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What do you all think of Vivek Ramsey?

I never said they were illegal immigrants

Vivek is trying to undue birthright citizenship, babies born here. Which is the only reason he is a US citizen himself.

He's a sell out, willing to betray the very thing that made him American.
Oh…while I see what you are saying I think a significant amount of legal immigrants could be motivated to come here illegally so that the future of their family is better. So say a mother is pregnant and in early pregnancy and they want a better life than the poverty and crime where they are from.

While there’s nothing wrong with that inherently and everyone should want to better their lives and those they lovethey are coming illegally

If they applied for amnesty then no issue. They get birth citizenship for their child, right? Is that how it works? I don’t know enough.

I guess that’s the way I see it but I don’t know much ya know. I’m just your average joe.
 
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We do need better choices. But like who?? That is the issue. You have to be rich I. America to run for president and rich people like you said don’t really connect with the common man unless they have been poor before. And who was the last president who wasn’t wealthy all their life?
Barrack Obama
 
Oh…while I see what you are saying I think a significant amount of legal immigrants could be motivated to come here illegally so that the future of their family is better. So say a mother is pregnant and in early pregnancy and they want a better life than the poverty and crime where they are from.

While there’s nothing wrong with that inherently ( everyone should want to better their lives and those they love) they are coming illegally.

If they applied for amnesty then no issue. They get birth citizenship for their child, right?

I guess that’s the way I see it but I don’t know much ya know. I’m just your average joe.

I grew up near the border in Tucson, AZ. I knew a lot of illegals. Some were friends. Mexicans, Hondurans, NIcaraguans, I met a lot of illegal dudes. Mostly because they had good drug connections.

No, I'm not suggesting any of that. As a democrat voter, I'm actually for increasing border security and revamping immigration policy.

But "border security" is just a fucking joke man. Republicans don't actually care about it. They voted NO on every single border issue during Biden's presidency, simply because making issues worse than they need to be and then complaining about it is the Republican MO these days. That's not my opinion that's what they said. Improving the border during Biden's presidency would make Biden look better, so they don't do it.

They don't fucking care about you, or what you think about border security... they just want to improve their chances of taking power, for no real reason other than their own self interest and enriching themselves monitarily.

if you think the republicans in seats right now care about border security you are mistaken, all they care about is maintaining their own power and wealth via legal corporate bribing

the democrats don't give a fuck about what I think about the border

the republicans don't give a fuck about what you think about the border

they just want you to think Biden made the border worse, to get your vote, when in all actuality the border situation is virtually the same as it has been since sept 11th

increased seizures and arrests don't mean the border is worse off than when Trump was here, in fact the opposite.... but in reality just the same
 
I grew up near the border in Tucson, AZ. I knew a lot of illegals. Some were friends. Mexicans, Hondurans, NIcaraguans, I met a lot of illegal dudes. Mostly because they had good drug connections.

No, I'm not suggesting any of that. As a democrat voter, I'm actually for increasing border security and revamping immigration policy.

But "border security" is just a fucking joke man. Republicans don't actually care about it. They voted NO on every single border issue during Biden's presidency, simply because making issues worse than they need to be and then complaining about it is the Republican MO these days. That's not my opinion that's what they said. Improving the border during Biden's presidency would make Biden look better, so they don't do it.

They don't fucking care about you, or what you think about border security... they just want to improve their chances of taking power, for no real reason other than their own self interest and enriching themselves monitarily.

if you think the republicans in seats right now care about border security you are mistaken, all they care about is maintaining their own power and wealth via legal corporate bribing

the democrats don't give a fuck about what I think about the border

the republicans don't give a fuck about what you think about the border

they just want you to think Biden made the border worse, to get your vote, when in all actuality the border situation is virtually the same as it has been since sept 11th

increased seizures and arrests don't mean the border is worse off than when Trump was here, in fact the opposite.... but in reality just the same
I like to believe there has got to be one or two honest politicians out there but in all honesty, my hope in that regard is very limited. As a whole I agree with what you said.

I just wish there would be an idealist who steps up. An idealist with righteous ideals and morals whatever those may be but at least striving to treat people well and to truly serve the people.

One day…maybe one day. The thing is about idealist is you can’t coerce them. They will die on that hill.

In all honesty, at first impressions so far, this guy really does strike me as an idealist. But idk for sure of course. Could be a play.

So I guess I just found him interesting as a candidate which is why I posted I guess.

Edit: I just wanted to add, I dont think the majority of illegal immigrants are here with bad intentions. I don’t think that whatsoever.
 
