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What can be done to make public officials and the gen pop. Realize that drug addicts that want to remain addicts exist???

LucidSDreamr

LucidSDreamr

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I just got done watching the newly elected San Francisco mayors press conference on fentanyl.

As usual, he’s painfully misinformed and clueless. As usual, the media and general citizens complaining about tranq zombies on their front lawn clueless so they fail to realize the cluelessness of those in the lead

The conference was is basically summed up as “more funding for rehab”. “More funding for shelters (that you have to be sober to be in.”
What about the drug using population that DOES NOT WANT TO STOP???? They don’t want rehab. Any forced rehabs will be a revolving door of money wasting back to them wasting themselves on the street the day they get out.

The public refuses to acknowledge that a large amount (I’d love to hear percents for. You guys l) of active users DO NOT WANT TO GET CLEAN AMD WILL KEEP USING ACTIVELY EVEN IF IN JAIL OR REHAB.

Why is there never any solutions proposed for how to deal with these ppl littering the sidewalks? If rehab and jail were enough the problem would be solved already.

If this website is for anything more than bragging about what exotic designer psychedelics you’ve done or warning ppl not to mix dangerous combos is love to hear if what I’m imagining is actually a very real issue and hole in “drug policy” and maybe some ways we can get the issue on anybody’s radarZ

I also wonder if the reason it’s left off the radar is because there is no actual solution to it. Those ppl will keep using no matter how much money you throw at the problem so it’s unfixable. But adjacent problems like drug related theft and wasting bodies in the street can be addressed and ppl don’t want to admit that addicts will never stop so we just choose to live in a fucking fantasy land where that is the ultimate goal.
 
They have been arresting doctors. This is a bipartisn effort and it ain't gonna change. If fact dumbass biden tried to make Marijuana schedule 2, meaning you have to find a doctor who will prescribed weed and since there are no refills on schedule 2 drugs and some federal judge is causing problems and potentially ruining legalized Marijuana.
There is basically no chance.

Also the DEA said amphetamines are the new opiod crisis, with Biden in office. Trump did nothing to fuck up weed or opiods other than convince the Chinese to stop shipping Fentanyl here.
Now they ship the precursor drugs to Mexico.

If there are stage 4 cancer patients who have trouble getting opiods and doctors scared to write, and a bipartisan effort, initially started by Obama, then I would say the chances of legalization is roughly the same as Osama bin Laden coming back to life and becoming the next Prime Minister of Israel.

Then they face jail or prison. There is no one of any importance who will stand up and fight. The Democrats started the war on opiods and do you think the Republicans are going to be more understanding? LMAO

Trump really doesn't care but their is an existential threat from the courts because of Biden. He should have left Marijuana alone. His dumbass or whoever is pulling his strings could potentially ruin recreational Marijuana, and the Democrats led the charge against opiods and the Republicans will not help.
The majority want hard drugs illegal and this is a democracy( sort of), and guess what, a minority of people are not going to get their way on this anytime soon. They may ease penalties some but Washington is not going to put up with much regarding opiods or any harder drugs. Also psilocybin is probably in jeopardy also because big government is here to take away not give freedom.

The general population and government don't give a shit what a relatively small percentage of people want. If pain patients like me, have been limited by a Democrat governor and a republican state legislature, then there is no chance.

If no one will stick up for pain patients, then there is no hope of recreational users and the policy of ignoring the federal laws on Marijuana could be potentially, leading to shutting down every dispensary, then what? Back to the cartels number 1 cash crop, shitty weed.
 
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I have been whittled down from 60mg/ to 10mg of methadone
This is at least one pill short of "covering" my pain
since 1998, got fusion neck surgery; had another disc replaced
completely blew my ankle and have hardware that I could remove
Synovial cyst in hip; swellbow in both arms torn biceps tendon shoulder surgery
Too much skating and surfing but the drugs allow my to still do it and even work
as a teacher since 2003

Meanwhile I am drugged; maybe at 56 I've done myself good enough
to deserve methadone treatment in a sufficient dose to my own judgement
Methadone, clonazepam,and pregabalin...... out
 
lolis my thesis said:
I

Meanwhile I am drugged; maybe at 56 I've done myself good enough
to deserve methadone treatment in a sufficient dose to my own judgement
Methadone, clonazepam,and pregabalin...... out
Click to expand...
isn’t that what methadone for addiction is? You basically get to choose your dose as you get up to it where if it’s high enough and you say “ok this is enough methadone for me not to also go do fentanyl on top of it” you can get up to that dose?

My cousin regularly pisses dirty for coke and fent and Xanax, is always pregnant; and she’s gotten raises and weekly take homes up to 100mg per day now for a small girl.

With pain it’s 10 mgs a day no matter how bad you are injured. The funny thing is that’s line 3x lower than the CDCs since retracted and retracted and retreated guidline. That retracted guideline the DEA will forever use to prosecute doctors is still 3X higher than the 10 mg of methadone; yet my doctor won’t go up past 10 no matter what.

