Opioids Vitamin C: Opioid Addiction Cure?

[Panacea]

Mechanism of ascorbate destruction of opiate stereospecific binding (SSB) in guinea pig brain homogenate

Ascorbic acid produced a concentration dependent, biphasic destruction of opiate SSB, with maximum destruction occurring at 1 mM, and decreasing at higher ascorbate concentrations. Destruction of SSB by direct chemical reduction was ruled out, since several other reducing agents were without effect. Structural analogs of ascorbic acid were tested. The stereoisomer, D-isoascorbic acid, produced destruction similar to that caused by ascorbate. Dehydroascorbic acid produced only slight loss of SSB, and protected against further destruction of SSB by ascorbate. All other analogs tested were without effect. Oxygen was necessary for ascorbate destruction of SSB, since no loss of SSB was seen in degassed homogenates incubated with ascorbate under nitrogen. Reagents which prevent ascorbate catalyzed lipid peroxide formation were shown also to prevent ascorbate destruction of SSB, and dose-response studies showed that destruction of SSB paralleled ascorbate induced lipid peroxide formation. The mechanism for ascorbate destruction of SSB, therefore, appears to involve modification of some critical receptor moiety by ascorbate catalyzed peroxidation.

Dunlap III, C.E., Leslie, F.M., Cox, B.M. 1979 Federation Proceedings 38 (3 I), pp. No.135

 

[Panacea]

Chronic treatment with ascorbic acid inhibits the morphine withdrawal response in guinea-pigs

The effects of ascorbic acid (AA) were investigated on the morphine withdrawal response of guinea-pigs, a species which shares with man the inability to synthesize AA. Chronic pretreatment of guinea-pigs with AA, 1 g/l, in drinking water for 3 days, or AA 200 mg/kg subcutaneously (s.c.) 3 times daily for 3 days, markedly reduced the locomotor and behavioural withdrawal responses of guinea-pigs given naloxone hydrochloride, 15 mg/kg s.c. 2 h after a single dose of morphine sulphate, 15 mg/kg s.c. AA, 1 g/kg given intraperitoneally (i.p.) 30 min before morphine had no significant effect on morphine withdrawal. However, intracerebroventricular injection of AA, 1 μmol, 30 min before naloxone significantly enhanced morphine withdrawal. It is concluded that chronic but not acute administration of AA inhibits opiate withdrawal.

Johnston, P.A., Chahl, L.A. 1992 Neuroscience Letters 135 (1), pp. 23-27

 

[Panacea]

Effect of ascorbate on the toxicity of morphine in mice

The effects of ascorbic acid on the toxicity of morphine in mice were investigated. An intraperitoneal dose of sodium ascorbate (1 G/kg) injected 10 min prior to morphine (500 mg/kg, i.p.) was found to provide significant protection against mortality due to respiratory depression, while having no effect on the lethality of the pentobarbital. Pretreatment with ascorbate had no effect on the distribution of morphine in brain tissue, nor did it alter the pH of the plasma. Administration of ascorbate in vivo also produced no inactivation of binding to opioid receptors. It is postulated that ascorbate antagonizes the lethality of morphine by selectively affecting neuronal activity.

Dunlap III, C.E., Leslie, F.M. 1985 Neuropharmacology 24 (8), pp. 797-804



Inhibition of morphine analgesia by ascorbate

Oral administration of single doses of ascorbate produced a decrease in the analgesic effect of morphine in mice when assayed by the tail-flick test. Inhibition of analgesia was dose dependent, had a rapid onset (2 hr) and long duration (48 hr). Ascorbate doses over 8 mg/kg also protected mice from lethal doses of morphine. These findings are in accord with recent reports that ascorbate destroys opioid receptor in vitro and indicates that a similar effect occurs in vivo.