Yeah, but idk that that did much good tbh. Obama has great charisma but idk how I feel about his presidency.
You're entitled to your opinion, however, your question was about when the last time someone became president who hadn't been rich already.

Regarding Obama's presidency, he did (and still does) a lot of good for the average citizen. He made health insurance available to people who wouldn't be able to get it, in ways that reduced the cost to everyday people. He helped us through the worst financial crisis in almost a century, and he genuinely seems like a decent guy. Have you ever seen any of the interviews he did with guys serving time in prison for drug convictions? He demonstrated tremendous compassion for people in really difficult situations. He did this all while being treated pretty poorly by insecure white Americans, having his wife being accused of all sorts of absurd things, and he rose above that shit. He worked to figure out how to make sure that legislation was passed by trying to bridge the gap between conservative minded leaders and liberals (like with the ACA).

If you don't mind me asking, what did you dislike about him as a president?
 
So I guess I just found him interesting as a candidate which is why I posted I guess.
I just wanted to interject that you absolutely should ask people what their thoughts are about this stuff. I personally believe that a lot of the political failings comes from people expressing their views way more than asking and considering other people's views on these things. The beauty of the internet is we can think about how other people's perspectives differ from our own, and we can use that information to think about a variety of topics from different perspectives.

Years ago, I dated a girl whose family moved from Chicago up to Washington Island, Wisconsin. If you're unfamiliar, it's a tiny place off of the tip of the thumb, Door County. It's like a 500 people in the winter to 1500 people in the summer type of place, 2 hours outside of Green Bay. I went to visit a few times, and I was struck by how disconnected it felt from the world. I grew up in Boston, and have lived in the urban sprawl of the northeast for nearly my entire life, aside from a year in Arizona in my early 20s.

When her family first moved there, they were very progressive minded people, and actually had known JFK and Jackie Kennedy during the 50s. As they moved away from Chicago full-time, my girlfriend said that they had started to change, and express much different views. Part of it was the disconnection from the city, the dwindling of news sources, and simply the different perspective on issues that often become politicized. It made me think about if I lived in a place like that, where I had very little interaction with a diverse mix of people from different cultures, ethnicities, and lifestyles, it would become easier and easier to see differences as exciting and new, and instead see them as strange or threatening - especially when those things are filtered through a news media that uses fear to generate revenue. It also made me think about how folks living that far from a city, might take issue with the idea of their taxes going to support things that are, on their face, largely get absorbed into urban centers to deal with issues I am completely disconnected with. It would make it easy to start seeing other people's problems as simply *their problems* rather than thinking of those problems as being *our problems*.

We need more conversations from people with different ideas, backgrounds, opinions and views. It helps me to challenge my own views, and to have empathy for those whose views differ than mine. Asking about this stuff on forums like this is a great way to do that, and sharing your perspective is valuable as well. I know my story was a bit different than the topic at hand, but I felt like it was relevant.
 
The bottom line is that there is no point in caring about the guy. He's not going to be president. The cold hard fact is that unless Trump is in prison, he is going to be the republican candidate. And Trump is not going to be in prison, because his lawyers are not going to be stupid enough to waive a jury trial again. And the jury will come down to math and statistics. And the reality is that, when you run the numbers, you'll discover that even in San Francisco if you select 12 people at random; statistically, at least one of them will be a republican. It takes all 12 to convict. Therefore Trump will not be in prison and will be the nominee. So I never really saw any point in getting to know a lot about him; or any of the other wannabe GOP "candidates" for the nomination.

I did watch the Club Random episode in which Bill Maher interviewed him though. Politically... at least as much as the podcast is (nowhere near as) political (versus Maher's actual show)... he came off as one with mostly establishment republican positions but trying to present himself as young, edgy, and hip. He also came off, to me anyway, as an intensely unpleasant person whom I'd like to see punched in the face no matter his politics.
 
You're entitled to your opinion, however, your question was about when the last time someone became president who hadn't been rich already.

Regarding Obama's presidency, he did (and still does) a lot of good for the average citizen. He made health insurance available to people who wouldn't be able to get it, in ways that reduced the cost to everyday people. He helped us through the worst financial crisis in almost a century, and he genuinely seems like a decent guy. Have you ever seen any of the interviews he did with guys serving time in prison for drug convictions? He demonstrated tremendous compassion for people in really difficult situations. He did this all while being treated pretty poorly by insecure white Americans, having his wife being accused of all sorts of absurd things, and he rose above that shit. He worked to figure out how to make sure that legislation was passed by trying to bridge the gap between conservative minded leaders and liberals (like with the ACA).