I think internally at the DEA there’s a policy to prosecute doctors at 30 MME or more. The public just doesn’t see that the true limit is 30 and not 90 like the retracted CDC guidelines from 2016 said
 
LucidSDreamr said:
I just got done watching the newly elected San Francisco mayors press conference on fentanyl.

As usual, he’s painfully misinformed and clueless. As usual, the media and general citizens complaining about tranq zombies on their front lawn clueless so they fail to realize the cluelessness of those in the lead

The conference was is basically summed up as “more funding for rehab”. “More funding for shelters (that you have to be sober to be in.”
What about the drug using population that DOES NOT WANT TO STOP???? They don’t want rehab. Any forced rehabs will be a revolving door of money wasting back to them wasting themselves on the street the day they get out.

The public refuses to acknowledge that a large amount (I’d love to hear percents for. You guys l) of active users DO NOT WANT TO GET CLEAN AMD WILL KEEP USING ACTIVELY EVEN IF IN JAIL OR REHAB.

Why is there never any solutions proposed for how to deal with these ppl littering the sidewalks? If rehab and jail were enough the problem would be solved already.

If this website is for anything more than bragging about what exotic designer psychedelics you’ve done or warning ppl not to mix dangerous combos is love to hear if what I’m imagining is actually a very real issue and hole in “drug policy” and maybe some ways we can get the issue on anybody’s radarZ

I also wonder if the reason it’s left off the radar is because there is no actual solution to it. Those ppl will keep using no matter how much money you throw at the problem so it’s unfixable. But adjacent problems like drug related theft and wasting bodies in the street can be addressed and ppl don’t want to admit that addicts will never stop so we just choose to live in a fucking fantasy land where that is the ultimate goal.
Click to expand...

To me it boils down to three things:

1) The disease model of drug addiction means they want to try and cure it.
2) They don't want to normalize it.
3) There is a fundamental belief that abstinence-only is the best way to live, even though most of society is using drugs of some kind now. There's just "approved" drugs and "not approved drugs."

It's also going to be hard to differentiate between people who want to be on drugs because they are hopelessly dependent vs. those who have deeply searched themselves and believe that a drug life is superior to a sober life. If someone says "I want to be this way" they will just assume it's the addiction talking, and not a rational person.
 
In San Francisco, it's basically you aren't going to use my property, especially my house or my bedroom to consume your drug of choice. If you want use opioids use your own property, house bedroom. Maybe a night or two in jail will give you a kick in the pants, but then again maybe if won't. Tongue planted firmly in cheek.
 
specialrelativity said:
In San Francisco, it's basically you aren't going to use my property, especially my house or my bedroom to consume your drug of choice. If you want use opioids use your own property, house bedroom. Maybe a night or two in jail will give you a kick in the pants, but then again maybe if won't. Tongue planted firmly in cheek.
Click to expand...

The thing is addicts are going to use public and private property to consume drugs because we have decided we are banning all drugs from shelters and banning safe usage sites.

They are going to use in cities because drugs are illegal
And therefore expensive and cities are where homeless get money easily. If fentanyl costed as much as cigarettes these expensive cities would be absent of drug addicts. Drug addicts don’t want to live in SF because they like SF. They want to live there because that’s the only place they can get enough money to keep a habit up of 59 cents worth of fentanyl per day that the black market has marked up to $300

Make all the laws you want. Shoot at them. They are going to keep using in front of your house and in front of the sidewalk at the pharmacy no matter what.

If the goal is to just get them out of sight you only have two options:

1). Kill them all (new addicts are constantly minted so keep killing)
2) relocate them to a place they can use until they die from it.

There is no option that exists that involves getting them off drugs. I do t understand why people don’t understand that. We’ve been trying to “solve” addiction for 70+ years and failed miserably; addiction is not going to be eradicated; the only choice we have is “where do we want it to occur”

Nobody wants to talk about that issue; we want to talk about eliminating addiction as if we are retarded and haven’t noticed the last 70 years
 
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Yep. The "best intentions" have mixed results at best. They were handling down life sentences for heroin sale for decades before fentanyl took over. Got everyone else hooked on pharmaceuticals for decades leading up to cutting them off.

What's a junkie supposed to do? Access to rehab and halfway houses might have worked 50 years ago. And it can still work now but you really have to want it and for people who are suffering so much already in the mental health community. A lot of people reason that it's just easier to self-medicate.

I have mixed opinions on this issue. I had a pretty substantial hydrocodone dependency for years. Then my supply got cut off mainly because they rescheduled hydrocodone from a schedule 3 to a scheduled two. This may have been the catalyst for me to eventually get clean. But it sucked transitioning from a daily hydrocodone use to daily whatever I could get my f****** hands on use.

Now everybody's losing their minds on fentanyl and all these other substitute drugs that are more deadly than heroin ever was... More deadly than hydrocodone ever was...





