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Bupe Using on top of Bupe

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5StarSquatHotel

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As of my 3 week Subutex script there has been a couple of occasions where I have used herion on top. I'm only taking 4mg and I try to wait at least 24hours as of last dose to use which I finds works fine, prob about 70% effective anyway that night after using when I lie in bed I get a really high heart rate and it feels like my heart it thumping out of my chest, is this a reaction to the subutex? It honestly feels like it's the onset of a heart attack and it lasts all night untill I finally fall asleep. Can anyone shed some light on this? It's worth mentioning that when I use I prob smoke 0.25 of crack as well which I expect does not help.

Cheers ears
 
The crack definitely isn't helping, but may not be the only reason why this is happening. I doubt it's a reaction to the subutex, which should slow your heart rate not increase it. When do you take your subutex? Do you take 4mg at once in the morning, mid day or do you does multiple times during the day? If you take all 4mg at once in the morning, it may be that you're starting to feel some withdrawal symptoms possibly. I'm not real sure what else it could be outside of a panic attack, which seems unlikely to happen when you're relaxing, trying to sleep, but not impossible by any means.
 
As of my 3 week Subutex script there has been a couple of occasions where I have used herion on top. I'm only taking 4mg and I try to wait at least 24hours as of last dose to use which I finds works fine, prob about 70% effective anyway that night after using when I lie in bed I get a really high heart rate and it feels like my heart it thumping out of my chest, is this a reaction to the subutex? It honestly feels like it's the onset of a heart attack and it lasts all night untill I finally fall asleep. Can anyone shed some light on this? It's worth mentioning that when I use I prob smoke 0.25 of crack as well which I expect does not help.

Cheers ears

I believe you answered your own question, sir.
 
Ok so it's not the crack. Use with out crack involved still leads to the same thing. I take 4mg 1st thing in the morning and if there is no on top use I dont suffer these symptoms so it's not mild w/d's kicking in. I thought it might be a reaction between the bupe and the herion?
 
if so, it's not the normal reaction, but maybe it is for you. or some sort of cut maybe?
 
There is no possible reaction that can occur between bupe and heroin. Other than the bupe blocking the H.

Some people, who believe naloxone actually does something, would say that, except it would already been gone due to short h/l.

Could be you're just thinking about it too much giving yourself panic attacks
 
There is no possible reaction that can occur between bupe and heroin. Other than the bupe blocking the H.

Some people, who believe naloxone actually does something, would say that, except it would already been gone due to short h/l.

Could be you're just thinking about it too much giving yourself panic attacks

That is not entirely true. While bupe generally blocks, and thus diminishes the effects of other opioids. at small doses of bupe, there can actually be a synergistic effect between bupe and other opioids.

If one takes a small dose of bupe and then a standard dose of another opioid, the other opioid can bind to the many receptors that are not occupied by bupe, and thus you end up with the full effects of the opioid, plus the effects of the bupe.

At how low of a bupe dose this happens it up for debate. I would guess that anything under 1mg could cause this though, perhaps even 2mg.
 
the fact that your using crack is probably the problem here. even if your not using it every time this problem occurs...the fact that have been using crack recently still can effect your body and cause a rapid heart rate and other effects related to stimulant use. especially when you use any drug, it can trigger a reaction that could be traced back to residual effects from the crack use.

There is no possible reaction that can occur between bupe and heroin. Other than the bupe blocking the H.

Some people, who believe naloxone actually does something, would say that, except it would already been gone due to short h/l.

Could be you're just thinking about it too much giving yourself panic attacks

also....this isnt true...bupe can be used in combination with heroin to give you a nice high, it just depends on your tolerance, experience, and what drugs you have been using when and in what amounts. For example, I could use a tiny dose of suboxone to get a nice buzz and then use some heroin on top of that to inrease my buzz.....because I only took a small amount of suboxone, the heroin had plenty of receptors to bind to and "get me high" so to speak, so the two drugs were acting together, getting me high. Therefore, your statement...

