'll be honest. I enjoy hurting other people. Either psychologically or physically. I've got an addiction to very violent and abusive forms of pornography. I deliberately start arguments with other people who are vulnerable, etc. And I can't, right now, really feel a connection with their feelings.

This stems from something I decided years ago, when I decided that real life was too painful to be experienced. This realization came at about age 13. I was taking ambien and adderall at the time. Over the years, I really developed a resilence to feeling discomfort experienced by others.

But here's the thing. I really REALLY hate this about myself. But I like hating myself. So it's almost like I do shitty things, think shitty thoughts, etc so that I can justify feeling shitty about myself and being (somewhat) suicidal.

Now I've met people online who are 'successful' and 'into' some of the things I consider objectionable (at least in terms of sexual turn-ons, for example). But I don't identify with them. I question too much to ignore someone else's suffering. But I still feel like my obsession with myself above others and my inability to feel empathetic relegates me to being a 'psychopath' in the common sense.

The thing that makes me feel really hopeless though is this. This applies to many areas but this is a concrete example. Say I look at a picture of a bangin hot babe naked. I find it attractive, but I'm not turned on. Hell, I've given myself ED in situations where I'm just hooking up with a girl in a 'normal' manner. And this leads me to think well fuck it, I've obviously fucked myself up so much there's no going back. Because unlike my drug problems or other issues, I can't 'force' myself to be attracted to something or think in a certain way. I can force myself not to drink. I can force myself not to hurt others. I can force myself not to abuse amphetamines. But I absolutely cannot force myself to be attracted to 'normal' (i.e. non abusive) relations with a girl, for example. I also cannot force myself not to want to start arguments, or say nasty things.

And this is what gets me. It seems that I can stop the symptoms, but for the life of me, I cannot stop the problems.

I've been told that I need to keep 'forcing' myself not to engage in these behaviors I dislike that that make me abhor myself, but I feel like I'd have to do this for so long to get myself back to being 'normal' that it's just not worth it. Dunno what to do.

And that's why I think I might be a psychopath....but I don't know. And it really bothers the shit out of me.

DISCLAIMER: I've never done anything illegal or extremely harmful to others, aside from just being a jerkoff emotionally in some relationships. I have enough self control not to act on terrible impulses, but I'm terrified as to why I feel them.
 
The fact that you're questioning it and not liking the thoughts/feelings/behavior, leads me to believe you're not a pyschopath. The lack of empathy and enjoyment of hurting others is disturbing. I'm a masochist and have sought out people like you who treat me like shit. I'm trying to change my ways and find a more kind, 'normal' girl, but it's tough. This kinda shit is deep within you man. If you're not already, get into therapy. It helps.
 
Generally if you were a psychopath, you wouldn't be afraid. Many psychopaths also have very little insight into themselves to recognize the signs, or even care to.

You obviously have different standards for sexuality than most people do. A lot of people need more than to see a hot girl with her clothes off in order to really get into it, especially if you've become used to hardcore pornography. The internet is literally FLOODED with pictures of naked women everywhere. I guess it's possible you've become a little numb to it. If you work on yourself and your unhealthy urges, though, I'm sure you can (and should) find the appeal in less abusive forms of sexual relation. I've been into all kinds of different things with girls. A lot of girls love rough sex, and it can be enjoyed without literally hurting each other.

I think it might be possible that you have some anti-social and narcissistic tendencies, and you should definitely seek help. Because it doesn't appear to be the end-all be-all for you. It's a matter of working on yourself.
 
Also, do you ever experience what you'd consider genuine emotion? Do you ever cry? Do you ever feel bad for something you did or said? Do you ever watch an emotional scene on a movie or TV show and react emotionally?
 
I have to agree with ArtVandalay and blahman, in that if you were genuinely a psychopathic personality type you wouldn't be afraid of it and you wouldn't have the capacity to be concerned or question it. Therefore I am leaning towards no, that you aren't a psychopath. Given the difficult circumstances of your childhood it's not surprising that you've sustained some lasting effects to your personality and the way you approach relationships. It also sounds like you have some self esteem issues which could explain why you "like to hate yourself". The good news is that you don't have to continue feeling this way. Therapy really can help with things like what you're experiencing, e.g. hating yourself, thoughts of hurting people, argumentative tendencies, even your sexual attraction.