Back in 2000 something the Australian law enforcement agencies along with Interpol managed to track the largest shipment of MDMA to date. The intercepted the delivery from place tracking devices on these crates of MDMA pills from Italy. It was the biggest bust in world history at that time. Everybody patted each other on the back and knew that they had taken a huge MDMA organized crime syndicate down. But you know what happened overdose is skyrocketed from 20 a year to 200 a year. But why?

Well as it turns out the people they busted were the main supplies of MDMA into Australia for the last decade. The demand was still there kids still wanted to rave on MDMA but there was none. So what happened is exactly what happened with our synthetic opiate market. A bunch of dangerous b******* was being sold to fill the void.

I think if our laws and are drug policies reflected actual harm reduction, instead of a one size fits all mandatory minimum, we might have had meaningful change over time.

But this whole throw money at the problem, while at the same time not even studying how we got to this point is always a recipe for insanity.
 
crazyhairman said:
Yep. The "best intentions" have mixed results at best. They were handling down life sentences for heroin sale for decades before fentanyl took over. Got everyone else hooked on pharmaceuticals for decades leading up to cutting them off.

What's a junkie supposed to do? Access to rehab and halfway houses might have worked 50 years ago. And it can still work now but you really have to want it and for people who are suffering so much already in the mental health community. A lot of people reason that it's just easier to self-medicate.

I have mixed opinions on this issue. I had a pretty substantial hydrocodone dependency for years. Then my supply got cut off mainly because they rescheduled hydrocodone from a schedule 3 to a scheduled two. This may have been the catalyst for me to eventually get clean. But it sucked transitioning from a daily hydrocodone use to daily whatever I could get my f****** hands on use.

Now everybody's losing their minds on fentanyl and all these other substitute drugs that are more deadly than heroin ever was... More deadly than hydrocodone ever was...





Back in 2000 something the Australian law enforcement agencies along with Interpol managed to track the largest shipment of MDMA to date. The intercepted the delivery from place tracking devices on these crates of MDMA pills from Italy. It was the biggest bust in world history at that time. Everybody patted each other on the back and knew that they had taken a huge MDMA organized crime syndicate down. But you know what happened overdose is skyrocketed from 20 a year to 200 a year. But why?

Well as it turns out the people they busted were the main supplies of MDMA into Australia for the last decade. The demand was still there kids still wanted to rave on MDMA but there was none. So what happened is exactly what happened with our synthetic opiate market. A bunch of dangerous b******* was being sold to fill the void.

I think if our laws and are drug policies reflected actual harm reduction, instead of a one size fits all mandatory minimum, we might have had meaningful change over time.

But this whole throw money at the problem, while at the same time not even studying how we got to this point is always a recipe for insanity.
Click to expand...


It makes me wonder if governments are actually this inept at understanding a problem or if they are purposely trying to make it as bad as possible (everyone hooked on fentanyl or something)
 
I think the levels of ignorance and indifference in both government and the general population are so high that not much can really be done. The general population has been indoctrinated to believe that drugs, especially opioids, are bad and people shouldn't be allowed to remain on them regardless of whether they want to or not. I don't think most politicians really care a whole lot about drug policy or have any real understanding of it. They're going to move in whatever direction they think leads to the most votes. Really, they have too if they want to succeed in their chosen career, politics.

I think a big part of the issue lies in the incentive structure of the US political system. Politicians have to prioritize maintaining popularity over pushing for the best possible policies. Taking unpopular stands is a good way to end one's political career in an electoral democracy and advocating for unpopular groups of people is too.

Fentanyl addicts who don't want to stop using are a profoundly unpopular group and they're also unlikely to vote. Advocating for them will probably offend and alienate numerous voters who dislike addicts and will likely win very few new votes, so doing so is a big risk for little reward. Politicians who take risks like that don't reach positions where they can influence policy for any length of time. And so US drug policy is stuck in a rut leading nowhere (or to an eventual invasion of Mexico).
 
We have hypocrites in power.

Drugs are "bad" and a "moral failing" when poor people use them but it's totally okay & "safe" when rich people want to use them -


I think they're trying to make drugs a rich-people-only thing. Have you seen the prices of real heroin in the US? Anywhere from 160-200 bucks for GRAM of fucking heroin! Which would last any junkie MAYBE 3 days if they're lucky!


We need legal heroin & legal other opioids (hydromorphone, oxymorphone, the codones, etc..) or at least loosened restrictions on methadone to help people get away from fentanyl.

Not everyone wants to give up drugs because some of us function better & feel better when we're on them. It should be a big part of the whole "pursuit of happiness" thing. And it's a bodily autonomy issue.

I defend abortion & trans issues, but I never see anyone (on the "left") really sticking up for drug reform.
In fact I saw a lot of "haha Elon Musk is a druggie" type posts on reddit over the past few weeks (a generally "liberal" website).
I'm not a fan of Elon myself, but attacking some one for using ketamine is just really pathetic & stupid.


I think in the end, crooked corporations & institutions make more profit by keeping everything illegal.
If drugs were legal, cops would actually have to focus on REAL crimes instead of harassing people who enjoy using drugs.
 
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