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  • BDD Moderators: Keif’ Richards

Vyvanse & Heart Problems

A benzodiazepine binds to GABA-a receptors and enhances the efficiency of it by increasing the frequency of the opening of the associated C.I. channel. Therefore, a benzodiazepine is a GABA-a

No it isn't.

An agonist is a substance that can induce a response from a neuron WITHOUT a neurotransmitter being present. Benzodiazepines do not induce a response from the neuron without GABA being present. GABA must be present and MUST be binding to GABAa in order for a benzodiazepine to cause increase a positive response from the neuron.

Therefore a benzodiazepine is not an agonist. It's classified as a positive allosteric modulator.

Also, I am fully aware of what a benzodiazepine does to the firing if a GABA receptor. My response and calling it "widening" is meant for the layman. All your information is entirely wrong, so I made it easy for you to understand since you have no idea what you're talking about.

Opiates and GABA augmenters both relax muscles. According to your info, an opiate would also cause upper airway restriction as they both relax muscles! Also Mu-Opioid activation, indirectly agonizes GABA. Your info isn't wrong, but it's incorrectly attributed. Wikipedia poorly describes this information; I advise you to get your information from Publisher Medical from now on.

Let me spell this out for you one more time. GABA augmented and Stimulant drugs are contradictory. By mixing these you're putting intense strain of your autonomic nervous system. By cause this intense strain, you're greatly increasing the likelihood of this system failing. That's why GABA augmenters and Stimulant drugs should never be mixed.

I would reply to your idiocy in its entirety, but I am on vacation and therefore on a mobile device. I will response properly, citing my sources, when I get back on Sunday.
 
I think after reading that, I am going to get out of this one. Completely lost me. Idiocy stings pretty bad lol
 
No it isn't.

Yes, it is.

An agonist is a substance that can induce a response from a neuron WITHOUT a neurotransmitter being present. Benzodiazepines do not induce a response from the neuron without GABA being present. GABA must be present and MUST be binding to GABAa in order for a benzodiazepine to cause increase a positive response from the neuron.

Therefore a benzodiazepine is not an agonist. It's classified as a positive allosteric modulator.

Semantics. A benzodiazepine is more specifically classified as a PAM because of its MOA when binding to its corresponding receptor site. However, by binding to the "benzodiazepine site" on compatible GABA-a receptors, by increasing the frequency of the opening of the associated chloride ion channel, its PA-modulating effects are triggering a stimulatory response in the associated receptor.

Also, I am fully aware of what a benzodiazepine does to the firing if a GABA receptor. My response and calling it "widening" is meant for the layman.

Sure bud.

All your information is entirely wrong, so I made it easy for you to understand since you have no idea what you're talking about.

Countless people are living proof that your copied and pasted theories of opioids, benzodiazepines, stimulants and heart attacks are flawed.

Opiates and GABA augmenters both relax muscles. According to your info, an opiate would also cause upper airway restriction as they both relax muscles!

Ugh - it's hopeless. Do you not understand that an opioid does not affect respiration in exactly the same manner as a benzodiazepine? The end result is the same, but the "route taken to get there" is unique when comparing the two.

Wikipedia poorly describes this information; I advise you to get your information from Publisher Medical from now on.

Believe it or not, I've cited PubMed countless times over the years. And with relation to pharmacology, I wouldn't be surprised if it's the most cited source with respect to Wikipedia's information on the topic.

Let me spell this out for you one more time. GABA augmented and Stimulant drugs are contradictory. By mixing these you're putting intense strain of your autonomic nervous system. By cause this intense strain, you're greatly increasing the likelihood of this system failing. That's why GABA augmenters and Stimulant drugs should never be mixed.

And let me reply again - I believe you are incorrect. So show me some solid, concrete proof.

I would reply to your idiocy in its entirety, but I am on vacation and therefore on a mobile device. I will response properly, citing my sources, when I get back on Sunday.

I was waiting for this. I feel sorry for your type. You obviously can't debate a topic without including some personal attack if someone doesn't agree with your arrogant self. Try to reflect on this, and refrain from repeating it during a debate because it's beyond childish.