If you don't mind me asking, what did you dislike about him as a president?
Nah - I was “in the streets “ as in I was literally living on the streets for most that time of my life so never kept up in mich news or politics m. I wasn’t part of mainstream society for a long long time after I got out.

I literally meant I don’t know how I feel about his presidency. There is some stuff I do t like that happened but there is stuff I did. I did like him holding the irs accountable for going after conservatives and asking the guy to resign.

But Benghazi happened on his watch and I do feel very strongly about that though that was mostly Clinton. He appointed her…

I am a veteran so it really bothers me when I think about my people being left to die…

But like I said I really don’t know how I feel about his presidency. I don’t know enough about it. Thats literally all I remember.
 
How is he eradicating personal freedom and support of complete authoritarianism?

  • he sought to appeal to evangelical Christian right and Christian nationalist voters, [...] Ramaswamy has criticized secularism. He said that the U.S. was founded on "Christian values" or "Judeo-Christian values"
  • Ramaswamy is a vocal supporter of Donald Trump. [He] promised to pardon him if elected president
  • He supports state-level six-week abortion bans,
  • Ramaswamy favors raising the voting age to 25, with exceptions, [...] he would allow citizens between 18 and 24 to vote only if they are enlisted in the military, work as first responders, or pass a civics test. He is also in favor of [...] requiring Voter ID to cast a ballot. (all things to conveniently exclude the more liberal leaning 21-24yo group, also Voter ID just makes voting more confusing and harder for the disenfranchised - voter fraud is not really a problem in USA)
  • Ramaswamy supports expanding presidential power, pledging to rule by executive fiat to a degree unprecedented among modern U.S. presidents. (read: he wants to be a dictator) He supports abolishing and replacing the Department of Education, FBI, and IRS.
  • Ramaswamy has pledged to "use our military to annihilate the Mexican drug cartels", yet he has described himself as "not a war on drugs person" (??? Who wants a useless war with Mexico, raise your hand! ... I don't see any hands.)
  • Ramaswamy argues that identity politics promotes a "victimhood" culture that needs to be replaced with a "merit" culture that promotes excellence. He also opposes affirmative action, calling it the "single biggest form of institutionalized racism in America today", and vowing to rescind Executive Order 11246 if elected. (which basically bans discrimination based upon race, sex, age, religion etc, in Federal contractors doing jobs over $10,000) Ramaswamy has also argued that American-style capitalism provides an antidote to India's caste system by offering lower-caste citizens more economic opportunities. He opposes teaching critical race theory. (thinly veiled racist dogwhistles)
  • Ramaswamy has taken no public position on the 2017 Trump tax cuts. (so he's OK with the rich getting big cuts) [...] he expressed support for an inheritance tax rate as high as 59% and criticized intergenerational transfers of wealth, writing that they create "hereditary aristocracy". (which is the only large payment many poorer people will ever get in their life: more wealthy people have investments they can transfer without incurring tax)
  • Ramaswamy favors "major concessions to Russia" in the Russo-Ukrainian war. He favors ending U.S. military aid to Ukraine, excluding Ukraine from NATO (saying he is "dead-set opposed" to it), and allowing Russia to occupy regions of Ukraine in exchange for an agreement that Russia end its alliance with China. (about as likely to happen as Charlie Sheen staying sober for 48 hours)

There are more
 
The bottom line is that there is no point in caring about the guy. He's not going to be president. The cold hard fact is that unless Trump is in prison, he is going to be the republican candidate. And Trump is not going to be in prison, because his lawyers are not going to be stupid enough to waive a jury trial again. And the jury will come down to math and statistics. And the reality is that, when you run the numbers, you'll discover that even in San Francisco if you select 12 people at random; statistically, at least one of them will be a republican. It takes all 12 to convict. Therefore Trump will not be in prison and will be the nominee. So I never really saw any point in getting to know a lot about him; or any of the other wannabe GOP "candidates" for the nomination.

I did watch the Club Random episode in which Bill Maher interviewed him though. Politically... at least as much as the podcast is (nowhere near as) political (versus Maher's actual show)... he came off as one with mostly establishment republican positions but trying to present himself as young, edgy, and hip. He also came off, to me anyway, as an intensely unpleasant person whom I'd like to see punched in the face no matter his politics.
Yeah, he's what they call an Edge Lord. He has to know he'd never win the nomination, much less the election, but he likes the attention and there is nothing like being "edgy" and pushing buttons to get attention. He is in a race to the bottom as far as attention-getting goes along with a bunch of other assholes
 
  • he sought to appeal to evangelical Christian right and Christian nationalist voters, [...] Ramaswamy has criticized secularism. He said that the U.S. was founded on "Christian values" or "Judeo-Christian values"
Exploiting known vulnerability in a voting block. A strategy that started with the Christian Coalition in the late 70s to early 80s which turned this historically non-voting segment of the population into a reliable and predictable voting block. The love their god and their big mans who they seem to deify.