There is no possible reaction that can occur between bupe and heroin. Other than the bupe blocking the H.

...is not entirely true.
 
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When I take heavy doses of bups (12-16mg) especially when I first started, I would get the same feeling- My heart would be racing and I was all over the place for a few days.
Also- when I use (oc for me) shortly after taking bupe I get the same feeling

I thought i was the only one...
 
Maybe a very minor precipitated withdrawal? Some people who are very opiate tolerant get mild WD's after getting high ONE time! Or at least that's what several forum members on here and opiophile have said, and I believe them.

So maybe when you take your next bupe dose after doing H, the H is being torn from your receptors and giving you a very minor precipitated WD.

Just the first explanation that popped in my head.
 
That is not entirely true. While bupe generally blocks, and thus diminishes the effects of other opioids. at small doses of bupe, there can actually be a synergistic effect between bupe and other opioids.

If one takes a small dose of bupe and then a standard dose of another opioid, the other opioid can bind to the many receptors that are not occupied by bupe, and thus you end up with the full effects of the opioid, plus the effects of the bupe.

At how low of a bupe dose this happens it up for debate. I would guess that anything under 1mg could cause this though, perhaps even 2mg.

the fact that your using crack is probably the problem here. even if your not using it every time this problem occurs...the fact that have been using crack recently still can effect your body and cause a rapid heart rate and other effects related to stimulant use. especially when you use any drug, it can trigger a reaction that could be traced back to residual effects from the crack use.



also....this isnt true...bupe can be used in combination with heroin to give you a nice high, it just depends on your tolerance, experience, and what drugs you have been using when and in what amounts. For example, I could use a tiny dose of suboxone to get a nice buzz and then use some heroin on top of that to inrease my buzz.....because I only took a small amount of suboxone, the heroin had plenty of receptors to bind to and "get me high" so to speak, so the two drugs were acting together, getting me high. Therefore, your statement...



...is not entirely true.

Ugh, I guess you guys didn't read my post, I said PROBLEMATIC.

How are a "nice high' or "synergy" problematic? yes, this is harm reduction, so I suppose its possible to OD, but I'm well aware of how receptors work, and the pharmacological effects of bupenorphine, and, thus, I said problematic.
 
^um... where? I am not trying to start a fight, but I did a "find in page" and the only time problematic was used was in THIS POST I'm pointing at (#14).

to quote my brilliant avatar-

"There is a good rule of thumb: if something is repeated
over and over as obvious, the chances are that it is obviously false."
 
A cutting agent in the dope maybe if it happens when you aint smoking crack?
 
Regardless of my post above, I agree with jamtastic... even if low dose bupe can be taken with heroin and doesn't just block it, it still wouldn't explain tachycardia.

Precipitated withdrawals also wouldn't make sense because that would occur immediately after taking the bupe and if I understand correctly, this is after the bupe wore off, after you've taken heroin correct?

Anxiety, aka what jamtastic said, seems most likely to me (or the crack of course) rather than some kind of interaction between the buprenorphine and heroin.
 
interesting debate....and i cant really say anything knew it seems.......

id also say crack.....this is not helping anything....pretty much no matter what.....

whats your ROA? for the dope.....and what about the bupe?

and whoever said that bupe can increase heart rate, is also right.
 
^Right it CAN, but if it were the bupe it couldn't be causing that long after the bupe effects have faded and heroin has replaced it on the receptors.
 
Regardless of my post above, I agree with jamtastic... even if low dose bupe can be taken with heroin and doesn't just block it, it still wouldn't explain tachycardia.

Precipitated withdrawals also wouldn't make sense because that would occur immediately after taking the bupe and if I understand correctly, this is after the bupe wore off, after you've taken heroin correct?

Anxiety, aka what jamtastic said, seems most likely to me (or the crack of course) rather than some kind of interaction between the buprenorphine and heroin.

Yeah that's right mate. I wait at least 24hours after a dose of 4mg of bupe and use in the morning and the problems dont start till late that evening.
 
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