So let's see. You still haven't provided any sources, not even one, because of a lame excuse of being on vacation. Apparently using Google for a few minutes is just too hard. However, you did have time to run over to Wikipedia, check what I copied and pasted, and scoot back over here to tell me about it. Then the insult. And now you expect me to take you seriously?

Good luck with the sources.

P.S. I continue to feel just fine while combining a stimulant with a benzo. Going on 6 years, 10 months, 23 days. I recently I had my physical, and also an ECG. No problemo. It can't be! How did I not die of a heart attack by now. Divine intervention perhaps?

P.P.S. I have been corrected on this site many times by others who didn't resort to name-calling, and who thoroughly cited their information. What do you think I did - what I'm doing with you now? No. I sincerely apologized for being mistaken. Food for thought.

I'm an addict and alcoholic and have horrible ADD my old psych said he was surprised I was even passing classes, because of the results of my ADD test he had me do. Anyways I am a bad user of any drug that's abusable, I am 19 now and finally couldn't take it any more, I finally was sober again after a 8 month relapse, and speed and MDMA were my weakness.

Ohshitebro - I just wanted to reply to your OP regarding mixing large amounts of booze with potent stimulants such as Vyvanse.

In short, there are potentially serious health risks involved here which don't apply to benzodiazepines.

I'm sure by now you notice that when you get drunk, you start pissing like a racehorse. That's because alcohol affects the secretion of a hormone known as vasopressin. This hormone is responsible for regulating the amount of water in the body. As a result, getting smashed is associated with (possibly severe) dehydration.

If you add a recreational dose of a potent stimulant (e.g. Vyvanse) to this, the result may be fatal. This is because the stimulant also dehydrates the body mainly through increased body temperature and sweating.

Symptoms of severe dehydration may include (among other things) profuse sweating, low blood pressure, increased heart-rate, fainting, seizures, heart failure and death.

I know this sounds rediculous but by week two I was all about it and felt okay about it becàuse I was in good heàlth, I had 1 left at 2 weeks, and made an app early to get high dose and new script, and did so then same deal 120 mg a day thing worked great with tons of monsters and mountain dews to make it stronger and it did, so I ran out and decided to wait out the two weeks to avoid sketchiness, next script same dose 60mg but I started to use 300 mgs with a kpin or two to take the edge off, then I decided I wanted mdma, so I went to my guy who lives 2 hrs away, bought my gram, and did it all that night on a kpin, went back home, took 300 to 600 mgs a day with the kp, cleaned my car 4 days after my trip my car was dirty, and I was cleaning it and found a bag with .2 crystal in it, already took my vyvanse 300mgs and then did the mdma and a kpin .5 kpins btw not high dosage and could barely feel the Molly, I shit on my brain with the gram, that was the most mdma I've ever done I used to use .5 every week and would hallucinate dogs at the end, never Thot u could on Molly. Anyways back to now, lost job, family found out I used again (lots of kpins, blackin out at night. Then 600mgs in a twelve hour period daily with 1mg kpins. Staying up 72 hours sleep then 48ish. Ran out my script in no time. Less than 2 weeks and idr shit about end of nights. Finally stopped and am clean since 2 days ago. And I was smoking a pack to two packs of smokes a day (smoked since I was like 12, 6th grade however old that was). Figured I woulda died somehow but I'm here still. I figured my heart must just be tired, brain is def fried a bit. Idk what does this abuse of that med of to me, it was no meth but it was legal.

Mixing high dosages of Vyvanse with other stimulants may seem fun, but it also produces synergistic adverse effects (increased heart-rate, blood pressure, etc.) and is a bad idea in general. That includes caffeine, MDMA and also nicotine (tabacco). I'm not trying to preach - just please, be careful. I speak partly from experience here as I used to be a stimulant freak myself (with a serious smoking habit to go along) and mixing high amounts landed me in the hospital twice (both times I was treated with IV benzodiazepines, which helped considerably).