  • Ramaswamy is a vocal supporter of Donald Trump. [He] promised to pardon him if elected president
Fucking sycophant.
  • He supports state-level six-week abortion bans,
Yes because he has a dick and probably no empathy for those who don't have one, but would rather make decisions on their behalf because 'family values'
  • Ramaswamy favors raising the voting age to 25, with exceptions, [...] he would allow citizens between 18 and 24 to vote only if they are enlisted in the military, work as first responders, or pass a civics test. He is also in favor of [...] requiring Voter ID to cast a ballot. (all things to conveniently exclude the more liberal leaning 21-24yo group, also Voter ID just makes voting more confusing and harder for the disenfranchised - voter fraud is not really a problem in USA)
Honestly - I'm not opposed to this. I think that something like this would be good for our society. We need more initiatives that support the development of engaged citizenry, and it would need to have enough diverse opportunities to do that to account for the huge disparity in education around civics. More public service work would be really positive. This is the one thing that I think is good, though obviously can understand how it underhands progressives initially, I think that overtime it would benefit progressives since people would actually understand civic responsibility and the need for regulation and funding of infrastructure, rather than cutting taxes and then wondering why our infrastructure is fucked up
  • Ramaswamy supports expanding presidential power, pledging to rule by executive fiat to a degree unprecedented among modern U.S. presidents. (read: he wants to be a dictator) He supports abolishing and replacing the Department of Education, FBI, and IRS.
How sad to think that we would conclude the great experiment of democracy only 2 years shy of the 250th!

I'd need to know what he wanted to replace those agencies with, but frankly, that sounds like a lot work that will get punted into the Trump Wall phase of the plan... (read: moving goalposts)
  • Ramaswamy has pledged to "use our military to annihilate the Mexican drug cartels", yet he has described himself as "not a war on drugs person" (??? Who wants a useless war with Mexico, raise your hand! ... I don't see any hands.)
We're going to use violence to end the war!
  • Ramaswamy argues that identity politics promotes a "victimhood" culture that needs to be replaced with a "merit" culture that promotes excellence. He also opposes affirmative action, calling it the "single biggest form of institutionalized racism in America today", and vowing to rescind Executive Order 11246 if elected. (which basically bans discrimination based upon race, sex, age, religion etc, in Federal contractors doing jobs over $10,000) Ramaswamy has also argued that American-style capitalism provides an antidote to India's caste system by offering lower-caste citizens more economic opportunities. He opposes teaching critical race theory. (thinly veiled racist dogwhistles)
I don't agree with his conclusion, but I do feel like he's tapping into something with the mindset of folks in our culture. I'm a therapist, I would argue that I"m a halfway decent one at that. I'd even argue that I"m a topic matter experts on certain areas of evidence-based practice and diagnostics. The sheer number of people who self diagnose because they watched a TikTok video or some instagram story, and then carry that diagnosis into their reddit disclaimer: 'as a person with SEVERE BPD (which one? unclear...) Autism, DID, CPTSD I am qualified to have an opinion on this topic...' - It's mind boggling. I do think there's an inherent truth to the pathological mentality that exists in our society, and I do not think that anti-discrimination laws being repealed are the answer, sorry Vivek, try again dude.
  • Ramaswamy has taken no public position on the 2017 Trump tax cuts. (so he's OK with the rich getting big cuts) [...] he expressed support for an inheritance tax rate as high as 59% and criticized intergenerational transfers of wealth, writing that they create "hereditary aristocracy". (which is the only large payment many poorer people will ever get in their life: more wealthy people have investments they can transfer without incurring tax)
Sycophant, and aware enough to know whose money he needs in his pockets to stand a chance.
  • Ramaswamy favors "major concessions to Russia" in the Russo-Ukrainian war. He favors ending U.S. military aid to Ukraine, excluding Ukraine from NATO (saying he is "dead-set opposed" to it), and allowing Russia to occupy regions of Ukraine in exchange for an agreement that Russia end its alliance with China. (about as likely to happen as Charlie Sheen staying sober for 48 hours)
Fuck that shit, we should not back down on allies who have given us no reason to abandon, especially not in a way that gives Russia a leg up. The Cold War was not that long ago, and Russia is a society that is old as fuck. Putin is a huge influence on Trump, governing through deception. That is not the kind of influence that I would ever want to have a chance to develop even more daylight in the US. We used to stand for values in this country, and we used to stand behind our allies.
There are more
I'm sure he has some Crypto that he wants me to invest in as well
 
The bottom line is that there is no point in caring about the guy. He's not going to be president.

this.

