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  • BDD Moderators: Keif’ Richards

very concerned about alcohol withdrawals!

MoreFeens4Morphine

Bluelighter
Joined
Jul 23, 2013
Messages
243
Location
Springfield, IL
Hello fellow BL members, long time no post.

Quick Background:
I recently decided to give up alcohol for at least a weak to break my dependency on needing it to sleep. I'm only 2 days in without a drink but I'm having a lot of anxiety and pains in my chest. At the same time, I am prone to anxiety and have posted that in these forums before. I have 3 xanax left and am not even in town. I'm coming back from a trip to TX. I typically drink about 12-16 drinks a day starting from 11am or noon until I pass out. However, the last week it's easily been 16 at minimum a day. I haven't had a drop in about 40 hours.

My questions:

How should I time my xanax (0.5 mg) to last me 2-4 days until I can get my refill?

What is my risk of going into a grand mal or suffering any other worse physical symptoms?

What additional advice can you give me to help me break my dependency on alcohol?

Please note: I said I am having anxiety. Try not to dramatize, at the same time I realize I may not like the answers I hear.

(I realize most people here are not doctors and I should talk to one. I can't talk to mine or else I risk losing my xanax and the only doctor who has ever understood how severe my anxiety/panic disorder is).
 
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With three pills left, I don't know how you would make that last up to 4 days. You may have to go to the E.R. because seizures are a major concern during alcohol and benzo withdrawal. You could take a pill tonight, but you could be in the same or even worse boat tomorrow. Even though it's been nearly two days since you drank, I don't think you're out of the woods yet.

Have you ever been to a meeting? Once you get stabilized, you might want to check out our Recovery Forums.
 
Go to a hospital, the ER, or a medical professional and tell them what's happening. Good luck, and stay safe.

Don't attempt to get through alcohol withdrawal yourself with or without benzos, as people have died this way.
 
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yeah go to the er and tell them whats going on
the amount of alcohol you are consuming is def a cause for concern
im not a doc but then again i have been told plenty of times that 72 hrs after your last drink will be the shittest
i wouldnt go the xanax route for dealing with possible withdrawals valium or klonopin would be best as they have anti anxiety and anti seizure properties and have a long half life
good luck bud
 
Q1: Take it only when you start to feel like you need it. you can't time this shit unless you really want to.
Q2: Try switching to beers. You're tolerance to alcohol should actually decrease the more you drink, This is what I've been told. Or maybe switch to small cocktails. Start making your own drinks. They'd give you shit about this in an A.A. (have you been to one? They're great) but this actually works.
Q3: ^^^
 
"When you really need it" can be a bit of a fallacy during alcohol withdrawal. The slightest hint of withdrawal is usually enough to make me gobble up every pill in sight. It's hard to make rational decisions when you're going through such an intense experience. Like others have said, go to the hospital or at the very least a doctor. Unlike with opioid withdrawal, they're going to be required to treat you regardless of your financial situation.
 
Alcohol withdrawal is fairly complex and the only thing I know for certain is that you mustn't hesitate if you feel the need for medical attention. Seizures can be very dangerous, usually are, and obviously they are the primary thing you are trying to avoid with concern to alcohol withdrawal. I guess if you've made it through at least the first 24 hours without DT's (Delirium Tremens) that is a good sign. I also don't know how much Xanax you've taken up to this point in order to stave off the withdrawals; because if the answer is a lot then you will probably run into trouble before you are able to refill your script. Don't try and go through combination alcohol and benzo withdrawal at the same time without seeking medical help, even if you think you are doing pretty well that doesn't mean you won't seizure. I've seen someone with 4 full clean days off benzos/alcohol proceed to have a seizure on day 5 at a time when they seemed to be feeling pretty good in spite of their circumstances, this was at a locked facility where I know they could not have snuck substance of any kind in.

I will preface the following by stating the obvious fact that I am not a doctor, nor have I earned a degree that entitles me the privilege of giving medical advice.... this being said I'm also unconcerned with being politically correct regarding these matters given the experience I have in this realm.