So fucking do research guys, It is not all the doctors fault I didn't do my research and am lucky I didn't fully relapse to the real drugs instead of those things. Got to have done something to myself. I don't care about dying but shit fuck a coma or stroke. Was the vyasnse pretty bad for my heart? What damage does said use do to the drug abuser with no known heart problems? I mean it was not as bad as I was before my first rehab on reàl shit, but in the name of drug safety for others, would love to know! Thanks guys. Sorry if this sucked, no more meds lol.

There's always a possibility you could have done some damage to a vital organ, such as your heart. If you wanna make sure (for peace of mind) that your heart is functioning properly, I would ask my family doctor for a referral to a cardiologist.

Good luck with everything. I hope you are alright.
 
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Mixing stimulants and benzos is safe and is a widely prescribed combination. Yes, even to be taken at the same time. It will not "give you a heart attack" or make you "just plain stupid". As mentioned, lorazepam (Ativan) is indicated in emergency departments for amphetamine/methamphetamine overdose (and not just as a preventive of seizures).

Abuse will not be tolerated.
 
SwampFox said:
Also, mixing an Opiate with a stimulant is much safer than mixing a benzodiazepine with a stimulant. Sources and facts can be cited, however, this is easily found in any study.

You'll need to start citing some sources, as most all the information you've given in this thread is mistaken. The two main dangers posed by combinations of stimulants and depressants are:
1. taking too large a dose of one due to the other masking its subjective effects, the latter wearing off before the former, and experience of too severe of effects and
2. combined respiratory depression and increased pulse putting strain on cardiac muscle to receive sufficient oxygen.

These both can be prevented by judicious dosing.

Also, they aren't using huge doses of Lorazepam like a recreational user would.

The dosages used in clinical settings tend to be similar to or larger than recreational doses (2 mg / IV is common first-line treatment for panic reactions to stimulants, more added as needed).

Therefore a benzodiazepine is not an agonist. It's classified as a positive allosteric modulator.

Because direct GABAnergic agonists are uncommon in clinical use, people use "agonist" as short-hand for PAM with benzos.

Also, I am fully aware of what a benzodiazepine does to the firing if a GABA receptor. My response and calling it "widening" is meant for the layman.

This is misleading rather than simplified: barbiturates increase the amount of time that GABAA ionotropic channels remain open, benzodiazepines increasing the frequency of opening. We need to keep these mechanisms straight.

ebola
 
I could do a long post detailing my history with amps, but I'm not going to bother with that here.

Just wanted to get a message out to the OP - you originally posted on here when you were 19, you said - yeah, with all the stimulant shit you're doing, your heart probably has a shelf life of just another year or two before it gets fucked up for the rest of your life, real talk.

I mean, personally, I didn't do as crazy much amps as you except for a total of maybe a week, combined together from separate days over a period of time, and I still have this sort of conviction something could be wrong with my heart, although I've never felt bad enough to go into an ER..and I completely stopped fucking around with amps just a month and a half into being 22 years old.

Basically, you can usually fuck around with speed/amps a lot when you're still in that 18-20-21 age range, but take it from me, your heart will become vulnerable to getting fucked up from amp use really fast. And that shit will just bite you without much physical warning. Honestly, I felt absolutely fine just 2-3 weeks, hell, maybe even just a week-week and a half, before the last day I did Adderall.

I'm just saying, dude, this shit probably won't kill you, because it IS tough to actually overdose and kill yourself on amps, though not impossible, but yeah, there are tons of people out there who've gotten heart problems in their 20's/30's from abusing stimulants, be they coke or amps.

And oh yeah, even if you're doing them on separate days/nights, you should never drink when you're doing stimulant regimens. You're literally wasting away your internal organs...also, if it's not obvious by now, I've fucked around with both Vyvanse and Adderall, and fuck what the doctor said (because, at least with these ADD drugs, doctors are basically programmed what to say from what I've heard/read), and both are equally addictive as far as I'm concerned - the Vyvanse might actually be worse for an actual addict to take because the Vyvanse doesn't come on as strong/fast as the Adderall does and you might start compulsively dosing up what you already got - that's happened to me a number of times...bottom line if you can tell you have a problem with abusing these ADD drugs, you gotta get them out of your life, don't be fucking around with your heart since you only got one...
 
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