With specific regards to the level of severity of hardcore porn that you tend to seek out and watch, I honestly believe that sexual attraction can get numbed if one is constantly subjected to harder styles of porn (it's the same kind of thing with desensitisation to violent movies, video games and stuff on the net etc). If you're concerned that you now can't be aroused by "normal" non-violent sex, just give it a rest on the harder stuff for a while (like, a few months at least) and see if that helps. But you know, some people are just in to that kind of thing and if you are one of those people, and if you honestly enjoy it, there's no point worrying about it. As long as no-one actually gets harmed and as long as everything is fully consentual, I don't think there's a problem with it. However if you do have a problem with it, then please get help.
 
The Rock Monster said:
OP: seek professional help IMMEDIATELY
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I've been seeking it, but so far (probably because I haven't seen the right people, looking into CBT and the like now) I have felt it's just a time to go in every week and make small talk about bullshit I already know, then prove how right I am about the way I live my life, then ask for an adderall prescription. Kinda stupid now that I think about it.

To address other concerns, yes I've absolutely felt genuine emotion in the past. I was never abused as a child or beaten or something like that, but I grew up in a family where there was constant fighting and arguing. Additionally, I had promises constantly made and then broken. Finally, around age 13, I decided it was the last straw and that I didn't want to have emotion anymore. Since then I've been somewhat different. I abused (unknowingly since I didn't know the risks) my ambien and adderall prescriptions at that time, ultimately leading to a paranoid schizophrenia diagnosis and massive seroquel dosages. This diagnosis was retracted later, but it was obvious something was wrong.

Here's what bothers me...I hate what I've become. I despise the wrong I've seen my father and others inflict. I know that abusing drugs and alcohol and such are bad. But at the end of the day, I live in this world mired up in bullshit, where it's all rationalizations, lies told to others to get by, etc. It's like I have no personality anymore. I try to cover it with drugs or other things but it doesn't go away.

But the reason I try to cover it is what makes me suspect psychopathic tendencies. At the end of the day I can boil down all my actions down to pure self interest. I spent a lot of time being nice to this girl? Was it because I genuinely cared about her life? No I wanted to get someone so in love with me I'd be in control. Am I really interested in helping social causes? Is that the reason I spend hours on them? No, I want recognition as someone important. On and on and on till I've broken down lately and just given up on trying to do anything because I abhor what I feel I've turned into.

But the thing that annoys me the most is that I can't force myself to feel differently or to feel emotions that I don't have (or are more likely buried under a mountain of bullshit)....I can force myself not to drink. I can force myself not to use drugs. I can force myself to go to class. I can't physically force myself to be interested in, say, porn that isn't violent towards women. And I don't mean BDSM. I'm good at reading people. If something looks fake it bores me. And this carries into other areas in my life where I start arguments with people or play on their care about me to extract things that I want.

Yeah I'm getting professional help but it hasn't seemed to go beyond simple statements like "well if you know the right way to act then do it" or "it doesn't matter if you don't do something for the right reason it matters that you do it." While this is true, and I certainly try not to be manipulative or nasty on purpose, I'd just rather not feel that in the first place. Fuck I used so many psychadelics and dissociatives to try and convince my mind to look at things differently, but it didn't work. I guess I just have no faith that I'll be able to ever return to where I was mentally and emotionally before all this shit occured, making me wonder if I've permanently fucked my ability to think non-selfishly, ie. non-sociopathically.

Disclaimer: I don't consider myself a danger to others. While I've watched certain nasty things on video, if I even approach doing such a thing in real life it repulses me so much I can't continue. I'd much rather just wither away and do nothing than contribute to the suffering around me.
 
Well, you are not a psychopath. A psychopath would never have been concerned with or said any of these things (unless they were to say it insincerely just to amuse themselves). They don't care what they are because they do not have to capacity to care.

You've felt genuine emotion in the past, but chose to cut it off, perhaps because you were conditioned not to trust people around you. Therefore, you emotionally shut yourself off from others. I think you probably find it so difficult to connect emotionally with others partly because you doubt their sincerity, much like you doubt your own.

I also think you'd be surprised how many people's behavior is motivated by pure self-interest. I see it all the time, even in the company of those I've become friends with. The difference is that you're clearly a very analytical thinker, so unlike them, you're aware of it (and unlike them, you give a shit). Analytical thinking isn't always bad, but I think in your case, it might be a problem, because it appears to be leaning towards obsessive. I know this from personal experience. Obsessive thinking is a huge reason why I drink. I myself spent a great deal of time worried sick and constantly analyzing myself because I thought I might be a psychopath, a narcissist, a schizophrenic (no offense to anyone here who is), etc. And all logic says that I'm not any of those things, but my obsession and fear about it was always what brought it back around. I then became obsessed with all personality disorders and began obsessively reading symptoms and articles, and began connecting dots that weren't necessarily there. I must have spent time on every single one, convincing myself that I have it. I've diagnosed myself so many times with so many different things (both mental and physical disorders) and basically tortured myself. Do not do that to yourself.