It's nice to see that you desire to clean yourself out to some degree; I think that's a noble goal. On the other hand between your benzos/alcohol trying to simply take a week long tolerance break, for lack of a better term, isn't the safest thing to do without medical supervision. I understand you cannot go to your doctor with the issue... this being said then maybe you should scale back on the drinking instead of trying to take a week off. Also it sounds like you used up your Xanax script a few days too fast, maybe not, but that is what I took away from what you wrote. So you are considering trying to take .5mgs of Xanax a day for 3 days until you refill your script? Idk what your normal daily stipend for Xanax is but if it is more than .5mgs then I definitely would not try to make 1.5mgs of Xanax last me 3 days. Stopping alcohol and scaling back on Xanax at the same time can't possibly end well outside of a medical facility, even in a medical facility they would make you go cold turkey from practically a bottle a day while lowering your Xanax, they'd probably introduced some longer-acting benzos, be it Librium or Valium or even Klonopin, while maintaining your Xanax at least until they determined your condition was stable regarding alcohol detox. Point being don't try and be tough thinking you can deal with both benzo and alcohol issues at the same time; I only keep writing this same sentence because it's something I don't want you to shrug off.

Next point, switching from 12 drinks a day to 6 drinks a day is still a win even if you don't completely stop. Don't feel the need to completely stop, sure you might want to in order to prove to yourself or others that you can, but who gives a shit about your willpower to stop if you have a seizure. Somebody above me said try switching to beer, not a bad idea in the scheme of things if you can manage it. It's like taking an XR pill instead of a bunch of IR pills, ultimately your peak plasma concentrations (CMAX) will be lower, but your average concentrations will probably be higher. Honestly the AUC doesn't change, but do to the difference between taking shots and drinking beers it would work out something like what I just said if you had the same number of drinks daily but switched from liquor to beer. Point is that you are better off slowing down your drinking than you would be stopping it cold turkey from nearly a bottle a day. Nobody likes admitting that they need something (well there are those people, but that isn't the point) but if you drive, I won't condone drunk driving, but think about this. If you go to the hospital for alcohol detox they don't revoke your license for medical reasons once you leave simply because you are an admitted substance abuser. if you go to the hospital after having a seizure they will temporarily revoke your license until you have determined the nature of your seizure disorder and treated it adequately. So it's more dangerous to have a seizure while driving than to be at a .12 BAC while driving. It's really better if you scale back the drinking as opposed to stopping it cold turkey, especially if you will be behind the wheel of a vehicle, you definitely shouldn't be driving if you are going to drink, but I'd rather you had a relatively moderate BAC and drive than have a seizure while driving.

All evidence points to scaling your drinking back as opposed to stopping entirely unless you are going to seek medical help, which would be advisable, but granted that you said that wasn't going to happen, I would hope that you be risk averse as opposed to being heroic as it relates to overcoming alcohol dependency. Odds are it won't make a huge difference if you slowly tapering off alcohol starting once you have your Xanax filled rather than doing it while you don't have access to emergency Xanax.

Best of luck, I've been there before myself, I made it out, so you can too, but don't run out of the jungle attracting predators, walk out of the jungle quietly in tact and unfollowed.
 
Go to a hospital, the ER, or a medical professional and tell them what's happening. Good luck, and stay safe.

Don't attempt to get through alcohol withdrawal yourself with or without benzos, as people have died this way.

^ This!

As someone who has been a alcoholic and has gone through the DT's i know how terrifying and dangerous they can be. Untreated Alcohol withdrawal is very likely to cause seizures if left untreated or even death. Status Epilepticus often results from seizures due to severe alcohol wd and if you don't get immediate treatment (usually a shot of a benzo like Valium or Lorazepam or sometimes a barb like Phenobarbital or even Pentobarbital aka Nembutal if benzos don't work or if the doc is old school) your brain will fry and you will likely die or be left a total vegetable. Status Epilepticus is a life threatening condition where you don't stop seizing after 5 minutes. These need not be convulsions either per se and may be absence type seizures.