I am a veteran so it really bothers me when I think about my people being left to die…

But like I said I really don’t know how I feel about his presidency.

thank you for your service.

you've said in the past that you'd vote for trump.
  • he referred to american war dead as "losers" and "suckers".
  • at the grave of lt. robert kelly, son of future chief of staff john kelly, trump said to john kelly “i don’t get it. what was in it for them?”. to a father of a dead soldier.
  • he canceled a world war i cemetary visit in france because it was raining.
  • he told myeshia johnson - the widow of fallen soldier sgt. la david johnson - "he knew what he signed up for..."
  • belittled john mccain for being captured in vietnam
  • childishly attacked gold star family, khizr and ghazala khan, and belittled their dead son's sacrifice
  • on numerous other occasions, publicly criticized various members of the military, including generals
i tend to agree with gen wesley clark when he said "trump’s actions and behavior have led service members and veterans to question whether he really understands who a commander in chief is, or what he does."

as a veteran, how do you square your willingness to vote for trump with his incredible disrespect for the military?

alasdair
 
this.



thank you for your service.

you've said in the past that you'd vote for trump.
  • he referred to american war dead as "losers" and "suckers".
  • at the grave of lt. robert kelly, son of future chief of staff john kelly, trump said to john kelly “i don’t get it. what was in it for them?”. to a father of a dead soldier.
  • he canceled a world war i cemetary visit in france because it was raining.
  • he told myeshia johnson - the widow of fallen soldier sgt. la david johnson - "he knew what he signed up for..."
  • belittled john mccain for being captured in vietnam
  • childishly attacked gold star family, khizr and ghazala khan, and belittled their dead son's sacrifice
  • on numerous other occasions, publicly criticized various members of the military, including generals
i tend to agree with gen wesley clark when he said "trump’s actions and behavior have led service members and veterans to question whether he really understands who a commander in chief is, or what he does."

as a veteran, how do you square your willingness to vote for trump with his incredible disrespect for the military?

alasdair
Well, I guess what I have to say is if it’s true that he doesn’t respect veterans and others and especially those who paid the ultimate sacrifice then he’s despicable…

If it’s true that he said those things…

The thing with Benghazi is people died…because wel let them.And that is unforgivable to abandon those who volunteer to out their lives in the line for us.
 
Well, I guess what I have to say is if it’s true that he doesn’t respect veterans and others and especially those who paid the ultimate sacrifice then he’s despicable…

If it’s true that he said those things…

despicable indeed.

some of them are second hand, from sources closes to the president, but many of the others - the mccain stuff for example - he said in public and you can easily find it.

alasdair
 
The bottom line is that there is no point in caring about the guy. He's not going to be president. The cold hard fact is that unless Trump is in prison, he is going to be the republican candidate. And Trump is not going to be in prison, because his lawyers are not going to be stupid enough to waive a jury trial again. And the jury will come down to math and statistics. And the reality is that, when you run the numbers, you'll discover that even in San Francisco if you select 12 people at random; statistically, at least one of them will be a republican. It takes all 12 to convict. Therefore Trump will not be in prison and will be the nominee. So I never really saw any point in getting to know a lot about him; or any of the other wannabe GOP "candidates" for the nomination.

I did watch the Club Random episode in which Bill Maher interviewed him though. Politically... at least as much as the podcast is (nowhere near as) political (versus Maher's actual show)... he came off as one with mostly establishment republican positions but trying to present himself as young, edgy, and hip. He also came off, to me anyway, as an intensely unpleasant person whom I'd like to see punched in the face no matter his politics.

Never underestimate the stupidity of trumps lawyers lol
 
Have you been seriously injured in a motor vehicle accident? Call Tough Guy law, we’ve represented hundreds of people just like you, AND the former president of the United States!!!
 
Yeah, he's what they call an Edge Lord. He has to know he'd never win the nomination, much less the election, but he likes the attention and there is nothing like being "edgy" and pushing buttons to get attention. He is in a race to the bottom as far as attention-getting goes along with a bunch of other assholes
I remember 15 years ago when we were all laughing at a different edge lord saying he will never get elected and that ended up getting elected and destroying the fabric of government and ripping amaericans apart
 
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