CBT might not be a bad idea. You need to find a more positive and healthy way of thinking. I think it's about digging through the past and rebuilding. I've been through a lot of the same shit you have, namely growing up around a lot of fighting/arguing, doing drugs, feeling separate from people, and yet wanting something more than that and better than that. I also think you need to tone it down on the intense abusive porn. You're desensitizing yourself sexually, and you should back off from it for a while. I could be wrong, but I think if you toned it down on that, you'll eventually appreciate different standards of sex.

All in all, in a case like this, I think that your desire to get better might be reason enough to believe that you can get better.
 
Psychopath is a very loaded word in modern society so I am going to use sociopath here - they mean the same thing, pretty much, although the definition is a little different depending on what criteria you use. The key aspect is a lack of empathy - there are other traits, but that is the one that is the real hallmark of a sociopath.

I have to agree with the others - what you are describing is not consistent with a sociopathic/antisocial personality type. Personality is a spectrum - there are clusters of traits which tend to go together, and people can be anywhere along the spectrum, or a mixture of different types - so I don't find labels like that especially useful anyway. What matters is you, how you feel and how you want to be. You don't want to be how you are - you are repulsed by the thought of actually carrying out violent acts - and from what you say I believe you can feel empathy for others, you just also have other traits (whether they be personality traits or the result of upbringing/other factors) which make matters a lot more complicated for you. The fact that you want to change, however, and are seeking help - and hate yourself for what you are - speaks volumes. It is your thoughts and perceptions of yourself that are troubling you the most - the concern than you are a sociopath and your distaste for your tastes (if you see what I mean) and this is not how a psychopath would feel.

If the psychiatrist you are seeing isn't helping I would recommend trying another one - it sounds to me like there are a lot of complex things going on here, but you don't sound sociopathic. I agree that therapy is likely to be the most beneficial here - CBT may well actually be very useful actually, but you might need some more complex psychotherapy as well. Shop around to find what suits you.

I think, by the way, that you are incredibly brave coming on here and telling us this - and that alone shows me how much this distresses you and how much you want to change. Accepting oneself is never easy; you would be amazed how many people struggle with this and how many people have personality traits they dislike and have to work hard to suppress. Try to be kind to yourself - you are who you are, you can't help that, and you are doing everything you can to make suee you don't hurt others in any way and to try to change the aspects of yourself that you dislike. Not many people ever bother to do that - you should be proud of yourself <3
 
OP, I completely agree with all the above posters that you are most certainly not a person without empathy, whatever the label might be. What I am interested in adding is something about the nature of sexual fantasy. Sexuality is so buried and repressed and not discussed in our society and yet for each of us it forming in our subconscious and our bodies at an extremely early age. Sex, by its very nature involves vulnerability (fear) and power (control). The environment that we develop in, as a sexual being, affects our sexuality on a subconscious level and because we cannot control either the physical feelings (what excites us) or the mental stimuli (where the hell did that come from? :\) most of us have a fantasy life that is completely distinct from our actual sexual desires. What seems to be troubling you is that you feel your subconscious has become your conscious to the point that you cannot have a sexual relationship that does not involve causing pain.

I think that the fact that you are uncomfortable with the violence=sex equation, coupled with the very perceptive knowledge that you actually enjoy hating yourself for these feelings is what you need to delve into with a competent professional that does something more than just talking to you. CBT might be the answer, but whatever form of therapy you choose, you are going to have to be completely honest about what it is you want to change to have it be effective.

n3o touched on staying away from the hardcore violent porn. I could not agree more. What you are doing is seeking help from a psychiatrist on the one hand while deeply reinforcing on every level what you desire to change on the other hand. One hour a week at most of meaningless talk versus frequent subliminal reinforcement? It's obvious which will have more of an effect.