Willette, R.E., Thomas, B.L., Barnett, G. 1983 Research Communications in Chemical Pathology and Pharmacology 42 (3), pp. 485-491


Functional characterisation of the active ascorbic acid transport into cerebrospinal fluid using primary cultured choroid plexus cells

Crossing the blood-CSF barrier is an important pathway for certain nutrients to enter the CNS. Cultured choroid plexus epithelial cells are a potent model system to study active transport properties of this tissue in vitro. In the present study this in vitro model was used to analyse ascorbic acid transport across the blood-CSF barrier that is supposedly mediated by the Na+-dependent transporter SVCT2. The expression of SVCT2 in the cultured cells was proven by RT-PCR. Active transport across the cell monolayer resulted in ascorbic acid enrichment at the CSF mimicking side. Ascorbic acid transport and uptake were decreased to 13 and 27%, respectively, in the presence of 200 μM phloretin. Inhibition of both transepithelial substrate transport (to 7.5%) and cytoplasmatic uptake (to 20%) was observed in Na +-free medium indicating that a basolaterally located and Na +-dependent transporter mediates ascorbic acid uptake. Substituting Cl- by either iodide or D-gluconate increased ascorbic acid uptake by factors of 3.7 or 2.5, respectively. Similar observations were made when Na+-dependent myo-inositol transport was analysed. Additionally, in presence of 100 μM bumetanide, an inhibitor of Na+-Cl --cotransport, indirectly increased ascorbic acid and myo-inositol transport rates were observed showing that ascorbic acid-Na+- cotransport might balance low intracellular Na+ concentration. © 2003 Elsevier B.V. All rights reserved.

Angelow, S., Haselbach, M., Galla, H.-J. 2003 Brain Research 988 (1-2), pp. 105-113

 

[Tchort]

These findings are in accord with recent reports that ascorbate destroys opioid receptor in vitro and indicates that a similar effect occurs in vivo.

Is it just me, or does this sound like they're insinuating repeated megadoses of ascorbate would stop opioid withdrawal completely by destroying the opioid receptors that are empty and demanding to be filled?

 

[ilovechronic]

^ I agree. I took a gram of Vitamin C when I was in rehab if I had a cold and it didn't help the cravings at all. After getting out of rehab, I took Vitamin C for a month or so every single day to prevent me from catching a cold and that's the only thing it seemed to help with. Of course I had no idea about this info at the time, but obviously it didn't work for me.

yeah but this study is talking about mega doses of 25-100grams per day not a measely gram.

 

[Tchort]

yeah but this study is talking about mega doses of 25-100grams per day not a measely gram.

Yep, but given in increments throughout the day. Ascorbate has a short half life, so these megadoses were administered over something like a half dozen or more doses. Outside these specific requirements there doesn't seem to be any beneficial effect from taking more than the recommended 1-2.5g/day.

I wonder what effect megadoses of ascorbate have on opioid antagonists?
Nalorphine, Naltrexone, Naloxone, Nalmefene, etc have a restorative effect on the endogenous opioid system when taken daily after a period of opioid addiction and dependancy. I wonder if megadoses of ascorbate would inhibit antagonists the way it inhibits agonists?

 

[rolls]

I've heard of people 'curing' cancer with vitamin C before, everyone loves using megadoses of it to cure everything.

 

[Tchort]

I've heard of people 'curing' cancer with vitamin C before, everyone loves using megadoses of it to cure everything.

It has been proven that Ascorbate acts as a poison antidote for a number of toxins. It also seems to 'attack' foreign elements in the body (it inhibits the action of many/most drugs). The rationale it seems for it 'curing' opioid addiction is that it 1) 'attacks' the dependant opiate receptors in the endogenous opioid system, thus stopping the withdrawal syndrome from happening and stopping cravings and 2) by inhibiting exogenous opioids completely when megadoses are used throughout the day- meaning even if you tried to get high, it wouldn't work.

Same rationale is used for cancer. The cancerous cells are attacked and metabolised in a simialr manner as medications and the supposedly the opioid system.

Very interesting stuff. This isn't just a handful of individuals and studies, this has been studied heavily for decades by numerous people from different specialties.