There is no way 3 Xanax is going to last you 4 days and keep you out of Alcohol wd. It has a very short half life and method of action so there is no way you can make 3 of them last you 4 days. Also Xanax is never used as a anti-convulsant and has a very short half life. Longer acting benzodiazepines with anti-convulsant properties such as Valium, Chlordiazepoxide (brand name Librium), Clonazepam or Lorazepam are typically used for treating Alcohol Withdrawal. When i finally quit drinking after several failed attempts to do it cold turkey resulted in horrible DT's and inevitable relapse i finally saw my doctor about it and after i turned down his urgent requests to go into a detox facility he gave me a script for 40mg's of Valium a day which is typically the max dose here. I also visited another doctor i knew who was very "liberal" in his prescribing practices and with a story about insomnia which was actually true and a story about a sore back which was again not a lie (i worked at a shitty job where injuries where a name of the game) i managed to get 60 30mg Temazepam caps and 60 Oxy Ir's. With the help of all these meds i did finally manage to quit alcohol though no doubt the Valium would have been enough to keep me from having seizures or much in the way of hallucinations. I used the Temazepam for sleep and to calm me down when i really felt like i was losing it. The oxycodone helped with some of the pain and also some of the godawful depression and anhedonia i had during the acute stage and especially during the PAWS. Though i would not recommend swapping a alcohol addiction for a opiate addiction.

I will never forget going through the DT's or "the rats" here as we call it because rats along with bugs are a common hallucination. The delirium experienced during the DT's was very much like the delirium i got from the 2 times i was stupid enough to "trip" on Dramamine. I could not tell the difference between hallucination and reality and 1 very vivid hallucination i had was talking to my friend who of course wasn't there as he was a few thousand miles away. I was talking to him one minute then he just vanished. Another 1 i remember is when i was walking to the liquor store one morning and i looked across the road and saw these ghost images of people. I have no idea if these where actual people but it looked sort of like a image from a negative. Needless to say once i realized i was in the rats i downed half a pint of Whiskey as soon as i got out of the liquor store which straitened me up in about 10 minutes. Another hallucination i kept having was imaging the TV was on when it wasn't.

Alcohol withdrawals are a medical emergency as death is not a infrequent outcome of untreated Alcohol withdrawal. Many people also attempt or succeed in committing suicide as the psychosis combined with the godawful nihilistic depression that accompanies alcohol wd can be unbearable not to mention you may be so psychotic that you kill yourself without really thinking about it much. I know of a few people that killed themselves while trying to quit drinking and where i live i know of atleast 2 people that died from the DT's. You are drinking alot so i have no doubt you could experience severe withdrawals. I was averaging atleast 18 beers or a 26oz bottle of Whiskey or Rum or Vodka when i quit (on weekends i drank far more and i usually went through a 60ozer of Whiskey, Rum or Vodka and a 24 pack of beer by Sunday evening) and i can honestly say that it makes opiate withdrawal seem like a wet dream and also beats out benzo wd in terms of severity. When i ran out of my Clonazepam when i was far away from my doctor i remember it feeling sort of like Alcohol wd except nowhere near as acute or as painful. I was on 6mg's of Clonazepam a day and had been on it for maybe 6 years at that point. Alcohol withdrawal feels almost like a combination of benzo and opiate wd because not only do you get the gaba type withdrawal but the pain from it is worse then opiate wd and that includes the time i had Fentanyl withdrawal.

I wish you nothing but the best of luck in giving up the booze. It will be hard but trust me it's so fucking worth it in the long run. It may take awile but you will notice how much clearer your thinking is, how wonderful it is to have a memory again, how awesome it is to have your cognitive abilities back to normal and most of all not having to down booze first thing in the morning just to be able to function. I won't lie the acute wd is horrible and the PAWS are bad and stick around awile but with proper meds it is much easier. I found Valium and Temazepam to be the best for Alcohol wd because the muscle relaxing effects really help alot and so does the sedation.

If for some reason you ever need anyone to talk to please feel free to message me. I don't check my messages everyday but i am usually on every other day anyway so i don't go that long without checking them. Best of luck to ya b'y :)
 
Not sure if I would recommend xanax for WD's, as it's half life is exceptionally short. Essentially, you want as much time for those GABA receptors to be modulated as possible to stave off withdrawal.
 
hello, lt lurked ft poster here.

its good to.see people support each other in a thread like this.

can i ask for how.long have you all been drinking as heavily as you are now?

how does time frame factor.into whether you should be really.worried about withdrawal seizures?
 
hello, lt lurked ft poster here.

its good to.see people support each other in a thread like this.

can i ask for how.long have you all been drinking as heavily as you are now?

how does time frame factor.into whether you should be really.worried about withdrawal seizures?