I am very grateful for your post. You have no doubt made many other people feel less isolated in their own questioning and self doubt. The level of introspection and honesty you have has already led you to incredible insights and to me suggests that you are capable of the kind of complex thinking that can actually challenge the complexity of your subconscious. Keep looking for the kind of help you want--it may not be easy to find but I am sure that it exists. I once stepped completely out of my comfort zone and did some really ridiculous sounding (to my rational self) kind of metaphysical body work because every other therapy I had tried to dislodge some really obsessive worrying had failed. Much to my surprise, it worked. I think the reason it worked is that it was on a completely subconscious level. Sorry I can't tell you what it was called because I don't actually know--I just refer to it as one nutcase helping another (me!).:)

Good luck. We all have this one short life to figure ourselves out to the best of our abilities; it's a delicate balance between self-acceptance and self-realization. You are on your own unique path armed with both honesty and courage so you should be able to make any changes you want to make.<3
 
soeffedup said:
Disclaimer: I don't consider myself a danger to others. While I've watched certain nasty things on video, if I even approach doing such a thing in real life it repulses me so much I can't continue. I'd much rather just wither away and do nothing than contribute to the suffering around me.
Click to expand...

This quote alone is enough to let us say with significant certainty that you are not, in fact, a psychopath/sociopath. A truly psychopathic/sociopathic person would have none of the concerns or self-criticism that you have, and they wouldn't feel any remorse or repulsion from seeing, thinking, or partaking in the violent, questionable, and/or sexual acts that you've mentioned. If you're concerned about it I would recommend sticking with your professional help if you so choose, which would probably be beneficial for you, but I don't think it's a medical necessity, per se.

Is there any chance that maybe what is happening is merely a harmless curiosity? You say that you find certain sexual satisfaction in violent pornography, but at the same time you are overtly repulsed by the idea of actually participating in similar activity yourself. Maybe you're just fascinated with something about these socially-stigmatized things not because you're a psychopath but instead because they all share an underlying common element.

What if it's not the violence or the sexuality or the suffering that your mind is drawn to, but the control? Have you ever looked at it that way? Most of the things you're describing as somehow "pleasant" seem to me to have an element of control or power as a theme or core factor. Could it stem from something in your childhood or from something you discovered in yourself during a period of psychosomatically-intense dissociative use?*

Maybe I'm talking out of my ass, but I thought it was worth mentioning. You know, some food for thought.


*(No, I'm not a drugs-all-cause-brain-damage-and-make-you-batshit-crazy nutjob, I'm just considering the possibility of a negative spiritual experience as a result of overwhelmingly-powerful psychedelic use.)
 
hi. i found this thread while asking myself and trying to answer this question after a row with my girlfriend. I do too much thinking to have what may be a "normal" mind or mind set so i have taken that into account but although i know that to be asking these questions about myself does mean something good but the questions still stands...what is wrong with me? im sure everyone has this in their heads at some time but when you know, you know. you know?

Anyway the reason im posting is because as i was reading your post i found you had written this

"But at the end of the day, I live in this world mired up in bullshit, where it's all rationalizations, lies told to others to get by, etc. It's like I have no personality anymore. I try to cover it with drugs or other things but it doesn't go away."

Over the last few months I am starting to strongly believe that this is my problem, maybe ours and others aswel! This world is ridiculous and i am sick of it. i am sick of its people, im sick of how everything that everyone does is the reaction of some cok up of society that people are lead to believe is normal and anyoone outside that box is punished mentally for life by being convinced we have a problem we have to deal with on our own cuz we`re not right.....

OR! is that just another phsycotic way for me to justify the way a conduct myself through life? :)
i dont think it matters what we do as long as its not damaging other beings and you already know that, you obviously know the difference between right and wrong your just being told that something taboo is wrong. violent sex is great so long as its consentual. dont dwell on it too much, you know how it will pan out. pick something and do it. find an oil rig to work on or join the navy or something that will keep you busy that doesnt depress you. its when we`re doing things that we find answers, mosttimes without even looking for them. everything about it is pointless i know, down to the very last details of everything about it but you will find a place in your head to bring it all together in a way that suits, just dont give up. you know how you want to control your own mind its just a case of training it. over think small unimportant things from time t time. theres no doctor is going to just fix you or anyone, they help you deal with these things which is something we can all do with the right person to talk to. people might not get you but they dont have to. you know right from wrong, you are already asking for help and talking about it. hardest parts over. everything is dealt with in our minds and how we do that has effect on our lives everyday so be careful what you put through it and how

all that being said if you are in fear of physically hurting someone who doesnt want to be hurt then do seek professional help. And if you feel you have to emotionally abuse people befriend some scumbag loser and "mind-screw" him to join the monks or something

good luck anyway man, we all need it.
 
psychopath or not, you should be ok as long as you stop trying to change yourself fundamentally in order to fit into the definition of "normal".