 

[ChemicalSmiles]

LOL,
next time I'm really dopesick, I'll try eating an apple...but my guess is that I'll either shit it out or puke it up long before it has any effect.

agreed ^ ^

 

[Colstonewall1]

Vitamin C & Opiate Withdrawls

Too bad that whole thing won't work. I'd love to longer be an addict.

Won't work!?! Have you TRIED IT??? I thought not. . .Let me explain this to you, and everyone else that posted to this thread. . .

After being on Methadone for over 5 yrs, and several unsuccessful attempts to come off it and failing, I DID TRY IT!! And guess what it WORKS, PERIOD!!! So don't give this "it won't work" or "Vitamin C doesn't cross the Blood Brain Barrier, so it cannot work". . .

BS!!! It does work, and instead of criticizing something you know nothing about, why don't you try it for yourself before commenting on it negatively. . .And when or if you do try it, make sure you are doing it the RIGHT WAY or it won't work!

 

[Colstonewall1]

agreed ^ ^

Agreed!?? Did either one of you read the paper??? Because if you did, you would see an apple isn't what they were talking about using. Where did Apple come from? Because you think it has Vitamin C in it?

They were using many, many grams of Vit C with these patients. . .Let me explain this to you: Everyone has bowel tolerance to Vit C, that means when you reach it, you'll have diarrhea at a certain amount of Vit C you ingested. Now, what researchers have found is, A: Different people have different bowel tolerances, and B: As a person is put under stress (mental or physical) their bowel tolerance to Vit C goes way up.

So this means you must ingest as close to this tolerance as possible to get these effects. . .Let me tell you how this whole article came about. Researchers were working with terminally Ill cancer patients who were on high levels of Morphine. They began giving them high levels of Vit C and noticed their pain was going away, to the point where they were NOT taking their Morphine. And guess what, they noticed these patients had no (0) withdrawl symptoms. So, they rightly assumed this would be of value to addicts.

So before you guys start trying to prove me or this wrong, let me tell you this. It DOES WORK, I HAVE TRIED IT MYSELF, AND WAS 100% SUCCESSFUL at detoxing off Methadone usind Sodium Acorbate (10 grams, 5 times a day, in divided doses)

It simply amazes me how some people will say "impossible" to something they know nothing about, and have not tried it themselves. It can does work.

 

[Desdenova]

Do you realize you're jumping at things people said over a year ago?

It's also pretty obvious the apple comment was a damn joke. Lighten up.

 

[jaguraguguru]

I think that most of this is unrealistic, impractical, and just highly hyped up, like all studies of ascorbic acid (look at the 10000 about how it cures cancer, drastically increases immunity, the other 10000000000000000 that refute those theories).

That said, I don't doubt that some of the findings have a little truth to them, but putting that much of any chemical into your body is likely to fuck up just about everything. Anyways, there's always the possibility that ascorbic acid, being a rather strong acid (for an organic), acidifies the renal tubules/bladder (even maybe the blood at a very very high dose) as well as the stomach and intestines when given orally to such an extent that morphine given i.p. or s.c. anywhere near where an ascorbic acid dose was injected would be ionized and just get excreted without crossing the bbb. And then, any bit of morphine filtered into the urine or moved into the bowels would be ionized and never leave. That would explain the protection against overdose, decrease in toxicity, and reduced withdrawal symptoms very cleanly by itself.

Don't get me wrong, I'm not saying that every bit of information here is definitely incorrect or that megadoses couldn't help with withdrawal, but it definitely should be taken with a grain of salt and that any explanation for the mechanism of action of a megadose of any drug is bound to be incorrect.

-Jaguraguguru

 

[HighonLife]

It has been proven that Ascorbate acts as a poison antidote for a number of toxins. It also seems to 'attack' foreign elements in the body (it inhibits the action of many/most drugs). The rationale it seems for it 'curing' opioid addiction is that it 1) 'attacks' the dependant opiate receptors in the endogenous opioid system, thus stopping the withdrawal syndrome from happening and stopping cravings and 2) by inhibiting exogenous opioids completely when megadoses are used throughout the day- meaning even if you tried to get high, it wouldn't work.