I've never drank heavily enough to induce withdrawals or form a physical dependency but it's been more or less a moderation issue for me in the past. I rarely drink nowadays.

Do you mean time frame as in the severity of one's drinking? I'd say that it's pretty volume and time dependent. After a certain point it's dangerous to try and handle DT's by yourself without medical care.
 
Not sure if I would recommend xanax for WD's, as it's half life is exceptionally short. Essentially, you want as much time for those GABA receptors to be modulated as possible to stave off withdrawal.

^True. This is why detoxification protocol will most likely include a long-acting benzodiazepine. Diazepam (Valium) is common for the treatment of alcohol withdrawal, but it seems that chlordiazepoxide (Librium) is becoming the norm. I've read that at one point, phenobarbital (barbiturate) was common as well, but I've never actually seen it in use. I can testify to the long acting nature of the above mentioned benzodiazepines. I've been treated with both for 3-5 days and experienced amnesia for two days after the medication was stopped.

Alprazolam (Xanax) will work, but due to its short half-life, its hard to attain stable levels and thus, harder to estimate dosage. With the long acting benzodiazepines, if you receive regular doses, it will slowly build up in your system and there shouldn't be too much peak/trough effect. Either way, you're better off being in the care of a medical professional. They will take your vitals and titrate your medication based upon your condition.
 
voxide: yes I am wondering how lomg does somebody drink that heavily bfore they will expeerience withdrawal issues. srious health issues not just being anxious about quitting. five years? twenty? itseems to be rarely discussed for how long a person has been drinking mostly only how much. thanks for all help
 
voxide: yes I am wondering how lomg does somebody drink that heavily bfore they will expeerience withdrawal issues. srious health issues not just being anxious about quitting. five years? twenty? itseems to be rarely discussed for how long a person has been drinking mostly only how much. thanks for all help
I think it is different for everyone but I am not a doctor, medical professional, and have never experienced alcohol withdrawal. Good luck, and stay safe.
 
voxide: yes I am wondering how lomg does somebody drink that heavily bfore they will expeerience withdrawal issues. srious health issues not just being anxious about quitting. five years? twenty? itseems to be rarely discussed for how long a person has been drinking mostly only how much. thanks for all help

It's hard to give you an exact number and volume of intake but I think if you're at the point where you've been slamming a fifth after work every night for the past month you will notice some discomfort after stopping. Hangovers will be replaced with withdrawal symptoms. Health issues like liver damage and vitamin deficiencies will take much longer but those are a whole separate issue that has to dealt with any addition to DT's if you have them.
 
When you wake up every day with the shakes and need a drink to quell your tremors, you can trust that you are dependent on alcohol. At that point, you have the choice of reducing your intake and experiencing some mild symptoms of withdrawal, like heightened anxiety and maybe some depression and the aforementioned tremor will be present until you return to normal. For a light drinker in a stage such as this, the syndrome should be resolving at the ~48 hour mark, with residual symptoms lingering for a couple more days.

Now the second choice is to begin taking a "hair of the dog" in the morning to get rid of the tremor. This is your first step on the way to full-blown alcohol dependency. This is the trap that I found myself caught in a couple of times. I would either have class/work and couldn't do that shit without at least a couple shots in the morning to steady my nerves. This of course led to a couple of shots in the afternoon to steady my hands which were no longer steadied by a simple morning drink. The shakes would present sooner and sooner after drinking to the point where I would experience anxiety and tremor less than 2 hours after a drink. This led me to drinking 24 hours a day, as I was too much of a pussy to deal with the problem at hand. Eventually I was drinking over a fifth of liquor a day and when the time came to pay the piper, it was quite painful and scary. About 4-5 days of absolute hell for me. Unable to make sentences, hold a conversation, securely hold a cup of coffee; I was in bad shape.

The above only took about 2 months of round the clock booze. That's not a very long time, but I think the volume made up for that and the fact that I never actually experienced the real world for an extended period of time also played a part. I always had alcohol to calm my nerves and dull my senses and didn't actually have to deal with anything.
 
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