I donnot agree with the statements that since you raised a concern that you might be a psychopath that fact alone says that you are not a psychopath. But your fear not to be a phycopath is already good thing because that tells me that you are a responsible person and you don't want to cause violence on other people (unless it is done in a none damaging way, ie within the scope of the law and with the consent of your partner or just watching sexually violent videos on the internet). The fact that you are not attracted to the normal relationship is ok too, the entire BDSM community is based on the sexual relationships that you've mentioned in your post, does that make everyone in BDSM violent or bad for society? I'd say not at all. The good thing is that you can playout your fantasy with your partner and have your gratification. You have mentioned that you had problem with drugs and you was able to beat it (by the way congrats on that, it's not an easy task). But with the sadistic tendencies it won't be easy to get rid of them because you already have a thought pattern formed in your had that you won't be able to change, by time it will become more and more intense (if it becomes too intense yes you should seek for a medical help, but if its not intense and the intensity goes away for a while after you have sex or mastrubate on vidoes, then that makes you no more than an intensive mastrubator which is fine too). You just want the sex in a certain way because this is what you became for whatever reason which isn't very important at this point. I recommend you find people who think like yourself and get involved in the community so that you get a chance to hear other people so that you get a clear picture of your problems and their reflection in other people. However, sooner you accept what you become better you'll be. The guilt will go away once you know how to handle your "shortcomings" so to speak. The only reason you feel guilty about your actions is because you think what you are doing is wrong things and maybe you are, but on the other you won't be able to name a person in this world who hasn't done a wrongdoing so who is the judge here besides yourself?
 
wow! im having this same conversation with my psyc now - he's admitted me to a psyc ward and I got lot of things on my mind to discuss - this is one. I know that I am. How far to do you tell someone what you have done - there is no treatment for sociopathy! good luck to the opener
 
Oh wow, my original post was deleted. Anyways, a psychopath would be indifferent about the fact or take it as an ego boost. They are incapable of worry or fear to the point of being immune to punishment. The think they are always great and thrive in situations you would find painful. You wouldn't be thinking critically about yourself either. Enjoying being a douchebag then hating yourself for it is not the same thing as a psychopath, not even close.

This is the problem with laypeople having free access to psychiatric definitions online.
 
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Of all the evil people are capable of, what you're describing is just, so far down the scale it's hardly even note-worthy. Not that it's not troubling and worth exploring, I'm just saying. There are people who go through this in their late-adolescence/early 20's quite often and I am guessing you fall in this range? Dissecting yourself - "what is wrong with me?" "why do I do this?" "why do I think these things?" happens often during this age. You are a human being, that's why. Capable of the most extreme kindness and the most depraved acts of malice. Maybe you think other people *appear* normal b/c they really are? Ain't none of us perfect and very few were raised by parents who did everything right. Countess more were outright abused and tortured in various ways growing up.
I have heard other young men say that, at a certain age, they decided not to care anymore, or love anymore, or try anymore, variations of such things. My father was one of them. Drug addiction and alcoholism, as well as abuse, marked my childhood and destroyed my mother beyond repair. Literally. She has been in a coma for 22 years due to a chain of reactions which happened when my father kicked her in the head with his steel-toed work boot. He had a pretty calm childhood, although he was adopted by a loving, stable family as an infant when his mother fell ill at 27 and died. I guess we all have shit to cry about, don't we?
But yes, this "not caring" thing that happens often with young boys is interesting. They do seem to become rather mal-adjusted little bastards soon after that. My father had to nearly die of cancer at 55 and get down to 84lbs. before he started to change his tune and see others as human beings worthy of love and respect, too. My advice to you, go to a children's cancer ward and see how those kids act. See the spirit and innocence and love in their eyes - the thoughtfulness for others when they are in excruciating pain, have to watch their mother cry every day, have not even a shred of hope left to even go on BREATHING. It affected my dad in the most profound way but who knows if he wasn't dying too maybe he would've just used it as an excuse to loathe himself even more, self-centered cunt that he WAS. Some people take longer to get a clue than others.
I agree with the other poster who said "do something" - he was absolutely right. Sitting around talking about your fave subject some more, YOU - isn't going to change a thing. Help someone. Volunteer. Get a perspective on how non-important and small you REALLY are on this planet, how fortunate you are to have what you have, even if it is very little. There are people in the world who couldn't feed their children today. If you have access to hot running water you are more fortunate than 75% of the population of Earth. Even if you hate every minute of it you will learn something valuable. Only then do you have the right to go to a therapist to discuss/process your discoveries. Otherwise you're just wasting your time and theirs, wallowing in the shit.
At least you're asking questions, even if they are still of the "why me" variety. Good for you. Now get out there and be something worthwhile to the rest of us and not just another asshole roaming the street.
 
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