Very interesting stuff. This isn't just a handful of individuals and studies, this has been studied heavily for decades by numerous people from different specialties.

So how come this is something that is not talked about much?

Won't work!?! Have you TRIED IT??? I thought not. . .Let me explain this to you, and everyone else that posted to this thread. . .

After being on Methadone for over 5 yrs, and several unsuccessful attempts to come off it and failing, I DID TRY IT!! And guess what it WORKS, PERIOD!!! So don't give this "it won't work" or "Vitamin C doesn't cross the Blood Brain Barrier, so it cannot work". . .

BS!!! It does work, and instead of criticizing something you know nothing about, why don't you try it for yourself before commenting on it negatively. . .And when or if you do try it, make sure you are doing it the RIGHT WAY or it won't work!

Go on......

 

[Colstonewall1]

this article is total BS, vitamin C doesn't cross BB barrier and can't bind to mu receptors + 50 grams of pure vitamin C would probably lead to severe allergic reaction, I remember when I was a kid and one summer I was working on tomato farm picking them up and of course eating and after a week I had very bad allergic reaction (swollen tung,rash...) so doctor told me that's because of vitamin C in tomatoes and 2 days after I stopped eating them I was fine.
I'm sure massive doses of Vitamin C are not gonna help with addiction but this can be dangerous on couple levels:
1)if one uses pure Vitamin C it's an acid and in massive doses leads to allergic reactions and problems with stomach
2)if one uses massive doses of sodium ascorbate it has sodium in it and high levels of sodium are not good for your hard and cardiovascular system+ some people use calcium ascorbate which is even worse for simular reson
3)in one study high doses of VC in mice led to canser and kidny stones...
I know what I'm talking about back when I was in college my graduation work was about Vitamin C and I studied Biotechnology and Organic chemistry and I did a lot of research about this subject and never heard about 80+grams use for humans of ascorbic acid it's like with every substance difference between medicine and poison is in concentration.
I think this patients in this study had placebo effect. But Vitamin C in small doses(500mg-1.5gram) is good for your body.It takes part in a lot of biochemical reactions in the body including formation of some neurotransmiters but claim that it can revers overdoses is BS.Ask any doctor at ER to use vitamin C to revers heroine overdose and see what he or she has to say.
You will probably hear a lot of F words.

You incorrectly state that Vitamin C does NOT cross the Blood Brain Barrier. I suggest you do some more research on that, because, well, you are wrong. Please check out this link (http://www.newscientist.com/article/dn1794-vitamin-c-could-help-drugs-cross-bloodbrain-barrier.html) and you will read that not only does it cross, some companies are using it to help certain drugs cross the B.B.B.

As far as large doses causing adverse allergic reactions, this is also bogus. Study after study shows this to be 100% inaccurate. You can look this up for yourself. I've seen studies where individuals received 50, 60, 100, and up Grams of Vit C.

Also, as far as people considering these doses are "megadoses" is just plain wrong also. They base this on the R.D.A. Anyone with any sense knows the R.D.A. is the amounts that you must have to NOT get certain diseases. This does NOT mean for optimal health. Here's a great article explaining this (http://www.steadyhealth.com/articles/Vitamin_C___The_Overlooked_Miracle_Drug_a743.html)

I really wish you guys would do a little fact checking before you post inaccurate facts. You do a disservice to people trying to help themselves by any means necessary. Had I not known better, I might have believed you, and never tried this for myself, which meansI would still be an addict or slave I like to call it.

 

[Colstonewall1]

Do you realize you're jumping at things people said over a year ago?

It's also pretty obvious the apple comment was a damn joke. Lighten up.

Yes, I do realize these posts are old(er). What difference does that make? Obviously you are still reading them.

As far as my tone, I realized I got a little worked up, and I do apologize for that. However, when I see people spitting out inaccuracies for the simple reason they have never tried something themselves and have the nerve to criticize it, well I get a little hot. Especially when I HAVE tried it, and credit it with saving my life.

If the apple comment was a joke, again I apologize. But it didn't sound like a joke. . .Maybe I should have had a better attitude, but sometimes you just can't help it.

 

[Colstonewall1]

So how come this is something that is not talked about much?



Go on......

Why isn't this talked about much? That's a damn good question. I will point you toward this Utube video where the interviewee states (by personal experience) that he was told personally "people will lose jobs, rehabs will go out of business" Please check the video out, it's relatively short and very enlightening about this subject. . . http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5jUCZpIGnUY


You say "Go on . . ." What else would you like me to tell you. I would be more than happy to expound if you would like me to. Just tell me what you would like to know and I'll try to answer you.

 

[Colstonewall1]

I think that most of this is unrealistic, impractical, and just highly hyped up, like all studies of ascorbic acid (look at the 10000 about how it cures cancer, drastically increases immunity, the other 10000000000000000 that refute those theories).

That said, I don't doubt that some of the findings have a little truth to them, but putting that much of any chemical into your body is likely to fuck up just about everything. Anyways, there's always the possibility that ascorbic acid, being a rather strong acid (for an organic), acidifies the renal tubules/bladder (even maybe the blood at a very very high dose) as well as the stomach and intestines when given orally to such an extent that morphine given i.p. or s.c. anywhere near where an ascorbic acid dose was injected would be ionized and just get excreted without crossing the bbb. And then, any bit of morphine filtered into the urine or moved into the bowels would be ionized and never leave. That would explain the protection against overdose, decrease in toxicity, and reduced withdrawal symptoms very cleanly by itself.

Don't get me wrong, I'm not saying that every bit of information here is definitely incorrect or that megadoses couldn't help with withdrawal, but it definitely should be taken with a grain of salt and that any explanation for the mechanism of action of a megadose of any drug is bound to be incorrect.

-Jaguraguguru

You can find misinformation about anything, not just vitamins. All I can say to you my friend is, try it for yourself, then tell me it's wrong (or right)

I'll point you to these studies. These are fact. . .

http://www.doctoryourself.com/stone.html

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5jUCZpIGnUY

http://news.google.com/newspapers?n...d4qAAAAIBAJ&sjid=F4gFAAAAIBAJ&pg=1366,5468515

http://news.google.com/newspapers?id=ypkUAAAAIBAJ&sjid=Cq4DAAAAIBAJ&pg=2261,2083165&hl=en

http://www.whale.to/v/kalokerinos2.html

 

[Colstonewall1]

It has been proven that Ascorbate acts as a poison antidote for a number of toxins. It also seems to 'attack' foreign elements in the body (it inhibits the action of many/most drugs). The rationale it seems for it 'curing' opioid addiction is that it 1) 'attacks' the dependant opiate receptors in the endogenous opioid system, thus stopping the withdrawal syndrome from happening and stopping cravings and 2) by inhibiting exogenous opioids completely when megadoses are used throughout the day- meaning even if you tried to get high, it wouldn't work.

Same rationale is used for cancer. The cancerous cells are attacked and metabolised in a simialr manner as medications and the supposedly the opioid system.

Very interesting stuff. This isn't just a handful of individuals and studies, this has been studied heavily for decades by numerous people from different specialties.

Thank you for posting some facts. I wish I coulda been a little more diplomatic, LOL, like you.

All I ask is people (like yourself) do a little research on both ends of the controversy before coming to the conclusion something doesn't work. . .

I realize I came off a bit harsh, but this is something I am passionate about, and sometimes I get defensive. I do sincerely apologize for that, to everyone here.

For the record, my only goal here is to hopefully help some people. That's all I care about. So if I have to take some heat for my beliefs, then so be it. But please, please, just look into it before you come to the conclusion it doesn't work.

 

[rolls_]

The rationale for attacking cancer sounds great on paper but in reality it does not work much like this does not work for curing opiate withdrawal.

By all means try eating 20grams of calcium adsorbate (do not have ascorbic acid or you'll be shitting your pants and have horrid abdominal pain) next time you are in WD but I highly doubt it will do anything.

Anyone feel like being a guinea pig?